The saga continues as I attempt to fix this 5E-FE DIY with high HC hydrocarbon at idle. It is probably burning some oil also, maybe <1/2 qt every 3,000 miles, I have only had this car for a few weeks now.
Here comes the O2 sensor test part. The symptoms are:
Running rich while idling, failing emissions hydrocarbon test. Running 420 ppm while legal limit is 220 ppm.
Rough idle. Car would idle at 800 rpm, then drop to 750 rpm (normal idling speed), then the rpm would bounce down and up constantly.
With A/C on, engine rpm surging from time to time.
No power, but car (automatic) gets 30 mpg so far.
I used a digital multimeter, set it to voltage test 200 mVolt, pinned the positive into the red wire going to the downpipe's O2 sensor, and connected the negative lead to negative on the car battery.
With the engine already warm, I get a reading of 0.49~0.53 volts.
The readings stayed pretty constant, it was not like sweeping between 0.2~0.9 volts at all.
I unplug one of the vacuum line into the intake manifold. The engine revs to 2000 rpm because it is running lean, but the O2 sensor stays around 0.49~0.53 volts. I wait for a few minutes, nothing changes, so I plug the vacuum line back in.
Turned on the AC to simulate load. The radiator fan turns on, and the O2 sensor shows 0.9 volt. It stays at 0.9 volt during the entire duration the radiator fans are on. I suppose it is running rich to cool-off, but this doesn't help me with the smog test! With AC off, the radiator fans turns on from time to time, and the O2 sensor reading a constant 0.9 volt while the fans are on. Dropping back to ~0.5 volts when fans turn off.
I am kinda torn between buying a new O2 sensor or not... There is no CEL, and no OBD-II port to pull a code... At least this is the only O2 sensor I would need, right? Did I do the right tests?
So I did the Oxygen Sensor test wrong. This is apparently a heated oxygen sensor, so there are two wires going into it. I tapped into the red wire, which apparently is NOT the signal wire. The signal wire is the black one.
I bought a new oxygen sensor from AutoZone - a Bosch, and installed it. It is significantly larger on the outside, compared to the Toyota unit. (Factory original O2 sensor with 170k miles? ) This time I tapped into the Black wire, and attach the other wire into the battery's grounding point. I ran the pair of wire from the one and only oxygen sensor in the Paseo at the down pipe, to the passenger compartment. I attached a digital volt meter at the end, so I get the O2 sensor readings while I drive!
At cold start, I see the voltage slowly rises.
Once warmed up, I see the voltage jump all over the places frequently as it should, from 1+ volt to negatives while the engine is coasting.
My concern is running rich while engine is idling, and I find that it pretty much stays around the .45 volt mark.
Since my Oxygen sensor is telling me my engine is not running rich while idling, should I bring it in for a 3rd smog check? I need to decide this afternoon so please let me know soon!
Its worth a shot since you went out of your way for that test and put in a new sensor. Since it looks like your not running rich, make sure the STP treatment is in the oil when you go. 30 mpg is a bit low. You may want to run through a tank of fuel with the new sensor first to see if your mpg improves.
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1996 Paseo 5E-FE 269,xxx miles - Gotta fix that sagging DS door. New hinges on the way.
1993 Camry LE 5S-FE 264,xxx miles - New output shaft seals, Trans fluid service...
1997 Mazda B2300 213,xxx miles Underbody/frame resto in progress.
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Ignition timing should be set to 10 degrees BTDC and you need e1 and te1 jumpered in the underhood DLC. Timing must be set with a warm engine. No lights, no radio no blower running. All electronics need to be turned off while doing this. Get some liquid paper and paint the "V" notch in the crank pulley. Its much easier to see a white mark. I even paint the 10 degree mark on the timing cover as well. Makes it super easy to see. Hook up the gun and fire the light at the crank pulley. If its off, loosen the two distributor hold down bolts. One on the bottom and one on the side. Both should be 12mm. Adjust distributor and snug one bolt. Re-check timing with light. If not at 10 degrees, repeat previous two steps until its right. Did we discuss testing your ECT sensor in your previous thread(s)?
__________________
1996 Paseo 5E-FE 269,xxx miles - Gotta fix that sagging DS door. New hinges on the way.
1993 Camry LE 5S-FE 264,xxx miles - New output shaft seals, Trans fluid service...
1997 Mazda B2300 213,xxx miles Underbody/frame resto in progress.
Find my DIY's or advice helpful? Don't forget to hit the "Thanks" button.
Last edited by 96paseo; 06-04-2010 at 07:33 PM.
Reason: add'l info
The Following User Says Thank You to 96paseo For This Useful Post:
ECT stands for Engine Coolant Temperature sensor. Its a thermistor that's responsible for telling the ECU the engine temperature. More importantly, it along with 2 other sensors help the ECU inject the proper amount of fuel. If this sensor is not responding properly, the engine can run richer than its supposed to. Check your fsm or whichever manual you have for the resitance graph. You can choose to test the sensor on the car or remove and test in a pot of water with a thermometer. On the car, test it when the engine is cold, preferably in the morning after the car has been sitting overnight. Take note of the ambient air temperature and use that as a reference to the graph when you test. Then get the engine up to normal operating temp and measure the resistance again. Normal operating temp should be somewhere between 200-220F. Match your reading up to the graph and see if you fall into that temp range. If you want to be really picky, you can use an infared temp gun and shoot the inlet/outlet housing while testing.
__________________
1996 Paseo 5E-FE 269,xxx miles - Gotta fix that sagging DS door. New hinges on the way.
1993 Camry LE 5S-FE 264,xxx miles - New output shaft seals, Trans fluid service...
1997 Mazda B2300 213,xxx miles Underbody/frame resto in progress.
Find my DIY's or advice helpful? Don't forget to hit the "Thanks" button.
The Following User Says Thank You to 96paseo For This Useful Post:
I believe 96paseo is right in that it's a bad coolant temperature sensor. The car runs good when cold but when it warms up your idle jumps around and sometimes the engine will stall.
I had a bad one on a 93 paseo and it didn't throw any check engine light.
Do the self diagnosis anyway by bridging T and E1 and count the flashes.
Code 22 is coolant temperture sensor. 2 flashes, pause, 2flashes.
When ever I have a engine problem with these cars ( tercels and paseos) and there is no check engine light on , I do the trouble code check anyway and sure enough sometimes I will find a trouble code stored.
The Following User Says Thank You to fanorpner For This Useful Post:
Cool I am running out of things to check, so the ECT must be it! (I hope )
I did the ignition timing test. Turns out it's running stocking timing. The advance during warm up is 12 degrees BTDC and in a closed loop it's 10 degrees... During the test I didn't bridge the TE1 and E1, because I couldn't locate the data link connector. The only manual I have is for a 94' Paseo I found online, so that doesn't make things easy...
The manual:
Missing Data Link Connector pictured above?
Yup, the last pic where its on the firewall is the DLC. On the inside of the cap, there is a diagram for the pins. E1 and Te1 will be listed there. No worries about the manual being from a 94. Its the same engine, same procedure. Its important to jumper the DLC terminals when setting the timing. It stops the ECU from choosing its own ignition map based on sensor data. This allows the timing to be a direct result of the mechanical postition of the distributor.
__________________
1996 Paseo 5E-FE 269,xxx miles - Gotta fix that sagging DS door. New hinges on the way.
1993 Camry LE 5S-FE 264,xxx miles - New output shaft seals, Trans fluid service...
1997 Mazda B2300 213,xxx miles Underbody/frame resto in progress.
Find my DIY's or advice helpful? Don't forget to hit the "Thanks" button.
I did the timing test with TE1 & E1 connected. The timing came out ~9.5 degrees, so perhaps I should advance it to lean it more?
With TE1 & E1 bridged, I see the CEL blinks constantly. That indicates I have no error codes... I kinda want to see some codes so I know what to do, LOL
Went ahead and measured the #2 sensor in the picture below. It came out 30 ohms, so I take it that's not the ECT sensor?
According to AutoZone's online manual, the ECT sensor should be between 6 ~ 0.1 kohm...
The green sensor in the last pic is the ECT. Do not follow autozone's specs. The sensor has a very wide range of resistance depending on the temp. Get your timing set at 10 degrees. Every little bit helps. The CEL is supposes to flash when the pins are jumpered. As for checking codes, you need to do it a little differently. First jumper Te1 and E1 with the key off. Turn the key to on and check the cel. If it flashes constantly, there's no codes.
__________________
1996 Paseo 5E-FE 269,xxx miles - Gotta fix that sagging DS door. New hinges on the way.
1993 Camry LE 5S-FE 264,xxx miles - New output shaft seals, Trans fluid service...
1997 Mazda B2300 213,xxx miles Underbody/frame resto in progress.
Find my DIY's or advice helpful? Don't forget to hit the "Thanks" button.
Last edited by 96paseo; 06-09-2010 at 07:51 AM.
Reason: add'l info
__________________
1996 Paseo 5E-FE 269,xxx miles - Gotta fix that sagging DS door. New hinges on the way.
1993 Camry LE 5S-FE 264,xxx miles - New output shaft seals, Trans fluid service...
1997 Mazda B2300 213,xxx miles Underbody/frame resto in progress.
Find my DIY's or advice helpful? Don't forget to hit the "Thanks" button.
The Following User Says Thank You to 96paseo For This Useful Post:
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With AC off, the radiator fans turns on from time to time, and the O2 sensor reading a constant 0.9 volt while the fans are on. Dropping back to ~0.5 volts when fans turn off.
) This time I tapped into the Black wire, and attach the other wire into the battery's grounding point. I ran the pair of wire from the one and only oxygen sensor in the Paseo at the down pipe, to the passenger compartment. I attached a digital volt meter at the end, so I get the O2 sensor readings while I drive! 
1993 Toyota Camry
New hinges on the way.
FAILED... It has improved, but not enough... Hydrocarbon (HC) got lowered to 294, from 428. Limit is 220 ppm, so I am getting closer! 
)
Linear Mode
