Twin or single electrode spark plugs for sienna 1998

A friend of mine helped me with replacing original spark plugs (twin
electrode) in my 1998 sienna with "APP3923 Autolite Double Platinum"
which I got from PepBoys and is a single electrode.

It wasn't exactly easy and as we where replacing the fifth plug I
looked up under the hood and there a sticker saying "Do not use
single electrode spark plugs" in five different languages! At this
point we simply ignored the sign and put the single electrodes on.

Does any one knows if I have to use "twin electrode" spark plug in
sienna 1998 considering that every website I have checked have both
single and twin electrodes listed under sienna 98 spark plugs.

I appreciate you comments.

On Wed, 10 Aug 2005 07:44:52 -0700, pedi wrote:
[color=blue]
> A friend of mine helped me with replacing original spark plugs (twin
> electrode) in my 1998 sienna with "APP3923 Autolite Double Platinum"
> which I got from PepBoys and is a single electrode.
>
> It wasn't exactly easy and as we where replacing the fifth plug I
> looked up under the hood and there a sticker saying "Do not use
> single electrode spark plugs" in five different languages! At this
> point we simply ignored the sign and put the single electrodes on.
>
> Does any one knows if I have to use "twin electrode" spark plug in
> sienna 1998 considering that every website I have checked have both
> single and twin electrodes listed under sienna 98 spark plugs.
>
> I appreciate you comments.[/color]


If the sticker's there, I wouldn't ignore it. Perhaps Ray can shed more
light as to WHY you need dual platinum plugs; my guess would be
emissions/economy/carbon build-up. But I wouldn't vary from spec, and when
it comes to Toyota, I try to use the EXACT same plug (Usually NipponDenso)
because using others has bit me. The only success I had w/Aftermarket was
Bosch DP's in the Tercel

The ND or NGK dual platinums can be had at any good parts store such as
CarQuest, AutoZone or Advance.

And the reason they list single and dual electrode plugs for your car is,
they fit and have the same heat range. Don't use singles...

"HachiRoku" <Trueno@ae86.GTS> wrote in message
news:cFpKe.5247$rY.322@trndny03...[color=blue]
> On Wed, 10 Aug 2005 07:44:52 -0700, pedi wrote:
>[color=green]
>> A friend of mine helped me with replacing original spark plugs (twin
>> electrode) in my 1998 sienna with "APP3923 Autolite Double Platinum"
>> which I got from PepBoys and is a single electrode.
>>
>> It wasn't exactly easy and as we where replacing the fifth plug I
>> looked up under the hood and there a sticker saying "Do not use
>> single electrode spark plugs" in five different languages! At this
>> point we simply ignored the sign and put the single electrodes on.
>>
>> Does any one knows if I have to use "twin electrode" spark plug in
>> sienna 1998 considering that every website I have checked have both
>> single and twin electrodes listed under sienna 98 spark plugs.
>>
>> I appreciate you comments.[/color]
>
>
> If the sticker's there, I wouldn't ignore it. Perhaps Ray can shed more
> light as to WHY you need dual platinum plugs; my guess would be
> emissions/economy/carbon build-up. But I wouldn't vary from spec, and when
> it comes to Toyota, I try to use the EXACT same plug (Usually NipponDenso)
> because using others has bit me. The only success I had w/Aftermarket was
> Bosch DP's in the Tercel
>
> The ND or NGK dual platinums can be had at any good parts store such as
> CarQuest, AutoZone or Advance.
>
> And the reason they list single and dual electrode plugs for your car is,
> they fit and have the same heat range. Don't use singles...[/color]

I have no idea why you need dual electrode plugs. I have had much better
luck following the manufacturer's recommendations than ignoring them, so I
try to follow them whenever possible.

--
Ray O
correct the return address punctuation to reply

On Wed, 10 Aug 2005 11:19:30 -0500, Ray O wrote:
[color=blue]
>
> "HachiRoku" <Trueno@ae86.GTS> wrote in message
> news:cFpKe.5247$rY.322@trndny03...[color=green]
>> On Wed, 10 Aug 2005 07:44:52 -0700, pedi wrote:
>>[color=darkred]
>>> A friend of mine helped me with replacing original spark plugs (twin
>>> electrode) in my 1998 sienna with "APP3923 Autolite Double Platinum"
>>> which I got from PepBoys and is a single electrode.
>>>
>>> It wasn't exactly easy and as we where replacing the fifth plug I
>>> looked up under the hood and there a sticker saying "Do not use
>>> single electrode spark plugs" in five different languages! At this
>>> point we simply ignored the sign and put the single electrodes on.
>>>
>>> Does any one knows if I have to use "twin electrode" spark plug in
>>> sienna 1998 considering that every website I have checked have both
>>> single and twin electrodes listed under sienna 98 spark plugs.
>>>
>>> I appreciate you comments.[/color]
>>
>>
>> If the sticker's there, I wouldn't ignore it. Perhaps Ray can shed more
>> light as to WHY you need dual platinum plugs; my guess would be
>> emissions/economy/carbon build-up. But I wouldn't vary from spec, and when
>> it comes to Toyota, I try to use the EXACT same plug (Usually NipponDenso)
>> because using others has bit me. The only success I had w/Aftermarket was
>> Bosch DP's in the Tercel
>>
>> The ND or NGK dual platinums can be had at any good parts store such as
>> CarQuest, AutoZone or Advance.
>>
>> And the reason they list single and dual electrode plugs for your car is,
>> they fit and have the same heat range. Don't use singles...[/color]
>
> I have no idea why you need dual electrode plugs. I have had much better
> luck following the manufacturer's recommendations than ignoring them, so I
> try to follow them whenever possible.[/color]


<Faith Sligthly Shattered...> :(

There's a short discussion of this at

[url]http://universaltoyota.com/TPC_SparkPlugs.asp?SiteName=universaltoyota[/url]

"HachiRoku" <Trueno@ae86.GTS> wrote in message
news:LUpKe.5484$lK2.5452@trndny01...[color=blue]
> On Wed, 10 Aug 2005 11:19:30 -0500, Ray O wrote:
>[color=green]
>>
>> "HachiRoku" <Trueno@ae86.GTS> wrote in message
>> news:cFpKe.5247$rY.322@trndny03...[color=darkred]
>>> On Wed, 10 Aug 2005 07:44:52 -0700, pedi wrote:
>>>
>>>> A friend of mine helped me with replacing original spark plugs (twin
>>>> electrode) in my 1998 sienna with "APP3923 Autolite Double Platinum"
>>>> which I got from PepBoys and is a single electrode.
>>>>
>>>> It wasn't exactly easy and as we where replacing the fifth plug I
>>>> looked up under the hood and there a sticker saying "Do not use
>>>> single electrode spark plugs" in five different languages! At this
>>>> point we simply ignored the sign and put the single electrodes on.
>>>>
>>>> Does any one knows if I have to use "twin electrode" spark plug in
>>>> sienna 1998 considering that every website I have checked have both
>>>> single and twin electrodes listed under sienna 98 spark plugs.
>>>>
>>>> I appreciate you comments.
>>>
>>>
>>> If the sticker's there, I wouldn't ignore it. Perhaps Ray can shed more
>>> light as to WHY you need dual platinum plugs; my guess would be
>>> emissions/economy/carbon build-up. But I wouldn't vary from spec, and
>>> when
>>> it comes to Toyota, I try to use the EXACT same plug (Usually
>>> NipponDenso)
>>> because using others has bit me. The only success I had w/Aftermarket
>>> was
>>> Bosch DP's in the Tercel
>>>
>>> The ND or NGK dual platinums can be had at any good parts store such as
>>> CarQuest, AutoZone or Advance.
>>>
>>> And the reason they list single and dual electrode plugs for your car
>>> is,
>>> they fit and have the same heat range. Don't use singles...[/color]
>>
>> I have no idea why you need dual electrode plugs. I have had much better
>> luck following the manufacturer's recommendations than ignoring them, so
>> I
>> try to follow them whenever possible.[/color]
>
>
> <Faith Sligthly Shattered...> :([/color]

I've read up on the advantages of dual electrode plugs, but the sticker
about not using single electrode plugs wasn't on any models they sold while
I was still there. As far as the reason why not to use single-electrode
plugs, my guesses would be the same as yours.

--
Ray O
correct the return address punctuation to reply

On Wed, 10 Aug 2005 12:25:45 -0500, Ray O wrote:
[color=blue]
>
> "HachiRoku" <Trueno@ae86.GTS> wrote in message
> news:LUpKe.5484$lK2.5452@trndny01...[color=green]
>> On Wed, 10 Aug 2005 11:19:30 -0500, Ray O wrote:
>>[color=darkred]
>>>
>>> "HachiRoku" <Trueno@ae86.GTS> wrote in message
>>> news:cFpKe.5247$rY.322@trndny03...
>>>> On Wed, 10 Aug 2005 07:44:52 -0700, pedi wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> A friend of mine helped me with replacing original spark plugs (twin
>>>>> electrode) in my 1998 sienna with "APP3923 Autolite Double Platinum"
>>>>> which I got from PepBoys and is a single electrode.
>>>>>
>>>>> It wasn't exactly easy and as we where replacing the fifth plug I
>>>>> looked up under the hood and there a sticker saying "Do not use
>>>>> single electrode spark plugs" in five different languages! At this
>>>>> point we simply ignored the sign and put the single electrodes on.
>>>>>
>>>>> Does any one knows if I have to use "twin electrode" spark plug in
>>>>> sienna 1998 considering that every website I have checked have both
>>>>> single and twin electrodes listed under sienna 98 spark plugs.
>>>>>
>>>>> I appreciate you comments.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> If the sticker's there, I wouldn't ignore it. Perhaps Ray can shed more
>>>> light as to WHY you need dual platinum plugs; my guess would be
>>>> emissions/economy/carbon build-up. But I wouldn't vary from spec, and
>>>> when
>>>> it comes to Toyota, I try to use the EXACT same plug (Usually
>>>> NipponDenso)
>>>> because using others has bit me. The only success I had w/Aftermarket
>>>> was
>>>> Bosch DP's in the Tercel
>>>>
>>>> The ND or NGK dual platinums can be had at any good parts store such as
>>>> CarQuest, AutoZone or Advance.
>>>>
>>>> And the reason they list single and dual electrode plugs for your car
>>>> is,
>>>> they fit and have the same heat range. Don't use singles...
>>>
>>> I have no idea why you need dual electrode plugs. I have had much better
>>> luck following the manufacturer's recommendations than ignoring them, so
>>> I
>>> try to follow them whenever possible.[/color]
>>
>>
>> <Faith Sligthly Shattered...> :([/color]
>
> I've read up on the advantages of dual electrode plugs, but the sticker
> about not using single electrode plugs wasn't on any models they sold while
> I was still there. As far as the reason why not to use single-electrode
> plugs, my guesses would be the same as yours.[/color]

<Faith Restored...> ;)

I was thinking about this while posting my origianl response. I have the
GTS version Corolla, and it required Platinum tipped plugs, with a warning
on the hood telling you to ONLY used platinum tips. The Tercel required
dual platinum tips, and the '88 Supra (basically the same Yamaha engine as
in the Corolla with two more cylinders) also requires Platinum tips.

I also had, before the GTS, an '80 Corolla SR-5, regular NGK's, and after
I bought the GTS I bought a SOHC Corolla 4DR, regular NGK's. Seems to be a
thing with the Twin-Cams.

<bogusmailmark@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1123691688.985203.37930@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...[color=blue]
> There's a short discussion of this at
>
> [url]http://universaltoyota.com/TPC_SparkPlugs.asp?SiteName=universaltoyota[/url]
>[/color]

Geez...who created that BS? I love the part that says "Select Toyota models
feature the Toyota Direct Ignition System (D.I.S.). This system, introduced
in 1994, creates a more efficient and cost-effective engine for Toyota
owners. With this system, spark plugs fire twice as often."

DIS is just Toyota's version of a waste spark ignition system. While it is
true that the plugs fire twice as often, one of the firings is during the
exhaust stroke and has zero (nada, no) effect on engine performance. That
piece of BS makes it sound like some sort of advantage. Typical Toyota
marketing BS for what is an inferior ignition system (at least compared to
coil on plug). Oh what a feeling! And sheepeople wonder why I get upset with
Toyota. I suppose if you are going to baffle people with BS, you might as
well be experts at it.

I suppose the dual electrode plugs are an attempt to keep the overall wear
rate for the waste spark ignition the same as for a traditional distributor
type system or a more modern coil on plug system (those systems only fire
the plug once per cycle which is once every other engine revolution). Over a
long period of time the wear will be distributed over the two electrodes
although only one fires each time the plug is energized (although it is
energized twice as often with "DIS'"). Personally, I've had platinum plugs
last for over 100K with little noticeable wear, so I see no point in going
to dual electrodes. However, for a waste spark ignition it is important that
if you use platinum plugs that you use dual platinum plugs. When the spark
jumps from one electrode to the other, it erodes the surface. The platinum
is not eroded (or is eroded more slowly). In a traditional systems or coil
on plug systems, the spark jumps from the center electrode to the outer
electrode. In a DIS system, for half of the plugs, the spark also jumps from
the center electrode to the outer electrode, but for the over half the spark
jumps in the other direction (outer electrode to center electrode). In
theory you could install single platinum plugs where for one situation the
platinum was on the center electrode, and for the other situation the
platinum was on the outer electrode. Manufacturers actually do this for
factory builds, but it is too complicated for the aftermarket, so you need
dual platinum plugs where but electrodes are protected with platinum.

Ed

[SiennaSC98]

I'm using Toyota (Denso SK20RII) iridium plugs on my 1998 Sienna XLE.
The Toyota part number is 90919-01210 and these are the long-life (good for 100k miles) plugs with 0.70 mm single electrode tip. I think I paid $13.49/each from brandsport.com.

The commonly found Denso iridium plug IK20 on ebay are the 0.40 mm electrode tip. Denso’s recommendation is to replace them at 30K miles.

Thanks Ed,
You reply makes perfect sence, I replaced them with twin electrode
double platinum (Donso BKR6EKPB-11).

On Wed, 10 Aug 2005 14:04:48 -0400, C. E. White wrote:
[color=blue]
>
> <bogusmailmark@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:1123691688.985203.37930@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...[color=green]
>> There's a short discussion of this at
>>
>> [url]http://universaltoyota.com/TPC_SparkPlugs.asp?SiteName=universaltoyota[/url]
>>[/color]
>
> Geez...who created that BS? I love the part that says "Select Toyota models
> feature the Toyota Direct Ignition System (D.I.S.). This system, introduced
> in 1994, creates a more efficient and cost-effective engine for Toyota
> owners. With this system, spark plugs fire twice as often."
>
> DIS is just Toyota's version of a waste spark ignition system. While it is
> true that the plugs fire twice as often, one of the firings is during the
> exhaust stroke and has zero (nada, no) effect on engine performance. That
> piece of BS makes it sound like some sort of advantage. Typical Toyota
> marketing BS for what is an inferior ignition system (at least compared to
> coil on plug). Oh what a feeling! And sheepeople wonder why I get upset with
> Toyota. I suppose if you are going to baffle people with BS, you might as
> well be experts at it.[/color]

Are you in the right group, Ed? (and why do I keep asking that?)

Remember Nissan's dual PLUG ignition systems???

Why do you hate Toyotas?[color=blue]
>
> I suppose the dual electrode plugs are an attempt to keep the overall wear
> rate for the waste spark ignition the same as for a traditional distributor
> type system or a more modern coil on plug system (those systems only fire
> the plug once per cycle which is once every other engine revolution). Over a
> long period of time the wear will be distributed over the two electrodes
> although only one fires each time the plug is energized (although it is
> energized twice as often with "DIS'"). Personally, I've had platinum plugs
> last for over 100K with little noticeable wear, so I see no point in going
> to dual electrodes. However, for a waste spark ignition it is important that
> if you use platinum plugs that you use dual platinum plugs. When the spark
> jumps from one electrode to the other, it erodes the surface. The platinum
> is not eroded (or is eroded more slowly). In a traditional systems or coil
> on plug systems, the spark jumps from the center electrode to the outer
> electrode. In a DIS system, for half of the plugs, the spark also jumps from
> the center electrode to the outer electrode, but for the over half the spark
> jumps in the other direction (outer electrode to center electrode). In
> theory you could install single platinum plugs where for one situation the
> platinum was on the center electrode, and for the other situation the
> platinum was on the outer electrode. Manufacturers actually do this for
> factory builds, but it is too complicated for the aftermarket, so you need
> dual platinum plugs where but electrodes are protected with platinum.
>
> Ed[/color]