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Is the market for these really that limited? I think Toyota could effectively kill of Ram, and make a good sized dent in Ford and GM's business. A 3/4 Toyota Sequoia would eat up the Ford Expedtion and probably make GM look twice at the Tahoe and Suburban.
 

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Toyota v Domestics
It's a fight that is always gonna happen. On that note, I have heard that the Toyota Tundra, which I always thought was a 1500, is actually more of a 2500. Tundra's are already designed in the US so I am sure Toyota know's what they are doing.
Toyota is the best in the world, domestics is the best in North (and South?) America.
 

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Tundra was supposed to be F150 killer and look where it's at. Outdated and outperformed by every truck maker in the US. With horrendous mpg people don't want to hear about.
For them, to challenge those who been in this business way before old man Toyoda started his loom business, it rather foolish. They make reliable people and family haulers. Let them be there.
 

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I don't want to turn this into a MPG thread :) , but I had a 2000 Silverado with the 5.3L v8 that replaced the aging 5.7L v8 that was really popular. On a good day, I was getting about 18MPG and on average I was doing 15 MPG.

I thought 19 years later, they would improve those engines to at least 22 or 24 MPG, 19 years is a long time. But nope. Now the diesels get 22-24 MPG, but not the half tons with v8's in them. I had 2 different supervisors with 2018 Ford V8 eco boost engines. Those are serious joke. Hey you have a truck for hauling stuff, but we are going to put a rope around its neck cutting off 4 cylinders so your MPG's go up defeating the purpose of the V8 to begin with. And it is even more funny at the stop lights..... Hey we are going to shut the engine off and then as soon as you press the gas pedal, we are going to burn your starter up starting the engine again so you can get moving again. I was trying not to laugh at him.
 

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Is the market for these really that limited? I think Toyota could effectively kill of Ram, and make a good sized dent in Ford and GM's business. A 3/4 Toyota Sequoia would eat up the Ford Expedtion and probably make GM look twice at the Tahoe and Suburban.
Sequoia is over 10 years old...

Ram (the brand) actually sells almost as many (perhaps more now) than the Chevy Silverado. The Tundra isn't threatening Detroit like urkroz said. Simple fact has been the loyalty of the majority of truck owners. IMO, it also helps when you can go to almost any small town in America and find a GM/Ford/FCA dealership that has been there for decades and family owned for generations, whereas a Toyota store (and any import) is mostly found in the big cities. With these kinds of buyers, Toyota will always be perceived to be foreign and won't make inroads with some of these buyers, regardless of the product good or bad.
 

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284173

284174

I'll also add, if you live in places like Detroit or around a car manufacturing plant owned by the Big 3, you will get s**t for buying an import brand. If you come from a family where someone worked for one of the Big 3, the expectation is that you "Buy American" because of the discount you'll get. The only weird exception might be my Corolla that was built at NUMMI, which was a UAW plant.

While the Camry had been the best selling car for quite some years (no longer obviously to do crossover shift), the F150 still is the best selling vehicle. So far, gas prices haven't done anything to change that yet.

 

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View attachment 284173
View attachment 284174
I'll also add, if you live in places like Detroit or around a car manufacturing plant owned by the Big 3, you will get s**t for buying an import brand. If you come from a family where someone worked for one of the Big 3, the expectation is that you "Buy American" because of the discount you'll get. The only weird exception might be my Corolla that was built at NUMMI, which was a UAW plant.

While the Camry had been the best selling car for quite some years (no longer obviously to do crossover shift), the F150 still is the best selling vehicle. So far, gas prices haven't done anything to change that yet.

Ford F-150 is the best selling because as soon as you bought it you sold it 💩. Where all 90s Fords at!?

Though I guess I am not too surprised about those. For me, I guess you could say that while they may only always stick with "American" cars I know that in 20 years my 08 Camry will still be running and everyone would've forgotten about the... Chevy Cruze... Ford 500... Dodge Stratus... because we know that the ONLY classic American cars are only from the 60s. 🤷‍♀️ Honestly I think they forgot about the 90s Chevy Impala and Caprice Classic which is a shame... Even the 80's Camaro to me is sorta just shunned... The Grand Prix is probably in the same bag, just forgotten.

I never knew they mad a Grand Prix Turbo that was "high tech". Then again they all broke down and rusted away...
 

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Discussion Starter #8
View attachment 284173
View attachment 284174
I'll also add, if you live in places like Detroit or around a car manufacturing plant owned by the Big 3, you will get s**t for buying an import brand. If you come from a family where someone worked for one of the Big 3, the expectation is that you "Buy American" because of the discount you'll get. The only weird exception might be my Corolla that was built at NUMMI, which was a UAW plant.

While the Camry had been the best selling car for quite some years (no longer obviously to do crossover shift), the F150 still is the best selling vehicle. So far, gas prices haven't done anything to change that yet.

Ford F-150 is the best selling because as soon as you bought it you sold it 💩. Where all 90s Fords at!?

Though I guess I am not too surprised about those. For me, I guess you could say that while they may only always stick with "American" cars I know that in 20 years my 08 Camry will still be running and everyone would've forgotten about the... Chevy Cruze... Ford 500... Dodge Stratus... because we know that the ONLY classic American cars are only from the 60s. 🤷‍♀️ Honestly I think they forgot about the 90s Chevy Impala and Caprice Classic which is a shame... Even the 80's Camaro to me is sorta just shunned... The Grand Prix is probably in the same bag, just forgotten.

I never knew they mad a Grand Prix Turbo that was "high tech". Then again they all broke down and rusted away...
I have family that works for GM at various plants in Michigan. I have always been a GM Fan. 1 time we bought a ford and it was the biggest problem car ever. Ever since going Toyota and Honda, we have never looked back.

I second the fact about ford trucks. The last place I worked, most of the guys had F150's as personal vehicles and they trade them in ever 1 or 2 years.That is how their numbers are so high for sales. How often do you see a 10 or 20 year old ford on the road? Not much. They fall apart like a yugo.

Now GM trucks, they you see them on the road for 20, even 30 years.

I have just grown tired of vehicles that are designed to fail at a certain time. GM Does that crap. The transmission in their 1/2 ton trucks are designed to go out between1 180,000-220,000 miles, while the allison transmission in their diesel trucks can go 1 million miles with regular fluid changes. Forcing customers to rebuild or replace a transmission because they are stupid is a major expense.

And then Toyota just does their wiring harnesses better. very few electrical issues.
 

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Ford F-150 is the best selling because as soon as you bought it you sold it 💩. Where all 90s Fords at!?

Though I guess I am not too surprised about those. For me, I guess you could say that while they may only always stick with "American" cars I know that in 20 years my 08 Camry will still be running and everyone would've forgotten about the... Chevy Cruze... Ford 500... Dodge Stratus... because we know that the ONLY classic American cars are only from the 60s. 🤷‍♀️ Honestly I think they forgot about the 90s Chevy Impala and Caprice Classic which is a shame... Even the 80's Camaro to me is sorta just shunned... The Grand Prix is probably in the same bag, just forgotten.

I never knew they mad a Grand Prix Turbo that was "high tech". Then again they all broke down and rusted away...
The 80's Camaro (Especially in IROC form) was cool to me when I was a kid. I fondly remember it because of a cartoon AND toys.
284208


The Impala SS and Buick GN one of my ATFs...to me, there are always exceptions to any rule. Yeah, most of the GMs of many eras were throwaways, unless they were special like these and are still worth $. I still wish my dad got a Taurus SHO with the Yamaha built engine.
 

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The 80's Camaro (Especially in IROC form) was cool to me when I was a kid. I fondly remember it because of a cartoon AND toys.
View attachment 284208

The Impala SS and Buick GN one of my ATFs...to me, there are always exceptions to any rule. Yeah, most of the GMs of many eras were throwaways, unless they were special like these and are still worth $. I still wish my dad got a Taurus SHO with the Yamaha built engine.
Yet they are seemingly forgotten...
I like that era of Camaro, there is a good look to them. Could care less about the late 90s era...
 

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So OT as well, a lot of the late 80s/90s kids that are enthusiasts now are doing their best to keep that nostalgia alive with the show Radwood. Its also a good place to see old Toyotas from that era as well.
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