Dash speaker installation - Page 16 - Toyota Nation Forum : Toyota Car and Truck Forums
Camry 7th Generation (2012-2017) Toyota Camry Discussion for years: 2012-2017

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post #226 of 237 Old 03-17-2018, 04:16 PM
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man i wish i had an answer for that, i will let the legends answer this question as i am also looking forward for the answer its coincidence majority of guys on here have the same exact setup

(2X) COROLLA 2001,
COROLLA 1993,
HONDA CIVIC 2009,
CAMRY 2014 LE (REBUILT)
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post #227 of 237 Old 03-20-2018, 05:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eaglemaster View Post

so his recommendation was: powering the dash speakers with the radio instead of the alpine amp. You dont want the two sets being powered by the same channels on the amp because the Rockfords will handle way more power than those dash speakers.
I have over 20 years of experience in the car audio world.

The Camry has the dash and door speakers wired together in a passive crossover configuration with a capacitor as part of the dash speaker connector. This is to cut lower frequencies out of the audio signal.

You'll want to use the front channel of the amplifier to run the dash and door speakers as they're wired from the factory. The difference between the speakers won't have an effect on how it sounds...

The door speakers play more midbass frequencies due to how Toyota has them crossed over from the factory.

By separating the signal between the amp and head unit, you'd negate the crossover and have the door speakers playing hugger frequencies that the dash speakers playing lower frequencies than what you want them to be playing anyway.

Keep it wired as is and you'll be pleased with the sound.

If you had the luxury of an 8 channel electronic crossover that has bandpass capabilities, you could separate the dash speakers from the door speakers but you don't have that going on.

I hope this helps.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
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post #228 of 237 Old 03-20-2018, 05:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DM1975 View Post
I have over 20 years of experience in the car audio world.

The Camry has the dash and door speakers wired together in a passive crossover configuration with a capacitor as part of the dash speaker connector. This is to cut lower frequencies out of the audio signal.

You'll want to use the front channel of the amplifier to run the dash and door speakers as they're wired from the factory. The difference between the speakers won't have an effect on how it sounds...

The door speakers play more midbass frequencies due to how Toyota has them crossed over from the factory.

By separating the signal between the amp and head unit, you'd negate the crossover and have the door speakers playing hugger frequencies that the dash speakers playing lower frequencies than what you want them to be playing anyway.

Keep it wired as is and you'll be pleased with the sound.

If you had the luxury of an 8 channel electronic crossover that has bandpass capabilities, you could separate the dash speakers from the door speakers but you don't have that going on.

I hope this helps.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
Thanks you cleared out the confusion i will probably print this out and take it to the installer one last question, other here installed "100uF 100V Non-Polarized Capacitor" onto to the speakers for the dash what are your opinions on that?

Last edited by eaglemaster; 03-20-2018 at 05:23 PM.
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post #229 of 237 Old 03-20-2018, 05:23 PM
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Originally Posted by eaglemaster View Post
Thanks you cleared out the confusion i will probably print this out and take it to the installer one last question, other here installed "100uF 100V Non-Polarized Capacitor" for the dash speakers what are your opinions on that?
I bought some "bass blockers" to install at the dash speaker location to filter bass frequencies from them but upon removal found they already had capacitors installed so there's no need.

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post #230 of 237 Old 03-20-2018, 05:26 PM
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Originally Posted by DM1975 View Post
I bought some "bass blockers" to install at the dash speaker location to filter bass frequencies from them but upon removal found they already had capacitors installed so there's no need.

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niceee, bro where you located now i feel confident in hiring you to install my stuff the right way
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post #231 of 237 Old 03-20-2018, 05:28 PM
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Originally Posted by eaglemaster View Post
niceee, bro where you located now i feel confident in hiring you to install my stuff the right way
I'm in south bend, IN

I'd be more than happy to install your equipment.

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post #232 of 237 Old 03-20-2018, 05:30 PM
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I'm in south bend, IN

I'd be more than happy to install your equipment.

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Cool i am from Indianapolis Indiana, actually its my Gfs car she bought all the stuff and never got them installed i am about to shoot you an email
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post #233 of 237 Old 08-04-2018, 04:54 PM
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@Seth , thanks for your response to my other post.

I have spent a lot of time reading this thread and I have a couple questions regarding your post below to make sure I don't damage equipment I have installed or will be installing.

I have a 2015 Camry SE. I replaced the dash and door speakers with Kicker CSC 35 3.5" in the dash and 6 3/4" coax in the door. Each speaker has a 4 Ω rating. If I understand everything correctly the parallel wiring of the speakers (dash/door) result in 2 Ω showing at the H/U. By adding the 100 F capacitor to the positive terminal on the DS35 you were able to show 4 Ω at the H/U.

I don't believe my CSC 35's have a crossover (can't find any materials showing they do). Is it possible to add a second capacitor to the system so that the speakers I have will show 4 Ω at the H/U? If not, is there another option without replacing the speakers? I would like to use an amp that I have that is 4 Ω rated but not 2 Ω.

Thanks again.



Quote:
Originally Posted by sethr View Post
Okay, here's my take on the whole impedance/capacitor thing for the dash speakers.

Without real speaker part numbers we REALLY don't know brand and values of what Toyo put in. What we do know is the dash is a tweeter; and, it has a (low tolerance) 5.6 F capacitor. Mine actually metered out at 6.7 F.

Since these are tweeters only they are crossing over between 6100 and 7100Hz, depending on which value you use. Car audio places generally say 3200-4300Hz is the max for tweeters in the car. Not only that, but the better place would have been pillar mount (but there are airbags in it!) or up on the doors, right behind where the dash is when the door is closed. In any case we have what we have and the DS35/354s are sweet.

The cap on the tweeter also hides it from the head unit as far as impedance goes. Otherwise we would have two 4Ω speakers in parallel, then showing 2Ω to the head unit from the front. (The rears are not an issue.) What would have made sense with Toyo doing it this way is to just have put a 4Ω crossover on each side--under the dash or in the door--and move along. This was cheaper.

Some people said the DS35 sounded like crap and I would agree, compared to what mine do now. What I am going to show may SOUND complex, but it is not.

The DS35 is a 4Ω co-axial. The tweeter on THIS speaker has a crossover at 4000 per Kicker's specs. You can see the small cap in there. With a total power handling of 15W it doesn't have to be too big.


So that one is a little under 10 F. But the woofer part of the DS35 is still showing to the head unit as a 2Ω because it is parallel to the woofer in the door. (If that is what it is. It may be a a mid. Who knows? Not important now.)


The problem solved is putting a series capacitor BEFORE the woofer while not changing the tweeter crossover.


Without going into figuring it (stopping confusion LOL), putting a 100 microfarad capacitor on the positive lead of the DS35 solved it all.



And, yes, it's a little bigger because I used a 100V instead of the usual 50VDC version. That grey goo at the top is JB weld plastic weld to hold it. RTV would work as well.
The cap - goes into the speaker +, attach it to the basket, THEN solder the tab. Just less handling that way. The POS speaker wire gets soldered to the + side of the cap.


The new result is: 100 F to the woofer makes it pass somewhere from 350-400Hz and above. That's plenty for the dash. That 100F cap in series with the 10F cap already on the tweeter leaves it now at a little over 9F, crossing over at about 4200Hz. STILL better than the 7K Toyota gave us!


Now the DS35 is isolated from the head unit (impedance wise) and the front is 4Ω again.


Installing this without the 100F capacitor may be all right. But, installing the old speaker terminal WITH the old capacitor still on it drastically changes things. That would give the crap thing too.


The 5.6F Toyota cap on the old plug would wind up in series with the 10F cap already in the DS35(4)s. THAT combo nets 3.59F to the tweeter. That pair tries to force the woofer in at 7K and the tweeter in around 11K-12KHz. Kind of a waste of the speaker.


I put a DS in on one side (no extra cap; no factory plug) and left the other with the stock. It WAS louder than the other dash speaker--almost twice. So I am guessing things DID go to 2Ω on that side. Both DS in without the caps were even (with my head over the center console.)


Then I put the 100 F capacitor on one of the DSes. A difference again. SO now they're pretty sweet. Even with the stock Toyo door stuff still in there.


The rear deck speakers drastically suck, so they will be next, I think. No mods needed there or on the doors!!

Last edited by jed34; 08-04-2018 at 04:55 PM. Reason: had random "er" at in the sentence
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post #234 of 237 Old 08-04-2018, 05:54 PM
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First, are you saying there's NO cap on the 35s in the dash?

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post #235 of 237 Old 08-04-2018, 06:32 PM
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Yes. I did not install with a cap. I didn't remove the stock one and place on the 35's. And from all I can find about the speakers from kicker, there isn't one. I can remove and take photos of that helps. Thanks.
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post #236 of 237 Old 06-03-2019, 08:51 PM
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2017 Hybrid jumping in here, Bought some Kenwood Echelon 3 1/2 speakers to what I thought were sub quality dashs. Upon replacing them I took out these below.

Two issues have arisen. One the mid/tweeter I replaced is a nice looking unit. Not just a paper cone we've been accustomed to seeing. Two, the Echelons had their own bass blocking cap wired inline. I have not done any critiquing of them basically just swapped them out. Next step is to remove the center channel to see if it brightens up some.

I also bought a pair of Kenwood 6 3/4's for the doors, but if the dash speakers are any indication I may concentrate on the rear, using the 6 3/4's back there, if, a big if is that there is an unused right channel plug usused since it ships with just one in the rear, Ideally I'd to run a 10" dvc sub and use the Kenwood 6 3/4's with bass blockers on them in the deck all off the factory amp.

Trying to map this out in my head before actually pulling the seat out just to find out it won't work. Anyone upgrade the rears in a 17 LE greenedge?
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post #237 of 237 Old 06-05-2019, 11:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DM1975 View Post
I have over 20 years of experience in the car audio world.

The Camry has the dash and door speakers wired together in a passive crossover configuration with a capacitor as part of the dash speaker connector. This is to cut lower frequencies out of the audio signal.

You'll want to use the front channel of the amplifier to run the dash and door speakers as they're wired from the factory. The difference between the speakers won't have an effect on how it sounds...

The door speakers play more midbass frequencies due to how Toyota has them crossed over from the factory.

By separating the signal between the amp and head unit, you'd negate the crossover and have the door speakers playing hugger frequencies that the dash speakers playing lower frequencies than what you want them to be playing anyway.

Keep it wired as is and you'll be pleased with the sound.

If you had the luxury of an 8 channel electronic crossover that has bandpass capabilities, you could separate the dash speakers from the door speakers but you don't have that going on.

I hope this helps.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk



Where is this crossover located? What frequency and slope is it designed for? I hope it was a part of the OEM speaker (which mine are loooong in the garbage.)



I custom built my own door speakers (designing and building home and professional speakers for 35 years, as a hobby, so I thought I'd give a go for my Camry), and found the JL Audio C2-350 I had installed in the dash, years ago, WAY too present. I slapped a 200uF capacitor, along with a -3db Lpad. While I'm happy with the result, if there is another component in there somewhere, then the 3.5's may be experiencing some phasing issues. Considering it would actually be a 2nd order crossover, rather than the 1st order I was intending.



I have the feeling the capacitor for the 3.5's was mounted directly on them, if that was the case, then there isn't a problem.



Photo is attached and yes, I kept the stock wiring adapter. Those speakers and crossover components will NOT be going with the car, when I trade it and I don't want to have to muck around replacing a custom job. The losses inherent in those connectors do not worry me all that much.



Also, that is sound deadening you see. I just completed that project on Memorial Day Monday,when I removed the seats and applied it to the floor pan.
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