88 Pickup Electrical

[rbinc]

88 pickup V6. Charging fine at 14 volts. Good battery.

Charge, brake AND AT oil/temp dash lamps come on intermittently. Always all three together when they do. Sometimes dim, sometimes bright, sometimes flashing sporadically.

When this happens there is NO visible dimming of anything else. Never have to jump the truck and always cranks with the same speed and starts right up.

Other than living with the nuisance, any ideas?

Thanks for any help!

[Sidney]

If the brake and charge lights come on during revving of the engine then it's a sign that the carbon alternator brushes require replacing as this is the mileage for them to wear out. In alternators the brushes wear out on average every 140-170 000 miles where on the dashboard the brake & charge light both come on at the same time. About half of the auto electric shops in your local yellow pages sell carbon alternator brushes and copper solenoid starter contacts for about $5/pair.Another way to verify that the alternator is not charging is while the engine is running bring a metal screwdriver or any metal object near the alternator and if the alternator is working properly then it should act like a magnet and grab the screwdriver.

For carbon brushes R&R:

http://www.4x4wire.com/toyota/mainte...nator_brushes/ http://www.toyotaoffroad.net/afertig...torbrushes.htm
http://perso.wanadoo.fr/adherence.4x...nateur_kzj.htm
http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbul...d.php?t=166525
http://www.bitwalla.com/cruisers/art...lternator.html
http://www.barneymc.com/toy_root/tec...c/altrnatr.htm

For decoding the dashboard lights:

http://www.powerbase-auto.co.uk/alternator_faults.htm
http://members.1stconnect.com/anozir...alternator.htm

Here are part #'s for Toyota alternator carbon brushes and copper solenoid starter contacts which are used in about 95% of all Toyota vehicles.

Toyota alternator Brushes with holder:

Toyota # 27370-35060=$29

Alternator brush only (qty:1 brush unless otherwise stated):

AC Delco # E724,E731 (side wire and concave tip)
Ace Electric # DA-61 (brush only),S-5367 (brush holder)
Beck Arnley # 178-1669 (side wire and concave tip)
Beck Arnley # 178-1376
Borg Warner # X580 (side wire and concave tip)
Canadian Tire # 19-2050-6=$4.49/pair
Daihatsu # 27370-87302-000
Daihatsu # 27371-63020-000
Daihatsu # 27371-87501-000
Daihatsu # 27371-70300-000
Echlin # E601=$8.16/pair (UAP/NAPA)
Echlin # ECHE601
Echlin # EC480
Echlin # ECHE480
GP Sorensen # 255047 (side wire and concave tip)
GM # 94123056
GM # 96054118
Honda # 31144-PD1-004=$9.72
Honda # 31144-PD1-0040
Honda # 31144-PD1-0030
Honda # 31150-PR7-A01
Honda # 31150-PTO-003
Hino Industries # 021660-0390
Hino Industries # 021660-0510
Isuzu # 8-94123-056-0
Isuzu # 8-97032-308-0
Isuzu # 8-97032-310-0
Mazda # 021660-0390
Mazda # 021660-0510
Mazda # KL47-18-W75
Mileage Plus # E601SB
Mitsubishi # MD604474
Mitsubishi # 21660-0510
Niehoff # WA571 (side wire and concave tip)
NipponDenso # 021660-0390
NipponDenso # 021660-0510
Standard # JX-116 (side wire and concave tip)
Subaru # 021660-0390
Subaru # 021660-0510
Suzuki # 31631-82610
Suzuki # 31656-82611
Suzuki # 021660-0510
Toyota # 27370-42010
Toyota # 27370-75060
Toyota # 27371-63020=$5.80 (up to 9105) (side wire and concave tip)
Toyota # 27371-70300=$5.20 (9105-9511)
Toyota # 27371-76004-71
UAP/NAPA # MPEE601SB
Victory Lap # FAX57=$4.49/pair (Canadian Tire)
Wilson's Electric # 26-29-7534 (side wire and concave tip)=$2.20 each (Diesel Auto Electric)(Parts for Trucks,box of 10 for $3.40)

Specifications:
Length=15 mm
Width=7 mm
Thickness=5 mm
Lead length=49 mm

7 starter repair sites:

http://www.off-road.com/4x4web/toyota/tech/starter/ -
http://www.4crawler.com/4x4/CheapTricks/Starter.shtml
http://www.toyotaoffroad.net/afertig...rterrepair.htm
http://www.4x4wire.com/toyota/maintenance/starter/
http://www.barneymc.com/toy_root/techneek/starter.htm
http://perso.wanadoo.fr/adherence.4x4/start_bj.htm
http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbul...d.php?t=166530

Starter contact kits:

Toyota # 28226-72010/80 (battery side)(also1KZTE-2LT-1KZT)
Toyota # 28226-72080 (8808-9108)
Toyota # 28226-16130 (9108-9308)
Toyota # 28226-55050 (9308-9511)
Toyota # 28226-70040 (9308-9511)
Toyota # 28226-72040 (motor side if needed)
Toyota # 28226-72010 (8808-9511)
Toyota # 28226-74070 (9108-9511)

For others besides 22R series:

Toyota # 28226-54220 (motor side) (2LTE, 3L..LN13# IKZTE, 2L#, KZN130,LN108,112,85..4FC)
Toyota # 28226-54250 (Diesel Surf 2.4TD, contains a new end cover and gasket)
Toyota # 28226-54320 (battery side) (2LTE, 3L..LN13# IKZTE, 2L#, KZN130, LN108,112,85..4FC,3B-1HZ-BJ73-HZJ7#-1KZT-KZJ70)
Toyota # 28226-17030 (battery side) (1H#-HDJ80-HZJ80)
Toyota # 28226-56250 (battery side) (3B-1HZ-1PZ-PZJ7#)

Starter contacts only:

Toyota # 28226-70040
Wilson’s Electric # 45-29-652

Starter brushes:

AC Delco # D762
GP Sorensen # 255048
Standard # JX-117

Whether your starter uses two rectangular types or one rectangular and one crescent you can substitute with two squares or one square and one crescent so any of the above part #'s for those kits will be the right ones,or about half of the auto electric shops in your local yellow pages would sell aftermarket contacts for only $5 each or the pair.

Sidney
Repairs tv's,vcr's,home/car audio out of my home
E-mail:sidneybek@yahoo.com
Dartmouth,Nova Scotia
Canada
1985 Toyota 4-Runner,22R-E,W56,RN60LV-MSEK,rusted rear step/towing chrome bumper with 242 000 KM

[rbinc]

Sidney,

Thanks for the reply. I have no problem replacing the brushes or even slamming another alternator in the truck.

But missing from your post and links is any explanation on WHY these lights come on when I have verified 14 volts charge (under maximum load) at the battery. I'm curious what causes these lights to come on as an indicator of brush failure when the system is operating normally?

What am I missing when I look at the schematic and fail to see what grounds the low sides of these bulbs when the vehicle is running. I understand the "charge" light coming on under 12 volts, but it comes on when the vehicle is charging normally and totally fail to see what lights the others as an indicator of bad brushes that are doing their job??

Thanks again for any help in my understanding this.

[CraigW]

Have you measured the voltage when the lamps come on ?? to see if voltage drops then ?

I would try to repair your alternator instead of auto parts store gambles.

[rbinc]

CraigW,

Yes. I have pulled to the curb when the lights came on (and remained on during my test) while I measured 13.9 volts charge at the battery.

An alternator is cheap enough, but I fail to understand WHY a normally operating charging circuit, in all respects, turns these lights on.

Thanks for the reply as I try to get to the bottom of this!