5SFE Custom Intake Manifold Fabrication

[Metroxfi]

I have a '93 Celica GT, with the 5SFE. I have a bunch of mods on it already but i'm looking for a bit more power. i'm not into forced induction systems o anything that will harm to engine, i also don't want something that will kill MPG's like many high performance mods do.

I have been seriously thinking about getting (or rigging) a bigger throttle body but that won't help almost at all without a bored manifold. Last year i swapped a newer (less miles) 5SFE into the car and i do still have the old engine with all old parts to play with. I was thinking of taking the intake off of the old engine and using the flange so i would have the exact bolt pattern i would need and cutting the rest away and fitting some custom aluminum pipes to the flange. i would use all the original vacuum inlets for the same hook ups.

any suggestions? is this a dumb idea?
depending on how i make it, it would be lighter than the stock one so i'd save on weight. i'd use bigger diameter piping for higher airflow. Any feedback would be great, Thanks!

[Luckynumber5]

The intake manifold and throttle body aren;t what holds the 5sfe from making power, the engine comes factory with lame cams, barely decent ports, and the internals just plain suck for all motor performance. It's a stroked out 3s-fe and it hates to rev high.

Save your money and go FI, your gas mileage won;t suffer if you do it right.

[Metroxfi]

i know what you mean, i've also been looking into the Webcam 294 hardweld/regrind. the 294 isn't as aggressive as some other grinds which is good because i don't want to have to replace/mod the other components. also, i'm not into full on racing the car and i don't drive it hard at all. it's more of project car/time waster for me.

Originally Posted by Luckynumber5

Save your money and go FI, your gas mileage won;t suffer if you do it right.

what do you mean by "FI"?

[Luckynumber5]

Forced induction, turbo kits are very simple on the 5s-fe, but tuning isnt...

[concealer404]

Before we all jump on the bandwagon of bashing n/a 5sfes and 5sfes in general.....

What mods do you currently have done?

[PittsburghCeli]

Yeah, I like my 1991 5S-FE, which has never been towed.

Weight reduction is the best mod I can think of. Take out the back seat and full size spare tire in 10 minutes to reduce by 85 pounds. You will feel more acceleration! Get the bosch platinum 4+ spark plug and you don't have to worry if the electrode is pointed toward the cams, which is a power mod. Use synthetic oil so you can beat on it. Don't drive with the trunk/hatch fully open, like I do alot, can't get it past 80mph so it must be bad, don't do that The car has a factory cold air intake, so no mod there, use k&n filter. Advance timing a little and use better gas.

Some sensor is responsible for air fuel regulation and it compensates for a clogged filter so I don't think your mod will make a difference, but don't listen to me because I am not a mechanic.

[concealer404]

Originally Posted by PittsburghCeli

Yeah, I like my 1991 5S-FE, which has never been towed.

Weight reduction is the best mod I can think of. Take out the back seat and full size spare tire in 10 minutes to reduce by 85 pounds. You will feel more acceleration! Get the bosch platinum 4+ spark plug and you don't have to worry if the electrode is pointed toward the cams, which is a power mod. Use synthetic oil so you can beat on it. Don't drive with the trunk/hatch fully open, like I do alot, can't get it past 80mph so it must be bad, don't do that The car has a factory cold air intake, so no mod there, use k&n filter. Advance timing a little and use better gas.

Some sensor is responsible for air fuel regulation and it compensates for a clogged filter so I don't think your mod will make a difference, but don't listen to me because I am not a mechanic.

DEAR GOD DO NOT USE BOSCH PLUGS ON YOUR CELICA. Just. Don't.

NGK Coppers are about the best you'll get.

Oil doesn't really matter. Just stay away from Kendall brand or the like. I"ve never used synthetic in any of my celicas, and my last one survived nitrous at 210k miles.

The mod will make a difference..... just how much depends on the rest of the motor.

[Metroxfi]

thanks for some other feedback guys! i am absolutely sick of everyone saying: turbo it, supercharger kit, 3sgte swap, NO2, or 3sge head swap. i love my celica and the 5sfe in it is friggin' awesome and i have put so much work into it that i would hate to blow it up with a turbo. i don't want to be replacing piston rings and head gasket a couple years from now because i was dumb and tried to force it to do something it didn't want to. I do have plenty of mods on it already including venom injectors and an MSD box (with magnecor plug wires and NGK G-power platinum plugs) which has given me a great boost.

Weight reduction is a good idea, the only thing is that i don't want my car to look like it's ripped apart, might do that if i feel like racing though. the best way to reduce weight is to drop the passenger, you know, that one friend that rides with and tells you to race everyone because he doesn't have a car of his own... that's like 150lbs. right there! lol

Oil... hmmm i've heard good and bad about synthetic. my uncle switched his '02 Elantra to synthetic and i guess he was getting like 42 mpg highway, so that would be cool.Obviously thinner oil would be easier for your engine to move around thus unleashing a whopping 1-2HP's. I've also heard that if you have any sort of oil leaks or if you burn a bit of oil, synthetic is so much more thin than conventional that it will leak alot faster. Also, the japanese replacement engine i swapped into the car was EXTREMELY dirty inside so i've been running Rotella 15W40 through it every now and then, it's got a detergent in it already and cleans out the engine really well.

As for that manifold i was thinkin of making, i did some more research and found some other people that had made some. I found that making a bigger plenum (that bigger tube that runs across the other 4 pipes) will make a bit of a difference. another rather odd thing i found was "velocity stacks", i had never really heard of these before so i looked into them. imagine a gigatube on a subwoofer box, there are certain plastic inserts you can put in the hole to make the airflow alot faster with less resistance, it looks like the bell of a trumpet.I don't know, i found a guy that made a manifold for a VW and put velocity stacks on each pipe where it met with the plenum, try this-
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=4123853
but apparently they're supposed to allow for much better and much faster airflow, they're on a VW looks like a beetle but bare with me. that's the kind of thing i was thinking of.

I have just a short RAM intake on it, the end of the filter is just behind the battery. i still have the stock tube coming in from the bumper going to right beside the battery. i was thinking of making a fiberglass heatshield/airbox that leads to that little stock fresh air tube.

thanks guys!

[concealer404]

You don't have enough done to the car to really mess with the intake manifold yet.

At most at this stage, just smooth out the inlet to match the throttle body perfectly, taking off any burrs or ridges. Then on the runners, make sure they're port matched to your head.

At that point, call it a day. You pretty much have a stock 5sfe there.

Velocity stacks go on a throttle body. Without looking at your link, in the case of the old VW, they're probably going to carbs. Also common to put them on individual throttle bodies.

[Luckynumber5]

SOrry man, don;t mean to bash but with all you have done, and if you made the best intake plenum the world has ever seen. A turbo 5s-fe will still spank you by like 4 cars.

[concealer404]

Originally Posted by Luckynumber5

SOrry man, don;t mean to bash but with all you have done, and if you made the best intake plenum the world has ever seen. A turbo 5s-fe will still spank you by like 4 cars.

Probably closer to 20, to be honest, if the guy with the 5sfte has any idea what he's doing.

I'm not bashing an n/a 5sfe idea.... i think it's great, and i'm one of the few that actually believes you can make nice power.

But you're nowhere NEAR the point where you need a custom intake manifold. You have a LONG ways to go before it's going to do anything.

[concealer404]

Here..... read this:

Originally Posted by concealer404

1) Grounding... upgrade "The Big Three" is a good idea.



2) AM ignition box. NO. Stock ignition components is plenty to make 400+whp. Why would you upgrade it on a stock motor?



3) Bigger fuel injectors. NO. NO. NO.



The car runs rich STOCK.... why the HELL would you want to make that worse and lose further fuel economy AND lose power? The stock ECU CANNOT compensate for larger injectors.









Anyways......



OP, what turbo do you have. A stock turbo could mean pretty much anything. If you want to use it on your car, then start reading. There's enough tutorials floating around this site, and especially Celicatech that ALL of your questions are already answered if you care enough to take 10 minutes max to find them.



As for n/a, bolt on mods, here you go:



1) headER. You have ONE. So you buy a HEADER. You can get the "Surewin" Ebay header which seems to be a HotShot knockoff, and seems to perform well. Or you can grab a late model 96+ Camry 5sfe header which is also a 4-1 style. Or you can grab an 88-89 Celica GTS 4-2-1 header. Your choice.



2) Intake. Make one. I have a modified Civic intake on mine, works just fine. Although... you'll probably see better gains just with stock intake piping, with a K&N filter, as it is a true "cold air intake" STOCK.



3) Exhaust. Custom. 2.25" mandrel bend or 2.5" crush bent. All the way back to a muffler/fart can of your choice. DO include a cat or a resonator so you don't sound like a beehive.



At this point.... you MIGHT run a low 16 quarter mile, assuming you have a manual tranny, you know how to drive, and your car is healthy. SLOW.



So... let's move on.



4) Advance your timing to 15-17 degrees BTDC, and run 92-93 octane.



5) Run 1 step colder spark plugs



6) Upgrade your ignition wires.. WIRES ONLY.



And now we move into the more involved stuff:



7) Clutch/flywheel. Lighter flywheel improves engine response, less intertia to overcome.



8) Shave your head. You can take up to .040 off your head to raise the compression to gain more power, and still stay within the limits of your stock ECU. VERIFY FIRST THAT YOUR HEAD HAS NOT BEEN SHAVED BEFORE.



9) Get headwork/cams. Port/polish your head, rebuild it, get bigger valves (2jzge valves fit with fairly minimal modification), contact Webcams about regrinding your cams for more lift/duration.



At this point, you'll need some way to tune your car, DO NOT skimp here. If done properly, you should be around 150-155whp at this point, with a HUGE powerband, and a buttload of torque. Not bad for an unopened bottom end. You may also want to think about doing something with throttle body and intake manifold at this point.



10) Build your bottom end. You can have your crank machined to accept 3sgte rods to get rid of the main weak point of the 5sfe bottom end that prevents it from revving: the rod bolts are TINY. So.. machined crank, 3sgte rods (or just good aftermarket rods, stock crank), and high compression custom pistons, and you're in business.



This is really THE recipe to make a STRONG 5sfe and have it still be a 5sfe.



Spray on top of it if you like. Or just spray your stock motor.



If you want a turbo write up, go to Celicatech and read their stickies in the forced induction forum.

[asphalt victory]

yea ive noticed every littel thing on mine like synthetic oil is kindov like using 93 at the pump and although removing the back seat passenger seat (like 70 right there) spare tire make it a littel bit more responsive BUT on the highway she likes the weight for tracking...ive never seen such a complete wright up on a N/A 5sfe

[concealer404]

Hahah... that's not even a write-up lol... that's just a basic primer off the top of my head for 5sfe.

There's a whole forum at celicatech dedicated to NA tuning of the 5sfe. Great info there, some people doing really impressive things.

[asphalt victory]

yes it is refreshing to see someone not just say turbo/nitro ive been trying to create an account on celicatech but i cant figure it out (not windows compatable)