09 xB, Test drove one today, is the throttle delay normal? gets better?

[blueapple]

So I went to the local dealer and test drove the only Manual they had, the car drove well, steering was better than what I originally expected.... But this is what bugged me the whole time:

Throttle delay, when I up shift, I do it as I do on my other cars, lift throttle simultaneously with clutch depression (A split second before, actually). And what I noticed is that, instead of RPM dropping, it goes up another 700RPM or so before coming back done. Blipping the throttle on down shift seems a bit delayed as well, it does climb, but never seem to synchronize with my foot. After driving it for a little bit, I realized, the only way to drive this thing smooth, is to time my shifting by letting out the throttle almost a second before I disengage the clutch... this is just annoying the hell out of me, what's the point of a manual if I have to "wait" on the car.

I figured this is caused by the electronic throttle, probably programmed this way for emission purposes. I'd like to know, does it go away? Does the ECU learn that I need it to respond faster? or is this just how Toyota is nowadays? Among all the electronically throttled cars I've test driven, This one has by far the longest delay, even worse than the Camry I test drove, which is odd, they are the same engine, and the xB should technically be programmed more sporty.


Thanks!

[HATEnFATE]

I've noticed that the throttle delay doesn't seem to be an issue with me as much as a total lack of pedal feedback from the clutch pedal. I've had my xB 2 years now and still have trouble getting smooth shifts and it's because I can't feel where the disc starts to engage the flywheel/pressureplate.

[Timm099]

that is just how it is designed, it never changes, its not bad just different, you have to learn to live with it. Tacomas are like that too. When beating on an x runner it always hits rev limiter in between shifts.

[blueapple]

That's just moronic.... I can only assume Toyota's drive train engineers don't know how to drive manual...

[boxdin]

I have been looking for something to replace my current daily, and well, the new xB was at the top of this list, but with that little bit of a delay toyota lost themselves a sale... I have had one for a couple of occasions and it and I just dont jive. Im not sure exactly what to think (or who to blame for the matter) but it just isnt kosher, and yet another thing that makes me like my first gen just a little bit more

[HATEnFATE]

If you take your time shifting, it goes a little easier. If I'm shifting fast, I'll jerk the car a little but if I take my time between shifts....smooth as glass.

[TrevorS]

Originally Posted by blueapple

So I went to the local dealer and test drove the only Manual they had, the car drove well, steering was better than what I originally expected.... But this is what bugged me the whole time:

Throttle delay, when I up shift, I do it as I do on my other cars, lift throttle simultaneously with clutch depression (A split second before, actually). And what I noticed is that, instead of RPM dropping, it goes up another 700RPM or so before coming back done. Blipping the throttle on down shift seems a bit delayed as well, it does climb, but never seem to synchronize with my foot. After driving it for a little bit, I realized, the only way to drive this thing smooth, is to time my shifting by letting out the throttle almost a second before I disengage the clutch... this is just annoying the hell out of me, what's the point of a manual if I have to "wait" on the car.

I figured this is caused by the electronic throttle, probably programmed this way for emission purposes. I'd like to know, does it go away? Does the ECU learn that I need it to respond faster? or is this just how Toyota is nowadays? Among all the electronically throttled cars I've test driven, This one has by far the longest delay, even worse than the Camry I test drove, which is odd, they are the same engine, and the xB should technically be programmed more sporty.


Thanks!

I expect the throttle release behavior is indeed related to emissions, and I agree it's an annoyance, however -- as mentioned, it can be worked around. An effective solution is to accelerate and shift in a calm and relaxed manner, which reduces the overshoot plus allows time for a closer rpm match when re-engaging the clutch. The other is to make a point of releasing the throttle in advance of depressing the clutch, for me, somewhere around 1/2 sec or less seems to work pretty well.

I like manual shift cars and the switch to that behavior is jarring, but given a little practice, it's not hard to adapt to. I feel the vehicle has enough positives going for it, I can live with that flaw. I wouldn't be surpised iif some degree of that behavior is fairly typical in modern economy cars, though I really don't know.

[motoretro]

I have a 09 Tacoma 4 cylinder manual & it's not a problem as long as your not really tripping through the gears.....I have driven new Gen XB's and know just what you're talking about. You do get use to it, it just takes a couple hours of constant shifting to sort things out. I test drove a Nissan Frontier 6 speed/V6 combo once and really had a rough time getting smooth with it. The delay just really threw me. The best DBW vehicle I've experienced was a 01 VW New Beetle w/ 5 speed/ Turbo 1.8 combo, silky smooth, no delay. Keep practicing.

Motoretro

[MattK&NFilters]

Man that lack of response is really unfortunate. Hopefully it'll learn the driving habits of the owner like most OBD2 DBW cars do, but it sounds like it may not. You might also want to look into aftermarket throttle controllers like Blitz. If they have one for the xB it'll definitely help with that throttle issue.