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Discussion Starter #301
Exhaust solution

I wasn't willing to gamble on another glasspack or chambered muffler for noise reduction, so I picked up a Thrush turbo muffler. I've read that the highest possible flowing muffler is what's wanted, but this 2.5" inlet/outlet turbo muffler is used on good sized V8s (often on dual exhaust and well over 350 cu.in engines), so I'm positive that it will be more than adequate for my needs. I now have three exhaust tips to sell, lol, and I will be buying the shortest 3" - 3.5" double-walled tip I can find on eBay. For now I will stick with a single tip, but down the road, I may upgrade to two tips. One thing I do like about the inlet and outlet placements of this muffler, is that I can get the tip much closer to the passenger side. Honestly, as nice as the Megan was, I didn't like the placement of the tip, which was approaching the center of the bumper.

This isn't the ideal exhaust situation from an aesthetics point of view and it's and aluminized muffler, not stainless steel. The car isn't driven in the winter, and stored inside the rest of the time, but the minute it starts showing any corrosion, it will be painted flat black. I may do that now anyway.

My neighbour is going to weld my muffler on tomorrow and when my tip arrives, I'll have him weld that on too.







Here is approximately what it will look like:

 

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Discussion Starter #302 (Edited)
More GIMP image manipulation while I wait for my new tip to arrive and wait to get my muffler welded on. Thoughts on the exhaust being recessed into the bumper cover?

281676
 

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Discussion Starter #303 (Edited)
Some Updates

Got my muffler installed today and decided not to recess it into the bumper as it was risky in terms of how it would look. The car sounds absolutely amazing. Quiet, deep and smooth at idle, but a great tone at higher rpms. There is absolutely no drone under any operating conditions.

Since Torque failed me in the A/FR and boost monitoring (AFR response times are way too slow and it won't show anything over vacuum), I'm having to completely redo my gauge setup. As mentioned, fortunately I had another driver's upper glove box cover in mint condition. My wife and kids are away for a few days, so I decided to be bad and do this on our kitchen table.

It looks very dirty and messy now, but will looked great when I'm done, fingers crossed. The AFR gauge is from a different series of Prosport gauges (the Premium Series) so there are differences. The ring color is a little darker and the gauge is taller. However, I think it will look great. My rationalization is that it's the most important gauge, so it will be a little more 'pronounced'. Then the other gauges (two on each side of the AFR gauge) will be symetrical. The face size, lettering and lighting color is precisely the same as all the other gauges.

My setup will be (from left to right): Oil Temp, Oil Pressure, AFR, Boost and Trans Temp.

Below is a pic in its present state. The gauges fit great and the gauge cups completely cover the holes. Each of the cups for the new gauges (AFR and Boost) will need to be profiled to fit the curvature of the glovebox, but I'm optimistic that I can get the to match seemlessly as the other 3 already installed gauges do.

Unfortunately, this is a LOT of work as the A-pillars and complete dash cover has to come off to attach the new glovebox cover. Plus, all of my wiring will have to be lengthened to move the existing gauges. Wiring and tubing has to be run for the AFR and boost and I'll have to drill a hole in the tunnel for the AFR O2 sensor wiring.



Yesterday, after a conversation with a gent at Booslang Manufacturing (the outfit that makes the Plug n' Play harnesses), I picked up a few 2.2K Ohm resistors. They put these in many of their Toyota harnesses on the crank and cam signal wires to combat noise that can cause studdering and possible idle problems associated with dirty signals and the AEM F/IC's sensitivity to such. Oddly enough I drove the car quite a bit today and neither would it studder (I have been manipulating the fuel table), nor would it stall or even buck at idle. I haven't installed the resistors yet. Maybe my ECU is starting to make its own adjustments.

Resistors

 

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Diehard Rams Fan
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Some Updates

Got my muffler installed today and decided not to recess it into the bumper as it was risky in terms of how it would look. The car sounds absolutely amazing. Quiet, deep and smooth at idle, but a great tone at higher rpms. There is absolutely no drone under any operating conditions.

Since Torque failed me in the A/FR and boost monitoring (AFR response times are way too slow and it won't show anything over vacuum), I'm having to completely redo my gauge setup. As mentioned, fortunately I had another driver's upper glove box cover in mint condition. My wife and kids are away for a few days, so I decided to be bad and do this on our kitchen table.

It looks very dirty and messy now, but will looked great when I'm done, fingers crossed. The AFR gauge is from a different series of Prosport gauges (the Premium Series) so there are differences. The ring color is a little darker and the gauge is taller. However, I think it will look great. My rationalization is that it's the most important gauge, so it will be a little more 'pronounced'. Then the other gauges (two on each side of the AFR gauge) will be symetrical. The face size, lettering and lighting color is precisely the same as all the other gauges.

My setup will be (from left to right): Oil Temp, Oil Pressure, AFR, Boost and Trans Temp.

Below is a pic in its present state. The gauges fit great and the gauge cups completely cover the holes. Each of the cups for the new gauges (AFR and Boost) will need to be profiled to fit the curvature of the glovebox, but I'm optimistic that I can get the to match seemlessly as the other 3 already installed gauges do.

Unfortunately, this is a LOT of work as the A-pillars and complete dash cover has to come off to attach the new glovebox cover. Plus, all of my wiring will have to be lengthened to move the existing gauges. Wiring and tubing has to be run for the AFR and boost and I'll have to drill a hole in the tunnel for the AFR O2 sensor wiring.



Yesterday, after a conversation with a gent at Booslang Manufacturing (the outfit that makes the Plug n' Play harnesses), I picked up a few 2.2K Ohm resistors. They put these in many of their Toyota harnesses on the crank and cam signal wires to combat noise that can cause studdering and possible idle problems associated with dirty signals and the AEM F/IC's sensitivity to such. Oddly enough I drove the car quite a bit today and neither would it studder (I have been manipulating the fuel table), nor would it stall or even buck at idle. I haven't installed the resistors yet. Maybe my ECU is starting to make its own adjustments.

Resistors

Greta to hear that your Yaris sounds great! I love the sound of my Corolla too, especially with the turbo spools but the exhaust tome is excellent to me. Sounds like yours is similar with zero drone. Can't wait to see the final dash layout. That should look epic with 5 gauges! I've been trying to figure out a way to get 2 more gauges in my Corolla too.
 

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Discussion Starter #305
Greta to hear that your Yaris sounds great! I love the sound of my Corolla too, especially with the turbo spools but the exhaust tome is excellent to me. Sounds like yours is similar with zero drone. Can't wait to see the final dash layout. That should look epic with 5 gauges! I've been trying to figure out a way to get 2 more gauges in my Corolla too.

Yeah, it sounds SO good!
 

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Discussion Starter #306 (Edited)
Gauges continued

I still have a lot of work to do to contour, level and angle the gauge cups, but this should give a sense of the final look.







5 Gauges cont'

Not thrilled with the look, but at least I will be able to accurately monitor all necessary parameters.

Just before install into dash



Fortunately, I didn't have to completely remove the dash cover. I could lift it enough to get at the screws behind.



Swapping springs over



Just a few pieces left to install: A pillars, center console etc. As mentioned in another post, I has to mount the gauges slightly left of center to get them all in. The back of the cover has an outward curve close to the center console that limits gauge placement somewhat. It would have placed the gauge at an odd angle. I have to crane my neck slightly to the right to see my oil temp gauge on the far left, but oil pressure, AFR and boost are prefectly in line.



 

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Discussion Starter #307 (Edited)
Gauges working

Just a few small details to finish up.

Hole drilled for wideband sensor. I had an old rear windshield wiper rubber grommet that worked great for the wideband sensor harness. Ill just pop it back out and apply a little rtv and smush it back in after the paint is fully cured. I painted the bare metal with primer and silver paint.



Running the two harnesses for the AFR gauge and the tubing for the boost gauge.



Harnesses and wideband control module. I have yet to permanently mount that. Getting crowded back there behind the glove box.



Beginning stages or wiring and 're-wiring'.



Day mode. The pics look horrendous. The gauges look some much more crisp, bright and uniform than my cell phone would have one believe. I still have to remove the clear plastic protectors on the gauges. Interestingly, the AFR gauge shows the same approximate readings that torque does at idle but it is so much faster responding, so much so that torque completely misses the subtle variations. I haven't driven it yet but I expect the differences between Torque and the wideband gauge will be significant.



I have to rotate a couple gauges to properly align them yet. Again the pics don't do the gauges justice. I'm sure the flash doesn't help. When I take pics without the flash, they come out very grainy.

 

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Diehard Rams Fan
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I had a hard time getting decent pics of my gauges too. They look so much better in person than any pic that I've taken.
 

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Discussion Starter #309
New exhaust tip installed

I like the look, but wish I'd had the exhaust guy tilt the muffler a little closer to the bumper cover so the tip would be a tad closer. Still looks good, though, I think. I'll get an outdoor shot from a bit farther away. It was dark out when I took these.









 

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I like. Maybe consider adding the Yaris S bumper trim at the bottom of the bumper. That should finish it nicely.
 

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Discussion Starter #311
I like. Maybe consider adding the Yaris S bumper trim at the bottom of the bumper. That should finish it nicely.
Thanks. There's a member on yarisworld that has 2006 - 2008 Yaris RS rear bumper covers with the nice little recess for the exhaust tip. I'd really like to get my hands on one of those. Only problem is that they're over $300.00 plus shipping and it would have to be repainted. It's just a little beyond what I'd be willing to do at this point.
 

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Kudos, nonetheless.

It's turning out to be a nice setup. I never could get used to the speedometer being in the center of the dash. Although, I only drove a Yaris one time and it was a rental.

The gauge setup is cool. Now you have something to look at in front of you. 8).
 

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Kudos, nonetheless.

It's turning out to be a nice setup. I never could get used to the speedometer being in the center of the dash. Although, I only drove a Yaris one time and it was a rental.

The gauge setup is cool. Now you have something to look at in front of you. 8).
I thought the same thing until I bought a used 2006 Scion xB. I don't really think twice now when I drive it. I've been thinking of adding some gauges above the steering wheel on that car too as it has a perfect shelf to do so.
 

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New exhaust tip installed

I like the look, but wish I'd had the exhaust guy tilt the muffler a little closer to the bumper cover so the tip would be a tad closer. Still looks good, though, I think. I'll get an outdoor shot from a bit farther away. It was dark out when I took these.









Looks good. Hard to say from the pics if it needs to be higher. Too bad that the muffler can't be tucked up a little more behind the bumper but I love the look of the tip.
 

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Discussion Starter #315
Looks good. Hard to say from the pics if it needs to be higher. Too bad that the muffler can't be tucked up a little more behind the bumper but I love the look of the tip.
For sure, a bit higher would be better. But the exhaust guy made a good point. It's less likely to melt the bumper. The tip does get a bit hot after a few boosts. That said, it could go up a bit. I wonder how hard it would be to heat the pipe behind the muffler and bend it up a touch.
 

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Discussion Starter #316
Tip Pics

I really have to get my "rule of thirds" down. Not much of a photographer. Lol.





 

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Discussion Starter #317
Partial Throttle Boost AFR

Hey Jim!

I also posted this in your build thread Jim, but can remove it if you'd prefer that I do.

I've been looking into a way to adjust my part throttle, low boost AFR. Because our cars are in closed loop until the throttle is basically maxed out, our AFRs stay close to stoich in partial boost. I've read wildly conflicting opinions on this. Some say that stoich AFR is fine under low boost partial throttle as there is less load on the engine and therefore less chance of detonation. Others say that it's a must to enrich the AFR under even minimal boost and low TPS. Basically at cruise - on a long hill for example, I see ~14.5 - 14.7 AFR at partial throttle and, say, anywhere from 1 - 4 psi if I'm accelerating under moderate throttle.

There is no configured O2 map in the tune that I am aware of. Although the F/IC has the capability, apparently, the O2 spoofing function didn't work consistently across the cars that were tested and because of this a completed map wasn't included, afaik. I don't know if your tuner actually did any O2 mapping and if you're seeing the same AFRs as I am at partial throttle, low boost. I would assume that the Booslang harness is actually wired to include the connection to the AFR sensor. Do you have an O2 map with any numbers in the cells other than zeros? If you are seeing what I'm seeing in terms of part throttle AFRs, you've been driving your car for a long time with seemingly no issues.

Any chance you could have someone capture a quick video of your 1) part throttle, low boost AFRs? If you can't video it, could you tell me what your seeing under these conditions? Also, 2) what AFR are you getting at cruise under low boost - say going up a hill with enough throttle to get you into mild boost?

My car seems to richen up nicely at close to max throttle - maybe slightly less that all the way to the floor. Then I get great AFRs on the order of 12ish, low boost, then 11.5 at full throttle and boost. I plan to pursue spoofing the O2 signal but it will be a steep learning curve.

Thanks!
 

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Partial Throttle Boost AFR

Hey Jim!

I also posted this in your build thread Jim, but can remove it if you'd prefer that I do.

I've been looking into a way to adjust my part throttle, low boost AFR. Because our cars are in closed loop until the throttle is basically maxed out, our AFRs stay close to stoich in partial boost. I've read wildly conflicting opinions on this. Some say that stoich AFR is fine under low boost partial throttle as there is less load on the engine and therefore less chance of detonation. Others say that it's a must to enrich the AFR under even minimal boost and low TPS. Basically at cruise - on a long hill for example, I see ~14.5 - 14.7 AFR at partial throttle and, say, anywhere from 1 - 4 psi if I'm accelerating under moderate throttle.

There is no configured O2 map in the tune that I am aware of. Although the F/IC has the capability, apparently, the O2 spoofing function didn't work consistently across the cars that were tested and because of this a completed map wasn't included, afaik. I don't know if your tuner actually did any O2 mapping and if you're seeing the same AFRs as I am at partial throttle, low boost. I would assume that the Booslang harness is actually wired to include the connection to the AFR sensor. Do you have an O2 map with any numbers in the cells other than zeros? If you are seeing what I'm seeing in terms of part throttle AFRs, you've been driving your car for a long time with seemingly no issues.

Any chance you could have someone capture a quick video of your 1) part throttle, low boost AFRs? If you can't video it, could you tell me what your seeing under these conditions? Also, 2) what AFR are you getting at cruise under low boost - say going up a hill with enough throttle to get you into mild boost?

My car seems to richen up nicely at close to max throttle - maybe slightly less that all the way to the floor. Then I get great AFRs on the order of 12ish, low boost, then 11.5 at full throttle and boost. I plan to pursue spoofing the O2 signal but it will be a steep learning curve.

Thanks!
When I went on my 3500 mile trip to California I tried to look at the AFR gauge in a variety of conditions. When going up hill on low boost I remember seeing a every so slight enrichment. As boost pressure rises it would be similar to what you've seen at 11-12ish range. From what you are describing we are seeing similar things.

I also have no idea exactly what Travis did when tuning it. He has a lot of experience with the AEM FIC but I didn't get any O2 maps with numbers in the cells. That's way above my knowledge level on this stuff. You seem to have a lot better understanding of that part being able to change things yourself. I figure that things must be dialed in right since it runs so well. :D
 

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Discussion Starter #319 (Edited)
When I went on my 3500 mile trip to California I tried to look at the AFR gauge in a variety of conditions. When going up hill on low boost I remember seeing a every so slight enrichment. As boost pressure rises it would be similar to what you've seen at 11-12ish range. From what you are describing we are seeing similar things.

I also have no idea exactly what Travis did when tuning it. He has a lot of experience with the AEM FIC but I didn't get any O2 maps with numbers in the cells. That's way above my knowledge level on this stuff. You seem to have a lot better understanding of that part being able to change things yourself. I figure that things must be dialed in right since it runs so well. :D
Thanks Jim. I suspected that might be the case. You've had no issues with your setup so I'm guessing that the partial throttle AFRs are fine for our cars. That said, Jesse did advise that I should not dwell in partial boost at closed loop conditions. I'm going to add a TPS gauge to Torque and see at what position it triggers open loop. I"ll also start digging into the throttle a little more under partial boost to trigger open loop and richer AFRs. If I find that I don't like the driving characteristics under those conditions, I'll look into doing something with either o2 spoofing or trying to get the car into open loop at a lower TPS level.

It would be interesting for us to compare AFRs under similar loads/boost levels and rpms. That way we could try to establish a baseline for anyone else that has the kit or decides to get this kit installed. Mind you there would be some variation due to slightly different setups and environmental conditions.

At any time, did anyone from TK.com, or your tuner, advise you not to maintain partial throttle boosting conditions with near stoich AFRs? I know that it takes a combination of certain conditions to induce detonation, but we are starting out with a fairly high compression ratio engine. I tend to over think things and maybe it's a road that you're not particularly interested in going down and I'd completely respect that. However, I think it could provide the community with some great info/knowledge. TK.com has sold a lot of these kits and I believe they have proved to work successfully. I personally have not heard of any engine failures due to detonation associated with the kit. I only found out about the recommendation for richer AFRs at partial boost by observing my own AFRs, wondering about them and then researching it.

Please let me know if you're interested in co-developing some data sets. I think it would be quite easy to compile our observations and maybe document some trends that might prove useful for others. As mentioned before, I'd totally get it if you just wanted to enjoy your car and not get involved with any of this.

Thanks!
 

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Thanks Jim. I suspected that might be the case. You've had no issues with your setup so I'm guessing that the partial throttle AFRs are fine for our cars. That said, Jesse did advise that I should not dwell in partial boost at closed loop conditions. I'm going to add a TPS gauge to Torque and see at what position it triggers open loop. I"ll also start digging into the throttle a little more under partial boost to trigger open loop and richer AFRs. If I find that I don't like the driving characteristics under those conditions, I'll look into doing something with either o2 spoofing or trying to get the car into open loop at a lower TPS level.

It would be interesting for us to compare AFRs under similar loads/boost levels and rpms. That way we could try to establish a baseline for anyone else that has the kit or decides to get this kit installed. Mind you there would be some variation due to slightly different setups and environmental conditions.

At any time, did anyone from TK.com, or your tuner, advise you not to maintain partial throttle boosting conditions with near stoich AFRs? I know that it takes a combination of certain conditions to induce detonation, but we are starting out with a fairly high compression ratio engine. I tend to over think things and maybe it's a road that you're not particularly interested in going down and I'd completely respect that. However, I think it could provide the community with some great info/knowledge. TK.com has sold a lot of these kits and I believe they have proved to work successfully. I personally have not heard of any engine failures due to detonation associated with the kit. I only found out about the recommendation for richer AFRs at partial boost by observing my own AFRs, wondering about them and then researching it.

Please let me know if you're interested in co-developing some data sets. I think it would be quite easy to compile our observations and maybe document some trends that might prove useful for others. As mentioned before, I'd totally get it if you just wanted to enjoy your car and not get involved with any of this.

Thanks!
I've never been told to avoid any partial throttle under boost as that is what most is as I rarely just floor it. I haven't had any issues with detonation.

I don't mind trying to help develop some data sets. I would just need you to help me learn and understand what and how I would do that. Interfacing a computer and getting the information and even learning what I'm seeing would be great to know.
 
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