But this is the same type of "proof" that a dozen other companies that sell magnets of the same "quality" as the vortex have been publishing for years.
Do a google search on "Magnets fuel savings" and you can quickly compile a list of magnet suppliers that claim the same or better than vortex with longer lists of testimonials etc.
I know your not into actually trying to understand what the magnets could be doing but I see some shit in these testimonials that just don't make sense, for instance:
CO2 is a natural product of combustion and doesn't get reduced unless you burn less gas. What test are they doing, they must have burned only 22% of the gas, no wonder the other emissions went down, this isn't apples to apples. Oh you don't care that this doesn't make any sense. They should be claiming a 450% increase in mpg if they used only 22% of the fuel?
$500 - http://www.americanfuelsavers.com/ - this one must really work. This one at least answers the intake and coolant question. "charge on incoming air, encouraging a more homogeneous mixture of oxygen and atomized fuel in the combustion chamber", and "Reduced build-up of residues and scale in fuel and cooling systems (avoid unnecessary wear on engine fluid system)." Wonder why vortex doesn't even tout these awesome advantages?
Proably most of these don't work because they cost a lot less and most don't have the guts to claim strapping them on the intake and coolant has any effect.
That took all of 20 minutes, I'm sure there are dozens more, but I can guarantee you not a single one has actually had a "drive-cycle rolling-road test" to prove once and for all that their product DOESN'T work. They will stick to bogus uncontrolled testimonials.
__________________ 2005 Impulse Red 4x2 Access cab 2.7L 5-speed SR5.
Last edited by worthywads; 10-28-2008 at 08:11 PM.
That actually the intake spinner, not the Vortex magnet. But PM also found no results with 2 "Miracle magnets". Of course the Vortex magnet is different so they didn't debunk it.
__________________ 2005 Impulse Red 4x2 Access cab 2.7L 5-speed SR5.
That actually the intake spinner, not the Vortex magnet. But PM also found no results with 2 "Miracle magnets". Of course the Vortex magnet is different so they didn't debunk it.
Yeah, whatever, they are all "Snake Oil" gimmicks that someone is making money off of. Like they say, there is a sucker born every minute.
Let him waste his time and money on it. It's his loss.
I still find it funny how all of these gimmicks...er, inventions that claim to work so well and save fuel, yet none of the automotive companies use them, even though they are required by the gov't (CAFE) to maximize efficiency. How do they hide these secrets from them?
But you just know that MAC13 has no choice but to make a claim of huge gains after all this. I can get 18mpg or 37mpg depending on how I drive, surely MAC13 will claim (justify in his mind) that he didn't change his driving to get the big gains we will hear about very soon.
__________________ 2005 Impulse Red 4x2 Access cab 2.7L 5-speed SR5.
Last edited by worthywads; 10-28-2008 at 08:26 PM.
But you just know that MAC13 has no choice but to make a claim of huge gains after all this. I can get 18mpg or 37mpg depending on how I drive, surely MAC13 will claim (justify in his mind) that he didn't change his driving to get the big gains we will hear about very soon.
Yep, it's called the MPG Placebo effect. People install these gimmicks, then naturally drive much more conservatively since they are monitoring their mileage and trying to maximize it.
Hell, I can increase my mileage by 2-3 MPGs just by resetting the Avg MPG on the DIC and leaving it displayed and monitoring it.
My thing is they have worked on my buddy's car who drives like a nut. So sorry about the whole Placebo effect. Also did you not see the Actual testing report (Below) http://vortexfuelsaver.com/doc/IrrigationPump.pdf
It is their letterhead on the first page (summary of report) but the other two are letterhead from a testing company. which debunks everything you just said.
Then there is this guy (also on the website0 Prof from Temple http://vortexfuelsaver.com/literature_32.html
which basically shows the testing he did that got around 20% savings in Diesel fuel. Which goes right along with the trucking company that is using the diesel systems on their 18 wheelers getting 19%
I still can not get over that fine do not try it but when you have REAL companies using the systems and cities using the systems with them ALL saying they have increased fuel mileage I just find it hard to believe these places would be lying. What would be the gain for these places to lie???
I am not trying to sell you guys on this systems just letting people know what is working and who has tried it.
The coolant magnet is to keep the engine running cooler which does help.
My mileage will be easy to tell as I do a lot of highway miles so being able to slow down or BABY my mileage would be hard. I know what kind of Miles I am getting and will tell the people who want to know. Like one of you said it probably all in my head. YEAH RIGHT I will know one way another and tell you if you are right or wrong about the system.
as for the manufactors do you really think they are the only people that would be able to invent this stuff? Seriously, GM originally had the go on the Electric car and then bagged it. Now 5 years later there are like 32 companies that make HIGH end electric cars. The guy from GM was on 20/20 like 2 weeks ago saying they MIGHT have made a bad decision
My thing is they have worked on my buddy's car who drives like a nut. So sorry about the whole Placebo effect. Also did you not see the Actual testing report (Below) http://vortexfuelsaver.com/doc/IrrigationPump.pdf
It is their letterhead on the first page (summary of report) but the other two are letterhead from a testing company. which debunks everything you just said.
Lot of tests over a short period of time, didnt see how they were accurately measuring the fuel use? Debunks? Not enough info to debunk anything, just enough to make you the chump.
Quote:
Originally Posted by chump13
Then there is this guy (also on the website0 Prof from Temple http://vortexfuelsaver.com/literature_32.html
which basically shows the testing he did that got around 20% savings in Diesel fuel. Which goes right along with the trucking company that is using the diesel systems on their 18 wheelers getting 19%
Next one let's be clear, you've said Vortex magnets are special, but "proof" source says, "To be clear, this device is NOT a Vortex Fuel Saver, though the same fuel saving physics would apply."
That's Vortex's using someone elses research that has NOTHING to do with vortex, they don't know that Vortex exists.
I didn't see ANYWHERE in vortex's proof that viscosity had anything to do with the improvements which is the basis for this results, and Temple University is trying to patent this as original, not proof of Vortex's worth?
How can you accept this is PROOF for Vortex when any magnet company can claim Temple as PROOF of their magnets just like Vortex?
I still can not get over that fine do not try it but when you have REAL companies using the systems and cities using the systems with them ALL saying they have increased fuel mileage I just find it hard to believe these places would be lying. What would be the gain for these places to lie???
So the first paragraph after the VORTEX header is
"In June 2008, Vortex commenced a beta-test on four heavy duty diesel trucks for LaMonica Fine Foods, a division of Cape May Foods, Inc., Millville, New Jersey."
I can't see how you think that isn't sponsored by Vortex, just like every other fleet source that you trust. Face it, Vortex commenced this test, like all the rest, this one just has the most revealing evidence. None of these PROOFS are independent of Vortex.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mac13
The coolant magnet is to keep the engine running cooler which does help.
I don't see any magnet maker claiming the engine will run cooler and that it "does help", where are you getting this new claim from? I don't find that anywhere on the Vortex site? Can you show me. Vortex's "How it Works" doesn't even mention the intake or coolant magnets? Thermostats control engine temperature, not magnets.
I'm starting to think you work for Vortex, you are too convinced even before you have run your first tank with this BS snake oil, making claims that even Vortex doesn't on their site.
__________________ 2005 Impulse Red 4x2 Access cab 2.7L 5-speed SR5.
Last edited by worthywads; 10-30-2008 at 08:10 PM.
You are the type of person that even if they saw results they would be embarrassed to say they did because of all the BS you are trying to make up. Listen I do not work for the company and i DID just install it on my car. I only bought it and told people about it because my buddy had good results.
I will let the people on here with the OPEN MINDS what kind of results I got. I could really care less if you buy one or not. It does not affect my wallet like it is in the coming months on your wallet. I guess the cities and trucking companies and fleet owners ALL work for Vortex Fuel Saver (magnetic system as a couple of you think it is that crappy Metal thing in the Air intake) as well. I guess they are willing to lose their jobs by RECOMMENDING this product or letting Vortex use their name on the website. Sometimes people like yourself just kill me.
Not ONE person on here said they have used the product (the actual Vortex Fuel Saver and not just some other type of magnetic fuel system) and said it did not work. So I am going on a CLOSE firend's advise that i have known for years and that got over 20% INCREASE in MPG instead of some BLOWHARD with nothing better to do then pretend they know everything.
Good day and keep spending ove 20% more then me at the pump!!!!!
You are the type of person that even if they saw results they would be embarrassed to say they did because of all the BS you are trying to make up. Listen I do not work for the company and i DID just install it on my car. I only bought it and told people about it because my buddy had good results.
I will let the people on here with the OPEN MINDS what kind of results I got. I could really care less if you buy one or not. It does not affect my wallet like it is in the coming months on your wallet. I guess the cities and trucking companies and fleet owners ALL work for Vortex Fuel Saver (magnetic system as a couple of you think it is that crappy Metal thing in the Air intake) as well. I guess they are willing to lose their jobs by RECOMMENDING this product or letting Vortex use their name on the website. Sometimes people like yourself just kill me.
Not ONE person on here said they have used the product (the actual Vortex Fuel Saver and not just some other type of magnetic fuel system) and said it did not work. So I am going on a CLOSE firend's advise that i have known for years and that got over 20% INCREASE in MPG instead of some BLOWHARD with nothing better to do then pretend they know everything.
Good day and keep spending ove 20% more then me at the pump!!!!!
Know what kills me?
Every auto mfr out there spends millions and millions of dollars in R&D money every year trying to squeeze out every single fraction of an MPG they can get. Yet they ignore these "Snake Oils" that can net them 20% better MPGs for pennies on the dollar compared to what they are spending.
If these things truly did what you claim, they would be mandated by the EPA in every car made.
Every auto mfr out here spends millions and millions of dollars in R&D money every year trying to squeeze out every single fraction of an MPG they can get. Yet they ignore these "Snake Oils" that can net them 20% better MPGs for pennies on the dollar compared to what they are spending.
If these things truly did what you claim, they would be mandated by the EPA in every car made.
But hey, good luck!!!
It's the automotive world's version of the perpetual motion "free energy" machine and scam. It's universal, baby, ain't nothin' for free....
TrailDust
__________________
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2008 Highlander Base 4WD
2002 Avalon XL
1987 Suzuki Samurai 4X4 - Treading where no Jeep can follow....
It's a classic scam where they use pseudo-science to confuse people with no education into thinking it might work.
From the Vortex web site:
Quote:
Fuel molecules naturally have a self affinity for one another causing them to group together, resembling a cluster of grapes. When a like charge is added to the fuel (any hydrogen based fuel) it causes the molecules to repel each other -- separating them from the cluster into individual molecules. If a "grape cluster" of fuel molecules enters the combustion chamber, the "grapes" on the outside get burned while the ones on the inside may only get partially burned. Additionally, Vortex adds magnets to the air line of the opposite charge, thus the fuel and air are attracted to one another to create the ideal air/fuel ratio.
Fuel does like to stick together. However, hydrocarbons are unaffected by magnetic fields. Air is also unaffected by magnetic fields. They don't interact with magnetic fields like iron. They are not repelled or attracted by magnetic fields. Also, you can't make them charged by putting them in magnetic fields.
The claim that the fuel molecules in the middle of the combustion chamber somehow don't burn is just stupid. The spark plug is located in the middle of the combustion chamber. It is where the reaction between fuel and air starts, in the middle. It's not like that matters anyways, as the reaction happens at a very small timescale, which is why it is an explosion, and can be used to drive the cylinder in the first place. Once the spark plug goes off all the fuel molecules in the combustion chamber react with oxygen essentially at the same time, and almost all of them react. Also, air fills the combustion chamber evenly because it is a gas. Fuel is also forced into the gas phase by the carburetor or fuel injection. Fuel and air is distributed evenly in the combustion chamber since they are gases at that point. They are not in clusters.
Somehow I feel like I'm wasting my time by saying all this because you are obviously not interested in how anything works. Everything your friend says is holy, and there is a giant conspiracy to keep scamers, I mean inventors, from improving gas mileage by "magnetizing" fuel and air.
Open minded? Have you ever considered the possibility your friend is wrong? Have you actually read the information about how this "Vortex fuel saver" can't work instead of bitching about "BLOWHARDS who don't know anything"? Obviously not. To me it it you who is not open minded because you blindly agree with all the information that supports your friend, and you dismiss all the information that doesn't support him without even reading it, thinking about it, and taking it seriously.
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They will stick to bogus uncontrolled testimonials.
2005 Impulse Red 4x2 Access cab 2.7L 5-speed SR5.
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