Avalon shows dent in Toyota quality

From a recent Automotive News aricle -

Avalon shows dent in Toyota quality

Fixes sought for 'problematic vehicle'

Alan Seider has owned 11 Toyotas since 1982, but his 2006 Avalon likely will
be his last. He says quality glitches have bedeviled his Toyota sedan, which
he has driven less than 6,000 miles since he bought it last July. His dealer
could not solve the car's problems......

See
[url]http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060501/FREE/60501002/1024/LATESTNEWS[/url]

Ed

Thanks for the link. Toyota Avalon has had a free ride since 2001. Glad to
see a poor quality reputation is finally catching up with the reality of
owning one.


"C. E. White" <cewhite3@removemindspring.com> wrote in message
news:4458bd4b$1@kcnews01...[color=blue]
> From a recent Automotive News aricle -
>
> Avalon shows dent in Toyota quality
>
> Fixes sought for 'problematic vehicle'
>
> Alan Seider has owned 11 Toyotas since 1982, but his 2006 Avalon likely
> will
> be his last. He says quality glitches have bedeviled his Toyota sedan,
> which
> he has driven less than 6,000 miles since he bought it last July. His
> dealer
> could not solve the car's problems......
>
> See
> [url]http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060501/FREE/60501002/1024/LATESTNEWS[/url]
>
> Ed
>
>[/color]

Thanks for the link. Toyota Avalon has had a free ride since 2001. Glad to
see a poor quality reputation is finally catching up with the reality of
owning one.


"C. E. White" <cewhite3@removemindspring.com> wrote in message
news:4458bd4b$1@kcnews01...[color=blue]
> From a recent Automotive News aricle -
>
> Avalon shows dent in Toyota quality
>
> Fixes sought for 'problematic vehicle'
>
> Alan Seider has owned 11 Toyotas since 1982, but his 2006 Avalon likely
> will
> be his last. He says quality glitches have bedeviled his Toyota sedan,
> which
> he has driven less than 6,000 miles since he bought it last July. His
> dealer
> could not solve the car's problems......
>
> See
> [url]http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060501/FREE/60501002/1024/LATESTNEWS[/url]
>
> Ed
>
>[/color]

C. E. White wrote:[color=blue]
> From a recent Automotive News aricle -
>
> Avalon shows dent in Toyota quality
>
> Fixes sought for 'problematic vehicle'
>
> Alan Seider has owned 11 Toyotas since 1982, but his 2006 Avalon likely will
> be his last. He says quality glitches have bedeviled his Toyota sedan, which
> he has driven less than 6,000 miles since he bought it last July. His dealer
> could not solve the car's problems......
>
> See
> [url]http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060501/FREE/60501002/1024/LATESTNEWS[/url]
>
> Ed
>
>[/color]

Have not read the story yet, but the Camry based Avalon is known for
steering & suspension issues.

Rob

On Wed, 03 May 2006 20:05:35 -0400, trainfan1
<lmsearing@usdatanet.net> wrote:
[color=blue]
>C. E. White wrote:[color=green]
>> From a recent Automotive News aricle -
>>
>> Avalon shows dent in Toyota quality
>>
>> Fixes sought for 'problematic vehicle'
>>
>> Alan Seider has owned 11 Toyotas since 1982, but his 2006 Avalon likely will
>> be his last. He says quality glitches have bedeviled his Toyota sedan, which
>> he has driven less than 6,000 miles since he bought it last July. His dealer
>> could not solve the car's problems......
>>
>> See
>> [url]http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060501/FREE/60501002/1024/LATESTNEWS[/url]
>>
>> Ed
>>
>>[/color]
>
>Have not read the story yet, but the Camry based Avalon is known for
>steering & suspension issues.
>
>Rob[/color]
The problems, while upsetting to a long-time Toyota owner, are
significantly less serious than the average from GM, Chrysler, and
Ford.And from my experience with Toyota, the problems WILL be fixed,
both on the production line, and at the dealership.

*** Posted via a free Usenet account from [url]http://www.teranews.com[/url] ***

<clare at snyder.on.ca> wrote in message
news:72pi525fgvv2eqjdn54ga943q2dm084upf@4ax.com...[color=blue]
> On Wed, 03 May 2006 20:05:35 -0400, trainfan1
> <lmsearing@usdatanet.net> wrote:[/color]
[color=blue]
> The problems, while upsetting to a long-time Toyota owner, are
> significantly less serious than the average from GM, Chrysler, and
> Ford.And from my experience with Toyota, the problems WILL be fixed,
> both on the production line, and at the dealership.[/color]

And you are basing this opinion on? I think this is the thing that bothers
me most about Toyota owners. It seems that no matter how crappy their Toyota
is, they claim everything else is worse. I suppose you have to do that if
you pay two or three thousand more for a boring third rate design.

Ed

<clare at snyder.on.ca> wrote in message
news:72pi525fgvv2eqjdn54ga943q2dm084upf@4ax.com...[color=blue]
> On Wed, 03 May 2006 20:05:35 -0400, trainfan1
> <lmsearing@usdatanet.net> wrote:[/color]
[color=blue]
> The problems, while upsetting to a long-time Toyota owner, are
> significantly less serious than the average from GM, Chrysler, and
> Ford.And from my experience with Toyota, the problems WILL be fixed,
> both on the production line, and at the dealership.[/color]

And you are basing this opinion on? I think this is the thing that bothers
me most about Toyota owners. It seems that no matter how crappy their Toyota
is, they claim everything else is worse. I suppose you have to do that if
you pay two or three thousand more for a boring third rate design.

Ed

In alt.autos.ford C. E. White <cewhite@mindspring.com> wrote:
[color=blue]
> <clare at snyder.on.ca> wrote in message
> news:72pi525fgvv2eqjdn54ga943q2dm084upf@4ax.com...[color=green]
> > On Wed, 03 May 2006 20:05:35 -0400, trainfan1
> > <lmsearing@usdatanet.net> wrote:[/color][/color]
[color=blue][color=green]
> > The problems, while upsetting to a long-time Toyota owner, are
> > significantly less serious than the average from GM, Chrysler, and
> > Ford.And from my experience with Toyota, the problems WILL be fixed,
> > both on the production line, and at the dealership.[/color][/color]
[color=blue]
> And you are basing this opinion on? I think this is the thing that bothers
> me most about Toyota owners. It seems that no matter how crappy their Toyota
> is, they claim everything else is worse. I suppose you have to do that if
> you pay two or three thousand more for a boring third rate design.[/color]

What are you basing that opinion on? Go look on bobisthoilguy.com and find
that about 1/2 of the GM engines in the oil analysis section have coolant leaks
into the oil. Or is that not a 'serious problem?'

And if you don't like Toyota owners, what are you doing here? Masochist?

On Thu, 04 May 2006 02:59:23 GMT, "C. E. White"
<cewhite@mindspring.com> wrote:
[color=blue]
>
><clare at snyder.on.ca> wrote in message
>news:72pi525fgvv2eqjdn54ga943q2dm084upf@4ax.com...[color=green]
>> On Wed, 03 May 2006 20:05:35 -0400, trainfan1
>> <lmsearing@usdatanet.net> wrote:[/color]
>[color=green]
>> The problems, while upsetting to a long-time Toyota owner, are
>> significantly less serious than the average from GM, Chrysler, and
>> Ford.And from my experience with Toyota, the problems WILL be fixed,
>> both on the production line, and at the dealership.[/color]
>
>And you are basing this opinion on? I think this is the thing that bothers
>me most about Toyota owners. It seems that no matter how crappy their Toyota
>is, they claim everything else is worse. I suppose you have to do that if
>you pay two or three thousand more for a boring third rate design.
>
>Ed
>[/color]
Perhaps he has based this on actual owner surveys. Both Consumer
Reports and J.D. Powers have rated Toyota as the best in initial and
long-term quality.

He may have based this on his own experience too. Like most
Consumers, he may have owned GM and Ford too. He may have found that
they have presented more problems. Have you thought of that?

Think of this too. Every Toyota owner will tell you that there are
some quality problems sometimes. That's a given. What you don't
understand is that Toyota problems overall are significantly less than
GM and Ford when new. That's a fact, not opinion. Also, Toyotas are
far more reliable when they get old.

Toyotas are not boring third rate designs. Look at Lexus for example.
Every other luxury manufacturer has copied their interior design
(except for Acura). How come GM and Ford have electroluminescent (or
some form of cheap knock off) displays now? How come they all have
big round knobs for the radio now on opposite side like Lexus? I'll
tell you why, because they copied it. They did so because Lexus
outsells all other luxury makes in the U.S. FACT NOT OPINION.

It is you who is biased by your prejudices. Open your mind and be
willing to change. I did. I used to love my GM cars until I found
something better. Only old stubborn anachronisms don't change their
minds.

If you don't like what is posted in this newsgroup, you have the
freedom to go elsewhere. I don't see any postings asking you to stay.

[color=blue]
>[color=green][color=darkred]
>> > The problems, while upsetting to a long-time Toyota owner, are
>> > significantly less serious than the average from GM, Chrysler, and
>> > Ford.And from my experience with Toyota, the problems WILL be fixed,
>> > both on the production line, and at the dealership.[/color][/color]
>[color=green]
>> And you are basing this opinion on? I think this is the thing that
>> bothers
>> me most about Toyota owners. It seems that no matter how crappy their
>> Toyota
>> is, they claim everything else is worse. I suppose you have to do that if
>> you pay two or three thousand more for a boring third rate design.[/color]
>
> What are you basing that opinion on? Go look on bobisthoilguy.com and
> find
> that about 1/2 of the GM engines in the oil analysis section have coolant
> leaks
> into the oil. Or is that not a 'serious problem?'
>
> And if you don't like Toyota owners, what are you doing here? Masochist?
>
>[/color]
DON'T FORGET THE INCREDIBLE GM PISTON SLAP ISSUES !!!

[email]trexo@encompass.net[/email] wrote:
[color=blue]
> In alt.autos.ford C. E. White <cewhite@mindspring.com> wrote:
>[color=green][color=darkred]
>>> The problems, while upsetting to a long-time Toyota owner, are
>>> significantly less serious than the average from GM, Chrysler, and
>>> Ford.And from my experience with Toyota, the problems WILL be fixed,
>>> both on the production line, and at the dealership.[/color][/color]
>[color=green]
>> And you are basing this opinion on? I think this is the thing that bothers
>> me most about Toyota owners. It seems that no matter how crappy their Toyota
>> is, they claim everything else is worse. I suppose you have to do that if
>> you pay two or three thousand more for a boring third rate design.[/color]
>
> What are you basing that opinion on? Go look on bobisthoilguy.com and find
> that about 1/2 of the GM engines in the oil analysis section have coolant leaks
> into the oil. Or is that not a 'serious problem?'
>
> And if you don't like Toyota owners, what are you doing here? Masochist?[/color]

Pay no attention to "Ed White". He owned one Toyota in the early 80s that
turned out to be a rare lemon and still thinks that Toyota overall is no
better than other makers for reliability. He refuses to believe surveys by
Consumer Reports, JD Power, etc. because they don't agree with his own
opinions, claiming they are nothing more than popularity contests. But yet
he has never presented any solid, unbiased evidence to the contrary other
than his own limited anecdotal evidence.

On 04 May 2006 06:32:01 GMT, [email]trexo@encompass.net[/email] wrote:
[color=blue]
>Go look on bobisthoilguy.com[/color]

I think you left out an 'e' in the link

bobistheoilguy.com seems to work

--

Scott in Florida

"Bob H" <dontspam@nospam.org> wrote in message
news:PNudnS3U28KaRsTZRVn-rw@adelphia.com...
[color=blue]
> DON'T FORGET THE INCREDIBLE GM PISTON SLAP ISSUES !!![/color]

Last year I was shopping for a new pick-up. Initially I was primarily
interested in a Tundra. I liked the size. I test drove three different
Tundras. All three sounded like rock crushers when they were initially
started. Two of the salesmen said it was perfectly normal and that they all
did that. The third salesman more or less ignored my question. Now maybe the
noise was not piston slap, but it sure sounded like piston slap, and it was
worse than any GM vehicle I have personal experience with. Now maybe it
wasn't a problem (it did clear up with in a 20 seconds in all three cases),
but it certainly was not the sort of happy noise that you expect from a
Toyota (at least based on all the BS you read about Toyotas). I also think
it is unconscionable that Toyota still requires routine valve inspection /
adjustment on many of their engines. In the end I bought a Nissan Frontier
instead of a Toyota. This was primarily due to cost. With similar equipment,
the Nissan was 3k less than a Toyota. So far the Nissan is fine.

Ed

"High Tech Misfit" <me@privacy.net> wrote in message
news:1irnbm4rginfz.dlg@hightech.misfit...
[color=blue]
> Pay no attention to "Ed White". He owned one Toyota in the early 80s that
> turned out to be a rare lemon and still thinks that Toyota overall is no
> better than other makers for reliability. He refuses to believe surveys[/color]
by[color=blue]
> Consumer Reports, JD Power, etc. because they don't agree with his own
> opinions, claiming they are nothing more than popularity contests. But[/color]
yet[color=blue]
> he has never presented any solid, unbiased evidence to the contrary other
> than his own limited anecdotal evidence.[/color]

Toyotas are nothing special in the JD Powers rating, yet Toyota owners
constantly cite this as proof of Toyota superiority. You need to actually
read the stuff you are citing. For instance, in the 2005 Initial Quality
Study, Toyotas had 105 problems per 100 vehicles. Buicks only had 100. The
industry average was 118. In the 2005 Vehicle Dependability Study, Toyotas
had 194 problems per 100 vehicles, Bucks only 163. The industry average was
237. If you put so much faith in JD Powers results, you should be buying a
Buick. I put no faith in Consumer Reports rankings. Their methodology is
non-scientific. In recent years they have cleaned up the result to remove
really horrible inconsistencies (like Buicks scoring much better than
Oldsmobiles), however it is still a flawed survey. I just filled out my 2006
CR Survey. The amount of information they collected is insufficient to prove
anything. Given the attitude of most Toyota owners it is not surprising that
they do well in the Consumer Reports popularity survey.

Ed

>> But yet he has never presented any solid, unbiased evidence to the contrary other[color=blue][color=green]
>> than his own limited anecdotal evidence.[/color][/color]

Who needs solid and unbiased evidence for auto quality issues...
eventually they all break down, peroid.

It is very seldom that something goes wrong on my cars that I wasn't
already aware of or expected due to wear and tear or age.

Therefore I drive what I think to be the make that is easiest to
maintain and fix. This is a combination of the engineering but more
importantly what kind of support I can find on my own. And it helps to
be a tool collector.

In my case I base my purchase on how much I will be at the mercy of the
dealership for maintenance and repair issues. Ford has not let me down
in this regard.

Toyota, GM, Ford, Honda, Nissan... get over it. They all require TLC
and then just break down.