Re: When is a good time to buy 2007 Camry?

<success_ny@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1156477154.556083.247500@75g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...[color=blue]
>I want to buy 2007 Camry SE.
>
> They just came out so the price everyone is quoting is MSRP price (the
> highest there can be for a car).
>
> When do you think prices will come down a bit so it would be a good
> time to buy? I can wait up to 3 months, but really need to buy a car
> within a 3-month period.
>
> Any thoughts?
>
> Thanks.[/color]

I've bought a new car (not a Camry LE, but a Corolla LE) very shortly after
the new ones came out, but I still bargained like crazy, & on that
particular car wound up paying $400 over dealer cost. The first time in,
the sales rep refused to budge from the MSRP. I clearly - but politely -
told him I had no intention of paying list (again - I'd stated that right at
the outset, but I guess he didn't believe me), & walked out. I went back a
week or so later & he came down a little, but not nearly enough, so I walked
out sans deal again. I then went to the Honda dealership & asked for their
best price on a comparable Civic, explaining that I liked the Corolla better
(just personal taste - IMO, they're equals as far as quality/reliability),
but wanted to see what they'd offer, because hey, who knows? After a
l-o-n-g talk & a bunch of bargaining w/ a sales rep, the manager came out of
his office, found out what'd been discussed, & offered me a price of $200
over cost. He stated that he wanted to win me over to Honda. Diifuclt
offer to turn down, but told them I'd seriously consider it - which I did, &
went back to Toyota. Gave them a synopsis of what'd happened at Honda & got
them down to $400 over cost. For the difference of $200 I was willing to
buy the car I preferred. ;-)

The only Toyota (or any other car) I'd presently pay MSRP for would be a
hybrid. And I'd at least *try* to bargain even on one of those.

Cathy[color=blue]
>[/color]

"Cathy F." <clfr@adelphia.net> wrote in message
news:26-dnSpU7d3q6HPZnZ2dnUVZ_oednZ2d@adelphia.com...[color=blue]
>
> <success_ny@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:1156477154.556083.247500@75g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...[color=green]
>>I want to buy 2007 Camry SE.
>>
>> They just came out so the price everyone is quoting is MSRP price (the
>> highest there can be for a car).
>>
>> When do you think prices will come down a bit so it would be a good
>> time to buy? I can wait up to 3 months, but really need to buy a car
>> within a 3-month period.
>>
>> Any thoughts?
>>
>> Thanks.[/color]
>
> I've bought a new car (not a Camry LE, but a Corolla LE) very shortly
> after the new ones came out, but I still bargained like crazy, & on that
> particular car wound up paying $400 over dealer cost. The first time in,
> the sales rep refused to budge from the MSRP. I clearly - but politely -
> told him I had no intention of paying list (again - I'd stated that right
> at the outset, but I guess he didn't believe me), & walked out. I went
> back a week or so later & he came down a little, but not nearly enough, so
> I walked out sans deal again. I then went to the Honda dealership & asked
> for their best price on a comparable Civic, explaining that I liked the
> Corolla better (just personal taste - IMO, they're equals as far as
> quality/reliability), but wanted to see what they'd offer, because hey,
> who knows? After a l-o-n-g talk & a bunch of bargaining w/ a sales rep,
> the manager came out of his office, found out what'd been discussed, &
> offered me a price of $200 over cost. He stated that he wanted to win me
> over to Honda. Diifuclt offer to turn down, but told them I'd seriously
> consider it - which I did, & went back to Toyota. Gave them a synopsis of
> what'd happened at Honda & got them down to $400 over cost. For the
> difference of $200 I was willing to buy the car I preferred. ;-)
>
> The only Toyota (or any other car) I'd presently pay MSRP for would be a
> hybrid. And I'd at least *try* to bargain even on one of those.
>
> Cathy[color=green]
>>[/color][/color]
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Cathy, you're a woman to die for! A hard bargainer....which is necessary
to deal with auto dealers and their salesmen, the modern equivalent of the
Persian market.
Some time, I'd like to type up a list of items that I'd want on my next
car, and at the bottom, the price I would pay, and simply hand it to the
salesman and tell him "I've got fifteen minutes to spare to hear your (or
your manager's) answer. Then I'm out of here. I don't want any counter
offers from you...the price I'm willing to pay is clearly stated. If you
can meet it, we'll get along, and if not, tell me now and you won't see me
again."

I always recall how a car dealer told a friend about when buyers tell their
friends that they "screwed" the dealer, "stole the car" from the dealer,
etc.
He simply said
"I sell about 300 cars a month on average.
A customer buys one car every three or so years.
How often do you think *I* get screwed?"

"mack" <mackerel@dslextreme.com> wrote in message
news:12esvmhnmts2616@corp.supernews.com...[color=blue]
>
> "Cathy F." <clfr@adelphia.net> wrote in message
> news:26-dnSpU7d3q6HPZnZ2dnUVZ_oednZ2d@adelphia.com...[color=green]
>>
>> <success_ny@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>> news:1156477154.556083.247500@75g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...[color=darkred]
>>>I want to buy 2007 Camry SE.
>>>
>>> They just came out so the price everyone is quoting is MSRP price (the
>>> highest there can be for a car).
>>>
>>> When do you think prices will come down a bit so it would be a good
>>> time to buy? I can wait up to 3 months, but really need to buy a car
>>> within a 3-month period.
>>>
>>> Any thoughts?
>>>
>>> Thanks.[/color]
>>
>> I've bought a new car (not a Camry LE, but a Corolla LE) very shortly
>> after the new ones came out, but I still bargained like crazy, & on that
>> particular car wound up paying $400 over dealer cost. The first time in,
>> the sales rep refused to budge from the MSRP. I clearly - but politely -
>> told him I had no intention of paying list (again - I'd stated that right
>> at the outset, but I guess he didn't believe me), & walked out. I went
>> back a week or so later & he came down a little, but not nearly enough,
>> so I walked out sans deal again. I then went to the Honda dealership &
>> asked for their best price on a comparable Civic, explaining that I liked
>> the Corolla better (just personal taste - IMO, they're equals as far as
>> quality/reliability), but wanted to see what they'd offer, because hey,
>> who knows? After a l-o-n-g talk & a bunch of bargaining w/ a sales rep,
>> the manager came out of his office, found out what'd been discussed, &
>> offered me a price of $200 over cost. He stated that he wanted to win me
>> over to Honda. Diifuclt offer to turn down, but told them I'd seriously
>> consider it - which I did, & went back to Toyota. Gave them a synopsis
>> of what'd happened at Honda & got them down to $400 over cost. For the
>> difference of $200 I was willing to buy the car I preferred. ;-)
>>
>> The only Toyota (or any other car) I'd presently pay MSRP for would be a
>> hybrid. And I'd at least *try* to bargain even on one of those.
>>
>> Cathy[color=darkred]
>>>[/color][/color]
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> Cathy, you're a woman to die for! A hard bargainer....which is
> necessary to deal with auto dealers and their salesmen, the modern
> equivalent of the Persian market.[/color]

Heh. ;-) I really have absolutely no intention of paying MSRP - or anything
close to it, when the big-ticket item I'm buying is going to start to
depreciate the minute I drive it away from the dealership. (Well, as I
mentioned before, excpet for a Prius, for ex. - a different ball of wax
there... with that, would try to get them to come down at least a little.)
Plus the tax rate here is high, & the lower the price of the car, of course
the less the taxes will be. I've used the local Toyota dealership's service
dep't. since '84 - they've always been very fair AFAICT, so they know that
if I purchase a car from them they're going to make their $ there, for its
maintenance, Vs. on the initial sale. I've become better at the bargaining
process than I was for the purchase of my first 2 cars, but OTOH when I was
price negotiating for a new car back in '76, I told the dealer that I knew
what the dealer cost was & quoted it. He said, "Wait a sec," and looked it
up. His mouth literally fell open (first time I'd ever seen that actually
happen), he looked up at me from his paperwork, & said, "You're within $10 -
how'd you do that?!" Heh, heh, heh <gg> - I figured that at least he then
would probably be very leery of trying to pull a fast one on 20-something
female me.
[color=blue]
> Some time, I'd like to type up a list of items that I'd want on my next
> car, and at the bottom, the price I would pay, and simply hand it to the
> salesman and tell him "I've got fifteen minutes to spare to hear your (or
> your manager's) answer. Then I'm out of here. I don't want any counter
> offers from you...the price I'm willing to pay is clearly stated. If you
> can meet it, we'll get along, and if not, tell me now and you won't see me
> again."[/color]

This sounds like a good idea. Except I think I'd amend the last bit to
"...and if not, tell me now and I'm out of here." Or words to that effect.
That way, it still deletes a lot of the time wasted bargaining w/ the sales
rep, but also is ambiguous enough to leave one open to showing up again
later - 'cause they may well come down later on. If they know you want the
car, but that you are truly unwilling to pay more than your stated price
(say, $200 - 500 above dealer cost?), I think they'll finally decide that a
sale with a small profit margin is better than no sale. And it would save a
trip to another town/more distant dealership.

Cathy

[color=blue]
>
> I always recall how a car dealer told a friend about when buyers tell
> their friends that they "screwed" the dealer, "stole the car" from the
> dealer, etc.
> He simply said
> "I sell about 300 cars a month on average.
> A customer buys one car every three or so years.
> How often do you think *I* get screwed?"[/color]
[color=blue]
>
>[/color]

"Cathy F." <clfr@adelphia.net> wrote in message
news:eradndlnsoAnyXLZnZ2dnUVZ_sqdnZ2d@adelphia.com...[color=blue][color=green]
>> Some time, I'd like to type up a list of items that I'd want on my next
>> car, and at the bottom, the price I would pay, and simply hand it to the
>> salesman and tell him "I've got fifteen minutes to spare to hear your (or
>> your manager's) answer. Then I'm out of here. I don't want any counter
>> offers from you...the price I'm willing to pay is clearly stated. If you
>> can meet it, we'll get along, and if not, tell me now and you won't see
>> me again."[/color]
>
> This sounds like a good idea. Except I think I'd amend the last bit to
> "...and if not, tell me now and I'm out of here." Or words to that effect.
> That way, it still deletes a lot of the time wasted bargaining w/ the
> sales rep, but also is ambiguous enough to leave one open to showing up
> again later - 'cause they may well come down later on. If they know you
> want the car, but that you are truly unwilling to pay more than your
> stated price (say, $200 - 500 above dealer cost?), I think they'll finally
> decide that a sale with a small profit margin is better than no sale. And
> it would save a trip to another town/more distant dealership.
>
> Cathy[/color]

Good response, Cathy! The most unproductive time you can spend in your
life is the little series of dances you do as a buyer when you're trying to
negotiate with a salesman ...especially when he 'has to go see the sales
manager...' and return with a puny reduction in the price.
I once did that dance and when the salesman returned with a price $100 lower
than he'd quoted before, I sneered and asked "Are you intentionally trying
to insult me, or is it accidental?"
But the ultimate defense for the buyer is to remain totally unemotional
about the deal. Once the salesman infers that the customer "has GOTTA have
it!" or is "in love with that shiny machine!" his goose is cooked. The
buyer is not going to marry the car, or keep it forever in sickness and in
health, it's a machine for goodness sake, not a lover! If the buyer can
remove any 'romance' from his mind, and bear in mind that he's just
purchasing hardware, he's way ahead of the salesman.

"mack" <mackerel@dslextreme.com> wrote in message
news:12euvvditqch07d@corp.supernews.com...[color=blue]
>
> "Cathy F." <clfr@adelphia.net> wrote in message
> news:eradndlnsoAnyXLZnZ2dnUVZ_sqdnZ2d@adelphia.com...[color=green][color=darkred]
>>> Some time, I'd like to type up a list of items that I'd want on my next
>>> car, and at the bottom, the price I would pay, and simply hand it to the
>>> salesman and tell him "I've got fifteen minutes to spare to hear your
>>> (or your manager's) answer. Then I'm out of here. I don't want any
>>> counter offers from you...the price I'm willing to pay is clearly
>>> stated. If you can meet it, we'll get along, and if not, tell me now
>>> and you won't see me again."[/color]
>>
>> This sounds like a good idea. Except I think I'd amend the last bit to
>> "...and if not, tell me now and I'm out of here." Or words to that
>> effect. That way, it still deletes a lot of the time wasted bargaining w/
>> the sales rep, but also is ambiguous enough to leave one open to showing
>> up again later - 'cause they may well come down later on. If they know
>> you want the car, but that you are truly unwilling to pay more than your
>> stated price (say, $200 - 500 above dealer cost?), I think they'll
>> finally decide that a sale with a small profit margin is better than no
>> sale. And it would save a trip to another town/more distant dealership.
>>
>> Cathy[/color]
>
> Good response, Cathy! The most unproductive time you can spend in your
> life is the little series of dances you do as a buyer when you're trying
> to negotiate with a salesman ...especially when he 'has to go see the
> sales manager...' and return with a puny reduction in the price.
> I once did that dance and when the salesman returned with a price $100
> lower than he'd quoted before, I sneered and asked "Are you intentionally
> trying to insult me, or is it accidental?"
> But the ultimate defense for the buyer is to remain totally unemotional
> about the deal. Once the salesman infers that the customer "has GOTTA
> have it!" or is "in love with that shiny machine!" his goose is cooked.
> The buyer is not going to marry the car, or keep it forever in sickness
> and in health, it's a machine for goodness sake, not a lover! If the
> buyer can remove any 'romance' from his mind, and bear in mind that he's
> just purchasing hardware, he's way ahead of the salesman.[/color]

I've read that philosophy & can see where it's coming from. Yet I've often
clearly stated that even though I'm willing to take a look-see & test drive
another car (usually a Honda), that this is the car I want the most, & that
I know exactly which options I want & which I don't. (Of course, sometimes
those options are annoyingly tied up in packages which incl. one or two
things one could easily live without.) But I don't get starry-eyed &
drool-y over it, & I negotiate very point-blank, matter-of-factly - always
with my notes that list the car's base price (dealer cost), then each
option's cost to the dealer, along w/ the MSRP of each. I think the
difference between the two scenarios is: one done matter-of-factly & all
business, whereas the other states this is the car they want to take home,
but don't inject an "Okay, let's get down to no-nonsense business I know
what I want & what I'm willing to pay & that's that" sort of thing - but get
all "Oooh...I just *have* to have this car!" instead, leaving out the real
business end of the deal. *Then*, I think the sales person feels they have
the customer in the palm of their hand & can twist them right around their
little finger. (Which they probably can!)

So... the other side of the coin being - IMO - that if they know you really
want the car *and* they know you really aren't going to pay above "x" price,
that they'll eventually sell you the car at the price you want. :-) You
just have to be willing to walk out a time or two before actually making a
deal, if that's what it takes. Which may take a few days to a few weeks,
depending on time available to go car shopping.

Cathy[color=blue]
>
>[/color]

"Ray O" <rokigawaATtristarassociatesDOTcom> wrote in message
news:aeb74$44ef9991$47c97f29$2702@msgid.meganewsservers.com...[color=blue]
>
> "Cathy F." <clfr@adelphia.net> wrote in message
> news:JZGdnfh-P-yaDnLZnZ2dnUVZ_oOdnZ2d@adelphia.com...[/color]
<snipped>[color=blue][color=green]
>> So... the other side of the coin being - IMO - that if they know you
>> really want the car *and* they know you really aren't going to pay above
>> "x" price, that they'll eventually sell you the car at the price you
>> want. :-) You just have to be willing to walk out a time or two before
>> actually making a deal, if that's what it takes. Which may take a few
>> days to a few weeks, depending on time available to go car shopping.
>>
>> Cathy[color=darkred]
>>>[/color][/color]
>
> I send my Toyota/Lexus/Chevy/Ford dealer anywhere from 6 to 20 referrals a
> year. When I'm ready for a new car, I just order the car and they give me
> the employee courtesy delivery price, no haggling necessary ;-)[/color]

A long time ago (late 80's??), Toyota had a referral rebate deal going for
their customers. I referred a colleague to them - she bought a car, & I got
a check for $50 from Toyota. Granted, not a lot of money, but hey, was
still nice. (And $50 was considerably more then than it is now.)

Cathy

"Cathy F." <clfr@adelphia.net> wrote in message
news:A_CdnZp2evyeAXLZnZ2dnUVZ_oudnZ2d@adelphia.com...[color=blue]
>
> "Ray O" <rokigawaATtristarassociatesDOTcom> wrote in message
> news:aeb74$44ef9991$47c97f29$2702@msgid.meganewsservers.com...[color=green]
>>
>> "Cathy F." <clfr@adelphia.net> wrote in message
>> news:JZGdnfh-P-yaDnLZnZ2dnUVZ_oOdnZ2d@adelphia.com...[/color]
> <snipped>[color=green][color=darkred]
>>> So... the other side of the coin being - IMO - that if they know you
>>> really want the car *and* they know you really aren't going to pay above
>>> "x" price, that they'll eventually sell you the car at the price you
>>> want. :-) You just have to be willing to walk out a time or two before
>>> actually making a deal, if that's what it takes. Which may take a few
>>> days to a few weeks, depending on time available to go car shopping.
>>>
>>> Cathy
>>>>[/color]
>>
>> I send my Toyota/Lexus/Chevy/Ford dealer anywhere from 6 to 20 referrals
>> a year. When I'm ready for a new car, I just order the car and they give
>> me the employee courtesy delivery price, no haggling necessary ;-)[/color]
>
> A long time ago (late 80's??), Toyota had a referral rebate deal going for
> their customers. I referred a colleague to them - she bought a car, & I
> got a check for $50 from Toyota. Granted, not a lot of money, but hey,
> was still nice. (And $50 was considerably more then than it is now.)
>
> Cathy
>[/color]
Some dealers still do that.
--

Ray O
(correct punctuation to reply)

"Ray O" <rokigawaATtristarassociatesDOTcom> wrote in message
news:44791$44efb61b$47c97f29$3405@msgid.meganewsservers.com...[color=blue]
>
> "Cathy F." <clfr@adelphia.net> wrote in message
> news:A_CdnZp2evyeAXLZnZ2dnUVZ_oudnZ2d@adelphia.com...[color=green]
>>
>> "Ray O" <rokigawaATtristarassociatesDOTcom> wrote in message
>> news:aeb74$44ef9991$47c97f29$2702@msgid.meganewsservers.com...[color=darkred]
>>>
>>> "Cathy F." <clfr@adelphia.net> wrote in message
>>> news:JZGdnfh-P-yaDnLZnZ2dnUVZ_oOdnZ2d@adelphia.com...[/color]
>> <snipped>[color=darkred]
>>>> So... the other side of the coin being - IMO - that if they know you
>>>> really want the car *and* they know you really aren't going to pay
>>>> above "x" price, that they'll eventually sell you the car at the price
>>>> you want. :-) You just have to be willing to walk out a time or two
>>>> before actually making a deal, if that's what it takes. Which may take
>>>> a few days to a few weeks, depending on time available to go car
>>>> shopping.
>>>>
>>>> Cathy
>>>>>
>>>
>>> I send my Toyota/Lexus/Chevy/Ford dealer anywhere from 6 to 20 referrals
>>> a year. When I'm ready for a new car, I just order the car and they
>>> give me the employee courtesy delivery price, no haggling necessary ;-)[/color]
>>
>> A long time ago (late 80's??), Toyota had a referral rebate deal going
>> for their customers. I referred a colleague to them - she bought a car,
>> & I got a check for $50 from Toyota. Granted, not a lot of money, but
>> hey, was still nice. (And $50 was considerably more then than it is
>> now.)
>>
>> Cathy
>>[/color]
> Some dealers still do that.[/color]

Have they raised the amount of the check? ;-)

Cathy
[color=blue]
> --
>
> Ray O
> (correct punctuation to reply)
>[/color]