For Women Car Buyers

I have a message for car buyers, particularly women. Even at the most
upstanding dealerships, car salesmen can be full of tricks. Be prepared
with pricing information that's so readily available on the web. Also
learn from women like myself who got the full dealership treatment. I
was pressured to buy...and I bought. This didn't happen in a moment or
two, but was a process. I can't return the car, but I can describe what
I experienced so other car buyers will be better in the know.

My blog, Inside a Toyota Certified Used Car Deal, details the ins and
outs of a car deal as it unfolds (and afterwards). Go to:

realcardeal.blogspot.com

Hope you do it differently than I did.

You have a lot of nerve posting that garbage in this NG. Toyota dealers do
NOT discriminate against woman. I'll bet you were treated the same as
every other potential buyer at that dealership ;)

mike hunt


"LJ" <jeanonweb@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1130177499.721694.84910@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...[color=blue]
>I have a message for car buyers, particularly women. Even at the most
> upstanding dealerships, car salesmen can be full of tricks. Be prepared
> with pricing information that's so readily available on the web. Also
> learn from women like myself who got the full dealership treatment. I
> was pressured to buy...and I bought. This didn't happen in a moment or
> two, but was a process. I can't return the car, but I can describe what
> I experienced so other car buyers will be better in the know.
>
> My blog, Inside a Toyota Certified Used Car Deal, details the ins and
> outs of a car deal as it unfolds (and afterwards). Go to:
>
> realcardeal.blogspot.com
>
> Hope you do it differently than I did.
>[/color]

"Mike Hunter" <mikehunt2@mailcity.com> wrote in message
news:dW6dnUiJ1rtCtcDeUSdV9g@ptd.net...[color=blue]
> You have a lot of nerve posting that garbage in this NG. Toyota dealers
> do NOT discriminate against woman. I'll bet you were treated the same as
> every other potential buyer at that dealership ;)
>
> mike hunt
>[/color]



[color=blue]
> "LJ" <jeanonweb@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:1130177499.721694.84910@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...[color=green]
>>I have a message for car buyers, particularly women. Even at the most
>> upstanding dealerships, car salesmen can be full of tricks. Be prepared
>> with pricing information that's so readily available on the web. Also
>> learn from women like myself who got the full dealership treatment. I
>> was pressured to buy...and I bought. This didn't happen in a moment or
>> two, but was a process. I can't return the car, but I can describe what
>> I experienced so other car buyers will be better in the know.
>>
>> My blog, Inside a Toyota Certified Used Car Deal, details the ins and
>> outs of a car deal as it unfolds (and afterwards). Go to:
>>
>> realcardeal.blogspot.com
>>
>> Hope you do it differently than I did.
>>[/color][/color]

I just skimmed over the article, but I'll give you my 2 cents worth as an NU
alumni and someone who used to train dealership sales people and sale
managers. Please do not be insulted, but you are the dream customer that
every salesperson dreams of - a highly educated buyer (since higher
education tends to lead to more income), who has done little or no research
before shopping and is more emotional than rational. As far as I could
tell, your treatment was no different than a male buyer with the same
attributes would have received, and the process does not differ greatly from
brand to brand.

First of all, the dealership is not "Toyota." They merely have the
exclusive right to sell new Toyotas, repair them under warranty, and use
the name "Toyota" in their dealership name and advertising.

Always be prepared to shop at multiple dealerships to get the best deal and
service.

Put emotion aside. Count on paying top dollar for an emotional purchase.

If you were smart enough to graduate from NU, you're smart enough to know
not to sign a contract with blanks that are not filled in or to sign
anything that you have not read. You're also smart enough to know that you
are not under arrest and could have left at any time, do comparison
shopping, discuss the transaction with your husband or someone you know and
trust. You are smart enough to know that you can think straighter if you
are fresh and not tired. For whatever reason, you cast aside common sense,
like those people who meet in a bar in Vegas and get married that same
night.

If you want to trade a vehicle, always have some idea of what it is worth
beforehand. Research newspapers, Kelley Blue Book, Edmunds, etc. Know what
is wrong with the vehicle you are trading in beforehand so you won't be
surprised when the dealership people find it. Know what the vehicle you
want to buy is worth beforehand as well. Set a maximum amount you're
willing to spend.

The "Certified" part does add close to $1000 to the dealer's cost for the
vehicle.

If it makes you feel any better, many of your husband's explanations after
the fact were incorrect. Bill did not get most of the commission - he got a
token amount, if any. The salespeople at the desk with the sales manager
were not shooting the breeze, and the salespeople do not know what every
vehicle on the lot is worth because they were not in on every transaction.
Even the sales manager has to look up the vehicle in question to see how
much he has invested and what it is worth.

For some reason, many people seem to assume that car dealerships are
not-for-profit institutions; that they deserve the deal of the century; and
that they are smarter than the people at the dealership. For the record,
dealerships are in business to make a profit, and like any business, they
try to maximize their profit. As far as getting a "great deal" on a used
car at a dealership, IMO, anything less than Kelley Blue Book average retail
is a good deal. Dealerships know what their merchandise is worth. Nobody,
including me (15 years in the car business) will pull one over on the car
dealer and get the deal of the century. Be happy with a fair deal that
allows the dealer a reasonable profit.
--
Ray O
correct the return address punctuation to reply

"LJ" <jeanonweb@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1130177499.721694.84910@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...[color=blue]
>I have a message for car buyers, particularly women. Even at the most
> upstanding dealerships, car salesmen can be full of tricks. Be prepared
> with pricing information that's so readily available on the web. Also
> learn from women like myself who got the full dealership treatment. I
> was pressured to buy...and I bought. This didn't happen in a moment or
> two, but was a process. I can't return the car, but I can describe what
> I experienced so other car buyers will be better in the know.
>
> My blog, Inside a Toyota Certified Used Car Deal, details the ins and
> outs of a car deal as it unfolds (and afterwards). Go to:
>
> realcardeal.blogspot.com
>
> Hope you do it differently than I did.
>[/color]

I read your blog. I really do not see a big problem there. You got what you
paid for. Yes, the salesman pushed hard, but if he didnt, he would not be
selling cars. You also seem to take things personally.

"Dan J.S." <me@hyperx.com> wrote in message
news:11lqjhr3l58qh82@news.supernews.com...[color=blue]
>
> "LJ" <jeanonweb@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:1130177499.721694.84910@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...[color=green]
>>I have a message for car buyers, particularly women. Even at the most
>> upstanding dealerships, car salesmen can be full of tricks. Be prepared
>> with pricing information that's so readily available on the web. Also
>> learn from women like myself who got the full dealership treatment. I
>> was pressured to buy...and I bought. This didn't happen in a moment or
>> two, but was a process. I can't return the car, but I can describe what
>> I experienced so other car buyers will be better in the know.
>>
>> My blog, Inside a Toyota Certified Used Car Deal, details the ins and
>> outs of a car deal as it unfolds (and afterwards). Go to:
>>
>> realcardeal.blogspot.com
>>
>> Hope you do it differently than I did.
>>[/color]
>
> I read your blog. I really do not see a big problem there. You got what
> you paid for. Yes, the salesman pushed hard, but if he didnt, he would not
> be selling cars. You also seem to take things personally.
>[/color]
That's what I got. It's a cliché, but here we go with the 'victim' thing.
I think the salesman would have been the same whether the customer had a
penis or not. My husband has walked out of dealerships because of
high-pressure salesmen. The best thing to do is show up with what you want
to pay in mind. If they can't match it, say adios. It's a good idea to
check newsgroups and bulletin boards beforehand, to get an idea of what you
should be paying.

Natalie, rolling her eyes

Well said.

"qslim" <Suckers@suckersdotcom> wrote in message
news:f7bcb356c08fc550246833b3138dc5a6@localhost.talkaboutautos.com...[color=blue]
> Well said.
>[/color]
What the OP said?
--
Ray O
correct the return address punctuation to reply

"Ray O" <rokigawa@tristarassociatesDOT.com> wrote in
news:e13e6$435d4610$44a4a10d$4217@msgid.meganewsservers.com:


<snip>

[color=blue]
> You're also smart enough to
> know that you are not under arrest and could have left at any time,[/color]



Bingo.

That's the ONE weapon anyone has against the delaership: The willingness to
walk out. It's the one and only thing they can't fight or twist around. It
takes balls to be able to do that under the salesman's pressure, but you
MUST do it if you're not getting your deal. And if they let you walk, well,
your deal wasn't realistic.


<snip>

[color=blue]
>
> For some reason, many people seem to assume that car dealerships are
> not-for-profit institutions; that they deserve the deal of the
> century; and that they are smarter than the people at the dealership.[/color]



Probably the biggest single mistake anyone can make. Salesmen are there all
day, every day, and you're walking in maybe once in five years. They've
seen and heard it all, and you've got to go in there assuming that you
cannot--and will not--say something they haven't heard before.


[color=blue]
> For the record, dealerships are in business to make a profit, and like
> any business, they try to maximize their profit. As far as getting a
> "great deal" on a used car at a dealership, IMO, anything less than
> Kelley Blue Book average retail is a good deal. Dealerships know what
> their merchandise is worth. Nobody, including me (15 years in the car
> business) will pull one over on the car dealer and get the deal of the
> century. Be happy with a fair deal that allows the dealer a
> reasonable profit.[/color]



Or set a budget, find the best car that best fits that budget, then stick
to that budget. Let the dealership figure out if they're making a profit on
the deal.



--
TeGGeR®

No, you. Very succinct and to the point. The OP laid right over and started
pointing fingers when she came to and realized what she did.
Lee Iacocca would have gotten ripped off too if he walked into a
dealership all emotional with zippy research. It's not like its '83, you
know? I just typed in 'used car buying tips' into Google and got
43,600,000 hits. The info is out there and it's easy to get. Don't wave
the gender flag. You screwed up.

"qslim" <Suckers@suckersdotcom> wrote in message
news:ce554503da42156258adf35f3d6c1ba5@localhost.talkaboutautos.com...[color=blue]
> No, you. Very succinct and to the point. The OP laid right over and
> started
> pointing fingers when she came to and realized what she did.
> Lee Iacocca would have gotten ripped off too if he walked into a
> dealership all emotional with zippy research. It's not like its '83, you
> know? I just typed in 'used car buying tips' into Google and got
> 43,600,000 hits. The info is out there and it's easy to get. Don't wave
> the gender flag. You screwed up.
>[/color]

Thanks.

My wife chides me of putting aside emotion and only considering facts when
making a decision or considering something. At the risk of sounding like
Mr. Spock, following emotions is rarely a good idea when making any kind of
decision.
--
Ray O
correct the return address punctuation to reply

True, true. When I was little my dad told me 'emotions change, facts
usually don't".

"Wickeddoll®" <wickeddoll1958DIEspammersDIE@yahoo.com> wrote in
news:djj5tr.2co.1@news.evilcabal.org:
[color=blue]
>
> "Dan J.S." <me@hyperx.com> wrote in message
> news:11lqjhr3l58qh82@news.supernews.com...[color=green]
>>
>> "LJ" <jeanonweb@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>> news:1130177499.721694.84910@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...[color=darkred]
>>>I have a message for car buyers, particularly women. Even at the most
>>> upstanding dealerships, car salesmen can be full of tricks. Be
>>> prepared with pricing information that's so readily available on the
>>> web. Also learn from women like myself who got the full dealership
>>> treatment. I was pressured to buy...and I bought. This didn't happen
>>> in a moment or two, but was a process. I can't return the car, but I
>>> can describe what I experienced so other car buyers will be better
>>> in the know.
>>>
>>> My blog, Inside a Toyota Certified Used Car Deal, details the ins
>>> and outs of a car deal as it unfolds (and afterwards). Go to:
>>>
>>> realcardeal.blogspot.com
>>>
>>> Hope you do it differently than I did.
>>>[/color]
>>
>> I read your blog. I really do not see a big problem there. You got
>> what you paid for. Yes, the salesman pushed hard, but if he didnt, he
>> would not be selling cars. You also seem to take things personally.
>>[/color]
> That's what I got. It's a cliché, but here we go with the 'victim'
> thing. I think the salesman would have been the same whether the
> customer had a penis or not.[/color]




You got it. Sharks are sharks and bait is bait. End of story.




[color=blue]
> My husband has walked out of dealerships
> because of high-pressure salesmen. The best thing to do is show up
> with what you want to pay in mind. If they can't match it, say adios.[/color]



Yep. It's the ONLY way. Otherwise they WILL bend you over and...



--
TeGGeR®

"Ray O" <rokigawa@tristarassociatesDOT.com> wrote in message
news:2a7aa$435d6251$44a4a10d$6579@msgid.meganewsservers.com...[color=blue]
>
> "qslim" <Suckers@suckersdotcom> wrote in message
> news:ce554503da42156258adf35f3d6c1ba5@localhost.talkaboutautos.com...[color=green]
>> No, you. Very succinct and to the point. The OP laid right over and
>> started
>> pointing fingers when she came to and realized what she did.
>> Lee Iacocca would have gotten ripped off too if he walked into a
>> dealership all emotional with zippy research. It's not like its '83, you
>> know? I just typed in 'used car buying tips' into Google and got
>> 43,600,000 hits. The info is out there and it's easy to get. Don't wave
>> the gender flag. You screwed up.
>>[/color]
>
> Thanks.
>
> My wife chides me of putting aside emotion and only considering facts when
> making a decision or considering something. At the risk of sounding like
> Mr. Spock, following emotions is rarely a good idea when making any kind
> of decision.
> --
> Ray O[/color]

I'd say marriage is probably the only time emotion should guide your
decision...

Natalie

"TeGGeR®" ...[color=blue]
> "Wickeddoll®"
>[color=green]
>>
>> "Dan J.S."[color=darkred]
>>>
>>> "LJ" .
>>>>I have a message for car buyers, particularly women. Even at the most
>>>> upstanding dealerships, car salesmen can be full of tricks. Be
>>>> prepared with pricing information that's so readily available on the
>>>> web. Also learn from women like myself who got the full dealership
>>>> treatment. I was pressured to buy...and I bought. This didn't happen
>>>> in a moment or two, but was a process. I can't return the car, but I
>>>> can describe what I experienced so other car buyers will be better
>>>> in the know.
>>>>
>>>> My blog, Inside a Toyota Certified Used Car Deal, details the ins
>>>> and outs of a car deal as it unfolds (and afterwards). Go to:
>>>>
>>>> realcardeal.blogspot.com
>>>>
>>>> Hope you do it differently than I did.
>>>>
>>>
>>> I read your blog. I really do not see a big problem there. You got
>>> what you paid for. Yes, the salesman pushed hard, but if he didnt, he
>>> would not be selling cars. You also seem to take things personally.
>>>[/color]
>> That's what I got. It's a cliché, but here we go with the 'victim'
>> thing. I think the salesman would have been the same whether the
>> customer had a penis or not.[/color]
>
>
>
>
> You got it. Sharks are sharks and bait is bait. End of story.
>
>
>[/color]
Yup[color=blue]
>
>[color=green]
>> My husband has walked out of dealerships
>> because of high-pressure salesmen. The best thing to do is show up
>> with what you want to pay in mind. If they can't match it, say adios.[/color]
>
>
>
> Yep. It's the ONLY way. Otherwise they WILL bend you over and...
>
>
>
> --
> TeGGeR®
>[/color]
...and since neither my husband or I swing that way...

Natalie

"Wickeddoll®" <wickeddoll1958DIEspammersDIE@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:djjgb1.2n0.1@news.evilcabal.org...[color=blue]
>
> "Ray O" <rokigawa@tristarassociatesDOT.com> wrote in message
> news:2a7aa$435d6251$44a4a10d$6579@msgid.meganewsservers.com...[color=green]
>>
>> "qslim" <Suckers@suckersdotcom> wrote in message
>> news:ce554503da42156258adf35f3d6c1ba5@localhost.talkaboutautos.com...[color=darkred]
>>> No, you. Very succinct and to the point. The OP laid right over and
>>> started
>>> pointing fingers when she came to and realized what she did.
>>> Lee Iacocca would have gotten ripped off too if he walked into a
>>> dealership all emotional with zippy research. It's not like its '83, you
>>> know? I just typed in 'used car buying tips' into Google and got
>>> 43,600,000 hits. The info is out there and it's easy to get. Don't wave
>>> the gender flag. You screwed up.
>>>[/color]
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> My wife chides me of putting aside emotion and only considering facts
>> when making a decision or considering something. At the risk of
>> sounding like Mr. Spock, following emotions is rarely a good idea when
>> making any kind of decision.
>> --
>> Ray O[/color]
>
> I'd say marriage is probably the only time emotion should guide your
> decision...
>
> Natalie[/color]


A typically female response.

We know from history that marriage is designed to give women legal power
over men in order to 'civilize' men for the sake of raising children and for
the sake of society at large.

We also know from history that marriage is a CONTRACT agreement ... that
requires The State and a lawyer to make and break.

Men have a strong sense these things are true which is why we are commitment
phobic.
--

- Philip