Re: engine oil, warming up the car

"slatt333" <slatt333@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1143220801.285239.110740@t31g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...[color=blue]
> Two questions 1) which oil to use for a 2003 corolla with 23K miles,
> automatic.
>
> 2) Should I warm the engine up before driving, esp in cold weather?
> Another car manual (VW Golf) instructed me to just start the car and
> drive away even in the cold because (a) the car warms up faster this
> way and (b) it's bad for the engine to leave the car idle warming up.
>[/color]
Three minutes is the general rule of thumb

Hard to believe, but true -- "hachiroku" <Trueno@ae86.gts> typed:
[color=blue]
>
>"slatt333" <slatt333@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>news:1143220801.285239.110740@t31g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...[color=green]
>> Two questions 1) which oil to use for a 2003 corolla with 23K miles,
>> automatic.
>>
>> 2) Should I warm the engine up before driving, esp in cold weather?
>> Another car manual (VW Golf) instructed me to just start the car and
>> drive away even in the cold because (a) the car warms up faster this
>> way and (b) it's bad for the engine to leave the car idle warming up.
>>[/color]
>Three minutes is the general rule of thumb[/color]

Whose thumb is that??

Drive off gently as soon as the engine is running is the best way of
warming up the engine of any vehicle. There is NO reason to let it sit
idling when it's first started . . . and at least one good one not to
.. . . or do you like wasting gasoline?

--
"We have enough youth; let's start looking for the Fountain of Sense." --Anon

On Fri, 24 Mar 2006 16:33:29 -0600, Don Fearn wrote:
[color=blue]
> Hard to believe, but true -- "hachiroku" <Trueno@ae86.gts> typed:
>[color=green]
>>
>>"slatt333" <slatt333@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>news:1143220801.285239.110740@t31g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...[color=darkred]
>>> Two questions 1) which oil to use for a 2003 corolla with 23K miles,
>>> automatic.
>>>
>>> 2) Should I warm the engine up before driving, esp in cold weather?
>>> Another car manual (VW Golf) instructed me to just start the car and
>>> drive away even in the cold because (a) the car warms up faster this
>>> way and (b) it's bad for the engine to leave the car idle warming up.
>>>[/color]
>>Three minutes is the general rule of thumb[/color]
>
> Whose thumb is that??[/color]

Click and Clack, among others.

You don't take the time to let the pistons get friendly with the cylinder
walls before you start revving it?
[color=blue]
>
> Drive off gently as soon as the engine is running is the best way of
> warming up the engine of any vehicle. There is NO reason to let it sit
> idling when it's first started . . . and at least one good one not to
> . . . or do you like wasting gasoline?[/color]

--
In the grand scheme fo things...
What difference does it make?

Hard to believe, but true -- Hachiroku <Trueno@ae86.GTS> typed:
[color=blue]
>On Fri, 24 Mar 2006 16:33:29 -0600, Don Fearn wrote:
>[color=green]
>> Hard to believe, but true -- "hachiroku" <Trueno@ae86.gts> typed:
>>[color=darkred]
>>>
>>>"slatt333" <slatt333@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>>news:1143220801.285239.110740@t31g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
>>>> Two questions 1) which oil to use for a 2003 corolla with 23K miles,
>>>> automatic.
>>>>
>>>> 2) Should I warm the engine up before driving, esp in cold weather?
>>>> Another car manual (VW Golf) instructed me to just start the car and
>>>> drive away even in the cold because (a) the car warms up faster this
>>>> way and (b) it's bad for the engine to leave the car idle warming up.
>>>>
>>>Three minutes is the general rule of thumb[/color]
>>
>> Whose thumb is that??[/color]
>
>Click and Clack, among others.
>
>You don't take the time to let the pistons get friendly with the cylinder
>walls before you start revving it?[/color]

Yup. That takes a few seconds at most. Then I rev it GENTLY until it's
up to operating temperature. When I've reached the highway (about a
mile from the house) it's ready to GO.

Three minutes is way longer than is needed. Three seconds is more like
it. Don't ROMP on it until it's up to full operating temperature, but
that will happen a lot sooner if you drive it gently instead of
letting it idle.

--
"We have enough youth; let's start looking for the Fountain of Sense." --Anon

On Fri, 24 Mar 2006 17:31:33 GMT, "hachiroku" <Trueno@ae86.gts> wrote:
[color=blue]
>
>"slatt333" <slatt333@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>news:1143220801.285239.110740@t31g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...[color=green]
>> Two questions 1) which oil to use for a 2003 corolla with 23K miles,
>> automatic.
>>
>> 2) Should I warm the engine up before driving, esp in cold weather?
>> Another car manual (VW Golf) instructed me to just start the car and
>> drive away even in the cold because (a) the car warms up faster this
>> way and (b) it's bad for the engine to leave the car idle warming up.
>>[/color]
>Three minutes is the general rule of thumb[/color]

What? Perhaps it's the rule of thumb if the weather is below 0F.
Above freezing, you only need to give it 15 to 30 seconds, and above
50F 15 seconds of 'warm-up' is plenty - then drive gently till the
coolant temperature gauge starts approaching normal. Side streets.

Jumping on the freeway or expressway is not advised till the engine
temperature is about halfway to normal - if you live 500 feet from the
on-ramp, or your house fronts on a county highway with a 55 MPH speed
limit and you need to accelerate briskly to merge in, that would be an
exception to the rule - give it another minute or two to warm up
before you leave.

Cars in moderate to warm climates do not need extended warm-ups any
more - just give them long enough to circulate the oil everywhere it
needs to be. Ay more is just wasting gasoline.

--<< Bruce >>--

Ray O is one-hundred percent right.

Page 248 of the 2006 Camry manual:

"You can start a cold or hot engine as follows: With your
foot off the accelerator pedal, crank the engine by turning the
key to START. Release it when the engine starts.

"Engine should be warmed up by driving, not in idle.
For warming up, drive with smoothly turning engine until engine
coolant temperature is within normal range."

Ten pages later on Page 258, [[the manual states:]]

"Avoid lengthy warm-up idling. Once the engine is running
smoothly, begin driving--but gently. Remember, however, that on
cold winter days this may take a little longer."

-- Toyotas are Built_Well

Hard to believe, but true -- "Built_Well" <bw@bbbb.com> typed:
[color=blue]
>Ray O is one-hundred percent right.
>
> Page 248 of the 2006 Camry manual:
>
> "You can start a cold or hot engine as follows: With your
>foot off the accelerator pedal, crank the engine by turning the
>key to START. Release it when the engine starts.
>
> "Engine should be warmed up by driving, not in idle.
>For warming up, drive with smoothly turning engine until engine
>coolant temperature is within normal range."
>
>Ten pages later on Page 258, [[the manual states:]]
>
> "Avoid lengthy warm-up idling. Once the engine is running
>smoothly, begin driving--but gently. Remember, however, that on
>cold winter days this may take a little longer."[/color]

But what would the Camry manual know? The RULE OF THUMB is "Three
minutes of warmup!"
--
"We have enough youth; let's start looking for the Fountain of Sense." --Anon

On Mon, 27 Mar 2006 18:13:11 -0600, Don Fearn wrote:
[color=blue]
> Hard to believe, but true -- "Built_Well" <bw@bbbb.com> typed:
>[color=green]
>>Ray O is one-hundred percent right.
>>
>> Page 248 of the 2006 Camry manual:
>>
>> "You can start a cold or hot engine as follows: With your
>>foot off the accelerator pedal, crank the engine by turning the
>>key to START. Release it when the engine starts.
>>
>> "Engine should be warmed up by driving, not in idle.
>>For warming up, drive with smoothly turning engine until engine
>>coolant temperature is within normal range."
>>
>>Ten pages later on Page 258, [[the manual states:]]
>>
>> "Avoid lengthy warm-up idling. Once the engine is running
>>smoothly, begin driving--but gently. Remember, however, that on
>>cold winter days this may take a little longer."[/color]
>
> But what would the Camry manual know? The RULE OF THUMB is "Three
> minutes of warmup!"[/color]

Gee, someone coomes in and asks a question, I provide an answer.
Don't like it? Stuff it!
I've only been doing it for 30 fucking years and have gotten over 250,000
on a number of cars.
Guess I've been doing something wrong, eh?

Moron.

--
In the grand scheme fo things...
What difference does it make?

Hard to believe, but true -- Hachiroku <Trueno@ae86.GTS> typed:
[color=blue]
>
>Gee, someone coomes in and asks a question, I provide an answer.
>Don't like it? Stuff it![/color]

Bummer, man. Doncha hate it when your answer doesn't quite cut the
mustard?
[color=blue]
>I've only been doing it for 30 fucking years and have gotten over 250,000
>on a number of cars.[/color]

I'll see your 30 years and raise you another 5 or 6. And although my
cars don't add up to more than about 200,000; adding in my motorcycle
miles gets me to well over 350,000 total vehicle miles . . . .
[color=blue]
>Guess I've been doing something wrong, eh?[/color]

Could be. Maybe over-warming your engines. Oh well, it doesn't make a
huge difference in longevity and only wastes some gas, I guess.
[color=blue]
>Moron.[/color]

That's me. Or was that your signature?
[color=blue]
>--
>In the grand scheme fo things...
>What difference does it make?[/color]


Oh, I guess not. Try this one out:
--
"What do *you* care what other people think?" --Arline Feynman

"Don Fearn" <pooder@charter.net> wrote in message
news:h8eh22hadvtbhj8kpp28evajtdjuvub05l@4ax.com...[color=blue]
> Hard to believe, but true -- Hachiroku <Trueno@ae86.GTS> typed:
>[color=green]
>>
>>Gee, someone coomes in and asks a question, I provide an answer.
>>Don't like it? Stuff it![/color]
>
> Bummer, man. Doncha hate it when your answer doesn't quite cut the
> mustard?
>[color=green]
>>I've only been doing it for 30 fucking years and have gotten over 250,000
>>on a number of cars.[/color]
>
> I'll see your 30 years and raise you another 5 or 6. And although my
> cars don't add up to more than about 200,000; adding in my motorcycle
> miles gets me to well over 350,000 total vehicle miles . . . .
>[color=green]
>>Guess I've been doing something wrong, eh?[/color]
>
> Could be. Maybe over-warming your engines. Oh well, it doesn't make a
> huge difference in longevity and only wastes some gas, I guess.
>[color=green]
>>Moron.[/color]
>
> That's me. Or was that your signature?[/color]

"Don't let the door slap your ass on the way out".
Troll.
[color=blue]
> I'll see your 30 years and raise you another 5 or 6. And although my
> cars don't add up to more than about 200,000[/color]

Then I guess your method work real well. Read again, NitWit. Over 250,000
PER CAR, on 5 cars.
Please, try to keep up. If you can't:

"Don't let the door slap your ass on the way out".

Bye Bye now!

PLONK!

[color=blue]
>
> "Don Fearn" <pooder@charter.net> wrote in message
> news:h8eh22hadvtbhj8kpp28evajtdjuvub05l@4ax.com...[color=green]
>> Hard to believe, but true -- Hachiroku <Trueno@ae86.GTS> typed:
>>[color=darkred]
>>>
>>>Gee, someone coomes in and asks a question, I provide an answer.
>>>Don't like it? Stuff it![/color]
>>
>> Bummer, man. Doncha hate it when your answer doesn't quite cut the
>> mustard?
>>[color=darkred]
>>>I've only been doing it for 30 fucking years and have gotten over 250,000
>>>on a number of cars.[/color]
>>
>> I'll see your 30 years and raise you another 5 or 6. And although my
>> cars don't add up to more than about 200,000; adding in my motorcycle
>> miles gets me to well over 350,000 total vehicle miles . . . .[/color][/color]

Oh, and, you fail to mention. Is your motorcycle Air-Cooled, by any chance?
Slight bit of a difference you may have overlooked.

On Tue, 28 Mar 2006 14:14:16 GMT, "Hachiroku" <Trueno@ae86.GTS> wrote:
[color=blue]
>
>"Don Fearn" <pooder@charter.net> wrote in message
>news:h8eh22hadvtbhj8kpp28evajtdjuvub05l@4ax.com...[color=green]
>> Hard to believe, but true -- Hachiroku <Trueno@ae86.GTS> typed:
>>[color=darkred]
>>>
>>>Gee, someone coomes in and asks a question, I provide an answer.
>>>Don't like it? Stuff it![/color]
>>
>> Bummer, man. Doncha hate it when your answer doesn't quite cut the
>> mustard?
>>[color=darkred]
>>>I've only been doing it for 30 fucking years and have gotten over 250,000
>>>on a number of cars.[/color]
>>
>> I'll see your 30 years and raise you another 5 or 6. And although my
>> cars don't add up to more than about 200,000; adding in my motorcycle
>> miles gets me to well over 350,000 total vehicle miles . . . .
>>[color=darkred]
>>>Guess I've been doing something wrong, eh?[/color]
>>
>> Could be. Maybe over-warming your engines. Oh well, it doesn't make a
>> huge difference in longevity and only wastes some gas, I guess.
>>[color=darkred]
>>>Moron.[/color]
>>
>> That's me. Or was that your signature?[/color]
>
>"Don't let the door slap your ass on the way out".
>Troll.
>[color=green]
>> I'll see your 30 years and raise you another 5 or 6. And although my
>> cars don't add up to more than about 200,000[/color]
>
>Then I guess your method work real well. Read again, NitWit. Over 250,000
>PER CAR, on 5 cars.
>Please, try to keep up. If you can't:
>
>"Don't let the door slap your ass on the way out".
>
>Bye Bye now!
>
>PLONK!
>[/color]

LOL...

You go Hacki!

--

Scott in Florida

"Scott in Florida" <MoveOn@outa.here> wrote in message
news:jtii22poihvo9p99hprtrbqbn2khtq7lu4@4ax.com...[color=blue]
> On Tue, 28 Mar 2006 14:14:16 GMT, "Hachiroku" <Trueno@ae86.GTS> wrote:
>[color=green]
>>
>>"Don Fearn" <pooder@charter.net> wrote in message
>>news:h8eh22hadvtbhj8kpp28evajtdjuvub05l@4ax.com...[color=darkred]
>>> Hard to believe, but true -- Hachiroku <Trueno@ae86.GTS> typed:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>Gee, someone coomes in and asks a question, I provide an answer.
>>>>Don't like it? Stuff it!
>>>
>>> Bummer, man. Doncha hate it when your answer doesn't quite cut the
>>> mustard?
>>>
>>>>I've only been doing it for 30 fucking years and have gotten over
>>>>250,000
>>>>on a number of cars.
>>>
>>> I'll see your 30 years and raise you another 5 or 6. And although my
>>> cars don't add up to more than about 200,000; adding in my motorcycle
>>> miles gets me to well over 350,000 total vehicle miles . . . .
>>>
>>>>Guess I've been doing something wrong, eh?
>>>
>>> Could be. Maybe over-warming your engines. Oh well, it doesn't make a
>>> huge difference in longevity and only wastes some gas, I guess.
>>>
>>>>Moron.
>>>
>>> That's me. Or was that your signature?[/color]
>>
>>"Don't let the door slap your ass on the way out".
>>Troll.
>>[color=darkred]
>>> I'll see your 30 years and raise you another 5 or 6. And although my
>>> cars don't add up to more than about 200,000[/color]
>>
>>Then I guess your method work real well. Read again, NitWit. Over 250,000
>>PER CAR, on 5 cars.
>>Please, try to keep up. If you can't:
>>
>>"Don't let the door slap your ass on the way out".
>>
>>Bye Bye now!
>>
>>PLONK!
>>[/color]
>
> LOL...
>
> You go Hacki!
>
> --
>
> Scott in Florida[/color]

LOL! I suppose next he tells me that washing and waxing my cars every 3
months isn't the reason why they go 15 or more years in New England without
rusting, too.

Quite a gracious person, isn't he?

On Tue, 28 Mar 2006 15:11:29 GMT, "Hachiroku" <Trueno@ae86.GTS> wrote:
[color=blue]
>
>"Scott in Florida" <MoveOn@outa.here> wrote in message
>news:jtii22poihvo9p99hprtrbqbn2khtq7lu4@4ax.com...[color=green]
>> On Tue, 28 Mar 2006 14:14:16 GMT, "Hachiroku" <Trueno@ae86.GTS> wrote:
>>[color=darkred]
>>>
>>>"Don Fearn" <pooder@charter.net> wrote in message
>>>news:h8eh22hadvtbhj8kpp28evajtdjuvub05l@4ax.com...
>>>> Hard to believe, but true -- Hachiroku <Trueno@ae86.GTS> typed:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Gee, someone coomes in and asks a question, I provide an answer.
>>>>>Don't like it? Stuff it!
>>>>
>>>> Bummer, man. Doncha hate it when your answer doesn't quite cut the
>>>> mustard?
>>>>
>>>>>I've only been doing it for 30 fucking years and have gotten over
>>>>>250,000
>>>>>on a number of cars.
>>>>
>>>> I'll see your 30 years and raise you another 5 or 6. And although my
>>>> cars don't add up to more than about 200,000; adding in my motorcycle
>>>> miles gets me to well over 350,000 total vehicle miles . . . .
>>>>
>>>>>Guess I've been doing something wrong, eh?
>>>>
>>>> Could be. Maybe over-warming your engines. Oh well, it doesn't make a
>>>> huge difference in longevity and only wastes some gas, I guess.
>>>>
>>>>>Moron.
>>>>
>>>> That's me. Or was that your signature?
>>>
>>>"Don't let the door slap your ass on the way out".
>>>Troll.
>>>
>>>> I'll see your 30 years and raise you another 5 or 6. And although my
>>>> cars don't add up to more than about 200,000
>>>
>>>Then I guess your method work real well. Read again, NitWit. Over 250,000
>>>PER CAR, on 5 cars.
>>>Please, try to keep up. If you can't:
>>>
>>>"Don't let the door slap your ass on the way out".
>>>
>>>Bye Bye now!
>>>
>>>PLONK!
>>>[/color]
>>
>> LOL...
>>
>> You go Hacki!
>>
>> --
>>
>> Scott in Florida[/color]
>
>LOL! I suppose next he tells me that washing and waxing my cars every 3
>months isn't the reason why they go 15 or more years in New England without
>rusting, too.
>
>Quite a gracious person, isn't he?
>[/color]

LOL....

Hey Howie was GREAT today..

--

Scott in Florida

Hard to believe, but true -- "Hachiroku" <Trueno@ae86.GTS> typed:
[color=blue]
>Oh, and, you fail to mention. Is your motorcycle Air-Cooled, by any chance?[/color]

Most of them have been. Some have been oil-cooled and I've had some
water-cooled, too. The most automotive was my '86 BMW K75; water
cooled with a dry clutch and shaft drive; basically a BMW car
four-cylinder engine flopped on its side and a cylinder lopped off.
[color=blue]
>Slight bit of a difference you may have overlooked.[/color]

What difference is that?

I can only think of one:

For pre-Evolution Harleys (like my '56 FLH) it's recommended to let
them idle a minute or two to allow the cylinders and heads to warm
slowly with minimum of applied stress before riding off. If that's
not done, the difference in expansion rates between the cast-iron
cylinder and aluminum head can result in oil weepage through the head
and base gaskets which will get worse over time. This is a case where
a two or three minute rule of thumb applies.

Any other engines I know of, a two or three minute idling warmup
should be an exception rather than a rule of thumb. I can't imagine
why I'd ever do it on a motorcycle; it's not like I'm waiting for the
cabin to warm up and the windshield to clear off ;^)

If my air-cooled motorcycle engines are exceptions, I'd be glad to
learn about those differences. Or for other car engines too, for that
matter . . . .

-Don

--
__ ____ _ _____________________________________________________
/ // o ) // | Don Fearn | In | \
| // __/_// | of | Th' | Harris - '01 R1100S |
|((_/oo(o/er is: Rochester, | MAN | Harvey - '72 CB500-4 |
| DoD #591 | Minnesota | Garage: Hermione - '65 TR6R |
\_____________|_______________|_______|___Butcher_Boy_-_'56_FLH__/
"What do _you_ care what other people think?" --Arline Feynman