Re: 2005 corolla oil changes

Huw wrote:[color=blue]
> "Philip" <1chip-state1@earthlink.n0t> wrote in message
> news:K4mSd.2711$Ba3.1800@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...[color=green]
>> Huw wrote:[color=darkred]
>>> "Donald Mackenzie" <reaper_nz@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>> news:cvbp1u$pch$1@lust.ihug.co.nz...
>>>>
>>>> Having just done a conversion I see we have some vehicles here in
>>>> New Zealand that are running similar service intervals for regular
>>>> service (Mitsubishi L300 Turbo Diesel at 15000km)
>>>>
>>>
>>> I would have thought that most direct injection diesels and petrol
>>> engines these days would run to those sort of intervals if not
>>> longer. The USA always lags significantly behind on length of
>>> service intervals because so many just look forward to those 3000
>>> mile oil changes as if their engines were sentient beings that will
>>> *thank them for cheap insurance* rather than lumps of metal and plastic
>>> that will perform just as well with 'appropriate' service.
>>>
>>> Huw[/color]
>>
>> Huw: How come Americans and Canadians get sludged engines running
>> your UK service intervals? Does it have something to do with the
>> Gulf Stream, the sinking of the Bismark, bland foods?[/color]
>
>
> I find it hard to believe that Americans outside Alaska would have any
> trouble at European service intervals. It is just that Americans
> appear obsessed with changing their oil as if they have nothing
> better to do. If, however, they go to extremes, as some will, and
> totally neglect maintenance, then that is when sludge will rear its
> jellied butt. There may be exceptions of course and we all know one
> engine model don't we. You have a Corolla so why not run to 10,000 mile
> intervals yourself?
> I can almost guarantee a long and trouble free life. Go on. Live life
> on the edge. You know you want to.
>
> Huw[/color]

You can ALMOST guarantee? One is either pregnant or not! I suspect you
would guarantee no sludge if I used Mobil1 0w-40. But how about some
generic label conventional oil that sells for $.99 per quart but still has
the API SL rating?
--

- Philip

"Huw" <hedydd[nospam]@tiscali.co.uk> wrote in message
news:37tp9aF5haqllU1@individual.net...[color=blue]
>
> "Donald Mackenzie" <reaper_nz@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:cvbp1u$pch$1@lust.ihug.co.nz...[color=green]
>>
>> "Huw" <hedydd[nospam]@tiscali.co.uk> wrote in message
>> news:37rqfvF5faoanU1@individual.net...[color=darkred]
>>>
>>> "Donald Mackenzie" <reaper_nz@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>> news:cv92ak$tm1$1@lust.ihug.co.nz...
>>>>
>>>> "Philip" <1chip-state1@earthlink.n0t> wrote in message
>>>> news:fWMRd.1294$Ba3.302@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
>>>>> Huw wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And I would bet not. This is because 'severe' is defined as driving
>>>>>> *mainly* with any of those conditions. There is, of course, nothing
>>>>>> wrong with shortening the recommended interval by any amount between
>>>>>> 5000 and 3000 if one feels like it. In Europe the same engines run on
>>>>>> the same quality oil have 10,000 mile/one year intervals and very few
>>>>>> owners indeed even know about any 'severe' schedule and,
>>>>>> nevertheless, have no engine lubrication or wear problems.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Huw
>>>>>
>>>>> But "We" do. Why is that, Huw?
>>>>> --
>>>>>
>>>>> - Philip
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> The thing here is the 10,000 is probably Kilometers being European - as
>>>> far as I am aware most countries outside of America and the UK don't
>>>> use miles anymore.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Well that's interesting. I am in the UK and, as you quite rightly point
>>> out, we use miles. Toyota have had 10,000 mile service intervals here
>>> for a long time. Ford migrated from their long established 10,000 mile
>>> schedule a few years back and now have 12000 mile service intervals for
>>> most cars. GM/Vauxhall/Opel cars, as well as VW have had 20,000 mile oil
>>> change intervals in use for several years. Should I ever post in French
>>> or German or move to the Irish Republic then I shall post in kilometres
>>> but will make the distinction clear. You have my word on it.
>>>
>>> Huw
>>>[/color]
>> I was not aware that you were from the UK and would have thought you
>> would have stated this rather than refering to European.[/color]
>
> Last time I thought about it, the UK was part of Europe ;-)
>
>
>
> I apologise about my[color=green]
>> assumption that your statement may have been incorrect (and promise to
>> read better next time).[/color]
>
> I did specifically say 'miles', so I did.
>
>[color=green]
>>
>> Having just done a conversion I see we have some vehicles here in New
>> Zealand that are running similar service intervals for regular service
>> (Mitsubishi L300 Turbo Diesel at 15000km)
>>[/color]
>
> I would have thought that most direct injection diesels and petrol engines
> these days would run to those sort of intervals if not longer. The USA
> always lags significantly behind on length of service intervals because so
> many just look forward to those 3000 mile oil changes as if their engines
> were sentient beings that will *thank them for cheap insurance* rather
> than lumps of metal and plastic that will perform just as well with
> 'appropriate' service.
>
> Huw
>[/color]
Most of the vehicles I have contact with at work run from 7500km through to
the Mitsi at 15000km for regular servicing - the lowest I know of there is
Nissan with a 'check the dipstick' dealer service at the 5000km mark.

"Philip" <1chip-state1@earthlink.n0t> wrote in message
news:GVySd.3553$Ba3.2124@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...[color=blue]
> Donald Mackenzie wrote:[color=green]
>> "Huw" <hedydd[nospam]@tiscali.co.uk> wrote in message
>> news:37tp9aF5haqllU1@individual.net...[color=darkred]
>>>
>>> "Donald Mackenzie" <reaper_nz@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>> news:cvbp1u$pch$1@lust.ihug.co.nz...
>>>> Having just done a conversion I see we have some vehicles here in
>>>> New Zealand that are running similar service intervals for regular
>>>> service (Mitsubishi L300 Turbo Diesel at 15000km)
>>>>
>>>
>>> I would have thought that most direct injection diesels and petrol
>>> engines these days would run to those sort of intervals if not
>>> longer. The USA always lags significantly behind on length of
>>> service intervals because so many just look forward to those 3000
>>> mile oil changes as if their engines were sentient beings that will
>>> *thank them for cheap insurance* rather than lumps of metal and
>>> plastic that will perform just as well with 'appropriate' service.
>>>
>>> Huw
>>>[/color]
>> Most of the vehicles I have contact with at work run from 7500km
>> through to the Mitsi at 15000km for regular servicing - the lowest I
>> know of there is Nissan with a 'check the dipstick' dealer service at
>> the 5000km mark.[/color]
>
> 5,000 km - 3,100 miles
> 7,500 km - 4,660 miles
> 15,000 km - 9,320 miles
>[/color]

Mitsubishi indirect injection diesel engines have 4500 mile service
intervals here. In fact I believe that all English language countries share
vehicle documentation and schedules. The latest vehicles have either a 9000
or 10,000 mile interval here and direct injection engines.
No, I have not got a diesel Mitsu presently although they are very common
here and I did own a 2.5td Pajero/Montero, known here as a 'Shogun'.

Huw

Huw wrote:[color=blue]
> "Philip" <1chip-state1@earthlink.n0t> wrote in message
> news:1euSd.3256$Ba3.738@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...[color=green]
>> Huw wrote:[color=darkred]
>>> "Philip" <1chip-state1@earthlink.n0t> wrote in message
>>> news:K4mSd.2711$Ba3.1800@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
>>>> Huw wrote:
>>>>> "Donald Mackenzie" <reaper_nz@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:cvbp1u$pch$1@lust.ihug.co.nz...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Having just done a conversion I see we have some vehicles here in
>>>>>> New Zealand that are running similar service intervals for
>>>>>> regular service (Mitsubishi L300 Turbo Diesel at 15000km)
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I would have thought that most direct injection diesels and petrol
>>>>> engines these days would run to those sort of intervals if not
>>>>> longer. The USA always lags significantly behind on length of
>>>>> service intervals because so many just look forward to those 3000
>>>>> mile oil changes as if their engines were sentient beings that
>>>>> will *thank them for cheap insurance* rather than lumps of metal and
>>>>> plastic that will perform just as well with 'appropriate' service.
>>>>>
>>>>> Huw
>>>>
>>>> Huw: How come Americans and Canadians get sludged engines running
>>>> your UK service intervals? Does it have something to do with the
>>>> Gulf Stream, the sinking of the Bismark, bland foods?
>>>
>>>
>>> I find it hard to believe that Americans outside Alaska would have
>>> any trouble at European service intervals. It is just that Americans
>>> appear obsessed with changing their oil as if they have nothing
>>> better to do. If, however, they go to extremes, as some will, and
>>> totally neglect maintenance, then that is when sludge will rear its
>>> jellied butt. There may be exceptions of course and we all know one
>>> engine model don't we. You have a Corolla so why not run to 10,000
>>> mile intervals yourself?
>>> I can almost guarantee a long and trouble free life. Go on. Live
>>> life on the edge. You know you want to.
>>>
>>> Huw[/color]
>>
>> You can ALMOST guarantee? One is either pregnant or not![/color]
>
> I am not in the guaranteeing business.
>
>
> I suspect you[color=green]
>> would guarantee no sludge if I used Mobil1 0w-40. But how about some
>> generic label conventional oil that sells for $.99 per quart but
>> still has the API SL rating?[/color]
>
>
> If it is certified as meeting API SL then it is a good oil and that
> oil would be good for the 10,000 mile scheduled official service
> interval in Europe. Personally, because I am a perfectionist, I would
> tend to use a better oil if it were my car, but tens of thousands of
> cars run perfectly on the minimum recommended oil at the scheduled
> intervals. Remember that there is a one year limit that over-rides
> the mileage limit for those that run a low annual mileage.
>
> Huw[/color]

Where is it stated that SL oil .... the stuff that really just BARELY meets
the SL rating and carries no ACEA is suitable for 10k miles here in America?
We know cars sold in America with oil service intervals in excess of 7,500
miles usually require specific synthetic lubricants and/or have oil life
monitoring systems.
--

- Philip

"Philip" <1chip-state1@earthlink.n0t> wrote in message
news:eXNSd.4150$Ba3.3425@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...[color=blue]
> Huw wrote:[color=green]
>> "Philip" <1chip-state1@earthlink.n0t> wrote in message
>> news:1euSd.3256$Ba3.738@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...[color=darkred]
>>> Huw wrote:
>>>> "Philip" <1chip-state1@earthlink.n0t> wrote in message
>>>> news:K4mSd.2711$Ba3.1800@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
>>>>> Huw wrote:
>>>>>> "Donald Mackenzie" <reaper_nz@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>>>>> news:cvbp1u$pch$1@lust.ihug.co.nz...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Having just done a conversion I see we have some vehicles here in
>>>>>>> New Zealand that are running similar service intervals for
>>>>>>> regular service (Mitsubishi L300 Turbo Diesel at 15000km)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I would have thought that most direct injection diesels and petrol
>>>>>> engines these days would run to those sort of intervals if not
>>>>>> longer. The USA always lags significantly behind on length of
>>>>>> service intervals because so many just look forward to those 3000
>>>>>> mile oil changes as if their engines were sentient beings that
>>>>>> will *thank them for cheap insurance* rather than lumps of metal and
>>>>>> plastic that will perform just as well with 'appropriate' service.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Huw
>>>>>
>>>>> Huw: How come Americans and Canadians get sludged engines running
>>>>> your UK service intervals? Does it have something to do with the
>>>>> Gulf Stream, the sinking of the Bismark, bland foods?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I find it hard to believe that Americans outside Alaska would have
>>>> any trouble at European service intervals. It is just that Americans
>>>> appear obsessed with changing their oil as if they have nothing
>>>> better to do. If, however, they go to extremes, as some will, and
>>>> totally neglect maintenance, then that is when sludge will rear its
>>>> jellied butt. There may be exceptions of course and we all know one
>>>> engine model don't we. You have a Corolla so why not run to 10,000
>>>> mile intervals yourself?
>>>> I can almost guarantee a long and trouble free life. Go on. Live
>>>> life on the edge. You know you want to.
>>>>
>>>> Huw
>>>
>>> You can ALMOST guarantee? One is either pregnant or not![/color]
>>
>> I am not in the guaranteeing business.
>>
>>
>> I suspect you[color=darkred]
>>> would guarantee no sludge if I used Mobil1 0w-40. But how about some
>>> generic label conventional oil that sells for $.99 per quart but
>>> still has the API SL rating?[/color]
>>
>>
>> If it is certified as meeting API SL then it is a good oil and that
>> oil would be good for the 10,000 mile scheduled official service
>> interval in Europe. Personally, because I am a perfectionist, I would
>> tend to use a better oil if it were my car, but tens of thousands of
>> cars run perfectly on the minimum recommended oil at the scheduled
>> intervals. Remember that there is a one year limit that over-rides
>> the mileage limit for those that run a low annual mileage.
>>
>> Huw[/color]
>
> Where is it stated that SL oil .... the stuff that really just BARELY
> meets the SL rating[/color]

If it meets SL then it meets it. Period.


[color=blue]
>and carries no ACEA is suitable for 10k miles here in America?[/color]

I was unaware that Toyota recommended *any* oil for 10,000 miles in America.
This is because of consumer resistance and expedience.

Huw


[color=blue]
> We know cars sold in America with oil service intervals in excess of 7,500
> miles usually require specific synthetic lubricants and/or have oil life
> monitoring systems.
> --
>
> - Philip
>
>
>
>
>[/color]

Huw wrote:[color=blue]
> "Philip" <1chip-state1@earthlink.n0t> wrote in message
> news:eXNSd.4150$Ba3.3425@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...[color=green]
>> Huw wrote:[color=darkred]
>>> "Philip" <1chip-state1@earthlink.n0t> wrote in message
>>> news:1euSd.3256$Ba3.738@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
>>>> Huw wrote:
>>>>> "Philip" <1chip-state1@earthlink.n0t> wrote in message
>>>>> news:K4mSd.2711$Ba3.1800@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
>>>>>> Huw wrote:
>>>>>>> "Donald Mackenzie" <reaper_nz@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>> news:cvbp1u$pch$1@lust.ihug.co.nz...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Having just done a conversion I see we have some vehicles here
>>>>>>>> in New Zealand that are running similar service intervals for
>>>>>>>> regular service (Mitsubishi L300 Turbo Diesel at 15000km)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I would have thought that most direct injection diesels and
>>>>>>> petrol engines these days would run to those sort of intervals
>>>>>>> if not longer. The USA always lags significantly behind on
>>>>>>> length of service intervals because so many just look forward to
>>>>>>> those
>>>>>>> 3000 mile oil changes as if their engines were sentient beings
>>>>>>> that will *thank them for cheap insurance* rather than lumps of
>>>>>>> metal and plastic that will perform just as well with
>>>>>>> 'appropriate' service. Huw
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Huw: How come Americans and Canadians get sludged engines
>>>>>> running your UK service intervals? Does it have something to do
>>>>>> with the Gulf Stream, the sinking of the Bismark, bland foods?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I find it hard to believe that Americans outside Alaska would have
>>>>> any trouble at European service intervals. It is just that
>>>>> Americans appear obsessed with changing their oil as if they have
>>>>> nothing better to do. If, however, they go to extremes, as some will,
>>>>> and
>>>>> totally neglect maintenance, then that is when sludge will rear
>>>>> its jellied butt. There may be exceptions of course and we all
>>>>> know one engine model don't we. You have a Corolla so why not run
>>>>> to 10,000 mile intervals yourself?
>>>>> I can almost guarantee a long and trouble free life. Go on. Live
>>>>> life on the edge. You know you want to.
>>>>>
>>>>> Huw
>>>>
>>>> You can ALMOST guarantee? One is either pregnant or not!
>>>
>>> I am not in the guaranteeing business.
>>>
>>>
>>> I suspect you
>>>> would guarantee no sludge if I used Mobil1 0w-40. But how about
>>>> some generic label conventional oil that sells for $.99 per quart
>>>> but still has the API SL rating?
>>>
>>>
>>> If it is certified as meeting API SL then it is a good oil and that
>>> oil would be good for the 10,000 mile scheduled official service
>>> interval in Europe. Personally, because I am a perfectionist, I
>>> would tend to use a better oil if it were my car, but tens of
>>> thousands of cars run perfectly on the minimum recommended oil at the
>>> scheduled
>>> intervals. Remember that there is a one year limit that over-rides
>>> the mileage limit for those that run a low annual mileage.
>>>
>>> Huw[/color]
>>
>> Where is it stated that SL oil .... the stuff that really just BARELY
>> meets the SL rating[/color]
>
> If it meets SL then it meets it. Period.
>[color=green]
>> and carries no ACEA, is suitable for 10k miles here in America?[/color]
>
> I was unaware that Toyota recommended *any* oil for 10,000 miles in
> America. This is because of consumer resistance and expedience.
>
> Huw[/color]

Huw, I never mentioned Toyota specifically.
[color=blue][color=green]
>> We know cars sold in America with oil service intervals in excess of
>> 7,500 miles usually require specific synthetic lubricants and/or
>> have oil life monitoring systems.
>> --
>>
>> - Philip[/color][/color]

To reiterate ... There are cars sold in America that do have the "ok" by
their manufacturers to long longer than 7,500 miles.
--

- Philip

"Huw" <hedydd[nospam]@tiscali.co.uk> wrote in message
news:37rqfvF5faoanU1@individual.net...[color=blue]
>
> "Donald Mackenzie" <reaper_nz@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:cv92ak$tm1$1@lust.ihug.co.nz...[color=green]
>>
>> "Philip" <1chip-state1@earthlink.n0t> wrote in message
>> news:fWMRd.1294$Ba3.302@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...[color=darkred]
>>> Huw wrote:
>>>> "ma_twain" <ma_twain@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:42155C8F.4000407@yahoo.com...
>>>>> [email]n877@msn.com[/email] wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> My Toyota dealer invited us to participate in a Q&A discussion at
>>>>>> the dealership with refreshments and a free oil change. Among other
>>>>>> things, claiming the oil sludging problem was poor maintenance,
>>>>>> They recommend using Toyotas 5000 mile oil change policy for non
>>>>>> severe driving, as opposed to conventional wisdom about 3000 mile
>>>>>> intervals. I found this rather interesting.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Define "non severe", then we will decide if this is rather
>>>>> interesting. The 3000 mile interval is typical for severe driving
>>>>> conditions which includes just one or more of the following:
>>>>> 1. Frequent short trips were the engine does not fully warm up
>>>>> 2. Dusty conditions (farms/construction etc)
>>>>> 3. Stop and go traffic
>>>>> 4. Towing
>>>>> 5. Racing or using the full potential of the engine when you leave
>>>>> the lights (teenage drivers)
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I would bet most of the drivers in the US qualify for at least one of
>>>>> these categories.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> And I would bet not. This is because 'severe' is defined as driving
>>>> *mainly* with any of those conditions. There is, of course, nothing
>>>> wrong with shortening the recommended interval by any amount between
>>>> 5000 and 3000 if one feels like it. In Europe the same engines run on
>>>> the same quality oil have 10,000 mile/one year intervals and very few
>>>> owners indeed even know about any 'severe' schedule and,
>>>> nevertheless, have no engine lubrication or wear problems.
>>>>
>>>> Huw
>>>
>>> But "We" do. Why is that, Huw?
>>> --
>>>
>>> - Philip
>>>
>>>[/color]
>> The thing here is the 10,000 is probably Kilometers being European - as
>> far as I am aware most countries outside of America and the UK don't use
>> miles anymore.
>>[/color]
>
> Well that's interesting. I am in the UK and, as you quite rightly point
> out, we use miles. Toyota have had 10,000 mile service intervals here for
> a long time. Ford migrated from their long established 10,000 mile
> schedule a few years back and now have 12000 mile service intervals for
> most cars. GM/Vauxhall/Opel cars, as well as VW have had 20,000 mile oil
> change intervals in use for several years. Should I ever post in French or
> German or move to the Irish Republic then I shall post in kilometres but
> will make the distinction clear. You have my word on it.
>
> Huw
>[/color]
I was not aware that you were from the UK and would have thought you would
have stated this rather than refering to European. I apologise about my
assumption that your statement may have been incorrect (and promise to read
better next time).

Having just done a conversion I see we have some vehicles here in New
Zealand that are running similar service intervals for regular service
(Mitsubishi L300 Turbo Diesel at 15000km)

"Philip" <1chip-state1@earthlink.n0t> wrote in message
news:K4mSd.2711$Ba3.1800@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...[color=blue]
> Huw wrote:[color=green]
>> "Donald Mackenzie" <reaper_nz@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:cvbp1u$pch$1@lust.ihug.co.nz...[color=darkred]
>>>
>>> Having just done a conversion I see we have some vehicles here in New
>>> Zealand that are running similar service intervals for regular
>>> service (Mitsubishi L300 Turbo Diesel at 15000km)
>>>[/color]
>>
>> I would have thought that most direct injection diesels and petrol
>> engines these days would run to those sort of intervals if not
>> longer. The USA always lags significantly behind on length of service
>> intervals because so many just look forward to those 3000 mile oil
>> changes as if their engines were sentient beings that will *thank
>> them for cheap insurance* rather than lumps of metal and plastic that
>> will perform just as well with 'appropriate' service.
>>
>> Huw[/color]
>
> Huw: How come Americans and Canadians get sludged engines running your UK
> service intervals? Does it have something to do with the Gulf Stream, the
> sinking of the Bismark, bland foods?[/color]


I find it hard to believe that Americans outside Alaska would have any
trouble at European service intervals. It is just that Americans appear
obsessed with changing their oil as if they have nothing better to do. If,
however, they go to extremes, as some will, and totally neglect maintenance,
then that is when sludge will rear its jellied butt. There may be exceptions
of course and we all know one engine model don't we.
You have a Corolla so why not run to 10,000 mile intervals yourself? I can
almost guarantee a long and trouble free life. Go on. Live life on the edge.
You know you want to.

Huw

Huw wrote:[color=blue]
> "Philip" <1chip-state1@earthlink.n0t> wrote in message
> news:K4mSd.2711$Ba3.1800@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...[color=green]
>> Huw wrote:[color=darkred]
>>> "Donald Mackenzie" <reaper_nz@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>> news:cvbp1u$pch$1@lust.ihug.co.nz...
>>>>
>>>> Having just done a conversion I see we have some vehicles here in
>>>> New Zealand that are running similar service intervals for regular
>>>> service (Mitsubishi L300 Turbo Diesel at 15000km)
>>>>
>>>
>>> I would have thought that most direct injection diesels and petrol
>>> engines these days would run to those sort of intervals if not
>>> longer. The USA always lags significantly behind on length of
>>> service intervals because so many just look forward to those 3000
>>> mile oil changes as if their engines were sentient beings that will
>>> *thank them for cheap insurance* rather than lumps of metal and plastic
>>> that will perform just as well with 'appropriate' service.
>>>
>>> Huw[/color]
>>
>> Huw: How come Americans and Canadians get sludged engines running
>> your UK service intervals? Does it have something to do with the
>> Gulf Stream, the sinking of the Bismark, bland foods?[/color]
>
>
> I find it hard to believe that Americans outside Alaska would have any
> trouble at European service intervals. It is just that Americans
> appear obsessed with changing their oil as if they have nothing
> better to do. If, however, they go to extremes, as some will, and
> totally neglect maintenance, then that is when sludge will rear its
> jellied butt. There may be exceptions of course and we all know one
> engine model don't we. You have a Corolla so why not run to 10,000 mile
> intervals yourself?
> I can almost guarantee a long and trouble free life. Go on. Live life
> on the edge. You know you want to.
>
> Huw[/color]

You can ALMOST guarantee? One is either pregnant or not! I suspect you
would guarantee no sludge if I used Mobil1 0w-40. But how about some
generic label conventional oil that sells for $.99 per quart but still has
the API SL rating?
--

- Philip

"Huw" <hedydd[nospam]@tiscali.co.uk> wrote in message
news:37tp9aF5haqllU1@individual.net...[color=blue]
>
> "Donald Mackenzie" <reaper_nz@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:cvbp1u$pch$1@lust.ihug.co.nz...[color=green]
>>
>> "Huw" <hedydd[nospam]@tiscali.co.uk> wrote in message
>> news:37rqfvF5faoanU1@individual.net...[color=darkred]
>>>
>>> "Donald Mackenzie" <reaper_nz@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>> news:cv92ak$tm1$1@lust.ihug.co.nz...
>>>>
>>>> "Philip" <1chip-state1@earthlink.n0t> wrote in message
>>>> news:fWMRd.1294$Ba3.302@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
>>>>> Huw wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And I would bet not. This is because 'severe' is defined as driving
>>>>>> *mainly* with any of those conditions. There is, of course, nothing
>>>>>> wrong with shortening the recommended interval by any amount between
>>>>>> 5000 and 3000 if one feels like it. In Europe the same engines run on
>>>>>> the same quality oil have 10,000 mile/one year intervals and very few
>>>>>> owners indeed even know about any 'severe' schedule and,
>>>>>> nevertheless, have no engine lubrication or wear problems.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Huw
>>>>>
>>>>> But "We" do. Why is that, Huw?
>>>>> --
>>>>>
>>>>> - Philip
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> The thing here is the 10,000 is probably Kilometers being European - as
>>>> far as I am aware most countries outside of America and the UK don't
>>>> use miles anymore.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Well that's interesting. I am in the UK and, as you quite rightly point
>>> out, we use miles. Toyota have had 10,000 mile service intervals here
>>> for a long time. Ford migrated from their long established 10,000 mile
>>> schedule a few years back and now have 12000 mile service intervals for
>>> most cars. GM/Vauxhall/Opel cars, as well as VW have had 20,000 mile oil
>>> change intervals in use for several years. Should I ever post in French
>>> or German or move to the Irish Republic then I shall post in kilometres
>>> but will make the distinction clear. You have my word on it.
>>>
>>> Huw
>>>[/color]
>> I was not aware that you were from the UK and would have thought you
>> would have stated this rather than refering to European.[/color]
>
> Last time I thought about it, the UK was part of Europe ;-)
>
>
>
> I apologise about my[color=green]
>> assumption that your statement may have been incorrect (and promise to
>> read better next time).[/color]
>
> I did specifically say 'miles', so I did.
>
>[color=green]
>>
>> Having just done a conversion I see we have some vehicles here in New
>> Zealand that are running similar service intervals for regular service
>> (Mitsubishi L300 Turbo Diesel at 15000km)
>>[/color]
>
> I would have thought that most direct injection diesels and petrol engines
> these days would run to those sort of intervals if not longer. The USA
> always lags significantly behind on length of service intervals because so
> many just look forward to those 3000 mile oil changes as if their engines
> were sentient beings that will *thank them for cheap insurance* rather
> than lumps of metal and plastic that will perform just as well with
> 'appropriate' service.
>
> Huw
>[/color]
Most of the vehicles I have contact with at work run from 7500km through to
the Mitsi at 15000km for regular servicing - the lowest I know of there is
Nissan with a 'check the dipstick' dealer service at the 5000km mark.

Donald Mackenzie wrote:[color=blue]
> "Huw" <hedydd[nospam]@tiscali.co.uk> wrote in message
> news:37tp9aF5haqllU1@individual.net...[color=green]
>>
>> "Donald Mackenzie" <reaper_nz@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:cvbp1u$pch$1@lust.ihug.co.nz...[color=darkred]
>>> Having just done a conversion I see we have some vehicles here in
>>> New Zealand that are running similar service intervals for regular
>>> service (Mitsubishi L300 Turbo Diesel at 15000km)
>>>[/color]
>>
>> I would have thought that most direct injection diesels and petrol
>> engines these days would run to those sort of intervals if not
>> longer. The USA always lags significantly behind on length of
>> service intervals because so many just look forward to those 3000
>> mile oil changes as if their engines were sentient beings that will
>> *thank them for cheap insurance* rather than lumps of metal and
>> plastic that will perform just as well with 'appropriate' service.
>>
>> Huw
>>[/color]
> Most of the vehicles I have contact with at work run from 7500km
> through to the Mitsi at 15000km for regular servicing - the lowest I
> know of there is Nissan with a 'check the dipstick' dealer service at
> the 5000km mark.[/color]

5,000 km - 3,100 miles
7,500 km - 4,660 miles
15,000 km - 9,320 miles

Hmmm. A little short of those Euro specs, Huw. ;-)
--

- Philip

"Philip" <1chip-state1@earthlink.n0t> wrote in message
news:1euSd.3256$Ba3.738@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...[color=blue]
> Huw wrote:[color=green]
>> "Philip" <1chip-state1@earthlink.n0t> wrote in message
>> news:K4mSd.2711$Ba3.1800@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...[color=darkred]
>>> Huw wrote:
>>>> "Donald Mackenzie" <reaper_nz@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:cvbp1u$pch$1@lust.ihug.co.nz...
>>>>>
>>>>> Having just done a conversion I see we have some vehicles here in
>>>>> New Zealand that are running similar service intervals for regular
>>>>> service (Mitsubishi L300 Turbo Diesel at 15000km)
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I would have thought that most direct injection diesels and petrol
>>>> engines these days would run to those sort of intervals if not
>>>> longer. The USA always lags significantly behind on length of
>>>> service intervals because so many just look forward to those 3000
>>>> mile oil changes as if their engines were sentient beings that will
>>>> *thank them for cheap insurance* rather than lumps of metal and plastic
>>>> that will perform just as well with 'appropriate' service.
>>>>
>>>> Huw
>>>
>>> Huw: How come Americans and Canadians get sludged engines running
>>> your UK service intervals? Does it have something to do with the
>>> Gulf Stream, the sinking of the Bismark, bland foods?[/color]
>>
>>
>> I find it hard to believe that Americans outside Alaska would have any
>> trouble at European service intervals. It is just that Americans
>> appear obsessed with changing their oil as if they have nothing
>> better to do. If, however, they go to extremes, as some will, and
>> totally neglect maintenance, then that is when sludge will rear its
>> jellied butt. There may be exceptions of course and we all know one
>> engine model don't we. You have a Corolla so why not run to 10,000 mile
>> intervals yourself?
>> I can almost guarantee a long and trouble free life. Go on. Live life
>> on the edge. You know you want to.
>>
>> Huw[/color]
>
> You can ALMOST guarantee? One is either pregnant or not![/color]

I am not in the guaranteeing business.


I suspect you[color=blue]
> would guarantee no sludge if I used Mobil1 0w-40. But how about some
> generic label conventional oil that sells for $.99 per quart but still has
> the API SL rating?[/color]


If it is certified as meeting API SL then it is a good oil and that oil
would be good for the 10,000 mile scheduled official service interval in
Europe. Personally, because I am a perfectionist, I would tend to use a
better oil if it were my car, but tens of thousands of cars run perfectly on
the minimum recommended oil at the scheduled intervals. Remember that there
is a one year limit that over-rides the mileage limit for those that run a
low annual mileage.


Huw
Huw

"Philip" <1chip-state1@earthlink.n0t> wrote in message
news:GVySd.3553$Ba3.2124@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...[color=blue]
> Donald Mackenzie wrote:[color=green]
>> "Huw" <hedydd[nospam]@tiscali.co.uk> wrote in message
>> news:37tp9aF5haqllU1@individual.net...[color=darkred]
>>>
>>> "Donald Mackenzie" <reaper_nz@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>> news:cvbp1u$pch$1@lust.ihug.co.nz...
>>>> Having just done a conversion I see we have some vehicles here in
>>>> New Zealand that are running similar service intervals for regular
>>>> service (Mitsubishi L300 Turbo Diesel at 15000km)
>>>>
>>>
>>> I would have thought that most direct injection diesels and petrol
>>> engines these days would run to those sort of intervals if not
>>> longer. The USA always lags significantly behind on length of
>>> service intervals because so many just look forward to those 3000
>>> mile oil changes as if their engines were sentient beings that will
>>> *thank them for cheap insurance* rather than lumps of metal and
>>> plastic that will perform just as well with 'appropriate' service.
>>>
>>> Huw
>>>[/color]
>> Most of the vehicles I have contact with at work run from 7500km
>> through to the Mitsi at 15000km for regular servicing - the lowest I
>> know of there is Nissan with a 'check the dipstick' dealer service at
>> the 5000km mark.[/color]
>
> 5,000 km - 3,100 miles
> 7,500 km - 4,660 miles
> 15,000 km - 9,320 miles
>[/color]

Mitsubishi indirect injection diesel engines have 4500 mile service
intervals here. In fact I believe that all English language countries share
vehicle documentation and schedules. The latest vehicles have either a 9000
or 10,000 mile interval here and direct injection engines.
No, I have not got a diesel Mitsu presently although they are very common
here and I did own a 2.5td Pajero/Montero, known here as a 'Shogun'.

Huw

Huw wrote:[color=blue]
> "Philip" <1chip-state1@earthlink.n0t> wrote in message
> news:1euSd.3256$Ba3.738@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...[color=green]
>> Huw wrote:[color=darkred]
>>> "Philip" <1chip-state1@earthlink.n0t> wrote in message
>>> news:K4mSd.2711$Ba3.1800@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
>>>> Huw wrote:
>>>>> "Donald Mackenzie" <reaper_nz@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:cvbp1u$pch$1@lust.ihug.co.nz...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Having just done a conversion I see we have some vehicles here in
>>>>>> New Zealand that are running similar service intervals for
>>>>>> regular service (Mitsubishi L300 Turbo Diesel at 15000km)
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I would have thought that most direct injection diesels and petrol
>>>>> engines these days would run to those sort of intervals if not
>>>>> longer. The USA always lags significantly behind on length of
>>>>> service intervals because so many just look forward to those 3000
>>>>> mile oil changes as if their engines were sentient beings that
>>>>> will *thank them for cheap insurance* rather than lumps of metal and
>>>>> plastic that will perform just as well with 'appropriate' service.
>>>>>
>>>>> Huw
>>>>
>>>> Huw: How come Americans and Canadians get sludged engines running
>>>> your UK service intervals? Does it have something to do with the
>>>> Gulf Stream, the sinking of the Bismark, bland foods?
>>>
>>>
>>> I find it hard to believe that Americans outside Alaska would have
>>> any trouble at European service intervals. It is just that Americans
>>> appear obsessed with changing their oil as if they have nothing
>>> better to do. If, however, they go to extremes, as some will, and
>>> totally neglect maintenance, then that is when sludge will rear its
>>> jellied butt. There may be exceptions of course and we all know one
>>> engine model don't we. You have a Corolla so why not run to 10,000
>>> mile intervals yourself?
>>> I can almost guarantee a long and trouble free life. Go on. Live
>>> life on the edge. You know you want to.
>>>
>>> Huw[/color]
>>
>> You can ALMOST guarantee? One is either pregnant or not![/color]
>
> I am not in the guaranteeing business.
>
>
> I suspect you[color=green]
>> would guarantee no sludge if I used Mobil1 0w-40. But how about some
>> generic label conventional oil that sells for $.99 per quart but
>> still has the API SL rating?[/color]
>
>
> If it is certified as meeting API SL then it is a good oil and that
> oil would be good for the 10,000 mile scheduled official service
> interval in Europe. Personally, because I am a perfectionist, I would
> tend to use a better oil if it were my car, but tens of thousands of
> cars run perfectly on the minimum recommended oil at the scheduled
> intervals. Remember that there is a one year limit that over-rides
> the mileage limit for those that run a low annual mileage.
>
> Huw[/color]

Where is it stated that SL oil .... the stuff that really just BARELY meets
the SL rating and carries no ACEA is suitable for 10k miles here in America?
We know cars sold in America with oil service intervals in excess of 7,500
miles usually require specific synthetic lubricants and/or have oil life
monitoring systems.
--

- Philip

Huw wrote:[color=blue]
> "Philip" <1chip-state1@earthlink.n0t> wrote in message
> news:GVySd.3553$Ba3.2124@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...[color=green]
>> Donald Mackenzie wrote:[color=darkred]
>>> "Huw" <hedydd[nospam]@tiscali.co.uk> wrote in message
>>> news:37tp9aF5haqllU1@individual.net...
>>>>
>>>> "Donald Mackenzie" <reaper_nz@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:cvbp1u$pch$1@lust.ihug.co.nz...
>>>>> Having just done a conversion I see we have some vehicles here in
>>>>> New Zealand that are running similar service intervals for regular
>>>>> service (Mitsubishi L300 Turbo Diesel at 15000km)
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I would have thought that most direct injection diesels and petrol
>>>> engines these days would run to those sort of intervals if not
>>>> longer. The USA always lags significantly behind on length of
>>>> service intervals because so many just look forward to those 3000
>>>> mile oil changes as if their engines were sentient beings that will
>>>> *thank them for cheap insurance* rather than lumps of metal and
>>>> plastic that will perform just as well with 'appropriate' service.
>>>>
>>>> Huw
>>>>
>>> Most of the vehicles I have contact with at work run from 7500km
>>> through to the Mitsi at 15000km for regular servicing - the lowest I
>>> know of there is Nissan with a 'check the dipstick' dealer service
>>> at the 5000km mark.[/color]
>>
>> 5,000 km - 3,100 miles
>> 7,500 km - 4,660 miles
>> 15,000 km - 9,320 miles
>>[/color]
>
> Mitsubishi indirect injection diesel engines have 4500 mile service
> intervals here. In fact I believe that all English language countries
> share vehicle documentation and schedules. The latest vehicles have
> either a 9000 or 10,000 mile interval here and direct injection
> engines. No, I have not got a diesel Mitsu presently although they are
> very
> common here and I did own a 2.5td Pajero/Montero, known here as a
> 'Shogun'.
> Huw[/color]

Hmmm. Ok, thank you Huw. :-)
--

- Philip