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#1 Old 05-27-2005, 06:50 PM
Denis
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Sienna wheel nut torque

I have a Sienna 2004. I'm fed up with garages screwing up a simple job
like changing my winter wheels for my summer wheels. Last garage lost
one of the locking nuts.

So I'm now looking at doing this myself from now on and maybe saving
myself about $30 each time. So I need a decent jack. But I don't have
an air compressor nor a pneumatic wrench to remove and put on the nuts.
I could use old fashioned elbow grease, but I'm looking for a quick
and easy way to do this. So I thought of the air wrench, but it's
expensive if you don't already have the compressor.

I have seen a 14 volt electric (Battery) impact wrench that puts out
1050 lb-in, or about 87 ft-lbs. There is NO torque adjustment on this
wrench, only speed adjustment.

3 questions:

1) What is the recommended torque setting for Sienna wheels (I have the
alloy in summer, steel in winter)? I have asked a few Toyota garages,
and the numbers range from 60 to 80 ft-lbs, with one saying 87 is way
too much and another saying 87 would be OK.

2) if 87 is OK, can I rely on an electric battery powered wrench to
deliver consistent torque for this type of application?

3) Is there another solution to this?

Thanks.
 
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#2 Old 05-27-2005, 07:28 PM
Scott in Florida
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Re: Sienna wheel nut torque

On Fri, 27 May 2005 19:50:04 -0400, Denis <denis_roy@rogers.com>
wrote:
[color=blue]
>I have a Sienna 2004. I'm fed up with garages screwing up a simple job
>like changing my winter wheels for my summer wheels. Last garage lost
>one of the locking nuts.
>
>So I'm now looking at doing this myself from now on and maybe saving
>myself about $30 each time. So I need a decent jack. But I don't have
>an air compressor nor a pneumatic wrench to remove and put on the nuts.
> I could use old fashioned elbow grease, but I'm looking for a quick
>and easy way to do this. So I thought of the air wrench, but it's
>expensive if you don't already have the compressor.
>
>I have seen a 14 volt electric (Battery) impact wrench that puts out
>1050 lb-in, or about 87 ft-lbs. There is NO torque adjustment on this
>wrench, only speed adjustment.
>
>3 questions:
>
>1) What is the recommended torque setting for Sienna wheels (I have the
>alloy in summer, steel in winter)? I have asked a few Toyota garages,
>and the numbers range from 60 to 80 ft-lbs, with one saying 87 is way
>too much and another saying 87 would be OK.
>
>2) if 87 is OK, can I rely on an electric battery powered wrench to
>deliver consistent torque for this type of application?
>
>3) Is there another solution to this?
>
>Thanks.[/color]

What I do is buy my tires at Sam's club.

Included in the price is unlimited balance/rotation.

They actually use a torque wrench to tighten your bolts!

Works for me!


--

Scott in Florida
 
#3 Old 05-27-2005, 07:41 PM
ma_twain
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Re: Sienna wheel nut torque

Denis wrote:
[color=blue]
> I have a Sienna 2004. I'm fed up with garages screwing up a simple job
> like changing my winter wheels for my summer wheels. Last garage lost
> one of the locking nuts.
>
> So I'm now looking at doing this myself from now on and maybe saving
> myself about $30 each time. So I need a decent jack. But I don't have
> an air compressor nor a pneumatic wrench to remove and put on the nuts.
> I could use old fashioned elbow grease, but I'm looking for a quick and
> easy way to do this. So I thought of the air wrench, but it's expensive
> if you don't already have the compressor.
>
> I have seen a 14 volt electric (Battery) impact wrench that puts out
> 1050 lb-in, or about 87 ft-lbs. There is NO torque adjustment on this
> wrench, only speed adjustment.
>
> 3 questions:
>
> 1) What is the recommended torque setting for Sienna wheels (I have the
> alloy in summer, steel in winter)? I have asked a few Toyota garages,
> and the numbers range from 60 to 80 ft-lbs, with one saying 87 is way
> too much and another saying 87 would be OK.
>
> 2) if 87 is OK, can I rely on an electric battery powered wrench to
> deliver consistent torque for this type of application?
>
> 3) Is there another solution to this?
>
> Thanks.[/color]

I tend to use 75 lb-ft for alloy wheels and up to 85 lb-ft for steel.
The trick is re-check them at 500 miles. I used to use an air wrench,
but I switched to the following system. I use a 24" ratchet wrench to
loosen to nuts. Then I use a speed bar to spin them off and on. The
final torque is by a good digital torque wrench. Use flank drive or 6
sided sockets and you won't tear up the lug nuts.

 
#4 Old 05-27-2005, 08:46 PM
Sylvan Butler
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Re: Sienna wheel nut torque

On Fri, 27 May 2005 19:50:04 -0400, Denis <denis_roy@rogers.com> wrote:[color=blue]
> 2) if 87 is OK, can I rely on an electric battery powered wrench to
> deliver consistent torque for this type of application?[/color]

NO!

impact wrenches are only for REMOVAL. You should _always_ tighten
by hand.
[color=blue]
> 3) Is there another solution to this?[/color]

I use one of those cross (+) shaped spinners to get the lugs snug, then
do final tighten to spec with an inexpensive torque wrench. I don't
know how accurate my torque wrench is, but it is almost certainly more
accurate than the power wrench.

Previous to picking up a compressor, I used the same + shaped wrench to
remove the lugs. Takes a bit of muscle and weight...

Do you have a harbor freight retail location near you? They have good
sales on tools like torque wrenches, compressors, impact wrenches,
jacks, ... (Regular prices are not so good.) The web site has good
sales also, but it is harder to inspect the merchandise and do a return
if necessary, and it probably will be.

[url]http://www.harborfreight.com/[/url] (mail order)
[url]http://www.harborfreightusa.com/[/url] (retail store sales)

sdb

--
Wanted: Omnibook 800 & accessories, cheap, working or not
sdbuse1 on mailhost bigfoot.com
 
#5 Old 05-28-2005, 06:56 AM
Car Guy
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Re: Sienna wheel nut torque

I do the same thing on my Camry and Buick!

Scott in Florida wrote:[color=blue]
> On Fri, 27 May 2005 19:50:04 -0400, Denis <denis_roy@rogers.com>
> wrote:
>[color=green]
>> I have a Sienna 2004. I'm fed up with garages screwing up a simple
>> job like changing my winter wheels for my summer wheels. Last
>> garage lost one of the locking nuts.
>>
>> So I'm now looking at doing this myself from now on and maybe saving
>> myself about $30 each time. So I need a decent jack. But I don't
>> have an air compressor nor a pneumatic wrench to remove and put on
>> the nuts. I could use old fashioned elbow grease, but I'm looking
>> for a quick and easy way to do this. So I thought of the air
>> wrench, but it's expensive if you don't already have the compressor.
>>
>> I have seen a 14 volt electric (Battery) impact wrench that puts out
>> 1050 lb-in, or about 87 ft-lbs. There is NO torque adjustment on
>> this wrench, only speed adjustment.
>>
>> 3 questions:
>>
>> 1) What is the recommended torque setting for Sienna wheels (I have
>> the alloy in summer, steel in winter)? I have asked a few Toyota
>> garages, and the numbers range from 60 to 80 ft-lbs, with one saying
>> 87 is way too much and another saying 87 would be OK.
>>
>> 2) if 87 is OK, can I rely on an electric battery powered wrench to
>> deliver consistent torque for this type of application?
>>
>> 3) Is there another solution to this?
>>
>> Thanks.[/color]
>
> What I do is buy my tires at Sam's club.
>
> Included in the price is unlimited balance/rotation.
>
> They actually use a torque wrench to tighten your bolts!
>
> Works for me![/color]


 
#6 Old 05-28-2005, 08:47 AM
Denis
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Re: Sienna wheel nut torque

Why would an impact wrench be OK for removal but not installation? If
you're concerned about damage to lug nuts during installation if using
an impact wrench, doesn't the same apply to removal?

Sylvan Butler wrote:[color=blue]
> On Fri, 27 May 2005 19:50:04 -0400, Denis <denis_roy@rogers.com> wrote:
>[color=green]
>>2) if 87 is OK, can I rely on an electric battery powered wrench to
>>deliver consistent torque for this type of application?[/color]
>
>
> NO!
>
> impact wrenches are only for REMOVAL. You should _always_ tighten
> by hand.
>
>[color=green]
>>3) Is there another solution to this?[/color]
>
>
> I use one of those cross (+) shaped spinners to get the lugs snug, then
> do final tighten to spec with an inexpensive torque wrench. I don't
> know how accurate my torque wrench is, but it is almost certainly more
> accurate than the power wrench.
>
> Previous to picking up a compressor, I used the same + shaped wrench to
> remove the lugs. Takes a bit of muscle and weight...
>
> Do you have a harbor freight retail location near you? They have good
> sales on tools like torque wrenches, compressors, impact wrenches,
> jacks, ... (Regular prices are not so good.) The web site has good
> sales also, but it is harder to inspect the merchandise and do a return
> if necessary, and it probably will be.
>
> [url]http://www.harborfreight.com/[/url] (mail order)
> [url]http://www.harborfreightusa.com/[/url] (retail store sales)
>
> sdb
>[/color]
 
#7 Old 05-28-2005, 09:59 AM
Bruce L. Bergman
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Re: Sienna wheel nut torque

On Sat, 28 May 2005 09:47:03 -0400, Denis <denis_roy@rogers.com>
wrote:
[color=blue]
>Why would an impact wrench be OK for removal but not installation? If
>you're concerned about damage to lug nuts during installation if using
>an impact wrench, doesn't the same apply to removal?[/color]

Because the torque on the nuts can vary wildly on an air impact
wrench, and isn't consistent enough for safe application. The Pros
can get it fairly close by sound and feel with enough practice, but
even they overdo it and snap off wheel studs. That's why the studs
are replaceable.

I use an impact both ways (now that I have enough compressor to run
it), but when installing the nuts the air is turned way down just to
spin the nuts on and get to an initial 'snug'. Then I break out a
torque wrench (or a hand lug wrench) for the final turn or two.

If the nuts are put it on by hand and properly torqued now, you
should be able to get them off by hand later. But if a gorilla at the
tire shop cranks them on with an air wrench at 5 Zillion foot-pounds
you may end up with a flat tire on the road, the factory hand lug
wrench, and no way to get the (darned) nuts loose. You try jumping on
the wrench, you try a pipe cheater on the handle, you watch the wrench
handle bend like a pretzel... ;-P

And the exact torque isn't critical, 5 foot-pounds either way from
the "ideal" setting isn't going to stop the world. The nuts won't
fall off, especially if you go back a week later and check them again
like you're supposed to. Tripling it, though... <snap!>

--<< Bruce >>--
--
Bruce L. Bergman, Woodland Hills (Los Angeles) CA - Desktop
Electrician for Westend Electric - CA726700
5737 Kanan Rd. #359, Agoura CA 91301 (818) 889-9545
Spamtrapped address: Remove the python and the invalid, and use a net.
 
#8 Old 05-29-2005, 12:12 PM
Sylvan Butler
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Re: Sienna wheel nut torque

On Sat, 28 May 2005 09:47:03 -0400, Denis <denis_roy@rogers.com> wrote:[color=blue]
> Why would an impact wrench be OK for removal but not installation? If[/color]

Because during removal you just need to get the nuts loose. How loose
you get them doesn't matter.
[color=blue]
> you're concerned about damage to lug nuts during installation if using[/color]

I am so not concered about damaging lug nuts. But if you were, you
would realize that removing lug nuts has a max force that will be
applied (just enough to loosen the nuts). Tightening the max force is
limited to the power available in the wrench which is typically much
more than needed or desirable to do the job.

All I'm concerned about is proper torque during tightening, and an
impact wrench is not accurate enough to apply proper torque.

In addition to the other poster's concern about snapping lugs, too much
torque has been known to warp brake discs and wheels. The only cure is
to replace the warped part(s).

If you want the job done right, don't use or allow an impact wrench to
tighten lug nuts. A torque wrench is the safe and correct tool.

sdb
--
Wanted: Omnibook 800 & accessories, cheap, working or not
sdbuse1 on mailhost bigfoot.com
 
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