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Platinum Shift Customs
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Is it just me or does a 30hp gain w/ .6L gain seam like a really small gain for the increase in engine size?

Jeff
 

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GT-i Crew
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Engine displacement rarely has anything to do with power output or torque. There are too many factors into play when it comes to producing power like the valve angle, aperture, size, timing etc. so you can have a small engine making lots of power or have a big one making average (for its size) power
 

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Auto-Cross Addict
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If you were talking overbore, maybe. But engines are designed entirely different (like he stated above).

Displacement doesn't matter once you get into head design, cam design, and all the other factors that go into the build of an engine.
 

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Platinum Shift Customs
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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
just curious because with the new celica being rumored to have the 2.4 and the celica gts already running 180 after lift in the 1.8 i dont really see a benefit

Jeff
 

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400whp club here I come!!
HT MR2 Turbo
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Ya... with the extra displacement you are going to gain the torque that the Celica is missing. If they still put VVTL-i on it... that would be pretty sweet ass... but i'm sure they won't... they like to not make us happy. Like discontinuing all of the decent RWD cars :rolleyes:
 

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Platinum Shift Customs
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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
it only has 30lb/ft more torque - that could easily be gained with some simple cheap mods w/ the 1.8 - if they put the 'L' in the 2.4 that would be incredable - but you are right - what are the chances of that.

It would be interesting to see a GTS against a TC to see who would be faster in the 1/4, any ideas? my bet is the GTS because of the added boost at the top end.
 

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Hatch said:
it only has 30lb/ft more torque - that could easily be gained with some simple cheap mods w/ the 1.8
Cheap mods would never get you 30 ft/lbs of torque. And even if you did get near that, it wouldn't be low-end torque, which is what the 2.4 has.
 

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There is no substitute.
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Yeah it's 30lb/fr more torque but if you look at the dyno graph you're in for a suprise.
 

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EKam said:
Yeah it's 30lb/fr more torque but if you look at the dyno graph you're in for a suprise.
So are you going to post it or what?:rolleyes:
 

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There is no substitute.
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Well I haven't seen a 2AZ-FE dyno graph before, but I doubt it will be much differrent from the 1MZ-FE's since they both use FE heads and have relatively close displacements.

On the other hand 1ZZ's torque curve is flat across the rpm range and sits way below the hp line which keeps increasing as rpm goes higher.
 

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And what is the suprise we are in for then?

(And I hate that people keep saying lbs/ft. The term is foot pounds. ft/lbs)
 

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^
Actually, if you read any manual, it will say "ft. lbs." The slash just puts them together. Putting a "x" in there just makes it the equation form.
 

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Platinum Shift Customs
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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
So if they both use the FE head would you be able to retrofit the GE head on the 2.4?
 

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SmokingTiresV6:

That's the thing most people don't realize.

Cars are not legos. Just because it's got 30 more torque on the paper doesn't equal to x amount of seconds faster because that's just peak torque.

Or when both cars have same horsepower rating doesn't mean they're equally fast because weight of the car and gearing are other major factors.

It leads to comments such as this:
"Is it just me or does a 30hp gain w/ .6L gain seam like a really small gain for the increase in engine size?"

Fact is it's not that simple, nor does a GE head will slap onto an engine with FE head like Legos put together.

I'm no expert compare to guys like Wraith or Tony the Tiger, but I think everyone who consider themselves as a car enthusiast must understand the simple concepts.
 

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Platinum Shift Customs
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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
I do understand the simple concepts - however what iwas pointing out was that with an increase in engine size there should be more than a 30hp increase at the top end at lease imho

and the thing about the GE head fitting with the FE head - where that came from was that since the 1.8 FE from the celica is the same head on the 2.4 Cam i figured that the GE(lift) might be able to be retrofitted to the 2.4 (i know you would have to add the corresponding computer system) to gain 'lift' in the 2.4
 

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EKam said:
SmokingTiresV6:

That's the thing most people don't realize.

Cars are not legos. Just because it's got 30 more torque on the paper doesn't equal to x amount of seconds faster because that's just peak torque.

Or when both cars have same horsepower rating doesn't mean they're equally fast because weight of the car and gearing are other major factors.

It leads to comments such as this:
"Is it just me or does a 30hp gain w/ .6L gain seam like a really small gain for the increase in engine size?"

Fact is it's not that simple, nor does a GE head will slap onto an engine with FE head like Legos put together.

I'm no expert compare to guys like Wraith or Tony the Tiger, but I think everyone who consider themselves as a car enthusiast must understand the simple concepts.
Ok, I just wasn't entirely sure what you meant by your comment. I entirely understand what your getting at.

Hatch, 30hp is a big gain for an import engine with FE heads. Imports tend to produce less raw horsepower even with larger displacement. And it has been a trend that I have noticed, when companies do boring, they do not tune the engine for the power that someone else might when boring over the engine. When they increase displacement, they change the valve train setup. And this tends to put out less hoursepower, but be more economical for the size increase. It's just something they do.
 

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I get angry when Im sober
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Let's compare two different things to make more of a point here. A GSX-R Hayabusa has a 1.3L engine. It has something like 185 hp. My Camry has a 2.2L engine, it has about 125 hp. My engine is .9L bigger and has -60 hp more.
 

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Corolla
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Hayabusa engine revs higher, thats why it gets the power. Ever wonder why F1 cars are so damn powerful? 18k redline does the trick.:rolleyes: But then again the hayabusa engine has no torque either.
 
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