On Thu, 9 Mar 2006 07:57:23 -0500, "Jim Higgins"
<gordian238@hotmail.com> wrote:
[color=blue]
>Yes, hybrids can mean savings
>[url]http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060309/BUSINESS01/603090499/1014[/url][/color]
I quote from the article
With the corrected math, Toyota Motor Corp.'s Prius saves an owner
about $400 over five years
> "Scott in Florida" wrote:[color=blue][color=green]
>> Yes, hybrids can mean savings
>> [url]http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060309/BUSINESS01/603090499/1014[/url][/color]
> I quote from the article
> With the corrected math, Toyota Motor Corp.'s Prius saves an owner
> about $400 over five years
> 400 over 5 years!
> ROFLMAO
> figures lie/liars figure
> You don't save a damned thing with a hybrid....[/color]
Yeah. Tell that to the British Columbia taxi cab company which is expanding
its fleet to over 40+ Prius vehicles.
So the guy saved a mere $900-$1100 per month (fuel costs alone!) by driving
one
Prius cab for 25 months (200,000 miles). Not to mention he cut his repair
costs in half.
Guess the Prius is really a money-losing vehicle after all, eh?
Funny CR admits to their blind blunder, although they really are wrong if
you ask a taxi fleet owner.
Cannot measure the geeky smiles of their owner's and what that's worth
either.
"B. Peg" <bent_peg@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:9wWPf.3401$8w2.284@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...[color=blue][color=green]
>> "Scott in Florida" wrote:[color=darkred]
>>> Yes, hybrids can mean savings
>>> [url]http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060309/BUSINESS01/603090499/1014[/url][/color]
>> I quote from the article
>> With the corrected math, Toyota Motor Corp.'s Prius saves an owner
>> about $400 over five years
>> 400 over 5 years!
>> ROFLMAO
>> figures lie/liars figure
>> You don't save a damned thing with a hybrid....[/color]
>
> Yeah. Tell that to the British Columbia taxi cab company which is
> expanding its fleet to over 40+ Prius vehicles.
>
> [url]http://www.grist.org/news/maindish/2005/08/02/sainsbury-cab/[/url]
>
> So the guy saved a mere $900-$1100 per month (fuel costs alone!) by
> driving one
> Prius cab for 25 months (200,000 miles). Not to mention he cut his repair
> costs in half.
>
> Guess the Prius is really a money-losing vehicle after all, eh?
>
> Funny CR admits to their blind blunder, although they really are wrong if
> you ask a taxi fleet owner.
>
> Cannot measure the geeky smiles of their owner's and what that's worth
> either.
>
> B~
>
>[/color]
"Scott in Florida" <MoveOn@outa.here> wrote in message
news:ssa012d7pm8u4vspa1ffvfebvnh6lmndl4@4ax.com...[color=blue]
> On Thu, 9 Mar 2006 07:57:23 -0500, "Jim Higgins"
> <gordian238@hotmail.com> wrote:
>[color=green]
>>Yes, hybrids can mean savings
>>[url]http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060309/BUSINESS01/603090499/1014[/url][/color]
>
> I quote from the article
>
> With the corrected math, Toyota Motor Corp.'s Prius saves an owner
> about $400 over five years
>
> 400 over 5 years!
>
> ROFLMAO
>
> figures lie/liars figure
>
> You don't save a damned thing with a hybrid....
>
> --
>
> Scott in Florida[/color]
This early in the game, I tend to believe Edmunds. On a pure cost per mile
basis, I do not believe a Hybrid saves over a conventional auto. The worse
part is disposal cost. When most cars depreciate to $4000, you have a 7 to
10 year old battery that will cost nearly the residual value of the car.
On the plus, and this is a big plus, you have a vehicle running for 100,000
that was reliable, low running costs, and substantially reduced emissions.
It's hard to put a cost on these. Imagine 100,000 hybrids replacing
existing daily drivers. Anyway, it's all too new to know anything for sure.
Hope Mac and other hybrid owners keep us up to date on operating history.
"M. MacDonald" <mmacdonald@bc.cc.ca.us> wrote in message
news:9RYPf.109$aN2.33316@okeanos.csu.net...[color=blue][color=green]
>> "Mike Hunter mistakenly wrote" Then $4,000 for the battery pack at
>> current prices[/color]
>
> LOL! (as technology advances, they're rapidly dropping to the $2 K mark)
>
> However, my battery pack's warranty is (in CA) 10 years and/or 120,000
> miles (I'll own another in 7 years though).
>
> Yet another non-issue.
>
> Try again Mike.
>
> Mack
>
>
>[/color]
That may be your opinion but CR does not agree with your opinion. They say
in ten years the overall cost of owning a hybrid will get even worse as
retail value tanks at the prospect of replacing the batter pack at a cost of
$4,000 to $7,000 LOL
mike hunt
"M. MacDonald" <mmacdonald@bc.cc.ca.us> wrote in message
news:9RYPf.109$aN2.33316@okeanos.csu.net...[color=blue][color=green]
>> "Mike Hunter mistakenly wrote" Then $4,000 for the battery pack at
>> current prices[/color]
>
> LOL! (as technology advances, they're rapidly dropping to the $2 K mark)
>
> However, my battery pack's warranty is (in CA) 10 years and/or 120,000
> miles (I'll own another in 7 years though).
>
> Yet another non-issue.
>
> Try again Mike.
>
> Mack
>
>
>[/color]
Many buyers fail to realize the premium price one pays to buy a hybrid, even
after tax rebates, will buy nearly all of the gas used by its conventionally
powered twin for the first three of four years. ;)
mike hunt
"Alex" <someone@microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:dmZPf.28130$2O6.7883@newssvr12.news.prodigy.com...[color=blue]
> This early in the game, I tend to believe Edmunds. On a pure cost per
> mile basis, I do not believe a Hybrid saves over a conventional auto. The
> worse part is disposal cost. When most cars depreciate to $4000, you have
> a 7 to 10 year old battery that will cost nearly the residual value of the
> car.
>
> On the plus, and this is a big plus, you have a vehicle running for
> 100,000 that was reliable, low running costs, and substantially reduced
> emissions. It's hard to put a cost on these. Imagine 100,000 hybrids
> replacing existing daily drivers. Anyway, it's all too new to know
> anything for sure.
>
> Hope Mac and other hybrid owners keep us up to date on operating history.
>
>
> "M. MacDonald" <mmacdonald@bc.cc.ca.us> wrote in message
> news:9RYPf.109$aN2.33316@okeanos.csu.net...[color=green][color=darkred]
>>> "Mike Hunter mistakenly wrote" Then $4,000 for the battery pack at
>>> current prices[/color]
>>
>> LOL! (as technology advances, they're rapidly dropping to the $2 K mark)
>>
>> However, my battery pack's warranty is (in CA) 10 years and/or 120,000
>> miles (I'll own another in 7 years though).
>>
>> Yet another non-issue.
>>
>> Try again Mike.
>>
>> Mack
>>
>>
>>[/color]
>
>[/color]
> "Mike Hunter" wrote:[color=blue]
> That may be your opinion but CR does not agree with your opinion. They
> say in ten years the overall cost of owning a hybrid will get even worse
> as retail value tanks at the prospect of replacing the batter pack at a
> cost of $4,000 to $7,000 LOL[/color]
Didn't read CR's Prius retraction, did ja? Wait for the April issue or
check out the Stanford professor's cost analysis and response which led to
their mistaken analysis. Besides, CR hasn't done a 10 year term evaluation
nor has the car been out there long enough for them to forecast that. It's
their opinion.
However, it's not my opinion but more factual since I have my credit card
statements to back it up, that show where my monthly fuel credit card
statements have dropped from $200 down to $60 with no change in mileage.
Guess I'm really losing money just like those Canadian cab companies are
(lol!). So I'm saving $1680 a year, not as much as the taxi companies have
at $1000 a month, but still good enough for me over the old dinosaur I had.
During the 7 years I plan on keeping it, that will come to $11,760 (it'll be
more if gas rises above $2.50/gallon) in fuel savings at current prices over
the old vehicle.
Besides, I toss out my cars and trucks after 7-8 years anyway, if they don't
manage to get smashed up before then. Don't want an old costly relic nor do
I want to waste time calling Auto Club's tow truck. Been there in the past.
I don't want some old relic with dried out electrical wiring,
hardened-rubber suspension parts, leaks, squeaks, rust, upholstery problems,
etc. At 10 years it's "driveway junk," imo.
Regarding the battery, I really don't care about the battery in my car's
lifetime - it's under warranty. Don't care what the person who gets it
after me spends on it (probably $2K or so, but nothing like an old
dinosaur's auto-transmission job). The battery is not my problem nor will
it cost me anything. In 10 years of owning any car, it's worth zero to me
as I either trade it in (maybe $500-$1000) or give it to the Goodwill store
for free and get the better write-off (with far less headache and subsequent
whining about the used car by its new owner).
As I said, it's a non-issue.
Got any better argument Mike? You really need some better facts against
those that own them, pay for them, and use them than your - or CR's -
fallacious hyperbole.
Funny how some like to point to CRs impartially when CR says something they
want to hear about the car that person
prefers, but when CR says something they do not want to hear about the car
that person prefers, all of a sudden it is only CRs opinion. The fact it
is not ONLY CRs opinion, every buff magi that has analyzed the pros and cons
of owning a hybrid over a conventionally powered twin have come to be of the
same 'opinion,' hybrids do not save money, even at $4 a gallon, but they
use less fuel for those that can afford to help save the planet. Educate
yourself, do a goole search of, Do hybrids save money?
Personally I could not care less where one choose to spend their money, but
one is delusional if they think they are saving money on fuel. One must
pay a lot more to buy a Pruis than if they had purchased a similarly
equipped Corolla and until they save enough on the difference in fuel
mileage between the two, that have not saved penny on fuel yet. Nor will
they in five years if you do the math.
By the way the high voltage battery pack warranty is prorated, just like the
warranty on all other batteries, there is no free lunch ;)
mike hunt
"M. MacDonald" <mmacdonald@bc.cc.ca.us> wrote in message
news:7N0Qf.112$aN2.33565@okeanos.csu.net...[color=blue][color=green]
>> "Mike Hunter" wrote:
>> That may be your opinion but CR does not agree with your opinion. They
>> say in ten years the overall cost of owning a hybrid will get even worse
>> as retail value tanks at the prospect of replacing the batter pack at a
>> cost of $4,000 to $7,000 LOL[/color]
>
> Didn't read CR's Prius retraction, did ja? Wait for the April issue or
> check out the Stanford professor's cost analysis and response which led to
> their mistaken analysis. Besides, CR hasn't done a 10 year term
> evaluation nor has the car been out there long enough for them to forecast
> that. It's their opinion.
>
> However, it's not my opinion but more factual since I have my credit card
> statements to back it up, that show where my monthly fuel credit card
> statements have dropped from $200 down to $60 with no change in mileage.
> Guess I'm really losing money just like those Canadian cab companies are
> (lol!). So I'm saving $1680 a year, not as much as the taxi companies
> have at $1000 a month, but still good enough for me over the old dinosaur
> I had. During the 7 years I plan on keeping it, that will come to $11,760
> (it'll be more if gas rises above $2.50/gallon) in fuel savings at current
> prices over the old vehicle.
>
> Besides, I toss out my cars and trucks after 7-8 years anyway, if they
> don't manage to get smashed up before then. Don't want an old costly
> relic nor do I want to waste time calling Auto Club's tow truck. Been
> there in the past. I don't want some old relic with dried out electrical
> wiring, hardened-rubber suspension parts, leaks, squeaks, rust, upholstery
> problems, etc. At 10 years it's "driveway junk," imo.
>
> Regarding the battery, I really don't care about the battery in my car's
> lifetime - it's under warranty. Don't care what the person who gets it
> after me spends on it (probably $2K or so, but nothing like an old
> dinosaur's auto-transmission job). The battery is not my problem nor will
> it cost me anything. In 10 years of owning any car, it's worth zero to me
> as I either trade it in (maybe $500-$1000) or give it to the Goodwill
> store for free and get the better write-off (with far less headache and
> subsequent whining about the used car by its new owner).
>
> As I said, it's a non-issue.
>
> Got any better argument Mike? You really need some better facts against
> those that own them, pay for them, and use them than your - or CR's -
> fallacious hyperbole.
>
> Mack
>
>
>[/color]
> "Mike Hunter" (wrong as usual) wrote:[color=blue]
> By the way the high voltage battery pack warranty is prorated, just like
> the warranty on all other batteries, there is no free lunch ;)[/color]
Wrong as usual. Checked that before I bought it. No pro-rating. Sorry,
you aren't right again.
Why not Google the fuel and maintenance savings by the Canadian cab
companies and dispute that "fact"?
Even simpler, assuming fuel costs at $2.50 per gallon and never changing,
and a "regular" car giving 35 mpg while a hybrid turns out 45 mpg, the
regular car costs $0.071 per mile to operate, the hybrid costs $.055. The
savings is $.016 per mile. At that rate and a fixed cost of $2.50, it would
take 812,500 miles to recover the added cost of the hybrid, assuming a
$13,000 price premium for the feature.
It doesn't matter much what the price of fuel is since we are comparing the
difference in per mile operating costs for the fuel alone. Add in the cost
of the batteries and it becomes clear to me that one ought not buy a hybrid
because it gets better fuel mileage. One buys a hybrid because they want to
help the environment. Having said that, I wonder if it takes more energy to
build a hybrid than a regular car. Hmmm ...
"Jim Higgins" <gordian238@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:12109ogk5pb7r3e@corp.supernews.com...[color=blue]
> Yes, hybrids can mean savings
> [url]http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060309/BUSINESS01/603090499/1014[/url]
>
> --
> Service Guarantees Citizenship
>[/color]
You better read your warranty if that is what you believe
"M. MacDonald" <mmacdonald@bc.cc.ca.us> wrote in message
news:zE3Qf.113$aN2.33957@okeanos.csu.net...[color=blue][color=green]
>> "Mike Hunter" (wrong as usual) wrote:
>> Funny how some like to point to CRs impartially when CR says something
>> they[/color][/color]
want to hear about the car that person
prefers, but when CR says something they do not want to hear about the car
that person prefers, all of a sudden it is only CRs opinion. The fact it
is not ONLY CRs opinion, every buff magi that has analyzed the pros and cons
of owning a hybrid over a conventionally powered twin have come to be of the
same 'opinion,' hybrids do not save money, even at $4 a gallon, but they
use less fuel for those that can afford to help save the planet. Educate
yourself, do a goole search of, Do hybrids save money?
Personally I could not care less where one choose to spend their money, but
one is delusional if they think they are saving money on fuel. One must
pay a lot more to buy a Pruis than if they had purchased a similarly
equipped Corolla and until they save enough on the difference in fuel
mileage between the two, that have not saved penny on fuel yet. Nor will
they in five years if you do the math.
By the way the high voltage battery pack warranty is prorated, just like the
warranty on all other batteries, there is no free lunch ;)
[color=blue]
> Wrong as usual. Checked that before I bought it. No pro-rating. Sorry,
> you aren't right again.
>
> Why not Google the fuel and maintenance savings by the Canadian cab
> companies and dispute that "fact"?
>
> Mack
>
>
>[/color]
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