OT: Discrimination?

[url]http://www.nbc4i.com/news/5070718/detail.html[/url]

I think if the sign said, "No non-English-speakers allowed", but that
doesn't appear to be the case. Unless I read it wrong, it looks like they
want to make it clear that the current staff can only speak English - it
didn't appear to make any demands. Thoughts?

Natalie

--




[url]http://www.dwarfstar.net[/url]

The best internet relay chat network in the entire world!

"Wicked little doll, you are not human;
Wicked little doll, you have no soul"
(David Byrne, 1997)

"Wickeddoll®" <wickeddoll1958DIEspammersDIE@yahoo.com> wrote in
news:dij6dr.2hc.1@news.evilcabal.org:
[color=blue]
> [url]http://www.nbc4i.com/news/5070718/detail.html[/url]
>
> I think if the sign said, "No non-English-speakers allowed", but that
> doesn't appear to be the case. Unless I read it wrong, it looks like
> they want to make it clear that the current staff can only speak
> English - it didn't appear to make any demands. Thoughts?
>[/color]


What a bunch of pinheads. Guess they haven't got anything else to keep
their pointy little minds occupied.

Maybe the sign should have said:
"Come right in and babble your order in whatever tongue you choose. If we
just stand there and drool at you, try another language. If none of your
languages get a response from our English-speaking staff, you may wish to
try English.
The text of this sign is not available in any other languages that you may
know or not know."

Perhaps a sign like that would bore people to death in front of the store,
and they'd be in even deeper doo-doo because of all the corpses.


--
TeGGeR®

"TeGGeR®" <tegger@tegger.c0m> wrote in message
news:Xns96ED9AD6FC614tegger@207.14.113.17...[color=blue]
> "Wickeddoll®" <wickeddoll1958DIEspammersDIE@yahoo.com> wrote in
> news:dij6dr.2hc.1@news.evilcabal.org:
>[color=green]
>> [url]http://www.nbc4i.com/news/5070718/detail.html[/url]
>>
>> I think if the sign said, "No non-English-speakers allowed", but that
>> doesn't appear to be the case. Unless I read it wrong, it looks like
>> they want to make it clear that the current staff can only speak
>> English - it didn't appear to make any demands. Thoughts?
>>[/color]
>
>
> What a bunch of pinheads. Guess they haven't got anything else to keep
> their pointy little minds occupied.[/color]

*shrug*[color=blue]
>
> Maybe the sign should have said:
> "Come right in and babble your order in whatever tongue you choose. If we
> just stand there and drool at you, try another language. If none of your
> languages get a response from our English-speaking staff, you may wish to
> try English.
> The text of this sign is not available in any other languages that you may
> know or not know."[/color]

LOL - oh man, that would make the ACLU go into convulsions[color=blue]
>
> Perhaps a sign like that would bore people to death in front of the store,
> and they'd be in even deeper doo-doo because of all the corpses.
>
>
> --
> TeGGeR®
>[/color]

hehehe - you are unwell

Natalie

On Wed, 12 Oct 2005 15:21:41 -0400, Wickeddoll® wrote:
[color=blue]
>
> "TeGGeR®" <tegger@tegger.c0m> wrote in message
> news:Xns96ED9AD6FC614tegger@207.14.113.17...[color=green]
>> "Wickeddoll®" <wickeddoll1958DIEspammersDIE@yahoo.com> wrote in
>> news:dij6dr.2hc.1@news.evilcabal.org:
>>[color=darkred]
>>> [url]http://www.nbc4i.com/news/5070718/detail.html[/url]
>>>
>>> I think if the sign said, "No non-English-speakers allowed", but that
>>> doesn't appear to be the case. Unless I read it wrong, it looks like
>>> they want to make it clear that the current staff can only speak
>>> English - it didn't appear to make any demands. Thoughts?
>>>[/color]
>>
>>
>> What a bunch of pinheads. Guess they haven't got anything else to keep
>> their pointy little minds occupied.[/color]
>
> *shrug*[color=green]
>>
>> Maybe the sign should have said:
>> "Come right in and babble your order in whatever tongue you choose. If we
>> just stand there and drool at you, try another language. If none of your
>> languages get a response from our English-speaking staff, you may wish to
>> try English.
>> The text of this sign is not available in any other languages that you may
>> know or not know."[/color]
>
> LOL - oh man, that would make the ACLU go into convulsions[color=green]
>>
>> Perhaps a sign like that would bore people to death in front of the store,
>> and they'd be in even deeper doo-doo because of all the corpses.
>>
>>
>> --
>> TeGGeR®
>>[/color]
>
> hehehe - you are unwell[/color]

I like that in a person!
[color=blue]
>
> Natalie[/color]

"Hachiroku"[color=blue]
> On Wed, 12 Oct 2005 15:21:41 -0400, Wickeddoll® wrote:
>[color=green]
>>
>> "TeGGeR>>>[color=darkred]
>>>> [url]http://www.nbc4i.com/news/5070718/detail.html[/url]
>>>>
>>>> I think if the sign said, "No non-English-speakers allowed", but that
>>>> doesn't appear to be the case. Unless I read it wrong, it looks like
>>>> they want to make it clear that the current staff can only speak
>>>> English - it didn't appear to make any demands. Thoughts?
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> What a bunch of pinheads. Guess they haven't got anything else to keep
>>> their pointy little minds occupied.[/color]
>>
>> *shrug*[color=darkred]
>>>
>>> Maybe the sign should have said:
>>> "Come right in and babble your order in whatever tongue you choose. If
>>> we
>>> just stand there and drool at you, try another language. If none of your
>>> languages get a response from our English-speaking staff, you may wish
>>> to
>>> try English.
>>> The text of this sign is not available in any other languages that you
>>> may
>>> know or not know."[/color]
>>
>> LOL - oh man, that would make the ACLU go into convulsions[color=darkred]
>>>
>>> Perhaps a sign like that would bore people to death in front of the
>>> store,
>>> and they'd be in even deeper doo-doo because of all the corpses.
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> TeGGeR®
>>>[/color]
>>
>> hehehe - you are unwell[/color]
>
> I like that in a person![/color]

I posted this on one of my favorite boards, and here is one response, that I
think is best so far:

This is a privately-owned business, and there is thus absolutely no legal
requirement that the owner learn Spanish, much less take orders in that
language. If customers don't speak English, all he has to do is shrug and
say, "I'm sorry, I don't understand you," and they'll have to find a way to
communicate to him some other way if they want to be served a drink.
(Pointing to what they want, asking a friend to order for them, whatever.)

The sign is therefore completely unnecessary from a legal perspective. All
it does is make it clear that the owner has a chip on his shoulder and
doesn't like Spanish-speaking people. Its true purpose is pretty obvious to
me: to make those customers feel unwelcome and discourage them from coming
in at all. Not to mention if he enforced his "policy" literally he *would*
be discriminating -- as long as the customer can come up with some way of
communicating what he wants (drawing a picture of a beer on a napkin if need
be!) the owner can't refuse service just because the guy can't speak
English.

(Jay)

On Wed, 12 Oct 2005 16:18:47 -0400, Wickeddoll® wrote:
[color=blue]
>
> "Hachiroku"[color=green]
>> On Wed, 12 Oct 2005 15:21:41 -0400, Wickeddoll® wrote:
>>[color=darkred]
>>>
>>> "TeGGeR>>>
>>>>> [url]http://www.nbc4i.com/news/5070718/detail.html[/url]
>>>>>
>>>>> I think if the sign said, "No non-English-speakers allowed", but that
>>>>> doesn't appear to be the case. Unless I read it wrong, it looks like
>>>>> they want to make it clear that the current staff can only speak
>>>>> English - it didn't appear to make any demands. Thoughts?
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> What a bunch of pinheads. Guess they haven't got anything else to keep
>>>> their pointy little minds occupied.
>>>
>>> *shrug*
>>>>
>>>> Maybe the sign should have said:
>>>> "Come right in and babble your order in whatever tongue you choose. If
>>>> we
>>>> just stand there and drool at you, try another language. If none of your
>>>> languages get a response from our English-speaking staff, you may wish
>>>> to
>>>> try English.
>>>> The text of this sign is not available in any other languages that you
>>>> may
>>>> know or not know."
>>>
>>> LOL - oh man, that would make the ACLU go into convulsions
>>>>
>>>> Perhaps a sign like that would bore people to death in front of the
>>>> store,
>>>> and they'd be in even deeper doo-doo because of all the corpses.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> TeGGeR®
>>>>
>>>
>>> hehehe - you are unwell[/color]
>>
>> I like that in a person![/color]
>
> I posted this on one of my favorite boards, and here is one response, that I
> think is best so far:
>
> This is a privately-owned business, and there is thus absolutely no legal
> requirement that the owner learn Spanish, much less take orders in that
> language. If customers don't speak English, all he has to do is shrug and
> say, "I'm sorry, I don't understand you," and they'll have to find a way to
> communicate to him some other way if they want to be served a drink.
> (Pointing to what they want, asking a friend to order for them, whatever.)
>
> The sign is therefore completely unnecessary from a legal perspective. All
> it does is make it clear that the owner has a chip on his shoulder and
> doesn't like Spanish-speaking people. Its true purpose is pretty obvious to
> me: to make those customers feel unwelcome and discourage them from coming
> in at all. Not to mention if he enforced his "policy" literally he *would*
> be discriminating -- as long as the customer can come up with some way of
> communicating what he wants (drawing a picture of a beer on a napkin if need
> be!) the owner can't refuse service just because the guy can't speak
> English.
>
> (Jay)[/color]


Que?

"Hachiroku" <Trueno@ae86.gts> wrote in message
news:pan.2005.10.12.21.24.49.27154@ae86.gts...[color=blue]
> On Wed, 12 Oct 2005 16:18:47 -0400, Wickeddoll® wrote:
>[color=green]
>>
>> "Hachiroku"[color=darkred]
>>> On Wed, 12 Oct 2005 15:21:41 -0400, Wickeddoll® wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> "TeGGeR>>>
>>>>>> [url]http://www.nbc4i.com/news/5070718/detail.html[/url]
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I think if the sign said, "No non-English-speakers allowed", but that
>>>>>> doesn't appear to be the case. Unless I read it wrong, it looks like
>>>>>> they want to make it clear that the current staff can only speak
>>>>>> English - it didn't appear to make any demands. Thoughts?
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> What a bunch of pinheads. Guess they haven't got anything else to keep
>>>>> their pointy little minds occupied.
>>>>
>>>> *shrug*
>>>>>
>>>>> Maybe the sign should have said:
>>>>> "Come right in and babble your order in whatever tongue you choose. If
>>>>> we
>>>>> just stand there and drool at you, try another language. If none of
>>>>> your
>>>>> languages get a response from our English-speaking staff, you may wish
>>>>> to
>>>>> try English.
>>>>> The text of this sign is not available in any other languages that you
>>>>> may
>>>>> know or not know."
>>>>
>>>> LOL - oh man, that would make the ACLU go into convulsions
>>>>>
>>>>> Perhaps a sign like that would bore people to death in front of the
>>>>> store,
>>>>> and they'd be in even deeper doo-doo because of all the corpses.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> TeGGeR®
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> hehehe - you are unwell
>>>
>>> I like that in a person![/color]
>>
>> I posted this on one of my favorite boards, and here is one response,
>> that I
>> think is best so far:
>>
>> This is a privately-owned business, and there is thus absolutely no legal
>> requirement that the owner learn Spanish, much less take orders in that
>> language. If customers don't speak English, all he has to do is shrug and
>> say, "I'm sorry, I don't understand you," and they'll have to find a way
>> to
>> communicate to him some other way if they want to be served a drink.
>> (Pointing to what they want, asking a friend to order for them,
>> whatever.)
>>
>> The sign is therefore completely unnecessary from a legal perspective.
>> All
>> it does is make it clear that the owner has a chip on his shoulder and
>> doesn't like Spanish-speaking people. Its true purpose is pretty obvious
>> to
>> me: to make those customers feel unwelcome and discourage them from
>> coming
>> in at all. Not to mention if he enforced his "policy" literally he
>> *would*
>> be discriminating -- as long as the customer can come up with some way of
>> communicating what he wants (drawing a picture of a beer on a napkin if
>> need
>> be!) the owner can't refuse service just because the guy can't speak
>> English.
>>
>> (Jay)[/color]
>
>
> Que?[/color]

*fwap*

Natalie

"Wickeddoll®" <wickeddoll1958DIEspammersDIE@yahoo.com> wrote:

I find that the link doesn't work well, it only came up once in
a half dozen tries, I thought I read "For service, speak English"
which I cannot see as discriminatory. He could have said nothing
(as someone suggested), then when asked in some other language
for something then just shrug. Or he might say on his sign
"Sorry, none of our help are able to speak other than English, if
you require an interpreter then you must supply your own" etc. I
sure don't see why it's discriminatory to not supply help for any
language that might be used. The rules didn't mention anything
about language at all...[color=blue]
>
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--

-Gord.
(use gordon in email)

"Gord Beaman" <gord@islandtelecom.com> wrote in message
news:i6buk1lc6unj0r75i1d2sko4a49280cgh5@4ax.com...[color=blue]
> "Wickeddoll®" <wickeddoll1958DIEspammersDIE@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> I find that the link doesn't work well, it only came up once in
> a half dozen tries, I thought I read "For service, speak English"
> which I cannot see as discriminatory. He could have said nothing
> (as someone suggested), then when asked in some other language
> for something then just shrug. Or he might say on his sign
> "Sorry, none of our help are able to speak other than English, if
> you require an interpreter then you must supply your own" etc. I
> sure don't see why it's discriminatory to not supply help for any
> language that might be used. The rules didn't mention anything
> about language at all...[/color]

We're having a very lively debate on one of my favorite boards about this.
Some see it as a slap in the face to the Hispanic community there, others
say anyone using an American business should be prepared to communicate with
the employees. I realize a person can't immigrate and speak the new
language right away, but there are folks who've been here for decades, but
refuse to learn English. That to me is ridiculous. I find nothing at all
wrong with holding on to your culture (My kids speak Polish), but if you
decide to move to a new country, I think learning its dominant tongue is not
too much to ask.

Having said that, I think your phrasing is way better - the original sign
*did* sound rather snippy, and a bit rude.

Natalie

I agree.

The staff does not speak spanish, and is not prepared to work with those
that speak other languages. Frankly, the tavern owner is probably making a
semi-serious business mistake by not having a spanish speaking employee on
hand to take orders, but there is no law against being a stupid businessman.





"Wickeddoll®" <wickeddoll1958DIEspammersDIE@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:dij6dr.2hc.1@news.evilcabal.org...[color=blue]
> [url]http://www.nbc4i.com/news/5070718/detail.html[/url]
>
> I think if the sign said, "No non-English-speakers allowed", but that
> doesn't appear to be the case. Unless I read it wrong, it looks like they
> want to make it clear that the current staff can only speak English - it
> didn't appear to make any demands. Thoughts?
>
> Natalie
>
> --
>
>
>
>
> [url]http://www.dwarfstar.net[/url]
>
> The best internet relay chat network in the entire world!
>
> "Wicked little doll, you are not human;
> Wicked little doll, you have no soul"
> (David Byrne, 1997)
>
>[/color]

"Jeff Strickland" <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:y8Kdnb0UD9-mvMjeRVn-gQ@ez2.net...[color=blue]
>I agree.
>
> The staff does not speak spanish, and is not prepared to work with those
> that speak other languages. Frankly, the tavern owner is probably making a
> semi-serious business mistake by not having a spanish speaking employee on
> hand to take orders, but there is no law against being a stupid
> businessman.
>
>[/color]
True, but perhaps he deliberately alienated the Hispanic community?

Natalie, shrugging[color=blue]
>
>
>
> "Wickeddoll®" <wickeddoll1958DIEspammersDIE@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:dij6dr.2hc.1@news.evilcabal.org...[color=green]
>> [url]http://www.nbc4i.com/news/5070718/detail.html[/url]
>>
>> I think if the sign said, "No non-English-speakers allowed", but that
>> doesn't appear to be the case. Unless I read it wrong, it looks like
>> they want to make it clear that the current staff can only speak
>> English - it didn't appear to make any demands. Thoughts?
>>
>> Natalie
>>
>> --
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> [url]http://www.dwarfstar.net[/url]
>>
>> The best internet relay chat network in the entire world!
>>
>> "Wicked little doll, you are not human;
>> Wicked little doll, you have no soul"
>> (David Byrne, 1997)
>>
>>[/color]
>[/color]

> All it does is make it clear that the owner has a chip on his shoulder and[color=blue]
> doesn't like Spanish-speaking people.[/color]

Why would the poster think that the sign indicates a bias against
Spanish speakers? It says nothing about Spanish. I don't think it's
any more discriminatory than "No Shirt, No Shoes, No Service". Every
choice one makes is a matter of discrimination, it's just a fact of
life.

Wickeddoll® wrote:[color=blue]
> [url]http://www.nbc4i.com/news/5070718/detail.html[/url]
>
> I think if the sign said, "No non-English-speakers allowed", but that
> doesn't appear to be the case. Unless I read it wrong, it looks like they
> want to make it clear that the current staff can only speak English - it
> didn't appear to make any demands. Thoughts?[/color]

I think they all need to just chill out and work it out. Damn that's
stupid. Fools, the lot of 'em