P0171 on 01 Echo with 19.5+ LTFT from 2 MAFs - Page 3 - Toyota Nation Forum : Toyota Car and Truck Forums
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post #31 of 69 Old 03-05-2017, 05:48 PM
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Ah ha! Good find and good way of finding it. That's not a hard gasket to replace usually and it's fairly inexpensive. Fix that and it's possible the fuel trims will become normal again. It would make sense that at idle air would more easily get sucked into the exhaust through that since there's little flow, that air would add oxygen which would tip the sensor to a false lean reading. While driving there's enough exhaust flow to make that slight introduction of air much less proportionally or even reverse it into an exhaust leak.

The Felpro exhaust gasket I used on my Celica for a similar connection worked very well and looked just like the dealer part. It kind of looks like a donut made of brillo pad in a cone shape with some kind of wax binder, avoid the ones that are made of a hunk of graphite.
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post #32 of 69 Old 03-05-2017, 05:59 PM Thread Starter
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I pulled the pipe off and couldn't seem to get the exhaust flange gasket off so I'm taking it to a trusted shop with an explanation of what I've been going through.
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post #33 of 69 Old 03-05-2017, 06:07 PM
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You need a thin scraper like a stiff putty knife to get between it and the manifold and then work around it prying outward till it pops off the extension of the flange it sits onto.
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post #34 of 69 Old 03-06-2017, 04:01 PM Thread Starter
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Ok I got the gasket off, i had to mutilate it to remove it.

I am going to put on a Fel-Pro 61124 flange gasket to try to get this thing fixed.
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post #35 of 69 Old 03-06-2017, 04:45 PM Thread Starter
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I installed the new gasket and ran a soapy water test. The flange still leaks. Is it necessary to replace the flange mounting hardware as well?
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post #36 of 69 Old 03-06-2017, 06:15 PM
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Typically no, as long as the springs are in good shape and not flattened. I think they're available as a bolt kit or by themselves, I guess it wouldn't hurt to replace the springs but you shouldn't need to. The bolts are called shoulder bolts because of that thicker non threaded section, you tighten them down till the shoulder bottoms against the flange and the spring is what holds tension on the seal. Try driving around some, maybe the gasket seals better once it heats up or something. Any change in fuel trims?
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post #37 of 69 Old 03-06-2017, 06:41 PM Thread Starter
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Holding at 15.6+ LTFT at idle after installed new flange gasket.

Time to pull the manifold gasket?
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post #38 of 69 Old 03-06-2017, 07:08 PM
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Well it's getting better so that's progress. Try adding some propane around the flange area to see if the O2 spikes rich or not and around the manifold itself.
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post #39 of 69 Old 03-06-2017, 07:10 PM Thread Starter
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I took it for a drive and it isn't getting better. It is back to 19.5+ LTFT after all the shit I have done to it.
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post #40 of 69 Old 03-06-2017, 07:37 PM
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https://www.motor.com/magazine-summa...-vs-fuel-trim/

Something to look at, could you have a leaky intake valve? Skim to about 2/3 down to see how that could cause a lean trim.

Does that engine have an EGR valve? If that's leaking exhaust into the intake it would cause an internal vacuum leak and push things lean but you wouldn't necessarily get it to show up by adding fuel around the outside of the engine.
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post #41 of 69 Old 03-06-2017, 07:40 PM Thread Starter
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No EGR on this model
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post #42 of 69 Old 03-19-2017, 12:57 PM Thread Starter
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I'm still at 19.5+ LTFT and the fuel pump is getting replaced in a week
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post #43 of 69 Old 03-22-2017, 08:58 PM Thread Starter
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Replacing the original fuel pump that had 188,000 miles on it resulted in the LTFT dropping from 19.5+ at idle to 14.1+. I still have an exhaust leak and a P0420 code that showed up. I'm guessing the crazy high LTFT I had caused the engine to dump more fuel than necessary into the engine and ruined the catalytic converter.

I am pulling the entire exhaust system and replacing the gaskets and hardware and will inspect the exhaust manifold for leaks or cracks. I will then put it back together and drive it for a few days. If the P0420 comes back I will replace the the downstream O2 sensor and/or the catalytic converter.
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post #44 of 69 Old 03-22-2017, 09:10 PM
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Getting there, getting closer, 14 is still higher than the +/-10 that's in the 'idea' range but it's better than it was.
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post #45 of 69 Old 03-23-2017, 04:40 AM
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What kind of scanner are you using

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