needing new valve seals vs. O rings

[Tercel Lady]

How do I know which is my problem: needing new valve seals vs. needing new O rings?

I have the blue puff of smoke and the needing to add oil between oil changes (and this is besides needing that new valve cover gasket).

I have heard it could be either valve seals or O rings...the latter I assume being more expensive a job.

How do I know which? What are the symptoms of needing new O rings?

[TTercel]

Is it a blue puff of smoke when you start the car up? If it is its most likely the valve seals.

[Tercel Lady]

Yep, blue puff, well...a smoky blue...but yeah, blue enough.

it used to be only in the morning at first startup. Now it's pretty much any startup where the car has sat for more than a couple of hours.

This is a lot less costly a job than O rings, right? (If I had known that, I would have had it done years ago...I was told O rings and that that is such a major job to just never have it done).

[Donald]

Originally Posted by Tercel Lady

How do I know which is my problem: needing new valve seals vs. needing new O rings?

I have the blue puff of smoke and the needing to add oil between oil changes (and this is besides needing that new valve cover gasket).

I have heard it could be either valve seals or O rings...the latter I assume being more expensive a job.

How do I know which? What are the symptoms of needing new O rings?

I strongly believe that they are refering to the same thing, just different nomenclature.

What is happening is that when you shutdown the engine, oil is seeping past the valve stem seals into the intake ports and accumulating there. When you start up, this accumulation gets sucked into the cylinders and burns. Hence the blue smoke. While you have the engine running, it is sucking oil past the seals but the amount is so small that you dont see it, but it is reducing the volume slowly.
Sometimes when you accallerate hard you might see it, or maybe just the driver of the car behind you might see it since it is such a small puff.

[thefish]

Aha, sounds exactly like my 93.
I've never done head work on a car engine before, what should I expect if I tried to fix this problem myself? (I just paid a mechanic ~600 to fix less, so i'm thinking that i'll do any work that this car needs myself from now on.) Should I pull out my manual, buy a torque wrench and hope for the best? Any suggestions?

Thanks!

[Tercel Lady]

It's the same thing? Someone told me to have the O rings replaced was thousands of dollars. I heard to have the seal replaced is just a few hundreds.

Please elaborate.

[Donald]

OH!!! Now I know what they are talking about.
It isn't "O" rings, they must mean piston rings. That is definately something else and costs more. That would mean taking the engine apart and at that point a rebuild or engine replacement might be worth the while.

Bad piston rings would produce constant smoke, which would probably get worst when you accellerate, not just at start-up.

[Tercel Lady]

Ah. Yes, not smoke. When I am warming up the car (like this winter to take the snow and ice off) I would notice it settles down after that first blast o' blue....

So seals is something else....I might be willing to get that done, really.

Let me ask you this, given its been like this for about 5 years, once it is done, is it ok, or is oil already in there forever and it is gunked up?

[Donald]

Originally Posted by Tercel Lady

Let me ask you this, given its been like this for about 5 years, once it is done, is it ok, or is oil already in there forever and it is gunked up?

"in there" meaning in the cylinders? ....... No, it burns away, but could leave a layer of carbon deposits on the top of the pistons and in the cylinder head. When the mechanic does the valve seals he should also remove that carbon build-up.
A good mechanic would do that just because the cylinder head is off. Now, if the carbon is really crusted in there and hard to remove, he might charge you a extra.

[Tercel Lady]

Thank you, all of you!