2gr-fe Test 'n Tune and Performance Question - Page 2 - Toyota Nation Forum : Toyota Car and Truck Forums
Hardcore Tech and Competition Strictly HARDCORE tech info and questions and also autocross / racing discussion!

 13Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #16 of 30 Old 06-22-2017, 08:13 PM
Honda-Tech White Ops
 
Esoteric Image's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 1,587
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 642 Post(s)
Thanks: 37
Thanked 104 Times in 97 Posts
Garage
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
Uhhmm.. uhh..


Unsprung weight is more towards acceleration.. not handling.


In all my years, I have never heard of rotational weight.. That might be be important for bikes as that whole gyroscope thing to keep the bike up, but you swapping out steel to CF just proves my point as well.



Theres many threads already of lighter wheels while racing to which unsprung weight has a drastic effect on acceleration.. Not sure your angle on handling, a wheel is a wheel when turning.


But whatever..


[SIZE="3"]2013 2.5 SE


Camry was rear ended (with structural damage) by a teenage girl, Got a Q60 3.0TT now
Esoteric Image is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #17 of 30 Old 06-23-2017, 12:55 PM
Senior TN Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: S.F. East Bay
Posts: 7,346
Mentioned: 47 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1879 Post(s)
Thanks: 109
Thanked 816 Times in 750 Posts
Lifetime Supreme Member
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
Most people have never heard of Kobe Lobster either, doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Esoteric Image View Post
Unsprung weight is more towards acceleration.. not handling. ..
Google "unsprung weight", which is components that are below the springs: wheels, control-arms, bottom of strut-housing, ball-joints, 1/2 axles, brake-rotors. All these follow the contours of the road and are not controlled by the springs & dampers. Racers try as much to lessen weight of unsprung components because they force the body up & down too much if the ratio of unsprung-to-sprung weight is too high. That's why heavier cars tend to have smoother rides, because the sprung-weight above the springs aren't tossed around as easily by the wheels & unsprung weight. Wikipedia - automobile handling.




However, rotating-parts have to deal with polar moment of inertia which is different than the upward linear push from unsprung weight. For every foot of forward movement, you have to rotate a piece of wheel & tyre through twice that distance. Rotational inertia

where:
meq = equivalent mass of rotating parts [kg]
= [ Iw (1/rw)^2 + Ip hf (if /rw)^2 + Ie ht (if ig / rw)^2]

where:

Iw = polar moment of inertia of wheels and axles ≈ 2.7 [kg m^2]

It's the square-root function of mass that causes rotating parts to have more inertia (harder to accelerate for given weight), than parts that are moving only in a straight line.


You've got your concepts correct, the terms aren't matching up.
Myxalplyx and Moondoggy-X like this.
DannoXYZ is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to DannoXYZ For This Useful Post:
Myxalplyx (07-04-2017)
post #18 of 30 Old 06-23-2017, 06:57 PM
Slow 2010 RAV4 Sport
 
Myxalplyx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Delaware
Posts: 278
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 53 Post(s)
Thanks: 35
Thanked 23 Times in 20 Posts
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
I'll leave the math to you guys. But my personal experience is that by installing lightweight wheels and tires on my RAV4 (Including my Subarus as well), I dropped 3/10th's of a second in the 1/4 mile. See my thread here ~~> Post #35-43
My wheel weight loss may be a little.......more than usual though. Hehe! My wheel diameter is also smaller than stock. So the wheel response is way more exaggerated. I will say it is not to most people's liking. Bothers me some as every bump has the whole RAV4 moving. The acceleration from idle and throttle response is amazing though.


I measured no extra power to the wheels though (Of course) when testing this on the dyno. However, I measured much better acceleration numbers on the dyno. My dyno plots are gone (Thanks to Imageshack). Rav4 Wheel Weight Dyno Test


So....if you want something you can feel everyday with better acceleration, better throttle response and better breaking, get yourself lighter wheels and tires. Don't compromise on your tires either. Get one of the best performing lightweight tires you can purchase. On smaller diameter wheels (to get the weight closer to the center of the wheel). And if you are nuts, get a smaller diameter tire than stock on your smaller wheels for even more amusement. Do so at your own risk and be safe. Trust me! I have a 2015 Honda Fit with a dirt slow automatic CVT Transmission. All I've added was my homemade intake, exhaust and lightweight wheels and tires (with slightly smaller diameter than stock). Took me from [email protected] to a best of [email protected] It has no business being as quick as some sportier cars. Here I am having fun with some Mustangs.
Moondoggy-X likes this.

2010 Toyota RAV4 Sprt
N/A --> [email protected]
Supercharged -->[email protected]

Last edited by Myxalplyx; 06-24-2017 at 05:54 AM.
Myxalplyx is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #19 of 30 Old 07-07-2017, 10:17 AM
Slow 2010 RAV4 Sport
 
Myxalplyx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Delaware
Posts: 278
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 53 Post(s)
Thanks: 35
Thanked 23 Times in 20 Posts
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moondoggy-X View Post

Here's the times I ran today. The temp outside was 89 degrees.

No Jet maf, no spacer, CEL ON...
14.604 secs @ 96.04 mph
14.725 secs @ 95.91 mph
14.770 secs @95.64 mph

No Jet maf, no spacer, CEL OFF...
14.984 secs @ 94.80 mph
15.021 secs @ 94.14 mph
15.111 secs @ 94.87 mph

Installed Jet Maf, no spacer , CEL ON...
14.808 secs @ 95.61 mph
15.035 secs @ 95.10 mph
15.039 secs @ 94.52 mph

No Jet Maf, installed Spacer, CEL ON...
14.784 secs @ 95.84 mph
14.826 secs @ 94.86 mph
14.886 secs @ 95.17 mph

Great day at the track today! Looks like I gained half a sec with lighter wheels and tires and the performance y-pipe. As you can see, the Jet Maf not only didn't make me faster, it appears that it was slowing me down. I was honestly surprised, because my "butt dyno" was telling me the complete opposite. The throttle body spacer was also a slight bottleneck. I imaging its because its slowing air down at higher RPMs. the most baffling thing is the check engine light. Why is the car so much slower when everything is supposed to be working correctly?
Never did ask Moondogg but what got you from the 14.7-14.8 range down to the ...what....14.3's your at now?
Moondoggy-X likes this.

2010 Toyota RAV4 Sprt
N/A --> [email protected]
Supercharged -->[email protected]
Myxalplyx is offline  
post #20 of 30 Old 07-07-2017, 10:45 AM
Honda-Tech White Ops
 
Esoteric Image's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 1,587
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 642 Post(s)
Thanks: 37
Thanked 104 Times in 97 Posts
Garage
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
When you get in the 12's, wake me up
Moondoggy-X likes this.


[SIZE="3"]2013 2.5 SE


Camry was rear ended (with structural damage) by a teenage girl, Got a Q60 3.0TT now
Esoteric Image is offline  
post #21 of 30 Old 07-07-2017, 08:03 PM Thread Starter
Official TN Member
 
Moondoggy-X's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Illinois
Posts: 231
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 88 Post(s)
Thanks: 14
Thanked 21 Times in 16 Posts
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
(Thread Starter)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Myxalplyx View Post
Never did ask Moondogg but what got you from the 14.7-14.8 range down to the ...what....14.3's your at now?
Lets see... Short answer, listening to you guys, a LOT of test'n'tuning, and getting the Torque app.
More specifically I 1) Switched from the K&N short ram to the DC Sports Cold Air intake. That got me to 14.5... 2) Wrapped the CAI in the sunshade ESPECIALLY the maf sensor itself. I even bought a laser thermometer to make sure that everything the intake was close to that could warm it up was wrapped. Then I did the coolant bypass for the throttle body. That got me down to 14.4... 3) I got the Orangevirus tune. That got me down to 14.3... It also helped that by the time all of this was done, it was october/november. Now I got the headers and dual exhaust, I'm running 14.3 in the same weather I was running 14.5 in last year...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Esoteric Image View Post
When you get in the 12's, wake me up
We'll be waking you up soon enough! not even counting my r9k tune. I've done an obsessive amount of research since starting this thread, and have test'n'tuned at least a dozen times since. I know my car. Still, Let me know if this doesn't hold water.

In October/November weather, 40-45 degrees, I'm confident I could pull a 14.1 sec quarter mile with my current setup. Now for my future mods
-.1 sec NST Lightweight Crank Pulley. Myxalplyx already tested.
-.1 sec Lightweight lithium battery and duplicate Myxalplys's tapered intake design. Myxalplyx already tested.
-.1 sec MWR valve body. Myxalplyx already tested a similar unit from Level 10, I believe.
-.3 sec Limited Slip Differential. Super Street already tested. http://www.superstreetonline.com/how...-differential/
-.??? R9k tune with the rev limiter raised to 7100 rpm.

^^^This will be done over the next year and should get me get me to mid-low 13s range. The following year, I'm looking to get either boosted, or built. HOPEFULLY that'll get me in very high 12s.

THEN... Ima wake you up, alright. by doing burnouts up and down your block
Myxalplyx likes this.

2009 Toyota Avalon XL
FM Headers
DC Sports CAI
Maxbore TB
Borla Mufflers
2.25 in True Dual exhaust w/x-pipe
Enkei J10 Wheels 18x7.5

Last edited by Moondoggy-X; 07-07-2017 at 08:09 PM.
Moondoggy-X is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to Moondoggy-X For This Useful Post:
Myxalplyx (08-03-2017)
post #22 of 30 Old 07-08-2017, 09:09 AM
Slow 2010 RAV4 Sport
 
Myxalplyx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Delaware
Posts: 278
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 53 Post(s)
Thanks: 35
Thanked 23 Times in 20 Posts
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moondoggy-X View Post
Lets see... Short answer, listening to you guys, a LOT of test'n'tuning, and getting the Torque app.
More specifically I 1) Switched from the K&N short ram to the DC Sports Cold Air intake. That got me to 14.5... 2) Wrapped the CAI in the sunshade ESPECIALLY the maf sensor itself. I even bought a laser thermometer to make sure that everything the intake was close to that could warm it up was wrapped. Then I did the coolant bypass for the throttle body. That got me down to 14.4... 3) I got the Orangevirus tune. That got me down to 14.3... It also helped that by the time all of this was done, it was october/november. Now I got the headers and dual exhaust, I'm running 14.3 in the same weather I was running 14.5 in last year...


We'll be waking you up soon enough! not even counting my r9k tune. I've done an obsessive amount of research since starting this thread, and have test'n'tuned at least a dozen times since. I know my car. Still, Let me know if this doesn't hold water.

In October/November weather, 40-45 degrees, I'm confident I could pull a 14.1 sec quarter mile with my current setup. Now for my future mods
-.1 sec NST Lightweight Crank Pulley. Myxalplyx already tested.
-.1 sec Lightweight lithium battery and duplicate Myxalplys's tapered intake design. Myxalplyx already tested.
-.1 sec MWR valve body. Myxalplyx already tested a similar unit from Level 10, I believe.
-.3 sec Limited Slip Differential. Super Street already tested. http://www.superstreetonline.com/how...-differential/
-.??? R9k tune with the rev limiter raised to 7100 rpm.

^^^This will be done over the next year and should get me get me to mid-low 13s range. The following year, I'm looking to get either boosted, or built. HOPEFULLY that'll get me in very high 12s.

THEN... Ima wake you up, alright. by doing burnouts up and down your block
That's a lot of detail. Thanks for your research on this. Looking forward to using the wrap.

I feel confident in you running in the 13s as well. That 1st 60ft is going to be critical with the extra power you will be putting out and tire grip.

On the highways, it'll be a beast.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk
Moondoggy-X likes this.

2010 Toyota RAV4 Sprt
N/A --> [email protected]
Supercharged -->[email protected]
Myxalplyx is offline  
post #23 of 30 Old 07-08-2017, 05:33 PM Thread Starter
Official TN Member
 
Moondoggy-X's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Illinois
Posts: 231
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 88 Post(s)
Thanks: 14
Thanked 21 Times in 16 Posts
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
(Thread Starter)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Myxalplyx View Post
That's a lot of detail. Thanks for your research on this. Looking forward to using the wrap.

I feel confident in you running in the 13s as well. That 1st 60ft is going to be critical with the extra power you will be putting out and tire grip.

On the highways, it'll be a beast.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk
True! I was already looking into wider wheels because I want more of a "stanced" look. The lsd is supposed to do wonders for grip also.
Myxalplyx likes this.

2009 Toyota Avalon XL
FM Headers
DC Sports CAI
Maxbore TB
Borla Mufflers
2.25 in True Dual exhaust w/x-pipe
Enkei J10 Wheels 18x7.5
Moondoggy-X is offline  
post #24 of 30 Old 07-09-2017, 08:04 AM
Honda-Tech White Ops
 
Esoteric Image's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 1,587
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 642 Post(s)
Thanks: 37
Thanked 104 Times in 97 Posts
Garage
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
Well, Mine isnt stanced.. but looks flush

19x8.5 +30
19x9.5 +35

Im using ESR wheels which are replicas of real wheels.
Myxalplyx and Moondoggy-X like this.


[SIZE="3"]2013 2.5 SE


Camry was rear ended (with structural damage) by a teenage girl, Got a Q60 3.0TT now
Esoteric Image is offline  
post #25 of 30 Old 07-09-2017, 11:51 AM Thread Starter
Official TN Member
 
Moondoggy-X's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Illinois
Posts: 231
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 88 Post(s)
Thanks: 14
Thanked 21 Times in 16 Posts
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
(Thread Starter)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Esoteric Image View Post
Well, Mine isnt stanced.. but looks flush

19x8.5 +30
19x9.5 +35

Im using ESR wheels which are replicas of real wheels.
Looks damn good! Where'd you get them? Is there a better place to shop aftermarket wheels than Tire Rack? I like that they show the weight for most of the wheels and tires, but the selection seems kind of limited for the bigger sizes.

2009 Toyota Avalon XL
FM Headers
DC Sports CAI
Maxbore TB
Borla Mufflers
2.25 in True Dual exhaust w/x-pipe
Enkei J10 Wheels 18x7.5
Moondoggy-X is offline  
post #26 of 30 Old 07-09-2017, 09:48 PM
Honda-Tech White Ops
 
Esoteric Image's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 1,587
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 642 Post(s)
Thanks: 37
Thanked 104 Times in 97 Posts
Garage
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
Ive been buying wheels from A-Spec wheels in Cali for almost 10yrs.


I always deal with Aaron - 510 533 3533

http://stores.ebay.com/A-Spec-Wheels...p2047675.l2563

http://www.ebay.com/itm/ESR-SR08-18X...1%26rkt%3D1%26
Moondoggy-X likes this.


[SIZE="3"]2013 2.5 SE


Camry was rear ended (with structural damage) by a teenage girl, Got a Q60 3.0TT now
Esoteric Image is offline  
post #27 of 30 Old 07-09-2017, 09:55 PM
Honda-Tech White Ops
 
Esoteric Image's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 1,587
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 642 Post(s)
Thanks: 37
Thanked 104 Times in 97 Posts
Garage
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
Looks like on the ESR site they are making Enkei RPF1 replicas.


IDK the weights, youd have to email them.
Moondoggy-X likes this.


[SIZE="3"]2013 2.5 SE


Camry was rear ended (with structural damage) by a teenage girl, Got a Q60 3.0TT now
Esoteric Image is offline  
post #28 of 30 Old 08-02-2017, 12:54 AM
Wallet abuser
 
Empty_Lord's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Indiana, Chicagoland
Posts: 114
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 17 Post(s)
Thanks: 4
Thanked 16 Times in 14 Posts
Garage
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moondoggy-X View Post
Lets see... Short answer, listening to you guys, a LOT of test'n'tuning, and getting the Torque app.
More specifically I 1) Switched from the K&N short ram to the DC Sports Cold Air intake. That got me to 14.5... 2) Wrapped the CAI in the sunshade ESPECIALLY the maf sensor itself. I even bought a laser thermometer to make sure that everything the intake was close to that could warm it up was wrapped. Then I did the coolant bypass for the throttle body. That got me down to 14.4... 3) I got the Orangevirus tune. That got me down to 14.3... It also helped that by the time all of this was done, it was october/november. Now I got the headers and dual exhaust, I'm running 14.3 in the same weather I was running 14.5 in last year...


We'll be waking you up soon enough! not even counting my r9k tune. I've done an obsessive amount of research since starting this thread, and have test'n'tuned at least a dozen times since. I know my car. Still, Let me know if this doesn't hold water.

In October/November weather, 40-45 degrees, I'm confident I could pull a 14.1 sec quarter mile with my current setup. Now for my future mods
-.1 sec NST Lightweight Crank Pulley. Myxalplyx already tested.
-.1 sec Lightweight lithium battery and duplicate Myxalplys's tapered intake design. Myxalplyx already tested.
-.1 sec MWR valve body. Myxalplyx already tested a similar unit from Level 10, I believe.
-.3 sec Limited Slip Differential. Super Street already tested. http://www.superstreetonline.com/how...-differential/
-.??? R9k tune with the rev limiter raised to 7100 rpm.

^^^This will be done over the next year and should get me get me to mid-low 13s range. The following year, I'm looking to get either boosted, or built. HOPEFULLY that'll get me in very high 12s.

THEN... Ima wake you up, alright. by doing burnouts up and down your block
Any pictures of the headers installed? me likey the idea of no more sulfer smelling cats...
Empty_Lord is offline  
post #29 of 30 Old 10-12-2017, 06:49 PM
Slow 2010 RAV4 Sport
 
Myxalplyx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Delaware
Posts: 278
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 53 Post(s)
Thanks: 35
Thanked 23 Times in 20 Posts
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
Hey Moondog,


Any new news? New times? I've been quiet lately but still doing things slowly to help the RAV4 get a little faster. Baby steps! I need to update my sig actually.

2010 Toyota RAV4 Sprt
N/A --> [email protected]
Supercharged -->[email protected]
Myxalplyx is offline  
post #30 of 30 Old 11-10-2017, 10:55 AM
Official TN Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 74
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
I'm a newbie to TN and I want to say thanks for the info in this thread. I've found helpful information in this thread and others on TN. Plus I'm curious to find out how fast you can make your Avalon as you mod it.
67beast is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

  Toyota Nation Forum : Toyota Car and Truck Forums > Toyota Nation Forums > Hardcore Tech and Competition

Bookmarks

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome