2003 Camry - Carfax vehicle history - suspicious?

I'm in the chicago area and I'm looking to buy this car from a local
Chevy dealer:

2003 Camry LE Sedan 4 DR
2.4L L4 EFI DOHC 16V
Equipment: Standard
Mileage: 49,500
Asking price: $13K

Kelly Blue book (Trade in value - Good condition) is about $11K for my
zip code (60004). Cosmetically the car is in excellent condition. The
body has no rust, paint is in great shape with no scratches, dents or
dings that I can see. The interior is also great, no fading, stains,
rips or tears that I can see. It rides great, and I'm going to take it
to a mechanic for an inspection.

The Chevy dealer will sell it to me for $12,300. They gave me a copy of
it's Carfax report, and I'm wondering how to decipher it:

8/25/2003
Mileage:
Source: NICB
Comments: Vehicle manufactured and shipped to original dealer.

9/04/2003
Mileage: 3
Source: Service Facility
Comments: Vehicle serviced.

9/05/2003
Mileage: 3
Source: Dealer Inventory Kentucky
Comments: Vehicle sold

9/15/2003
Mileage: 3
Source: Kentucky Motor Vehicle Dept - Louisville, Kentucky
Comments: Registered as a personal vehicle

9/18/2003
Mileage: 11
Source: Kentucky Motor Vehicle Dept - Louisville, Kentucky
Comments: Title or registration issued. First owner reported. Loan or
lien reported.

2/25/2005
Mileage: 41,328
Source: Kentucky Motor Vehicle Dept - Cedar Rapids, IA
Comments: Title or registration issued.

4/28/2005
Mileage: 49,391
Source: Auto Auction
Comments: Sold at auction in Southeast Region. Listed as a fleet
vehicle.

4/29/2005
Mileage: 49,391
Source: Kentucky Motor Vehicle Dept - Elizabethtown, Kentucky
Comments: Title or registration issued. New owner reported.

5/12/2005
Mileage: 49,398
Source: Auto Auction
Comments: Sold at auction in Southeast Region. Listed as a dealer
vehicle.

5/312005
Mileage: 49,398
Source: Dealer Inventory - Lincolnwood, IL
Comments: Vehicle offered for sale

2/24/2006
Mileage: 49,398
Source: Dealer Inventory - Palatine, IL
Comments: Vehicle offered for sale

3/10/2006
Mileage: 49,398
Source: Illinois Motor Vehicle Dept - Chicago, IL
Comments: Title issued or updated. New owner reported.

Can anyone summarize this for me? This car has bounced around a few
states, has been sold at auction twice, and has been offered for sale
twice with some pretty long gaps in between. Any red flags here? Any
help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

- Dave

<tron9901@msn.com> wrote in message
news:1146849078.200995.224130@g10g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...[color=blue]
> I'm in the chicago area and I'm looking to buy this car from a local
> Chevy dealer:
>
> 2003 Camry LE Sedan 4 DR
> 2.4L L4 EFI DOHC 16V
> Equipment: Standard
> Mileage: 49,500
> Asking price: $13K
>
> Kelly Blue book (Trade in value - Good condition) is about $11K for my
> zip code (60004). Cosmetically the car is in excellent condition. The
> body has no rust, paint is in great shape with no scratches, dents or
> dings that I can see. The interior is also great, no fading, stains,
> rips or tears that I can see. It rides great, and I'm going to take it
> to a mechanic for an inspection.[/color]
[color=blue]
> The Chevy dealer will sell it to me for $12,300. They gave me a copy of
> it's Carfax report, and I'm wondering how to decipher it:[/color]

Is the car at Lattof or Hoskins Chev?

My explanations are after the entries below.
[color=blue]
>
> 8/25/2003
> Mileage:
> Source: NICB
> Comments: Vehicle manufactured and shipped to original dealer.[/color]

Pretty self-explanatory.
[color=blue]
>
> 9/04/2003
> Mileage: 3
> Source: Service Facility
> Comments: Vehicle serviced.[/color]

Sounds like the pre-delivery service.
[color=blue]
>
> 9/05/2003
> Mileage: 3
> Source: Dealer Inventory Kentucky
> Comments: Vehicle sold
>
> 9/15/2003
> Mileage: 3
> Source: Kentucky Motor Vehicle Dept - Louisville, Kentucky
> Comments: Registered as a personal vehicle
>
> 9/18/2003
> Mileage: 11
> Source: Kentucky Motor Vehicle Dept - Louisville, Kentucky
> Comments: Title or registration issued. First owner reported. Loan or
> lien reported.[/color]

These 3 entries indicate that the car was sold to a retail or fleet
customer, registered, and a loan was issued.
[color=blue]
>
> 2/25/2005
> Mileage: 41,328
> Source: Kentucky Motor Vehicle Dept - Cedar Rapids, IA
> Comments: Title or registration issued.
>
> 4/28/2005
> Mileage: 49,391
> Source: Auto Auction
> Comments: Sold at auction in Southeast Region. Listed as a fleet
> vehicle.
>
> 4/29/2005
> Mileage: 49,391
> Source: Kentucky Motor Vehicle Dept - Elizabethtown, Kentucky
> Comments: Title or registration issued. New owner reported.
>
> 5/12/2005
> Mileage: 49,398
> Source: Auto Auction
> Comments: Sold at auction in Southeast Region. Listed as a dealer
> vehicle.
>
> 5/312005
> Mileage: 49,398
> Source: Dealer Inventory - Lincolnwood, IL
> Comments: Vehicle offered for sale[/color]

The car made the round of several auctions before it was sold. My guess is
that it was a fleet or rental car company vehicle that a dealer in
Lincolnwood eventually retailed as a used vehicle.
[color=blue]
>
> 2/24/2006
> Mileage: 49,398
> Source: Dealer Inventory - Palatine, IL
> Comments: Vehicle offered for sale
>
> 3/10/2006
> Mileage: 49,398
> Source: Illinois Motor Vehicle Dept - Chicago, IL
> Comments: Title issued or updated. New owner reported.[/color]

Whoever bought the car in Lincolnwood traded it in on something else.
[color=blue]
>
> Can anyone summarize this for me? This car has bounced around a few
> states, has been sold at auction twice, and has been offered for sale
> twice with some pretty long gaps in between. Any red flags here? Any
> help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!
>
> - Dave
>[/color]

the long gaps in between mean are the periods when someone owned the
vehicle.
--

Ray O
(correct punctuation to reply)

Ray O wrote:[color=blue]
> <tron9901@msn.com> wrote in message
> news:1146849078.200995.224130@g10g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...[color=green]
> > I'm in the chicago area and I'm looking to buy this car from a local
> > Chevy dealer:
> >
> > 2003 Camry LE Sedan 4 DR
> > 2.4L L4 EFI DOHC 16V
> > Equipment: Standard
> > Mileage: 49,500
> > Asking price: $13K
> >
> > Kelly Blue book (Trade in value - Good condition) is about $11K for my
> > zip code (60004). Cosmetically the car is in excellent condition. The
> > body has no rust, paint is in great shape with no scratches, dents or
> > dings that I can see. The interior is also great, no fading, stains,
> > rips or tears that I can see. It rides great, and I'm going to take it
> > to a mechanic for an inspection.[/color]
>[color=green]
> > The Chevy dealer will sell it to me for $12,300. They gave me a copy of
> > it's Carfax report, and I'm wondering how to decipher it:[/color]
>
> Is the car at Lattof or Hoskins Chev?
>
> My explanations are after the entries below.
>[color=green]
> >
> > 8/25/2003
> > Mileage:
> > Source: NICB
> > Comments: Vehicle manufactured and shipped to original dealer.[/color]
>
> Pretty self-explanatory.
>[color=green]
> >
> > 9/04/2003
> > Mileage: 3
> > Source: Service Facility
> > Comments: Vehicle serviced.[/color]
>
> Sounds like the pre-delivery service.
>[color=green]
> >
> > 9/05/2003
> > Mileage: 3
> > Source: Dealer Inventory Kentucky
> > Comments: Vehicle sold
> >
> > 9/15/2003
> > Mileage: 3
> > Source: Kentucky Motor Vehicle Dept - Louisville, Kentucky
> > Comments: Registered as a personal vehicle
> >
> > 9/18/2003
> > Mileage: 11
> > Source: Kentucky Motor Vehicle Dept - Louisville, Kentucky
> > Comments: Title or registration issued. First owner reported. Loan or
> > lien reported.[/color]
>
> These 3 entries indicate that the car was sold to a retail or fleet
> customer, registered, and a loan was issued.
>[color=green]
> >
> > 2/25/2005
> > Mileage: 41,328
> > Source: Kentucky Motor Vehicle Dept - Cedar Rapids, IA
> > Comments: Title or registration issued.
> >
> > 4/28/2005
> > Mileage: 49,391
> > Source: Auto Auction
> > Comments: Sold at auction in Southeast Region. Listed as a fleet
> > vehicle.
> >
> > 4/29/2005
> > Mileage: 49,391
> > Source: Kentucky Motor Vehicle Dept - Elizabethtown, Kentucky
> > Comments: Title or registration issued. New owner reported.
> >
> > 5/12/2005
> > Mileage: 49,398
> > Source: Auto Auction
> > Comments: Sold at auction in Southeast Region. Listed as a dealer
> > vehicle.
> >
> > 5/312005
> > Mileage: 49,398
> > Source: Dealer Inventory - Lincolnwood, IL
> > Comments: Vehicle offered for sale[/color]
>
> The car made the round of several auctions before it was sold. My guess is
> that it was a fleet or rental car company vehicle that a dealer in
> Lincolnwood eventually retailed as a used vehicle.
>[color=green]
> >
> > 2/24/2006
> > Mileage: 49,398
> > Source: Dealer Inventory - Palatine, IL
> > Comments: Vehicle offered for sale
> >
> > 3/10/2006
> > Mileage: 49,398
> > Source: Illinois Motor Vehicle Dept - Chicago, IL
> > Comments: Title issued or updated. New owner reported.[/color]
>
> Whoever bought the car in Lincolnwood traded it in on something else.
>[color=green]
> >
> > Can anyone summarize this for me? This car has bounced around a few
> > states, has been sold at auction twice, and has been offered for sale
> > twice with some pretty long gaps in between. Any red flags here? Any
> > help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!
> >
> > - Dave
> >[/color]
>
> the long gaps in between mean are the periods when someone owned the
> vehicle.
> --
>
> Ray O
> (correct punctuation to reply)[/color]

Thanks for the detailed reply Ray. It's Grossinger Chev actually.

The "long gaps in between" that I'm referring to is when the car
apparently sat on one (Lincolnwood) dealer's lot for 8 months
(5/31/2005 - 2/24/2006) without being sold, and then another (Palatine)
dealer's lot for 2 months (2/24/2006 - Present) until I walked up and
test drove it yesterday.

I would imagine the Camry, as a pretty popular car, would be fairly
easy to sell. Is this normal for a car to sit on a dealer's lot for
that long?

<tron9901@msn.com> wrote in message
news:1146855469.223469.8170@v46g2000cwv.googlegroups.com...[color=blue]
> Ray O wrote:[color=green]
>> <tron9901@msn.com> wrote in message
>> news:1146849078.200995.224130@g10g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...[color=darkred]
>> > I'm in the chicago area and I'm looking to buy this car from a local
>> > Chevy dealer:
>> >
>> > 2003 Camry LE Sedan 4 DR
>> > 2.4L L4 EFI DOHC 16V
>> > Equipment: Standard
>> > Mileage: 49,500
>> > Asking price: $13K
>> >
>> > Kelly Blue book (Trade in value - Good condition) is about $11K for my
>> > zip code (60004). Cosmetically the car is in excellent condition. The
>> > body has no rust, paint is in great shape with no scratches, dents or
>> > dings that I can see. The interior is also great, no fading, stains,
>> > rips or tears that I can see. It rides great, and I'm going to take it
>> > to a mechanic for an inspection.[/color]
>>[color=darkred]
>> > The Chevy dealer will sell it to me for $12,300. They gave me a copy of
>> > it's Carfax report, and I'm wondering how to decipher it:[/color]
>>
>> Is the car at Lattof or Hoskins Chev?
>>
>> My explanations are after the entries below.
>>[color=darkred]
>> >
>> > 8/25/2003
>> > Mileage:
>> > Source: NICB
>> > Comments: Vehicle manufactured and shipped to original dealer.[/color]
>>
>> Pretty self-explanatory.
>>[color=darkred]
>> >
>> > 9/04/2003
>> > Mileage: 3
>> > Source: Service Facility
>> > Comments: Vehicle serviced.[/color]
>>
>> Sounds like the pre-delivery service.
>>[color=darkred]
>> >
>> > 9/05/2003
>> > Mileage: 3
>> > Source: Dealer Inventory Kentucky
>> > Comments: Vehicle sold
>> >
>> > 9/15/2003
>> > Mileage: 3
>> > Source: Kentucky Motor Vehicle Dept - Louisville, Kentucky
>> > Comments: Registered as a personal vehicle
>> >
>> > 9/18/2003
>> > Mileage: 11
>> > Source: Kentucky Motor Vehicle Dept - Louisville, Kentucky
>> > Comments: Title or registration issued. First owner reported. Loan or
>> > lien reported.[/color]
>>
>> These 3 entries indicate that the car was sold to a retail or fleet
>> customer, registered, and a loan was issued.
>>[color=darkred]
>> >
>> > 2/25/2005
>> > Mileage: 41,328
>> > Source: Kentucky Motor Vehicle Dept - Cedar Rapids, IA
>> > Comments: Title or registration issued.
>> >
>> > 4/28/2005
>> > Mileage: 49,391
>> > Source: Auto Auction
>> > Comments: Sold at auction in Southeast Region. Listed as a fleet
>> > vehicle.
>> >
>> > 4/29/2005
>> > Mileage: 49,391
>> > Source: Kentucky Motor Vehicle Dept - Elizabethtown, Kentucky
>> > Comments: Title or registration issued. New owner reported.
>> >
>> > 5/12/2005
>> > Mileage: 49,398
>> > Source: Auto Auction
>> > Comments: Sold at auction in Southeast Region. Listed as a dealer
>> > vehicle.
>> >
>> > 5/312005
>> > Mileage: 49,398
>> > Source: Dealer Inventory - Lincolnwood, IL
>> > Comments: Vehicle offered for sale[/color]
>>
>> The car made the round of several auctions before it was sold. My guess
>> is
>> that it was a fleet or rental car company vehicle that a dealer in
>> Lincolnwood eventually retailed as a used vehicle.
>>[color=darkred]
>> >
>> > 2/24/2006
>> > Mileage: 49,398
>> > Source: Dealer Inventory - Palatine, IL
>> > Comments: Vehicle offered for sale
>> >
>> > 3/10/2006
>> > Mileage: 49,398
>> > Source: Illinois Motor Vehicle Dept - Chicago, IL
>> > Comments: Title issued or updated. New owner reported.[/color]
>>
>> Whoever bought the car in Lincolnwood traded it in on something else.
>>[color=darkred]
>> >
>> > Can anyone summarize this for me? This car has bounced around a few
>> > states, has been sold at auction twice, and has been offered for sale
>> > twice with some pretty long gaps in between. Any red flags here? Any
>> > help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!
>> >
>> > - Dave
>> >[/color]
>>
>> the long gaps in between mean are the periods when someone owned the
>> vehicle.
>> --
>>
>> Ray O
>> (correct punctuation to reply)[/color]
>
> Thanks for the detailed reply Ray. It's Grossinger Chev actually.
>
> The "long gaps in between" that I'm referring to is when the car
> apparently sat on one (Lincolnwood) dealer's lot for 8 months
> (5/31/2005 - 2/24/2006) without being sold, and then another (Palatine)
> dealer's lot for 2 months (2/24/2006 - Present) until I walked up and
> test drove it yesterday.
>
> I would imagine the Camry, as a pretty popular car, would be fairly
> easy to sell. Is this normal for a car to sit on a dealer's lot for
> that long?
>[/color]

Grossinger has dealerships in Lincolnwood as well as the one you went to, so
I bet the vehicle's movement was from one Grossinger dealership to another.

I have no idea why the vehicle sat for such a long time without selling
without looking at it. Cars sit in used car lots for extended periods
when they are overpriced; damaged and not repaired; not detailed properly;
or someone at the dealership was using it for their own use.
--

Ray O
(correct punctuation to reply)

[email]tron9901@msn.com[/email] wrote:[color=blue]
>I'm in the chicago area and I'm looking to buy this car from a local
>Chevy dealer:
>
>2003 Camry LE Sedan 4 DR
>2.4L L4 EFI DOHC 16V
>Equipment: Standard
>Mileage: 49,500
>Asking price: $13K
>
>Kelly Blue book (Trade in value - Good condition) is about $11K for my
>zip code (60004). Cosmetically the car is in excellent condition. The
>body has no rust, paint is in great shape with no scratches, dents or
>dings that I can see. The interior is also great, no fading, stains,
>rips or tears that I can see. It rides great, and I'm going to take it
>to a mechanic for an inspection.
>
>The Chevy dealer will sell it to me for $12,300. They gave me a copy of
>it's Carfax report, and I'm wondering how to decipher it:
>
>8/25/2003
>Mileage:
>Source: NICB
>Comments: Vehicle manufactured and shipped to original dealer.
>
>9/04/2003
>Mileage: 3
>Source: Service Facility
>Comments: Vehicle serviced.
>
>9/05/2003
>Mileage: 3
>Source: Dealer Inventory Kentucky
>Comments: Vehicle sold
>
>9/15/2003
>Mileage: 3
>Source: Kentucky Motor Vehicle Dept - Louisville, Kentucky
>Comments: Registered as a personal vehicle
>
>9/18/2003
>Mileage: 11
>Source: Kentucky Motor Vehicle Dept - Louisville, Kentucky
>Comments: Title or registration issued. First owner reported. Loan or
>lien reported.
>[/color]
These first four, the vehicle came into the country and was sold to an
individual who had to take out a loan to buy the car.
[color=blue]
>2/25/2005
>Mileage: 41,328
>Source: Kentucky Motor Vehicle Dept - Cedar Rapids, IA
>Comments: Title or registration issued.
>[/color]
Sounds like the guy moved to Iowa...but what's up with the "Kentucky Motor
Vehicle Dept"?
[color=blue]
>4/28/2005
>Mileage: 49,391
>Source: Auto Auction
>Comments: Sold at auction in Southeast Region. Listed as a fleet
>vehicle.
>
>4/29/2005
>Mileage: 49,391
>Source: Kentucky Motor Vehicle Dept - Elizabethtown, Kentucky
>Comments: Title or registration issued. New owner reported.
>
>5/12/2005
>Mileage: 49,398
>Source: Auto Auction
>Comments: Sold at auction in Southeast Region. Listed as a dealer
>vehicle.
>
>5/312005
>Mileage: 49,398
>Source: Dealer Inventory - Lincolnwood, IL
>Comments: Vehicle offered for sale
>
>2/24/2006
>Mileage: 49,398
>Source: Dealer Inventory - Palatine, IL
>Comments: Vehicle offered for sale
>
>3/10/2006
>Mileage: 49,398
>Source: Illinois Motor Vehicle Dept - Chicago, IL
>Comments: Title issued or updated. New owner reported.
>[/color]
The guy traded the car in the spring of 2005. It was such a high-mileage
vehicle (49,000+ miles in 18 months) that no one wanted to look at the rig, so
it got passed around a lot.
[color=blue]
>Can anyone summarize this for me? This car has bounced around a few
>states, has been sold at auction twice, and has been offered for sale
>twice with some pretty long gaps in between. Any red flags here? Any
>help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!
>
>- Dave
>[/color]
The mileage is pretty high for the age, but it's gotta be pretty much all
highway miles. If you plan on hanging onto it for a while, I'd say you've got
the best of both worlds -- you can use the high mileage to dicker down the
price, but the mileage doesn't really count from a wear-and-tear perspective --
highway miles are much better than in-town miles.

"Andy Hill" <andy_hill@hp.com> wrote in message
news:k7bn52t7huq3mv3qasbmdk47no7pbc9fk7@4ax.com...[color=blue]
> [email]tron9901@msn.com[/email] wrote:[color=green]
>>I'm in the chicago area and I'm looking to buy this car from a local
>>Chevy dealer:
>>
>>2003 Camry LE Sedan 4 DR
>>2.4L L4 EFI DOHC 16V
>>Equipment: Standard
>>Mileage: 49,500
>>Asking price: $13K
>>
>>Kelly Blue book (Trade in value - Good condition) is about $11K for my
>>zip code (60004). Cosmetically the car is in excellent condition. The
>>body has no rust, paint is in great shape with no scratches, dents or
>>dings that I can see. The interior is also great, no fading, stains,
>>rips or tears that I can see. It rides great, and I'm going to take it
>>to a mechanic for an inspection.
>>
>>The Chevy dealer will sell it to me for $12,300. They gave me a copy of
>>it's Carfax report, and I'm wondering how to decipher it:
>>
>>8/25/2003
>>Mileage:
>>Source: NICB
>>Comments: Vehicle manufactured and shipped to original dealer.
>>
>>9/04/2003
>>Mileage: 3
>>Source: Service Facility
>>Comments: Vehicle serviced.
>>
>>9/05/2003
>>Mileage: 3
>>Source: Dealer Inventory Kentucky
>>Comments: Vehicle sold
>>
>>9/15/2003
>>Mileage: 3
>>Source: Kentucky Motor Vehicle Dept - Louisville, Kentucky
>>Comments: Registered as a personal vehicle
>>
>>9/18/2003
>>Mileage: 11
>>Source: Kentucky Motor Vehicle Dept - Louisville, Kentucky
>>Comments: Title or registration issued. First owner reported. Loan or
>>lien reported.
>>[/color]
> These first four, the vehicle came into the country and was sold to an
> individual who had to take out a loan to buy the car.[/color]

Since Toyota makes Camrys in Kentucky, the likelihood is greater that the
car was made in Kentucky than in Japan.
[color=blue]
>[color=green]
>>2/25/2005
>>Mileage: 41,328
>>Source: Kentucky Motor Vehicle Dept - Cedar Rapids, IA
>>Comments: Title or registration issued.
>>[/color]
> Sounds like the guy moved to Iowa...but what's up with the "Kentucky Motor
> Vehicle Dept"?[/color]

The report was submitted to Carfax by the Kentucky Motor Vehicle Dept.


t auction in Southeast Region. Listed as a fleet[color=blue][color=green]
>>vehicle.
>>
>>4/29/2005
>>Mileage: 49,391
>>Source: Kentucky Motor Vehicle Dept - Elizabethtown, Kentucky
>>Comments: Title or registration issued. New owner reported.
>>
>>5/12/2005
>>Mileage: 49,398
>>Source: Auto Auction
>>Comments: Sold at auction in Southeast Region. Listed as a dealer
>>vehicle.
>>
>>5/312005
>>Mileage: 49,398
>>Source: Dealer Inventory - Lincolnwood, IL
>>Comments: Vehicle offered for sale
>>
>>2/24/2006
>>Mileage: 49,398
>>Source: Dealer Inventory - Palatine, IL
>>Comments: Vehicle offered for sale
>>
>>3/10/2006
>>Mileage: 49,398
>>Source: Illinois Motor Vehicle Dept - Chicago, IL
>>Comments: Title issued or updated. New owner reported.
>>[/color]
> The guy traded the car in the spring of 2005. It was such a high-mileage
> vehicle (49,000+ miles in 18 months) that no one wanted to look at the
> rig, so
> it got passed around a lot.
>[color=green]
>>Can anyone summarize this for me? This car has bounced around a few
>>states, has been sold at auction twice, and has been offered for sale
>>twice with some pretty long gaps in between. Any red flags here? Any
>>help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!
>>
>>- Dave
>>[/color]
> The mileage is pretty high for the age, but it's gotta be pretty much all
> highway miles. If you plan on hanging onto it for a while, I'd say
> you've got
> the best of both worlds -- you can use the high mileage to dicker down the
> price, but the mileage doesn't really count from a wear-and-tear
> perspective --
> highway miles are much better than in-town miles.
>[/color]

Late model, relatively high miles, sold at auction indicates that it was
probably a company car for someone.
--

Ray O
(correct punctuation to reply)

"Ray O" <rokigawa@tristarassociatesDOTcomn> wrote:[color=blue]
>"Andy Hill" <andy_hill@hp.com> wrote in message[color=green]
>> These first four, the vehicle came into the country and was sold to an
>> individual who had to take out a loan to buy the car.[/color]
>
>Since Toyota makes Camrys in Kentucky, the likelihood is greater that the
>car was made in Kentucky than in Japan.
>[/color]
Yeah. Brain fart on my part. The VIN would tell for sure -- a "U" in the 7th
place from the right would be the Kentucky plant.
[color=blue]
>Late model, relatively high miles, sold at auction indicates that it was
>probably a company car for someone.
>[/color]
Then why was it registered as a "personal" vehicle? Aren't most company-owned
vehicles registered as "fleet", etc. so they can write off the depreciation?

"Andy Hill" <andy_hill@hp.com> wrote in message
news:mjdn52ltep5cqrho738hbnhstee4sn7u2d@4ax.com...[color=blue]
> "Ray O" <rokigawa@tristarassociatesDOTcomn> wrote:[color=green]
>>"Andy Hill" <andy_hill@hp.com> wrote in message[color=darkred]
>>> These first four, the vehicle came into the country and was sold to an
>>> individual who had to take out a loan to buy the car.[/color]
>>
>>Since Toyota makes Camrys in Kentucky, the likelihood is greater that the
>>car was made in Kentucky than in Japan.
>>[/color]
> Yeah. Brain fart on my part. The VIN would tell for sure -- a "U" in
> the 7th
> place from the right would be the Kentucky plant.
>[color=green]
>>Late model, relatively high miles, sold at auction indicates that it was
>>probably a company car for someone.
>>[/color]
> Then why was it registered as a "personal" vehicle? Aren't most
> company-owned
> vehicles registered as "fleet", etc. so they can write off the
> depreciation?[/color]

Lease vehicles may be registered to the driver with title held by the
leasing company.

It is possible that the car was a company car for someone who worked at TMM
Georgetown, TMMNA, TMIS, or TMCC, which would account for the high miles
and 2 years of service.
--

Ray O
(correct punctuation to reply)

In fact in the VIN there is a "U" in the 7th place from the right.
Looks like it was made in the Kentucky plant.

So after analyzing the Carfax report, is it safe to say that there are
no obvious red flags?

I'm going to take it to a Toyota dealer service dept. where for $95
they'll inspect it. If I get a clean bill of health from them, is this
a good buy for $12,300? I plan on keeping the car for several years.
The main selling points for me are gas mileage and Toyota reliability.

Ray O wrote:[color=blue]
> "Andy Hill" <andy_hill@hp.com> wrote in message
> news:mjdn52ltep5cqrho738hbnhstee4sn7u2d@4ax.com...[color=green]
> > "Ray O" <rokigawa@tristarassociatesDOTcomn> wrote:[color=darkred]
> >>"Andy Hill" <andy_hill@hp.com> wrote in message
> >>> These first four, the vehicle came into the country and was sold to an
> >>> individual who had to take out a loan to buy the car.
> >>
> >>Since Toyota makes Camrys in Kentucky, the likelihood is greater that the
> >>car was made in Kentucky than in Japan.
> >>[/color]
> > Yeah. Brain fart on my part. The VIN would tell for sure -- a "U" in
> > the 7th
> > place from the right would be the Kentucky plant.
> >[color=darkred]
> >>Late model, relatively high miles, sold at auction indicates that it was
> >>probably a company car for someone.
> >>[/color]
> > Then why was it registered as a "personal" vehicle? Aren't most
> > company-owned
> > vehicles registered as "fleet", etc. so they can write off the
> > depreciation?[/color]
>
> Lease vehicles may be registered to the driver with title held by the
> leasing company.
>
> It is possible that the car was a company car for someone who worked at TMM
> Georgetown, TMMNA, TMIS, or TMCC, which would account for the high miles
> and 2 years of service.
> --
>
> Ray O
> (correct punctuation to reply)[/color]

<tron9901@msn.com> wrote in message
news:1146864002.809962.195850@j33g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...[color=blue]
> In fact in the VIN there is a "U" in the 7th place from the right.
> Looks like it was made in the Kentucky plant.
>
> So after analyzing the Carfax report, is it safe to say that there are
> no obvious red flags?
>
> I'm going to take it to a Toyota dealer service dept. where for $95
> they'll inspect it. If I get a clean bill of health from them, is this
> a good buy for $12,300? I plan on keeping the car for several years.
> The main selling points for me are gas mileage and Toyota reliability.
>[/color]

I'm not that familiar with Carfax and don't trust Carfax that much because
there is no guarantee that all problems have been reported. For example, if
the car got flooded, what is there to prevent FlyByNight Auto Repair from
using a hair dryer to dry out the carpets and then sending the car down the
road with no report? In other words, the absence of a report of a repair or
wreck does not necessarily mean that the car has never been wrecked.

A friend has had good experiences with Arlington Toyota on Dundee Rd., I've
had good experience with Bredemann in Park Ridge and Schaumburg Toyota if
you want to take the car there for inspection. I like Schaumburg Toyota
because the service department is open until Midnight, they are a multiple
time recipient of Toyota's President's Award, and Bill and Ricky in their
service department always give me a discount because I send all my friends
there.
--

Ray O
(correct punctuation to reply)

[email]tron9901@msn.com[/email] wrote:[color=blue]
> In fact in the VIN there is a "U" in the 7th place from the right.
> Looks like it was made in the Kentucky plant.
>
> So after analyzing the Carfax report, is it safe to say that there are
> no obvious red flags?
>
> I'm going to take it to a Toyota dealer service dept. where for $95
> they'll inspect it. If I get a clean bill of health from them, is this
> a good buy for $12,300? I plan on keeping the car for several years.
> The main selling points for me are gas mileage and Toyota reliability.
>[/color]

I've bought a couple lease vehicles in my life and managed to dicker down
the price due to the high mileage. Had good luck with both, had to have a
rebuilt trans in one but I knew that from the start, I dickered the price
accordingly.
Like someone else said, most of the mileage has to be highway mileage to
stack up that fast but, proper maintenance is still important. Can/will they
provide service records?
Talk to your bank or look at the KBB for the proper deduction for high
mileage. I think the price you want would be the average retail or resale
for your area, not the trade-in which would probably be lower. Follow your
instinct and have the car checked by a mechanic other than where you're
purchasing. If all checks out you should feel comfortable paying a little
over actual value since it's a Toyota.
My 2 cents,
Dave

[email]tron9901@msn.com[/email] wrote:[color=blue]
>In fact in the VIN there is a "U" in the 7th place from the right.
>Looks like it was made in the Kentucky plant.
>
>So after analyzing the Carfax report, is it safe to say that there are
>no obvious red flags?
>
>I'm going to take it to a Toyota dealer service dept. where for $95
>they'll inspect it. If I get a clean bill of health from them, is this
>a good buy for $12,300? I plan on keeping the car for several years.
>The main selling points for me are gas mileage and Toyota reliability.
>[/color]
I don't see any obvious red flags. Lots of TSBs against that year & model,
'tho -- I'd recommend checking over the list to see if anything gives you
heartburn, and maybe zero in on some of the items during the inspection.

Price-wise, $12,300 is pretty good from a dealer -- it's roughly what I'd be
willing to pay a private seller around here for that particular car. If it's
fully detailed inside and out, with new tires (basically, hard to tell from
"new"), I'd consider it a steal.

The car is definitely fully detailed inside and out - it looks mint.
The tires look okay, I'll get a closer look at them when I have the
mechanic check it out.

And "TSB" stands for what exactly?

I have had a couple people give me some warnings after reading over the
Carfax report:

"Between 2/25/2005 and 4/28/2005 approximately 8000 miles were put on
the car. That's 4000 miles a month. I was in the auto business many
years ago. Favorite of a used car dealer was to re-register cars in
different states to cover up a 'clocked' (speedo turned back) car. My
opinion is to be leery with this car."

"I don't like that it's been across several states. that's what is
done when there's a title problem. if it was listed as totaled or
severely damaged in one state, it may not be reflected in another,
depending upon what is required. Ditto for water damaged cars."

Are these valid concerns?

Andy Hill wrote:[color=blue]
> [email]tron9901@msn.com[/email] wrote:[color=green]
> >In fact in the VIN there is a "U" in the 7th place from the right.
> >Looks like it was made in the Kentucky plant.
> >
> >So after analyzing the Carfax report, is it safe to say that there are
> >no obvious red flags?
> >
> >I'm going to take it to a Toyota dealer service dept. where for $95
> >they'll inspect it. If I get a clean bill of health from them, is this
> >a good buy for $12,300? I plan on keeping the car for several years.
> >The main selling points for me are gas mileage and Toyota reliability.
> >[/color]
> I don't see any obvious red flags. Lots of TSBs against that year & model,
> 'tho -- I'd recommend checking over the list to see if anything gives you
> heartburn, and maybe zero in on some of the items during the inspection.
>
> Price-wise, $12,300 is pretty good from a dealer -- it's roughly what I'd be
> willing to pay a private seller around here for that particular car. If it's
> fully detailed inside and out, with new tires (basically, hard to tell from
> "new"), I'd consider it a steal.[/color]

<tron9901@msn.com> wrote in message
news:1146866373.400903.323290@g10g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...[color=blue]
> The car is definitely fully detailed inside and out - it looks mint.
> The tires look okay, I'll get a closer look at them when I have the
> mechanic check it out.
>
> And "TSB" stands for what exactly?
>[/color]

TSB = Technical Service Bulletin - manufacturers publish TSB's to advise
dealers of specifications, how to correct problems, production changes, etc.
[color=blue]
> I have had a couple people give me some warnings after reading over the
> Carfax report:
>
> "Between 2/25/2005 and 4/28/2005 approximately 8000 miles were put on
> the car. That's 4000 miles a month. I was in the auto business many
> years ago. Favorite of a used car dealer was to re-register cars in
> different states to cover up a 'clocked' (speedo turned back) car. My
> opinion is to be leery with this car."[/color]

OK, a bit of relevation for me. The car probably did not go to Cedar Rapids
Iowa. Cedar Rapids is the home of Toyota Motor Credit Corp - the car was
probably leased through them and was probably a TMCC employee's car. I used
to drive about 1,000 miles a week when I called on dealerships, so the 4,000
miles a month is about right for someone calling on dealerships, i.e., a
Toyota employee.

TMCC released the title when the lease was up.

An unscrupulous dealer would not clock a speedometer and still show 4,000
miles a month, and the new electronic odometers are not as easy to "clock"
as the old mechanical ones.
[color=blue]
>
> "I don't like that it's been across several states. that's what is
> done when there's a title problem. if it was listed as totaled or
> severely damaged in one state, it may not be reflected in another,
> depending upon what is required. Ditto for water damaged cars."[/color]

This is a valid concern, but it did not go from Kentucky to Iowa to
Illinois. I think it went from Kentucky to an auction and an Illinois
dealer bought it.

that said, a competent technician shoujld be able to detect physical
problems with the car.


--

Ray O
(correct punctuation to reply)

Ray O wrote:[color=blue]
> miles a month, and the new electronic odometers are not as easy to "clock"
> as the old mechanical ones.[/color]

Speaking as an electrical engineer, I can tell you that it's easier to
fudge an electronic odometer than an old-fashioned rolling-digits one.
Especially if the person doing the fudging works for a dealer and has
access to factory equipment designed for that very purpose.