Alloy wheel dent leaks air

Hi there,

My aftermarket rear right alloy wheel is dented on the lip and is
leaking air. Actually, it's dented in two places - one the visible and
one on the non-visible side (viewing from the street), and both places
are leaking. This was "fixed" by a metalworking wheel shop last year
for $25-50 and the problem has returned. I think he pounded the dent
back into place to stop the leaking.

My mechanic has suggested that I simply purchase four wheels and
corresponding tires. What is your advice?

I have considered the following

- getting it fixed again by a metal shop
- purchasing used toyota wheels / steelies with toyota caps to increase
resale value (with tires)
- purchasing a used set of aftermarket wheels, steelies or alloys (with
tires)

I'm mostly interested in getting used stuff to save money. Also note
that the current wheels are really ugly and came with the car - I
didn't install them.

Thanks for any advice you can offer.

[email]runxctry@hotmail.com[/email] wrote:[color=blue]
> Hi there,
> - getting it fixed again by a metal shop
> - purchasing used toyota wheels / steelies with toyota caps to increase
> resale value (with tires)
> - purchasing a used set of aftermarket wheels, steelies or alloys (with
> tires)[/color]

Erm, well youve covered all the options i can think of so all you have
to do is make up your mind? Alloys dont do 'fixing' very well, a big
enough dent to cause much air leakage more or less means a writeoff of
that wheel. Find some on ebay or find yourself some steelies (wont
increase sale value but it will be fairly cheap to do). Toyota caps are
seriously expensive.

In article <1159257749.177944.295330@b28g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,
<runxctry@hotmail.com> wrote:
[color=blue]
> - getting it fixed again by a metal shop[/color]

Instead of a local metal shop, look for a service that actually
specializes in alloy wheels. It's been a bunch of years, but I once
sent some bent VW alloys off for repair and was absolutely amazed at
the results.

There are also companies that specialize in 'take-offs", where people
buy a car and immediately replace the wheels/tires - leaving a nice set
factory set for sale.

Google, and a lot of patience, are your friends.

Finally, if looking into aftermarket stuff make sure the dealer really
understands the geometry of the wheels for the car, the offset in
particular. In my foolish youth, I was once sold new alloys - by a
reputable dealer! - that made the car nearly uncontrollable.

Further, unless the prospective buyer really has a jones for that
particular aftermarket wheel, they'll reduce the resale value, rather
than increase it.

<runxctry@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1159257749.177944.295330@b28g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...[color=blue]
> Hi there,
>
> My aftermarket rear right alloy wheel is dented on the lip and is
> leaking air. Actually, it's dented in two places - one the visible and
> one on the non-visible side (viewing from the street), and both places
> are leaking. This was "fixed" by a metalworking wheel shop last year
> for $25-50 and the problem has returned. I think he pounded the dent
> back into place to stop the leaking.
>
> My mechanic has suggested that I simply purchase four wheels and
> corresponding tires. What is your advice?
>
> I have considered the following
>
> - getting it fixed again by a metal shop
> - purchasing used toyota wheels / steelies with toyota caps to increase
> resale value (with tires)
> - purchasing a used set of aftermarket wheels, steelies or alloys (with
> tires)
>
> I'm mostly interested in getting used stuff to save money. Also note
> that the current wheels are really ugly and came with the car - I
> didn't install them.
>
> Thanks for any advice you can offer.[/color]

The advice from coyoteboy and Scott Schukert is good and right on. Beffore
you condem the wheel, make sure there isn't something puncturing the tire
and make sure the valve stem is not leaking. If the leak is a relatively
slow one, the wheel may be pourous, and the inside surface of the wheel can
be refinished or you can have it coated with a generous coating of bead
sealer. If you are just trying to fix it enough to sell, you can try some
of the Green Slime stuff.
--

Ray O
(correct punctuation to reply)[color=blue]
>[/color]

[color=blue]
> The advice from coyoteboy and Scott Schukert is good and right on. Beffore
> you condem the wheel, make sure there isn't something puncturing the tire
> and make sure the valve stem is not leaking.[/color]

I did the soapy water and bubbling method, and the leak is indeed
coming from the "lip?" -- right between the tire and the raised edge
of the rim. The weird thing is, I don't get why there's a leak in the
BACK of the tire, deepest on the wheel well. How can I hit something
there?? Maybe i drove off a curb.
[color=blue]
> If the leak is a relatively
> slow one, the wheel may be pourous, and the inside surface of the wheel can
> be refinished or you can have it coated with a generous coating of bead
> sealer.[/color]

I don't know what these options mean! Refinishing - is that like
pounding it into place, or more like resurfacing the rotors? Could you
please provide further detail?

If you are just trying to fix it enough to sell, you can try some[color=blue]
> of the Green Slime stuff.[/color]

In fact, I would like to sell my car, but there are a host of problems
I need to fix (that were there when I bought the car). Non-working
door checks, shopping cart vs. Camry dent on the door, non-working dome
light, broken passenger door key lock... sigh...

On 26 Sep 2006 01:02:29 -0700, [email]runxctry@hotmail.com[/email] wrote:
[color=blue]
>My aftermarket rear right alloy wheel is dented on the lip and is
>leaking air. Actually, it's dented in two places - one the visible and
>one on the non-visible side (viewing from the street), and both places
>are leaking. This was "fixed" by a metalworking wheel shop last year
>for $25-50 and the problem has returned. I think he pounded the dent
>back into place to stop the leaking.[/color]

If you don't like those wheels, find a set you do like. Call around
to all the wrecking yards and tire shops in the area, and find a set
of take-offs where someone had factory steel wheels and wanted alloys,
or had factory alloys and wanted custom.

Leave a business card with your needs written on the front - it
might take a month or three before you get a hit on your request. But
there's always someone with more money than common sense, and they
"gotta have the bling" of those 18" rims and 30-series tires...

If you know the wheel size and offset specs you need (like "15X6JJ")
tell them. And you want the matching hubcaps and/or center caps too -
or you'll spend a small fortune replacing them.

You can put an inner tube in a radial tire to stop the leak for now,
but it has to be a radial rated tube - red valve stem. The tire shop
will have to order it in, there isn't a lot of call for tubes.

I wouldn't put it on the front axle with a tube, spare or rear axle
only. Beside the heat buildup concerns with the tube, the "repaired"
spot on the wheel might not be, it could fracture there and cause a
blowout, and it will be far easier to control on the rear.

--<< Bruce >>--

Why is the section width of a tire invariably larger than the width of
a wheel? (And in different units - inch vs. mm!)? Given this
discreptancy, how can I tell whether a tire fits on a wheel, other than
the diameter ( which I assume DO match up between the tire diameter and
wheel diameter)?

For example:
Tire - P205/65/R15
Wheel - 15X7 5-114.36S

Diameter - Since the 15's are the "radius" I assume they match up.
Width - wheel width - 7" x 2.54 in/cm x 10 mm/cm = 177.8 mm
vs. 205 mm tire section width
I assume they don't match up.

Where did i go wrong in this? Is there some kind of tolerance I should
know about?

[color=blue]
> You can put an inner tube in a radial tire to stop the leak for now,
> but it has to be a radial rated tube - red valve stem. The tire shop
> will have to order it in, there isn't a lot of call for tubes.[/color]

Sounds like I will have to get the tire unmounted/remounted and
rebalanced. Or is it easy to do yourself? Probably won't go this way
- I can spend the money towards the new set of wheels & tires.
[color=blue]
> I wouldn't put it on the front axle with a tube, spare or rear axle
> only. Beside the heat buildup concerns with the tube, the "repaired"
> spot on the wheel might not be, it could fracture there and cause a
> blowout, and it will[/color]

Guess it's a good thing my problem is on the rear tire! Thanks for the
tip though.

runxctry wrote:
[color=blue]
> I don't know what these options mean! Refinishing - is that like
> pounding it into place, or more like resurfacing the rotors? Could you
> please provide further detail?[/color]

You can have them resin-coated etc to seal them.
[color=blue]
> If you are just trying to fix it enough to sell, you can try some[color=green]
> > of the Green Slime stuff.[/color][/color]

Nice easy fix, but i would imagine it would tend to hang around the
outer diameter of the tyres, not near the lip/rim.

The dent being on the inside is common (thats where two of mine are
dented) as theres less spoke-support there and all you have to do is
hit a pothole wrong and you've bent the softest bit of the rim. Usually
the rim, on the inside, can simply be rolled back into shape, without
the need for hammering or anything else, depending on damage. If the
rim is split its bin time 99% of the time.

Find out what car makes/models have the same stud pattern, offset and
inner bore diameter and scan the scrap yards for them. Be aware that a
crashed scrap car can have wheel damage also that you might not spot on
first glance.

Ebay is a likely friend. Original alloys go for buttons generally,
regularly the celica owners club in the UK flogs sets of standard
wheels for <£50 with tyres!

J

"runxctry" <runxctry@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1159284577.999908.240560@i42g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...[color=blue]
>[color=green]
>> The advice from coyoteboy and Scott Schukert is good and right on.
>> Beffore
>> you condem the wheel, make sure there isn't something puncturing the tire
>> and make sure the valve stem is not leaking.[/color]
>
> I did the soapy water and bubbling method, and the leak is indeed
> coming from the "lip?" -- right between the tire and the raised edge
> of the rim. The weird thing is, I don't get why there's a leak in the
> BACK of the tire, deepest on the wheel well. How can I hit something
> there?? Maybe i drove off a curb.[/color]

Dents on the inboard side of the wheel can come from road debris, driving
off of a curb, or it may have been there when you purchased the car.
[color=blue]
>[color=green]
>> If the leak is a relatively
>> slow one, the wheel may be pourous, and the inside surface of the wheel
>> can
>> be refinished or you can have it coated with a generous coating of bead
>> sealer.[/color]
>
> I don't know what these options mean! Refinishing - is that like
> pounding it into place, or more like resurfacing the rotors? Could you
> please provide further detail?
>[/color]

Cast aluminum is porous. In order to hold air, it is coated with a clear
coating. When aluminum corrodes, the coating can peel off, and refinishing
involves sanding off the corrosion and old clear coat and then re-applying
the clear coat.
[color=blue]
> If you are just trying to fix it enough to sell, you can try some[color=green]
>> of the Green Slime stuff.[/color]
>
> In fact, I would like to sell my car, but there are a host of problems
> I need to fix (that were there when I bought the car). Non-working
> door checks, shopping cart vs. Camry dent on the door, non-working dome
> light, broken passenger door key lock... sigh...
>[/color]

The non-working door check involves removing the interior door panel and
replacing the rubber that squeezes the door check.

The dent in the door will probably involve a visit to Dent Wizard or a
regular body shop.

The non-working dome light most likely is a burnt out bulb or fuse.

The passenger door key lock probably has a broken plastic clip.
--

Ray O
(correct punctuation to reply)

On 26 Sep 2006 08:45:01 -0700, "runxctry" <runxctry@hotmail.com>
wrote:
[color=blue]
>Why is the section width of a tire invariably larger than the width of
>a wheel? (And in different units - inch vs. mm!)? Given this
>discreptancy, how can I tell whether a tire fits on a wheel, other than
>the diameter ( which I assume DO match up between the tire diameter and
>wheel diameter)?
>
>For example:
>Tire - P205/65/R15
>Wheel - 15X7 5-114.36S
>
>Diameter - Since the 15's are the "radius" I assume they match up.
>Width - wheel width - 7" x 2.54 in/cm x 10 mm/cm = 177.8 mm
> vs. 205 mm tire section width
> I assume they don't match up.
>
>Where did i go wrong in this? Is there some kind of tolerance I should
>know about?[/color]

It's not an exact science, but you usually want the tire to be a bit
wider than the rim - among other things, that way the tire sidewall
scuffs the curb first, rather than the rim edge. The rubber will give
way without [too much] damage, the alloy rim won't.

And you really don't want to go below a 50-series tire, there isn't
much sidewall - one big pothole, and the rim and tire are toast.

Find a good local tire shop - they can talk you through all your
options. They have lists of all the stock and optional tire sizes
that will fit on your car, and the min/max rim size limits for them.

And they might have a good source for inexpensive chromed steel rims
that look nice and aren't too expensive. Or that set of take-offs.

Or you get a set of white spoke steel wheels and have them painted
(or powder-coated) to match the car body color, that can look good.
Or go for the NASCAR look - black rims with red pinstriping, blackwall
or ROWL tires.

I haven't seen an aftermarket full wheel cover yet that isn't 100%
fugly IMHO. Some of the factory ones are pretty bad, but...

--<< Bruce >>--

"runxctry" <runxctry@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:1159285804.499153.300480@i3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...[color=blue]
>[color=green]
>> You can put an inner tube in a radial tire to stop the leak for now,
>> but it has to be a radial rated tube - red valve stem. The tire shop
>> will have to order it in, there isn't a lot of call for tubes.[/color]
>
> Sounds like I will have to get the tire unmounted/remounted and
> rebalanced. Or is it easy to do yourself? Probably won't go this way
> - I can spend the money towards the new set of wheels & tires.
>[color=green]
>> I wouldn't put it on the front axle with a tube, spare or rear axle
>> only. Beside the heat buildup concerns with the tube, the "repaired"
>> spot on the wheel might not be, it could fracture there and cause a
>> blowout, and it will[/color]
>
> Guess it's a good thing my problem is on the rear tire! Thanks for the
> tip though.
>[/color]

That tip is way wrong. At highway speeds a front blow out in a passenger car
will make it pull to the side of the flat and all the other things you would
expect to happen. But when a rear tire blows out the car try's to swap ends
and its fish tail city.

Dan

I wanted to follow-up with everyone with regard to this topic.

- It turns out the wheel was CRACKED, not dented, at the lip.

- I was able to purchase a set of 1995 OEM Camry wheels & tires from
someone at work for $80. A great deal! I had to replace one of the
tires though. No biggie.

Thanks for all your help!

On 22 Oct 2006 08:30:24 -0700, "runxctry" <runxctry@hotmail.com>
wrote:
[color=blue]
>I wanted to follow-up with everyone with regard to this topic.
>
>- It turns out the wheel was CRACKED, not dented, at the lip.[/color]

Not surprising - Aluminum doesn't bend worth a darn, it fractures at
the bend line.
[color=blue]
>- I was able to purchase a set of 1995 OEM Camry wheels & tires from
>someone at work for $80. A great deal! I had to replace one of the
>tires though. No biggie.[/color]

Save the damaged wheel, toss it in the attic just in case you get
into this situation again and run out of extras. It is possible to do
a welded repair on the rim, though it's not simple - they have to make
a clay or soapstone negative mold of the bead profile as (where the
term came from) a "Tinker's Dam".

Aluminum, like Tin, only has about a 20 degree spread from solid, to
soft and weldable, to totally liquid. If they overheat the weld area
while repairing it (which is really easy to do) the dam (mold) keeps
the metal in the right place till it solidifies again.

Then they chuck it in a lathe and machine the bead profile flat
again and buff the exposed parts of the wheel, then re-anodize or
plate the wheel.

It costs a bit to repair an alloy rim, but sometimes it's a lot
cheaper than what they want for a new rim. IF you can get them - if
the rim was long ago discontinued the sellers who still have them know
they can charge big bucks.

--<< Bruce >>--