Hard To Shift Gear When Engine Is Running - Toyota Nation Forum : Toyota Car and Truck Forums

hydrogenh2 · 03-20-2006, 12:49 PM

89 Pickup V6 4x4 with manual transmission. When the engine is running, it’s very hard (I mean really hard, the vehicle has to be moving at certain speed, and I have to aggressively push the shift lever multiple times) to shift gear, especially to 1st, 2nd, and reverse. However, when the engine is off, there is no problem shifting.

Right now, it’s very difficult to drive this truck. At every traffic light, if I am lucky, I might be able push into 1st gear before the truck becomes fully stopped. Otherwise, I have to turn off the engine, put into 1st, and then restart the engine. To get into 2nd from 1st, I need luck, or I will ramp up RPM and jump into 3rd.

Any thoughts about the possible causes. I couldn’t find similar symptoms on the forum. Thanks for your input

BOSCOE · 03-20-2006, 01:41 PM

sounds like it needs clutch fluid. Check the fluid level if it's low you'll need to add fluid and probably bleed it. If it is low you probably need new seals in the system.

peterng · 03-20-2006, 01:52 PM

if the fluid was that low the pedal wouldn't have much resistance would it?

hydrogen - how does the pedal feel?

definately a good place to start, no doubt I'd have a new clutch swapped out before I realized it just needed clutch fluid

Pete

hydrogenh2 · 03-20-2006, 02:28 PM

Clutch fluid level is ok. Actually 2 days before this symptom happened, I did some tune-up myself. I found the brake fluid was low, so I added some brake fluid. Since this truck uses same fluid for brake and clutch. I also added a little fluid to clutch. But at time clutch fluid level was not low. I just added it to the max level mark. Now the clutch fluid level is still at max level. So I am sure there is no leak on clutch fluid.

As far as the resistance on the clutch pedal, it also seems okay. Maybe a little bit softer than before. I did press the clutch pedal harder recently, because the clutch pedal lever moved (or bent) a little bit, and I need to press the clutch pedal hard to press the ignition switch under the pedal in order to ignite the engine.

80toy · 03-20-2006, 04:27 PM

it sounds like your sincros are going out. how is the level of fluid/gear lube in your tranny? i would guess and say that your sicros are scored. are your gears grinding a little? what kind of fluid is in your tranny? my tranny was shifting hard, and i checked the level and it was low. i put in some more gear lube in mine and it solved the problem, we do have different trannies though.

Geius Maniacal · 03-20-2006, 05:11 PM

could it be something in the slave cylinder or the master clutch cylinder?

nofear4189 · 03-20-2006, 07:55 PM

awhile back i had to replace my master/slave for the clutch. the pedal would depress good 1 time, and then randomly get worse until I was able to depress it with my pinky. shifting was rough, so this could possibly be the problem.

-Adam

peterng · 03-20-2006, 08:47 PM

I'd of thought synchronizers if there wasn't the clutch pedal symptom. Definately check the tranny fluid level, then check the free play and clearance on the clutch pedal.

http://personal.utulsa.edu/~nathan-b...sm/clutch.html

check that link. It'll give you inspection techniques for the pedal, master and slave cylinders.

Good Luck !
Pete

hydrogenh2 · 03-20-2006, 11:28 PM

Thanks for the input from all you guys. People like you make the world brighter.

Transmission fluid level is normal (fluid comes out when the check/refill plug is open). Book says using 75W-90 gear oil. No grinding. Did a quick check on the master and slave cylinders. I looked at the slave cylinder push rod while someone was pumping the clutch pedal for me. The slave cylinder push rod did move back and forth. But I don't know how much travel should be on the push rod. Anyone knows it? How do I test if the cylinders are working properly or not? Will do a more thorough clutch check following peterng's link.

peterng · 03-21-2006, 07:42 AM

ya well I'm not working right now. I recently got another job back home 8 hours from here NORTHWARD. So I took 5 weeks off to fix up the pile of junk I have listed in my signature.

Today is DAY 2 and I pop inside every 3 hours or so for a bite to eat and to check TN.

I'm off to get some more deisel for the furnace to keep my ass warm right now.

What I will do is measure the travel and check the resistance on the push rod coming out of the slave, then if yours is the same you may be inside the tranny soon

LATER !
Pete

hydrogenh2 · 03-21-2006, 08:01 AM

One more question, when the clutch is fully pressed, should the pedal touch the floor or not? If not, how much clearance should be there between pedal and floor?

hydrogenh2 · 03-21-2006, 08:37 AM

If this problem is caused by clutch not being fully released, how could I prove it? I did the following thing, but failed to prove it. With engine off, press clutch and brake, put gear in 1st, and start engine. After engine is started, release brake while hold clutch pressed. If clutch is not fully released, I would expect the truck will try to move forward. But the reality is not the case; the truck didn’t move (nor attempted to move). I need to raise the clutch pedal to get the truck move.

Could air bubble cause such a serious problem? Will do a bleeding tonight anyway.

Flash319 · 03-21-2006, 11:27 AM

Sounds like it might be your pilot bearing is cooked. If the truck does not move with it in gear and clutch pulled, I would say that your pedal action is okay. If the pilot bearing is gone then the engine will still be putting torque on the shaft. If you pull the rear drive shaft off and have someone hold the clutch pedel in with it in gear and watch the output shaft. If it is spinning with some power then I would say that it is not your synchros. Clutch or pilot bearing.

Geius Maniacal · 03-21-2006, 11:51 AM

has the clutch gotten softer? or have u noticed it bein a bit softer and easier to press?

peterng · 03-21-2006, 12:20 PM

I think Flash is onto something there ...