All wheel drive vs. front wheel drive SUV's

what is the safety advantage of AWD vs. front wheel drive SUV's? All I
know is that AWD's don't get stuck in the mud as easily. Any other good
points?

"Paul L" <pstudy@netzero.net> wrote in message
news:FaW2h.1447$Mw.1282@newssvr11.news.prodigy.com...[color=blue]
> what is the safety advantage of AWD vs. front wheel drive SUV's? All I
> know is that AWD's don't get stuck in the mud as easily. Any other good
> points?[/color]

When comparing AWD vs. FWD:

An AWD vehicle will get better traction and handle better in the rain, snow,
and other slippery surfaces like leaf-covered streets. In a climate like CA
where it doesn't rain all summer, the first few rains of the season make the
oils rise off of the road surface, making them very slippery. An AWD
vehicle will also be slightly more stable in conditions where hydroplaning
occurs.

On the negative side, the AWD hardware weighs more and has more drag on the
drivetrain so it will get poorer fuel economy, and there are 2 extra
differentials to maintain.
--

Ray O
(correct punctuation to reply)

AWD vehicles are driven by all four tires, so they are inherently more
stable and predictable in adverse conditions. Having said that, there is not
a car on the road that can overcome sheer stupidity.





"Paul L" <pstudy@netzero.net> wrote in message
news:FaW2h.1447$Mw.1282@newssvr11.news.prodigy.com...[color=blue]
> what is the safety advantage of AWD vs. front wheel drive SUV's? All I
> know is that AWD's don't get stuck in the mud as easily. Any other good
> points?[/color]

In article <gfadnWDy_6U8VtHYnZ2dnUVZ_q2dnZ2d@ez2.net>,
"Jeff Strickland" <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote:
[color=blue]
> AWD vehicles are driven by all four tires, so they are inherently more
> stable and predictable in adverse conditions.[/color]

False.

A two wheel drive car with snow tires (or tires otherwise appropriate
for conditions) will, on the road, always be more capable than an all
wheel drive vehicle with all-season or otherwise inappropriate tires.

"Jeff Strickland" <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:gfadnWDy_6U8VtHYnZ2dnUVZ_q2dnZ2d@ez2.net...[color=blue]
> AWD vehicles are driven by all four tires, so they are inherently more
> stable and predictable in adverse conditions. Having said that, there is
> not a car on the road that can overcome sheer stupidity.
>[/color]

That last statement sure is true. Several years back I had a 91 camry and
was in a town about 30 miles away when it was snowing. The 4WDs were
passing me on the interstate, but about 5 miles down the road I was passing
them back as they were in the ditch. They thought just casue they could go
it was fine to go fast, they did not realise they could not turn or stop
much if any beter than a 2 wheel car.

Paul L wrote:[color=blue]
> what is the safety advantage of AWD vs. front wheel drive SUV's? All I
> know is that AWD's don't get stuck in the mud as easily. Any other good
> points?[/color]

A FWD SUV is an overpriced vanity car that is most likely a mainenance
nightmare, and may even get some odd stares or a sound ass kicking at
the local chuckwagon bar.

An AWD SUV is an overpriced vanity car that is most likely a mainenance
nightmare, and will leave you questioning your motives as you sign that
monthly $500 car payment.

One advantage to AWD over FWD is the torque is biased to the rear in most
AWD versions, (although some are 50/50) thus reducing the dangerous tendency
to loose steering control upon deceleration that is common with FWD.


mike


"Paul L" <pstudy@netzero.net> wrote in message
news:FaW2h.1447$Mw.1282@newssvr11.news.prodigy.com...[color=blue]
> what is the safety advantage of AWD vs. front wheel drive SUV's? All I
> know is that AWD's don't get stuck in the mud as easily. Any other good
> points?[/color]

Elmo P. Shagnasty wrote:[color=blue]
> In article <gfadnWDy_6U8VtHYnZ2dnUVZ_q2dnZ2d@ez2.net>,
> "Jeff Strickland" <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote:
>[color=green]
> > AWD vehicles are driven by all four tires, so they are inherently more
> > stable and predictable in adverse conditions.[/color]
>
> False.
>
> A two wheel drive car with snow tires (or tires otherwise appropriate
> for conditions) will, on the road, always be more capable than an all
> wheel drive vehicle with all-season or otherwise inappropriate tires.[/color]

Talk about stating the obvious :)

[toyomoho]

I concur with Ralph Mowery. Years ago I was constantly driving over a snowy mountain pass in a FWD Honda. Both AWD and 4WD SUV’s would pass me, only to end up on in the median or on their tops some time down the road.

Improved car traction does not translate in the ability to drive faster safely under slippery road conditions, or increase the cars ability to stop Just because these cars can go in the snow, does not mean the can stop any better or will not slid of the road just like any other car. Something the cars owners ending up learning the hard way.

This being said, having the capability of getting in to 4WD from 2WD in a car with some ground clearance can come in handy for extreme conditions. I have never needed it when driving on the highway. If things get real bad, there are always cable chains. A 10-minute job to put them on and take them off.

On Sat, 04 Nov 2006 12:26:39 -0500, "Elmo P. Shagnasty"
<elmop@nastydesigns.com> wrote:
[color=blue]
> In article <gfadnWDy_6U8VtHYnZ2dnUVZ_q2dnZ2d@ez2.net>,
> "Jeff Strickland" <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote:
>[color=green]
> > AWD vehicles are driven by all four tires, so they are inherently more
> > stable and predictable in adverse conditions.[/color]
>
> False.
>
> A two wheel drive car with snow tires (or tires otherwise appropriate
> for conditions) will, on the road, always be more capable than an all
> wheel drive vehicle with all-season or otherwise inappropriate tires.[/color]

Not true -- it depends on the conditions!

In about 76 I lived in Mt Shasta, Ca where it does snow - we had an Audi
fox wagon (FWD) and I drove an International P/U with studed rear tires and
positraction. I usually in tose days carried a few hundred lbs of ballast
in the bed. One day, I had a heck of a time getting into the drive and
garage. (We had to pull and back in because it did snow a lot) I probably
spent 15 minutes slipping/slidding on a bit of pack and maybe 18" of fresh.
My wife drove in with the Audi - continental all season tires - pushing the
loose stuff up on to the hood, backed in and asked me "what t he heck you
been doing?"

With that said, because I have to drive in the crap at times, am 68 and
have had 2 strokes, I drive an AWD Highlander. BUT I always pack the cable
chains with me!

Ron
"toyomoho" <toyomoho.2grlrn@no-mx.forums.yourdomain.com.au> wrote in message
news:toyomoho.2grlrn@no-mx.forums.yourdomain.com.au...[color=blue]
>
> I concur with Ralph Mowery. Years ago I was constantly driving over a
> snowy mountain pass in a FWD Honda. Both AWD and 4WD SUV’s would
> pass me, only to end up on in the median or on their tops some time down
> the road.
>
> Improved car traction does not translate in the ability to drive faster
> safely under slippery road conditions, or increase the cars ability to
> stop Just because these cars can go in the snow, does not mean the
> can stop any better or will not slid of the road just like any other
> car. Something the cars owners ending up learning the hard way.
>
> This being said, having the capability of getting in to 4WD from 2WD in
> a car with some ground clearance can come in handy for extreme
> conditions. I have never needed it when driving on the highway. If
> things get real bad, there are always cable chains. A 10-minute job to
> put them on and take them off.
>
>
> --
> toyomoho
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> toyomoho's Profile:
> [url]http://www.toyotanation.com/forum/member.php?userid=59151[/url]
> View this thread:
> [url]http://www.toyotanation.com/forum/showthread.php?t=163720[/url]
>[/color]

On Sat, 04 Nov 2006 12:26:39 -0500, "Elmo P. Shagnasty"
<elmop@nastydesigns.com> wrote:
[color=blue]
>In article <gfadnWDy_6U8VtHYnZ2dnUVZ_q2dnZ2d@ez2.net>,
> "Jeff Strickland" <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote:
>[color=green]
>> AWD vehicles are driven by all four tires, so they are inherently more
>> stable and predictable in adverse conditions.[/color]
>
>False.
>
>A two wheel drive car with snow tires (or tires otherwise appropriate
>for conditions) will, on the road, always be more capable than an all
>wheel drive vehicle with all-season or otherwise inappropriate tires.[/color]


Not in my experience. I've had plenty of examples of all of them, and
yes, I buy good snow tires.

Also, snow is not the only "adverse" condition.

"Bonehenge" <DwightSchrute@DunderMifflin.com> wrote in message
news:773qk21vho2l6eif1pv22spsb9pnh2hl7o@4ax.com...[color=blue]
> On Sat, 04 Nov 2006 12:26:39 -0500, "Elmo P. Shagnasty"
> <elmop@nastydesigns.com> wrote:
>[color=green]
>>In article <gfadnWDy_6U8VtHYnZ2dnUVZ_q2dnZ2d@ez2.net>,
>> "Jeff Strickland" <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>[color=darkred]
>>> AWD vehicles are driven by all four tires, so they are inherently more
>>> stable and predictable in adverse conditions.[/color]
>>
>>False.
>>
>>A two wheel drive car with snow tires (or tires otherwise appropriate
>>for conditions) will, on the road, always be more capable than an all
>>wheel drive vehicle with all-season or otherwise inappropriate tires.[/color]
>
>
> Not in my experience. I've had plenty of examples of all of them, and
> yes, I buy good snow tires.
>
> Also, snow is not the only "adverse" condition.[/color]

Unless one has to drive REGULARLY in a rural area, snow tires are marketed
for suckers. For most URBAN people, you do NOT need snow tires--GOOD all
season tires are adequate. I've lived in Edmonton Alberta, Canada..in the
great white north for SIXTY years and have been driving for 46 years.....in
all sorts of snow and ice conditions. Yeah, I've had to use a shovel the odd
time but that was usually when I insisted on parking in a spot that had 2
feet of snow.

"Mike Hunter" <mikehunt2@mailcity.com> wrote in message
news:4LadnQv3V6ShTNHYUSdV9g@ptd.net...[color=blue]
> One advantage to AWD over FWD is the torque is biased to the rear in most
> AWD versions, (although some are 50/50) thus reducing the dangerous
> tendency to loose steering control upon deceleration that is common with
> FWD.[/color]

Actually, no, where torque bias exists, its generally to the front wheels. I
don't know of any NORMALLY FWD car that has an AWD variant that biases
torque to the rear. There's lots of RWD vehicles with AWD/4WD variants that
runs to the front (most SUVs).

Examples are
- Honda CRV which is about 65/35 front rear (look at the diff ratios and the
rear diff hydro lock system)
- Chrysler "AWD" minivans are about 75/25 when its actually working, and
maybe 10% rear when its not, due to the rear drive being derived from the RH
front axle. Its an expensive system that only works because there's an
ABS/Traction system that gives limited AWD. Lose the ABS system and the
"AWD" becomes just excess weight.
- Early Mitsibishi Lancer GSR / EVO 1, EVO 2 with the W5M31 transmission
with about 65/35 bias to the front. The rear diff ratio was numerically
lower on the rear. Mitsu found this was unsuitable (and fragile) and
switched to the W5M33 series, see below.

Examples of 50/50 in normal operation are
- Mitsubishi Eclipse/Expo/Outlander/EVO 3+ Series with the center
diff/viscous coupler (W5M33 and W5M40 series transmissions and variants).
Front / Rear diff ratios are (almost) the same. Torque can vary somewhat
automatically F<-->R. In extreme situations the center viscous coupler locks
and you get back to 50-50.

-Audi Quatro uses an automaticlly controlled center diff that can be
progressively locked. Competition versions use (AFAIK) a Torsen diff.

- Subaru. Depending on one of at least three types of AWD (std, automatic
and WRX-std). The most capable is the WRX type with a Torsen center diff,
the less capable is the hydro clutch system in cars with the automatic
transmission.


--
Stewart DIBBS
[url]www.pixcl.com/lancerproject.htm[/url]

Then do a bit more research, WBMA ;)

mike hunt

"Stewart DIBBS" <sjd@pixcl.com> wrote in message
news:b7SdnbR5JsCPnNPYnZ2dnUVZ_uadnZ2d@magma.ca...[color=blue]
> "Mike Hunter" <mikehunt2@mailcity.com> wrote in message
> news:4LadnQv3V6ShTNHYUSdV9g@ptd.net...[color=green]
>> One advantage to AWD over FWD is the torque is biased to the rear in most
>> AWD versions, (although some are 50/50) thus reducing the dangerous
>> tendency to loose steering control upon deceleration that is common with
>> FWD.[/color]
>
> Actually, no, where torque bias exists, its generally to the front wheels.
> I don't know of any NORMALLY FWD car that has an AWD variant that biases
> torque to the rear.[/color]