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Pics of 5100's @ 1.75, w/ TSB leaf pack

10K views 41 replies 5 participants last post by  Fitz235 
#1 ·
Yeah, I know, another 5100 thread.

Anyway, what I'm looking for specifically, are some pics of this setup preferably on a truck that has had the rear leaf packs for at least a year. during my search people have mentioned that the rear leafs will settle. So I'd like to see a few setups that have been installed for a while.

I have my 5100's set to .85 right now, but will be getting my frame replaced soon. I'm thinking about doing it, and I figure, if I'm going to, now would be the time.

What would be ideal for me is a setup similar to what I have now, A slight rake, but mostly level.
 
#3 ·
That looks good. The settling is minor, and it still looks proportional front to rear.

So that's just the 5100's, and TSB leafs, no blocks or anything in the rear right?

No drive line issues, vibes, or anything right?
 
#7 · (Edited)
Yep, just 5100's with the TSB leaf packs in the rear...nothing else.

I know Daniel has the front diff vibes from the needle roller bearing. He just hasn't gotten around to fixing it with the ECGS bushing. That's one of those fixes where it will be better than new.
Yep, I was planning on replacing the bearing with the ECGS bushing while the weather was nice...Just ran out of time before the weather turned cold. It will probably have to wait until spring now. Which isn't a huge deal. I have dealt with the vibe for years, a few more months won't kill me... lol

Is that a result of the lift, or something else?
Lift mainly, but there have been instance where people have had the front diff vibe with no lift at all. I didn't have it when lowered mine back to stock height. I just hated the look of a stock truck more than the vibe...haha

I plan on raising the front to 2.5" and installing a rear AAL when I have the front end apart to do the bearing.

Lift. I couldn't find whether yours is 4wd since that's the only case that would apply. If you have the 5100s set to .85 and don't have the vibes now, you probably won't have an issue at 1.75. But if you're capable of installing 5100s yourself, you're completely capable of installing the bushing if ever needed.
I agree! Fitz, There are some great threads on TW about how to replace the bearing. I have torn my suspension apart three times now, it isn't to difficult even with just basic hand tools. Now that I am dealing with rusty, stubborn fasteners, I am holding off until I have access to or purchase a decent air compressor with an impact driver.
 
#4 ·
I know Daniel has the front diff vibes from the needle roller bearing. He just hasn't gotten around to fixing it with the ECGS bushing. That's one of those fixes where it will be better than new.
 
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#6 ·
Lift. I couldn't find whether yours is 4wd since that's the only case that would apply. If you have the 5100s set to .85 and don't have the vibes now, you probably won't have an issue at 1.75. But if you're capable of installing 5100s yourself, you're completely capable of installing the bushing if ever needed.
 
#9 ·
You're fine getting it within spec until you hit 3" lift. At that point, you need to get UCAs. Since 5100s only go to 2.5, you'd be fine. (You do have to get it aligned whenever you change the height setting on the 5100s)
 
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#11 ·
Currently 1.75. I had the dreaded front diff vibe before East Coast Gear Supply created the bushing to solve Toyota's design flaw. When I first installed them, they were set to 1.75. Then when I had the vibe, I lowered them to .85. After fixing the issue with the front diff, I went back to 1.75. I like the ride quality at 1.75 better than .85.
 
#12 · (Edited)
So, I'm thinking about just going brand new on all my suspension parts, and it's starting to add up. The leafs will be part of the frame deal, so that leaves the 5100's, and new front springs.

5100's @ $319 (w/free shipping) from Downsouth. Factory Offroad coils (I've always liked the ride) @ $200 for the pair. Another $100 +/- for related bushings/washers, etc.

I asked my dealer if they would charge to do the swap, and they said if the coilover assembly is complete, they wouldn't charge me, because they have to swap it from one frame to the new one anyway. If they have to install the new coils, it would be roughly $300 for them to do both sides.

So to save money, I'm thinking of just buying the whole assembly, and putting it together myself, and bringing it in when they do the swap.

With the original set, I attempted to install them myself, but the spring compressor I rented from the autoparts store looked like it was about to explode before I was even close to getting them off. So I just installed the rears, and had the dealer do the fronts.

So I'm not sure if I had the wrong type of compressor the first time (from what I remember, it was some type of threaded rod with a hook on each end). Do you guys have any recommendations on what type of spring compressor to get, and who might rent them?
 
#14 ·
Haven't installed the bushing yet. When I replaced the needle bearing myself a couple of years ago, it was before ECGS had even started on a solution. Bushing came out 8 or 9 months later. I'm waiting until this latest bearing gets noisy. Oddly enough, I have about 40k miles on it and it is still quiet. I saw recently that the bushing's price is over double what it was when Chase began selling them. Anyway, when it gets noisy I'll install the bushing.

And your question is very common. Guys have a lot of miles on them with zero problems reported. It's the same type of bushing ARB uses in their lockers. I've never heard of ARB having problems with them, so no reason to expect any problems. The bearing is supposed to last the life of the truck.
 
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#16 ·
It's an immediate thing. The minute you drive it after lifting. Typical speeds are around 40 mph. It's a cyclical vibe that you feel (feet on floorboard and hands on the wheel). That's a mild to moderate vibe. Mine was actually pretty severe. I could audibly hear it as a loud grinding sound (and could feel it at most speeds (15 mph up to 55 mph), but I had 89k miles on the truck when I installed the 5100s. If it's mild and you have M/T tires, good chance you won't feel it over the tires. When you switch to 4wd, the vibe goes away. Switching back to 2wd brings it back. That was the main diagnosis. No other vines hit at that speed and go away in 4wd.

Don't let it scare you though. Not everyone suffers this problem. And some guys are suffering it without ever lifting. Seems to be just the luck of the draw. You could slide under and grab the driver's CV Axle now and see how much you can wiggle it (front to back or up and down). There's some play in it. If you have a lot of play, expect the vibe.

If you're capable of installing the 5100s yourself (capable even if you're having the dealer do it for convenience), then you'll be capable of changing the bearing for the bushing afterward if it comes to that. Easier if you have a second set of hands, but not required.
 
#19 ·
You could slide under and grab the driver's CV Axle now and see how much you can wiggle it (front to back or up and down). There's some play in it. If you have a lot of play, expect the vibe.
I checked it, and as you said, there is some play in it. A little more up & down, than side to side. I don't have any reference to know how much is too much, but it didn't seem excessive to me. Maybe +/- 2/16"up and down.


On a related note, any one have any experience with these?


KYB Strut Mount Plates SM5640

These things are less than half the price of the factory strut mounts, and have a limited lifetime warranty.

 
#21 ·
It's in the front differential, driver's side where the CV Axle goes into the front diff. And yes, it will eventually cause problems in most cases (higher risk if lifted at all). And obviously only applies to 4x4.
 
#22 ·
Thanks 05moose but is it only on the drivers side or also passenger side. I guess both sides should be replaced. I have noticed a noise coming from the drivers side for a long time on my 05 4x4 Toy especially on cold mornings . I get the vibrations at highway speeds.
 
#25 ·
paceman, that needle bearing is located on both the left (driver's side) and right side of the differential. In almost all cases it is the left side that goes bad. The right side has a different loading situation.

On the driver's side the CV shaft enters directly into the needle bearing and is subject to side loads. On the right side, the CV shaft enters a ball bearing, only at the very end of the ADD tube, where it actually attaches to the diff, is where the other needle bearing lives. This needle bearing does not see the same side loads of the left one.

Having said that, I did have to replace the right as well because it trashed the short stub shaft there. I am now convinced that the damage was due to a mod called the 4lo Trac mod. I suspect hammering of the stub shaft against the needle bearings occurred during extensive high RPM testing where braking occurs and suddenly transfers torque through the differential to the opposite wheel.

In any event, this is probably rare and I am not recommending that the needle bearing on the right side be routinely replaced.
 
#23 ·
More likely wheel bearings if you're feeling it at highway speeds. As for the needle bearing, only one person (out of over a hundred) have had a problem with the passenger side. That's because the passenger side is different. The front diff vibe occurs the worst at 40 mph and will go away in 4Hi. Then comes back when you switch back to 2wd.
 
#24 · (Edited)
So I think I have all the hardware, but without pulling the existing ones apart, I'm not completely sure. The few exploded diagrams I've found online can be a little vague.



This is the order, and amount of washers/bushings I believe go on top of the the shock body. The first washer above the shock has a groove/lip on it. That appears to be set up to wrap around the outer edge of the under side of the strut mount, which kind of has a built in bushing.

If anything is out of place, or missing let me know.
 
#26 ·
So I think I have all the hardware, but without pulling the existing ones apart, I'm not completely sure. The few exploded diagrams I've found online can be a little vague.



This is the order, and amount of washers/bushings I believe go on top of the the shock body. The first washer above the shock has a groove/lip on it. That appears to be set up to wrap around the outer edge of the under side of the strut mount, which kind of has a built in bushing.

If anything is out of place, or missing let me know.
Here is the order using factory parts. If necessary post back and I will look at my spare parts (OEM) for you re: details of concave/convex, etc.
http://utoyot8.com/FullImage.aspx?c...Info=(0409-++++)GRN245,250,265,270,TRN24#,26#
 
#29 ·


So I got them together. So much easier when they're off the truck.

I noticed on the first one that the strut mount didn't sit completely flush on top of the spring, so I tried to orient the second one to sit in different positions on the top of the spring before I tightened it down. Some seemed a little better than others, but I didn't find anywhere that it sat completely flush. I assume it's normal because of the gap on top of the spring, and maybe it corrects itself when mounted on the truck.
 
#32 ·
Another thanks Taco'09.

That diagram helped a lot. I was definitely off by a lot on one, and a little on the other. Everything should be right where it needs to be now.
 
#33 ·
Alrighty then......

Long time since I posted in this thread.

I just got my truck back from frame swap. The the new suspension was installed, as well as the ECGS bushing.

I didn't post this earlier, but I actually had the diff. vibe before. I just didn't initially realize it. I've had my previous 5100's set to .85 for +/- 7 years, with no issues. About a year and a half ago I had the dealer install the Toytec 1/4" spacer on the driver's side when I had a whole new wheel / tire combo installed. After I got the truck back, I noticed a faint rumbling from the wheels (at least that's what it felt like) only when slowing to a stop, I figured it was the tread from the new Toyo's (Open Country they have a fairly aggressive tread). After a while, I realized it was happening between 20, and 40 mph, so I tried putting it 4wd while in this speed range, and sure as shit, it went away. At that point I realized I actually had the vibe. It seems like the 1/4" spacer put it over it's limit.

Anyway, after the ECGS bushing, it rides buttery smooth. No more vibes.
 
#34 ·
This is a re-post from a thread on TW (it was just easier to copy/paste it), that so far has only got 1 response, so I'm hoping one of you guys can help out:



Alright, this is probably going to be futile, as I've searched, and it sounds like the colors are constantly changing. But here it is:

I just got my truck back from a frame swap, they installed a new set of 5100's (now set to 1.75", from .85") with new Offroad coils, along with the new rear leafs, etc.

My "Before" (5100's @ .85") measurements were:

Driver Front: 21" center of hub to fender

Pass. Front: 21" center of hub to fender

Driver Rear: 22" center of hub to fender

Pass. Rear: 22" center of hub to fender

My "After" (5100's @ 1.75") measurements were:

Driver Front: 21.75" center of hub to fender

Pass. Front: 22.25" center of hub to fender

Driver Rear: 21.5" center of hub to fender

Pass. Rear: 21.75" center of hub to fender

It looks like there are a couple of things going on here:

One observation is that I went from 10 year old 2+1 leafs, that sat just slightly higher than the 3+1 TSB leafs on there now (I don't know if the front being higher, forces more weight on the rear, causing them to sag more?). At the least, they are no higher than the old leafs. I was expecting them to be +/- 1" higher from everything I've read. So it looks like an AAL is in my future.

The other observation, and main point is that the passenger side is now 1/2" higher than the driver's side with a 1/4" spacer on the driver's side.

I'm thinking the coils are swapped. I called the place I bought the parts from, but they didn't have a set in stock to check. So I figured I would check with the hive mind.

What's on there now:

Driver's side: Orange/White

Pass. side: Pink/White

So if anyone has an Offroad with matching colors, let me know, otherwise, I guess I'll be calling around.
 
#35 ·
What's on there now:

Driver's side: Orange/White

Pass. side: Pink/White

So if anyone has an Offroad with matching colors, let me know, otherwise, I guess I'll be calling around.
Fitz235, I too have a TRD Off Road AC. I took a quick peek at the front coils and they are so completely covered with mud all I could see was spring-shaped mud castings, ha. Tell me where the paint marks live on the springs and I will get the hose and clean them a little and see what is there.
 
#37 ·
Fitz235, well, I went and washed off the front coil springs. Here are the paint color markings on mine:

Driver's side: Yellow/Pink(a dirty pinkish or reddish-brownish-orangeish)

Pass. side: Pink(a dirty pinkish)/White

Note: the parts diagrams are showing part number changes for for the front coil springs on the Access Cab TRD Off Road. The catalogs do not give the dates of the change or color codes on the coil springs.
 
#38 ·
Taco'09 comes through once again.

Thanks man, I appreciate it.

Unfortunately, I think your color codes are different than mine. I had one other response from a guy on TW that had an '05 Offroad. His Orange/White was on the passenger side.

I'm pretty sure they must be swapped, I don't know how else it would be a 1/2" higher on the passenger's side with the spacer installed on the driver's side. It's also lower on the driver's side rear. I'm thinking it's because the high point is the passenger front, which would make the low point the driver's rear.

I had already called the dealer, and let them know what I found, and that I would be bringing it back in at some point, but I'll feel more confident if I have some backup, either from some of you guys, or a parts dept. I've called 2 dealers, and the parts warehouse I ordered from, and none have them in stock right now. I'll have to try some more places I guess.

The funny thing is that I put a note in my box of parts about which spring was which, but didn't make myself a copy.

Anyway, thanks again.
 
#39 ·
The parts guy at my dealership came through, and sent me some pics.

So, this will probably be more useless information taking up server space, but on the off chance someone can use this, here it is:


Front Left / Driver's side - P/N # 48131-AD231 - Pink/White



Front Right / Passenger's side - P/N # 48131-AD221 - Orange/White

BTW, this confirms that mine were installed on the wrong sides.
 
#40 ·
So, I got the truck back from the dealer the other day after they re-installed the springs on the proper sides, and the measurements are now dead even @ 22" center of hub to fender on all four corners. It looks like those front springs being reversed through the back off slightly as well.
 
#42 ·


I figured I might as well update this with a pic since I got mine installed. One caveat is I ended up going with a 2" AAL. The current 3+1 leafs, unlike the previous TSB 3+1's did not give any extra lift, and despite the truck measuring 22" at all 4 corners, it still looked slightly nose high. When I measured the cab, the front was a hair higher than the rear of the cab. I assume the rear wheel wells are arched a little higher than the fronts.
 
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