A broad question. What do you intend to do with your MKIII. With that in mind, suggestions become easier. If it's just to have a set of coilovers without any performance considerations, look for the pretty ones.
Not knowing your track time to date, I'd say that if this is early in your autox life (under 20 events), the stock car still has more capability than the driver will take advantage of. If that is the case, it's more about fashion and the sporty feel than purely function and starting with the Tein SS or perhaps a gently used set of HA's will get you happy for appearance and street ride, and give you room to grow as your driving skill improves.
im considering coil overs as well. i dont care about looks at all. i want to just boost the handling for some spirited daily driving. im going to go with sway bars as well, will the coil overs still be worth it without any track time planned?
i know im not taking the car to its handling limits, but i want to plan ahead and grow into the car if i can. rather than do small jumps in upgrades. figure with handling you can never have to much if you can afford it....?
Actually, you can have too much. For street only, with potential for a couple of lapping days or autox events, I'd suggest sways, springs and dampers. Koni and Eibach to be exact. About as much as you'd want on the streets, and up for some extra duty. If I was smarter a few years back, I would have saved myself a grand or so over the coilovers I purchased. Don't get me wrong, I don't regret getting them, and ride height/damping adjustment is from time to time a useful set of features, but I'm also very aware the money would have been better spent purchasing other things given the squishy bushing behind the steering wheel is far less up to the task of handling than the car was. The trifecta of sways springs and dampers could be had for under $1100 all in, where the coilovers were in the $1700 neighborhood plus a couple of hundred for balancing.
In speaking with a couple of race drivers, and those that have done the racing schools, everyone has clearly convinced me that the car can almost always do better than the driver can extract, and of course that once you start to exceed the car, it is the tires that are the real first limiting factor. Stock suspensions on slicks with a decent driver will often outrun a fully spent on suspension car on any tire less than them...even faster if the driver mod has not been performed!
Actually, you can have too much. For street only, with potential for a couple of lapping days or autox events, I'd suggest sways, springs and dampers. Koni and Eibach to be exact. About as much as you'd want on the streets, and up for some extra duty. If I was smarter a few years back, I would have saved myself a grand or so over the coilovers I purchased. Don't get me wrong, I don't regret getting them, and ride height/damping adjustment is from time to time a useful set of features, but I'm also very aware the money would have been better spent purchasing other things given the squishy bushing behind the steering wheel is far less up to the task of handling than the car was. The trifecta of sways springs and dampers could be had for under $1100 all in, where the coilovers were in the $1700 neighborhood plus a couple of hundred for balancing.
In speaking with a couple of race drivers, and those that have done the racing schools, everyone has clearly convinced me that the car can almost always do better than the driver can extract, and of course that once you start to exceed the car, it is the tires that are the real first limiting factor. Stock suspensions on slicks with a decent driver will often outrun a fully spent on suspension car on any tire less than them...even faster if the driver mod has not been performed!
ok great info, now you got me thinking the oppesite way haha.
what about cheaper coil over ive seen TEIN FLEXs for like 1200$... the price difference isnt that much(compared to 1100$ for springs damgers). even the cheaper TEIN SS are under 900$. the ride height/dampening would be nice. i live near some really bumpy rough roads, if i knew id be on them mostly it might be cool to soften the supension up a bit. im looking for a nice stiff slightly lowered ride basically. im worried if i go springs/dampers ill lowerer the car too much and be to stiff for the nasty roads. if i keep it near stock it wont be as low/stiff as id like...
it would be nice to save money and still get a nice non-coil over suspenion though
The flex were the 1700 set. I was one of the first 2 to get them in North America when they came out (had to get them grey market from Japan...tein USA was only about to start up at the time). I paid through the nose, but I was younger and really hadn't matured in realizing where money was best spent versus just having to get the "best I could afford"...not that all that much has changed as I still tend to go overboard just to have things, but I weigh those tradeoffs more now.
Given the price of the ss, I'd say they are a real choice now. They are basically the same as the discontinued Tein HA, but don't have the progressive helper spring. The Koni/Eibach combo are in the neighborhood for price ($750ish), and I would expect them to ride roughly the same as the SS, given the flex feel about the same as the Koni/Eibach cars I've driven on and use almost the same spring rates as the ss.
The Eibach are not too low IMO, and offer plenty of clearance while still looking great. In fact, if you use the tein recommended settings, they drop the car another 1/2 inch lower than the springs do, although you can adjust the ride height if you choose. I personally ride lower than H&R do by a hair using the factory setting (10 cm of ground clearance at the frame per tein, or ~4 inches of clearance...I can't use jiffy lube for a quick oil change as the guards over the pits are too high to clear the frame rails, not that it was a frequent choice, and automatic car washes are a complete no-no, again from the guide rail rubbing the frame).
The flex were the 1700 set. I was one of the first 2 to get them in North America when they came out (had to get them grey market from Japan...tein USA was only about to start up at the time). I paid through the nose, but I was younger and really hadn't matured in realizing where money was best spent versus just having to get the "best I could afford"...not that all that much has changed as I still tend to go overboard just to have things, but I weigh those tradeoffs more now.
Given the price of the ss, I'd say they are a real choice now. They are basically the same as the discontinued Tein HA, but don't have the progressive helper spring. The Koni/Eibach combo are in the neighborhood for price ($750ish), and I would expect them to ride roughly the same as the SS, given the flex feel about the same as the Koni/Eibach cars I've driven on and use almost the same spring rates as the ss.
The Eibach are not too low IMO, and offer plenty of clearance while still looking great. In fact, if you use the tein recommended settings, they drop the car another 1/2 inch lower than the springs do, although you can adjust the ride height if you choose. I personally ride lower than H&R do by a hair using the factory setting (10 cm of ground clearance at the frame per tein, or ~4 inches of clearance...I can't use jiffy lube for a quick oil change as the guards over the pits are too high to clear the frame rails, not that it was a frequent choice, and automatic car washes are a complete no-no, again from the guide rail rubbing the frame).
cool again thanks for all the info, certainly have me thinking now. if the SS is comparable to the koni/eibach but adds that adjustability for a few extra bucks, im leaning that way for the moment still.
what kind of issues are there with coilovers in the long run? can you have them rebuilt, is it pricey, or once they seen too many miles you just have to replace them? i just bought a ohlins racing suspension for my motorcycle, a big selling point of it was the ability to rebuild them as needed rather than replace.
which setup do you think would handle the seriously bumpy roads better or would they be equal in that area(aside from adjust ability). also how are speed bumps, can you clear them normally or have problems? every where i go heres theres speed bumps ;\
given the springs are matched to the dampers well in each case, the ride will be pretty much the same. Speedbumps I have to be very careful of, but I could raise the car 1/2 inch and be fairly OK as well, I'm just enjoying hte low ride too much .
The Tein flex are rebuildable and you can order the rebuild kt. I don't know if the ss are. If you can get the rebuild kit from a Tein dealer, any place that does suspension rebuilding can do it, and in a pinch Tein USA can also do the rebuilds...you need to send the kit to them of course. I've had no issues with mine, but they've onle seen a couple of seasons.
I have been racing dirt track for 13 years, so it is an issue of the car not being able to keep up wit the driver mod. If i am willing to spend the 1400 for the flex kit, is the performance work it? does anyone know the part number the for an Eibach system similiar to the Tein Flex kit?
The flex setup will benefit from sways. I actually find in certain larger dips and undulations in the streets I have almost bottomed out the front end with the Flex on stock sway bars, and the tires have gotten up into the plastic inner fender a couple of times. My original thought was to replace Flex kit 12kg front springs with 14kg similar to the ones the Tein SS systems run, but now that I've got the sway bars coming in, I'll see how things go with them before changing springs out. Of course, this is the big advantage of having rebuildable coilovers with independent ride height and spring preload adjustment such as the Flex...if you want to change the settings, you can. The up front entry cost is higher, but you have the benefit to experiment at a lower cost later.
If you prefer a spring and damper focused setup over sways, you may find them a little too soft. My thoughts at this point are that using them with upgraded sways should make for a more street friendly setup than say the Tein RA or the JIC FLT, with enough in reserve for the little bit of track type stuff I like to do.
Eibach does not make a coilover kit for us, but some have done custom rate Koni dampers with the eibach's and adjustible spring seats to create coilovers. Nobody here that I'm aware of has though.
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