Return of Sienna Squeaking Brakes + Thump... - Toyota Nation Forum : Toyota Car and Truck Forums
alt.autos.toyota General Toyota discussion newsgroup.

 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
#1 Old 06-21-2006, 11:38 AM
mothy
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Mentioned: Post(s)
Tagged: Thread(s)
Quoted: Post(s)
Return of Sienna Squeaking Brakes + Thump...

Well, I took our 2001 Sienna (with 95K miles) back to Sullivan Tire of
Manchester, NH for the third time in the last eight weeks this morning.
When they originally replaced the pads and turned my rotars at the end
of April, I immediately noticed a ton of squeaking in the top 25% or so
of brake pedal depression (at typically low speeds), and an
intermittant "thump" when backing up. About a week or two later, I
took it back and pointed out the noises, and after a couple of hours
they called me back to say that they had "adjusted" some things that
should take care of it. A few days later the squeaking was back. Then
a week after that, the van vibrated so much at highway speeds that my
wife pulled over fearing she had a flat tire; the boys from Sullivan
Tire came and picked my wife and kids up and took another look at the
van, and said that the rotars were warped because my wife "must have
stomped on the brakes in the first 200 miles after repair." They spend
a couple hours machining the rotars again and the vibration (from
brakes not releasing properly in back?) has not returned.

But the squeaking and the intermittant thump still obtained, so I took
it back this morning. I even demonstrated the incredible squeaking for
one of the techs, who was surprised that the amount of racket it was
making with only 1500 miles (likely less) of driving since the initial
repair. After a couple of hours, they called me back and said it was
fixed (they said they installed new composite brake pads and new
rotars). When I asked the counter guy what happened and how all this
could have been avoided, he took a deep breath and commented in an
incredibly patronizing way, "..How can I say this, but you need to make
sure your wife doesn't stomp on the brakes in the first 200 miles after
repair." I'm just glad my wife wasn't there or he might have been
stomped. When I rode with the tech this morning he said the stomping
comments are not true, that by the time they're done they've already
"seated" the breaks properly. The counter guy explained that the
manager would mail me the paperwork since he had to account somehow for
the $400 in extra costs today's repair cost him at no cost to me, but
the brake stomping comment has been said to me a half-dozen times by
everyone I've dealt with at this shop. Is it bogus? My wife drives a
minivan with three children under 5-years of age. She's not racing in
Louden. Do I have a right to be irritated by this question of
"stomping"?

Thanks,
mothy

Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
#2 Old 06-21-2006, 12:14 PM
someone@somewhere.org
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Mentioned: Post(s)
Tagged: Thread(s)
Quoted: Post(s)
Re: Return of Sienna Squeaking Brakes + Thump...

mothy <mothman@fritter.com> wrote:[color=blue]
> Do I have a right to be irritated by this question of "stomping"?[/color]

It sounds like 100% pure BS to me. They used cheap brake pads the first
time.
#3 Old 06-21-2006, 12:21 PM
Truckdude
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Mentioned: Post(s)
Tagged: Thread(s)
Quoted: Post(s)
Re: Return of Sienna Squeaking Brakes + Thump...

<someone@somewhere.org> wrote in message
news:Zfemg.93248$IZ2.20812@dukeread07...[color=blue]
> mothy <mothman@fritter.com> wrote:[color=green]
>> Do I have a right to be irritated by this question of "stomping"?[/color]
>
> It sounds like 100% pure BS to me. They used cheap brake pads the first
> time.[/color]

Agreed! If you are not savvy about automotive systems, take someone with
you who is. It will eliminate about 95% of the BS, plus it is fun to watch
them squirm.



#4 Old 06-21-2006, 12:56 PM
Ray O
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Mentioned: Post(s)
Tagged: Thread(s)
Quoted: Post(s)
Re: Return of Sienna Squeaking Brakes + Thump...


"mothy" <mothman@fritter.com> wrote in message
news:1150904315.921576.220110@y41g2000cwy.googlegroups.com...[color=blue]
> Well, I took our 2001 Sienna (with 95K miles) back to Sullivan Tire of
> Manchester, NH for the third time in the last eight weeks this morning.
> When they originally replaced the pads and turned my rotars at the end
> of April, I immediately noticed a ton of squeaking in the top 25% or so
> of brake pedal depression (at typically low speeds), and an
> intermittant "thump" when backing up. About a week or two later, I
> took it back and pointed out the noises, and after a couple of hours
> they called me back to say that they had "adjusted" some things that
> should take care of it. A few days later the squeaking was back. Then
> a week after that, the van vibrated so much at highway speeds that my
> wife pulled over fearing she had a flat tire; the boys from Sullivan
> Tire came and picked my wife and kids up and took another look at the
> van, and said that the rotars were warped because my wife "must have
> stomped on the brakes in the first 200 miles after repair." They spend
> a couple hours machining the rotars again and the vibration (from
> brakes not releasing properly in back?) has not returned.
>
> But the squeaking and the intermittant thump still obtained, so I took
> it back this morning. I even demonstrated the incredible squeaking for
> one of the techs, who was surprised that the amount of racket it was
> making with only 1500 miles (likely less) of driving since the initial
> repair. After a couple of hours, they called me back and said it was
> fixed (they said they installed new composite brake pads and new
> rotars). When I asked the counter guy what happened and how all this
> could have been avoided, he took a deep breath and commented in an
> incredibly patronizing way, "..How can I say this, but you need to make
> sure your wife doesn't stomp on the brakes in the first 200 miles after
> repair." I'm just glad my wife wasn't there or he might have been
> stomped. When I rode with the tech this morning he said the stomping
> comments are not true, that by the time they're done they've already
> "seated" the breaks properly. The counter guy explained that the
> manager would mail me the paperwork since he had to account somehow for
> the $400 in extra costs today's repair cost him at no cost to me, but
> the brake stomping comment has been said to me a half-dozen times by
> everyone I've dealt with at this shop. Is it bogus? My wife drives a
> minivan with three children under 5-years of age. She's not racing in
> Louden. Do I have a right to be irritated by this question of
> "stomping"?
>
> Thanks,
> mothy
>[/color]

The squealing and thumping sounds are probably both caused by aftermarket
brake pads. There are some very good aftermarket brake parts, but I am not
willing to experiment to find out which ones are good and which ones are not
good so I always stick to parts branded by the company that made the
vehicle, known as original equipment manufacturer, or OEM parts.

In my experience with Toyotas, a rotor that has been machined will tend to
warp fairly easily, causing vibration when braking.

The line about not stomping on the brake pedal in the first 200 miles is
totally incorrect.

I predict that the pulsation/vibration will re-appear in less than 6 months,
and that the brake pads that they installed most recently will have a
shorter life unless they installed OEM pads.

IMO, the best compromise between performance, quietness, and life for brake
parts are OEM brake parts. Next time you need brake work, go to a dealer or
an independent shop that will install OEM parts.
--

Ray O
(correct punctuation to reply)


#5 Old 06-21-2006, 02:13 PM
mothy
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Mentioned: Post(s)
Tagged: Thread(s)
Quoted: Post(s)
Re: Return of Sienna Squeaking Brakes + Thump...

Ray O,

Here I thought I actually penned an entire note without misspelling
"brake" at least once (I did it again). Thank you everyone for your
comments. I have learned my lesson the hard way, and I will take it to
the dealer (or a shop that uses OEM parts) from now on. The extra 25%
I would probably pay would have paid for itself in the amount of time
I've had to take off work and in the amount of aggravation I've
experienced. In a couple of weeks I'm going to be completely replacing
the brakes front and back on my '88 Toyota Pick-Up with my dad, as well
as a snapped e-brake cable. I'm hoping that the experience with
someone like my dad who knows what he's doing will allow me to do more
of this work myself from now on (or at least speak intelligently about
the same).

Yours,
mothy

Ps. Ray O, that vibration on the highway apparently seemed to my wife
like the brakes weren't releasing, because in addition to shaking all
over the place the back wheels smelled like something was burning once
she pulled over...

Ray O wrote:[color=blue]
> "mothy" <mothman@fritter.com> wrote in message
> news:1150904315.921576.220110@y41g2000cwy.googlegroups.com...[color=green]
> > Well, I took our 2001 Sienna (with 95K miles) back to Sullivan Tire of
> > Manchester, NH for the third time in the last eight weeks this morning.
> > When they originally replaced the pads and turned my rotars at the end
> > of April, I immediately noticed a ton of squeaking in the top 25% or so
> > of brake pedal depression (at typically low speeds), and an
> > intermittant "thump" when backing up. About a week or two later, I
> > took it back and pointed out the noises, and after a couple of hours
> > they called me back to say that they had "adjusted" some things that
> > should take care of it. A few days later the squeaking was back. Then
> > a week after that, the van vibrated so much at highway speeds that my
> > wife pulled over fearing she had a flat tire; the boys from Sullivan
> > Tire came and picked my wife and kids up and took another look at the
> > van, and said that the rotars were warped because my wife "must have
> > stomped on the brakes in the first 200 miles after repair." They spend
> > a couple hours machining the rotars again and the vibration (from
> > brakes not releasing properly in back?) has not returned.
> >
> > But the squeaking and the intermittant thump still obtained, so I took
> > it back this morning. I even demonstrated the incredible squeaking for
> > one of the techs, who was surprised that the amount of racket it was
> > making with only 1500 miles (likely less) of driving since the initial
> > repair. After a couple of hours, they called me back and said it was
> > fixed (they said they installed new composite brake pads and new
> > rotars). When I asked the counter guy what happened and how all this
> > could have been avoided, he took a deep breath and commented in an
> > incredibly patronizing way, "..How can I say this, but you need to make
> > sure your wife doesn't stomp on the brakes in the first 200 miles after
> > repair." I'm just glad my wife wasn't there or he might have been
> > stomped. When I rode with the tech this morning he said the stomping
> > comments are not true, that by the time they're done they've already
> > "seated" the breaks properly. The counter guy explained that the
> > manager would mail me the paperwork since he had to account somehow for
> > the $400 in extra costs today's repair cost him at no cost to me, but
> > the brake stomping comment has been said to me a half-dozen times by
> > everyone I've dealt with at this shop. Is it bogus? My wife drives a
> > minivan with three children under 5-years of age. She's not racing in
> > Louden. Do I have a right to be irritated by this question of
> > "stomping"?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > mothy
> >[/color]
>
> The squealing and thumping sounds are probably both caused by aftermarket
> brake pads. There are some very good aftermarket brake parts, but I am not
> willing to experiment to find out which ones are good and which ones are not
> good so I always stick to parts branded by the company that made the
> vehicle, known as original equipment manufacturer, or OEM parts.
>
> In my experience with Toyotas, a rotor that has been machined will tend to
> warp fairly easily, causing vibration when braking.
>
> The line about not stomping on the brake pedal in the first 200 miles is
> totally incorrect.
>
> I predict that the pulsation/vibration will re-appear in less than 6 months,
> and that the brake pads that they installed most recently will have a
> shorter life unless they installed OEM pads.
>
> IMO, the best compromise between performance, quietness, and life for brake
> parts are OEM brake parts. Next time you need brake work, go to a dealer or
> an independent shop that will install OEM parts.
> --
>
> Ray O
> (correct punctuation to reply)[/color]

#6 Old 06-21-2006, 03:57 PM
Ray O
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Mentioned: Post(s)
Tagged: Thread(s)
Quoted: Post(s)
Re: Return of Sienna Squeaking Brakes + Thump...


"mothy" <mothman@fritter.com> wrote in message
news:1150913595.638001.221860@g10g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...[color=blue]
> Ray O,
>
> Here I thought I actually penned an entire note without misspelling
> "brake" at least once (I did it again). Thank you everyone for your
> comments. I have learned my lesson the hard way, and I will take it to
> the dealer (or a shop that uses OEM parts) from now on. The extra 25%
> I would probably pay would have paid for itself in the amount of time
> I've had to take off work and in the amount of aggravation I've
> experienced. In a couple of weeks I'm going to be completely replacing
> the brakes front and back on my '88 Toyota Pick-Up with my dad, as well
> as a snapped e-brake cable. I'm hoping that the experience with
> someone like my dad who knows what he's doing will allow me to do more
> of this work myself from now on (or at least speak intelligently about
> the same).
>
> Yours,
> mothy[/color]

Good luck with the work on the pickup. Remember to use OEM brake parts when
you work on it!
[color=blue]
>
> Ps. Ray O, that vibration on the highway apparently seemed to my wife
> like the brakes weren't releasing, because in addition to shaking all
> over the place the back wheels smelled like something was burning once
> she pulled over...[/color]

If the brakes are not releasing, they will heat up the rotors/drums and warp
them. The repair shop should have checked to make sure that the the caliper
slides were moving freely, or the rear drums (if equipped with drum brakes)
were cleaned and adjusted properly.

Fortunately, there are several good Toyota dealerships within a reasonable
drive of the Manchester, NH area. I am not familiar with the current Toyota
dealer in Manchester, but the old Queen City Toyota had one of the best
service departments around. The Toyota dealers in Concord, Keene,
Claremont, Nashua, and Rochester were also very good.
--

Ray O
(correct punctuation to reply)

--

Ray O
(correct punctuation to reply)


#7 Old 06-23-2006, 10:19 AM
mothy
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Mentioned: Post(s)
Tagged: Thread(s)
Quoted: Post(s)
Re: Return of Sienna Squeaking Brakes + Thump...

Like a phoenix from the ashes (or is that a phoenix from the asses), I
was on the highway last evening and the Sienna steering wheel started
vibrated very rapidly, meaning the steering wheel was kicking back in
forth quickly about an inch in each direction, not that different from
riding on rumble strips. It was so quick I took my hands off the wheel
and it looked blurry! It felt like a tire was deflating! So I quickly
pulled over to check out the tires, and nothing was wrong. I guess I
finally experienced what my wife had talked about again and again.

Resuming the ride on the highway this condition did not repeat itself.
As soon as I can afford to, I guess I should forget my friends at
Sullivan Tire and take the van to Toyota? I've spent $450 at Sullivan
and they claim to have put in $400 more of their own money (not sure if
I believe that). Do I need to be sure that Sullivan really put new
rotars on the van like they said? Do you think brakes not releasing
caused that? It happened suddenly at highway speeds (perhaps within
5-10 minutes of stop-and-go traffic) then did not repeat itself once I
resumed. Are my rotars (perhaps the new rotars) now warped? I swear I
could offer a service for car owners where I would stand outside repair
shops and hit them in the head with one of those enormous Galligher
hammers. It sure would feel better than this!

Yours,
mothy

Ray O wrote:
[color=blue][color=green]
> > Ps. Ray O, that vibration on the highway apparently seemed to my wife
> > like the brakes weren't releasing, because in addition to shaking all
> > over the place the back wheels smelled like something was burning once
> > she pulled over...[/color]
>
> If the brakes are not releasing, they will heat up the rotors/drums and warp
> them. The repair shop should have checked to make sure that the the caliper
> slides were moving freely, or the rear drums (if equipped with drum brakes)
> were cleaned and adjusted properly.
>
> Fortunately, there are several good Toyota dealerships within a reasonable
> drive of the Manchester, NH area. I am not familiar with the current Toyota
> dealer in Manchester, but the old Queen City Toyota had one of the best
> service departments around. The Toyota dealers in Concord, Keene,
> Claremont, Nashua, and Rochester were also very good.
> --[/color]

#8 Old 06-23-2006, 12:18 PM
Ray O
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Mentioned: Post(s)
Tagged: Thread(s)
Quoted: Post(s)
Re: Return of Sienna Squeaking Brakes + Thump...


"mothy" <mothman@fritter.com> wrote in message
news:1151072361.151520.101050@c74g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...[color=blue]
> Like a phoenix from the ashes (or is that a phoenix from the asses), I
> was on the highway last evening and the Sienna steering wheel started
> vibrated very rapidly, meaning the steering wheel was kicking back in
> forth quickly about an inch in each direction, not that different from
> riding on rumble strips. It was so quick I took my hands off the wheel
> and it looked blurry! It felt like a tire was deflating! So I quickly
> pulled over to check out the tires, and nothing was wrong. I guess I
> finally experienced what my wife had talked about again and again.
>
> Resuming the ride on the highway this condition did not repeat itself.
> As soon as I can afford to, I guess I should forget my friends at
> Sullivan Tire and take the van to Toyota? I've spent $450 at Sullivan
> and they claim to have put in $400 more of their own money (not sure if
> I believe that). Do I need to be sure that Sullivan really put new
> rotars on the van like they said? Do you think brakes not releasing
> caused that? It happened suddenly at highway speeds (perhaps within
> 5-10 minutes of stop-and-go traffic) then did not repeat itself once I
> resumed. Are my rotars (perhaps the new rotars) now warped? I swear I
> could offer a service for car owners where I would stand outside repair
> shops and hit them in the head with one of those enormous Galligher
> hammers. It sure would feel better than this!
>
> Yours,
> mothy
>[/color]

Now that we have a better description of the vibration and when it appears,
I doubt if it is related to the work that Sullivan Tire did, although the
thumping noise probably is.

A warped rotor usually does not give intermittent vibration - it will give a
vibration under the same conditions almost all the time. Unless the rotor
is very badly warped, it will not give a vibration without applying the
brakes.

A random vibration while the vehicle is moving is usually related to the
steering, suspension, or tires. I recommend that you bring the vehicle to a
Toyota dealer for diagnosis and repair.
--

Ray O
(correct punctuation to reply)


#9 Old 06-23-2006, 04:30 PM
Gord Beaman
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Mentioned: Post(s)
Tagged: Thread(s)
Quoted: Post(s)
Re: Return of Sienna Squeaking Brakes + Thump...

"Ray O" <rokigawaATtristarassociatesDOTcom> wrote:
[color=blue]
>A random vibration while the vehicle is moving is usually related to the
>steering, suspension, or tires. I recommend that you bring the vehicle to a
>Toyota dealer for diagnosis and repair.[/color]

....aaand SOON!...gee, a strange unusual problem like that on a
high speed busy highway is damned scary...
--

-Gord.
(use gordon in email)
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
 

  Toyota Nation Forum : Toyota Car and Truck Forums > Toyota USENET Discussion Groups > alt.autos.toyota

Bookmarks

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Toyota Nation Forum : Toyota Car and Truck Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is Off
Smilies are Off
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome