outrageus clutch estimate.

[nightrider36]

I called my local Toyota dealer to complain about my clutch or possibly tranny problem. No big deal... just a chat. I asked the 60k PT warranty and they said (as I expected) that they didn't cover the clutch.

My dealer's estimate was--just for the inspection, they call it a teardown-- $700.
I was drinking coffee at the time and I nearly spat it out all over my computer here at work... I said, "man, you didn't even flinch when you quoted that price? --And that's just the inspection, that's not even fixing it--are you serious?"

Apparently the dealership in Escondido, Ca. charges about $1500 to $2k for the job.

Then I called AAMCO... the shock was not as bad but still pricey. So... would you guys take it to someone else? like AAMCO?

My experience is with GMs--that's all I've ever owned and I'd take a GM to AAMCO because they've always done good work--but I don't know about a Toyota. I must say... I bought a Toyota because of the maintenance record... I'm shocked that the clutch went out at 50k, so's AAMCO... My 1996 Camaro's clutch lasted much longer-- 92,000 miles. I don't know... I may return to GM... so far, I'm not impressed.

[Frank@toronto]

charges about $1500 to $2k for the job

They charge that much to replace a clutch ?

[nightrider36]

Originally Posted by Frank@toronto

They charge that much to replace a clutch ?

yes, they do...

AAMCO quoted me $700 parts and labor and said that according to my description, they doubted that it would even go that high. But I asked the mechanic for the worst case scenario.

But yes, Toyota of Escondido, Ca charges $700 just to breakdown and examine your car's transmission. That does NOT include actually FIXING it--that's extra.

ridiculous...

[rwd_3tc]

first of all. dont get pissed about the price to fix it. you dont know how to drive manual. toyota clutches last at least 150000km or 93000mi. under normal driving conditions. you havent put into consideration on the labour cost 6-8 hours @110-120 dollars/hour plus parts. so i think its a fair deal on a dealership standpoint.

[toyomoho]

You can generally expect the dealer to have higher quotes on repairs and parts. The AAMCO price seems OK, also get quotes from smaller shops. The labor is what is driving the price up. Parts are not that pricy when purchased at your local parts store.

[nightrider36]

Originally Posted by rwd_3tc

first of all. dont get pissed about the price to fix it. you dont know how to drive manual. toyota clutches last at least 150000km or 93000mi. under normal driving conditions. you havent put into consideration on the labour cost 6-8 hours @110-120 dollars/hour plus parts. so i think its a fair deal on a dealership standpoint.

Boy, am I sorry that I said that word, "GM" on this forum...

First of all, you don't know me nor do you know how I drive. I'm a very careful driver and driving manual is not that hard to do...

• 82 Isuzy P'up -- sold it at 85k miles with the original clutch.
• 84 Pontiac Fiero - clutch went out at 106,000 miles.
• 89 GEO Metro - drove it till it died at 150k miles -- clutch never went out--amazing little car!
• 96 Camaro - xwife trashed the tranny and eventually the clutch at 92k miles.
• 04 Matrix XRS - clutch slipping at 50k miles... new wife won't drive the trix.

Does this look like the driving record of someone who doesn't know how to drive a stick?--that's all I've ever owned--I learned on a stick--please...

It's no secret that dealer repairs are a massive rip-off, I'm not alone on this opinion. But I thought I'd check with the dealer first... unfortunately, I was right. The internet is littered with stories of Matrix owners who's clutches all went out at about 30 to 40k miles. Toyota simply #ucked up on this tranny, mistakes happen, even in Japanese cars. But Toyota should not charge that much just to tell you that your car's got a problem--I already know that. Besides, the dealer is there to mostly to do warranty repairs--that's it.

I find it ironic though that I decided to buy a Toyota for the first time to cash in on that "Toyota dependability" and my car happens to have more problems than most of the GMs I've owned--I'm just bummed is all... and frankly, a little surprised. And I've babied this car more than any other car I've ever owned (prolly because I'm older now...)!

I have put cost of labor into consideration--I will pay to have this fixed because I love this little car. But other shops won't charge the inflated rate for labor that Toyota wants. How do you justify paying that much when everyone else is charging much less?

[camryvibe]

I'd keep looking for additional quotes. You're right that the dealer's prices are generally very high for that type of repair, but the AAMCO number looks on the high side to me as well. The clutch went out in my '87 Corolla (actually the Chevy nameplate version) a few years ago at 167,000 miles and I took it to a local specialized clutch shop. They put in a new one for under $300 that felt and worked just like the original. The new clutch now has about 60,000 miles on it without any problems.

The clutches on the Matrix XRS and it's GM clone, the Vibe GT, do seem to have many reports of premature failure. Haven't seen nearly as many reported problems with the regular Matrix base/XR and Vibe. At least I hope that's true since we bought our daughter (who learned to drive on the Corolla/Nova's original clutch) a regular Vibe with 5-speed manual.

[spin156]

Are any of these clutch problems on other than the 6spd XRS?

[wantin150]

The Matrix 6sp clutch is notoriously weak. All the doubters can keep their mouths closed until they drive one. Personally, I have 57K on my original clutch which is daily driven by my wife. The stock clutch was designed for the much lighter Celica GTS so it doesn't have the holding power and burns easily.

And for the record, my prior manual was a 1983 Nissan Pkp which I had the clutch replaced in at 103k. My current 2004 Tacoma 2.4l clutch is holding strong and is alot better than the Matrix, by far.

The replacement labor estimate I got was 6 hours (from Goodyear's software). So, $6-700 is probably correct. DO NOT use another OEM clutch, or even a TRD. Go with a decent aftermarket like ACT, Gripforce, Fidanza, etc. TOTAL, you should be looking at $1100.

[nightrider36]

Originally Posted by wantin150

The Matrix 6sp clutch is notoriously weak. All the doubters can keep their mouths closed until they drive one. Personally, I have 57K on my original clutch which is daily driven by my wife. The stock clutch was designed for the much lighter Celica GTS so it doesn't have the holding power and burns easily.

And for the record, my prior manual was a 1983 Nissan Pkp which I had the clutch replaced in at 103k. My current 2004 Tacoma 2.4l clutch is holding strong and is alot better than the Matrix, by far.

The replacement labor estimate I got was 6 hours (from Goodyear's software). So, $6-700 is probably correct. DO NOT use another OEM clutch, or even a TRD. Go with a decent aftermarket like ACT, Gripforce, Fidanza, etc. TOTAL, you should be looking at $1100.

Hm... I may have to shop around then because AAMCO told me that they will only install and OEM clutch--IF that's the problem--they haven't looked at it and I'm still assuming that the problem is the clutch. Apparently, AAMCO's run into too many problems when they install parts that the customer requested. This seems to be a standing policy that this particular shop has. I didn't think that a clutch was one of those things that a shop could get burned on--they wear and tear but that's all.

[wantin150]

"Some" of the aftermarket clutches require an extended push rod which needs to be installed at the tranny inorder for the clutch to completely disengage. This maybe the reason for their policy. The Goodyear I frequent would pretty much do it for me "after hours" and I would pay the tech directly. I'm going to assist if possible to get the experience. I would attempt it myself but I don't have the "down time" necessary. Mine is still good but I'm shopping now. The Fidanza 3.2 looks pretty good. A lot of Matrix parts can be found at NeverEnoughAuto.com from Brad. He's a great guy to deal with. Excellent prices and great service.

[nightrider36]

Originally Posted by wantin150

"Some" of the aftermarket clutches require an extended push rod which needs to be installed at the tranny inorder for the clutch to completely disengage. This maybe the reason for their policy. The Goodyear I frequent would pretty much do it for me "after hours" and I would pay the tech directly. I'm going to assist if possible to get the experience. I would attempt it myself but I don't have the "down time" necessary. Mine is still good but I'm shopping now. The Fidanza 3.2 looks pretty good. A lot of Matrix parts can be found at NeverEnoughAuto.com from Brad. He's a great guy to deal with. Excellent prices and great service.

Ok, so... I guess my next set of questions are. What should I look for in a good clutch for the Matrix XRS's peculiar configuration?

Why would the extended push-rod installed at the tranny matter for AAMCO's policy?

[wantin150]

The "puck" style are a little harsher engagement that the "full" faced. The Fidanza 3.2 is a sprung hub 4 puck kevlar faced which is 1 step up from their full faced kevlar/carbon "OEM" style. Kevlar (according to them) can be abused once broken in. OEM is organic, and once burned, it's toast. Visit Fidanza.com for a really good informative video. Regardless of whether or not you get a Fidanza, the information is really good. And no, I don't work for them.

If aftermarket clutches need additional parts (and you didn't know this), you would think that any issues would be installation related and be going back to them for the fix. OEM fits everytime (or should anyway) and they know this and have adopted their policy accordingly.