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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
make that "64,000 electric Cinderella SE"

Toy 12-volt ride-in cars are recalled


Published: Feb. 19, 2008 at 9:33 AM

WASHINGTON, Feb. 19 (UPI) -- The U.S. Consumer Product Safety Commission announced a voluntary recall of approximately 64,000 Chinese-made battery operated electric vehicles.

The CPSC said wiring under the hood of the "Cinderella" 12-volt vehicles and in the battery compartment under the seat can short circuit, posing a safety hazard to children.

The importer -- Dumar International USA of Franklin, Mass. -- said it has received reports of 40 incidents of wires overheating.

The electric ride-in toy resembles the Pontiac Solstice. It is light blue and has Cinderella graphics on the front and sides. The wheels, steering wheel and two seats are pink and the white dashboard can contain an optional radio.

"Pontiac Solstice" is printed on the back of the car. "Walt Disney's Cinderella Special Edition" is printed on the license plate of the toy, designed for children 4 to 7 years old.

The cars were sold nationwide at Wal-Mart stores from August 2005 through February 2006 for about $200.

Consumers can contact Dumar International at 866-424-0500 for a free retrofit kit, including a new battery.
http://www.upi.com/NewsTrack/Business/2008/02/19/toy_12-volt_ride-in_cars_are_recalled/7105/

The recalls continue.

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Dang, yet another setback to GM's Volt project. . . . .now the prototypes are catching fire. . . .

Stupid GM. . . .

sincerely,
-fanfanfan

:D;)
 

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Is anyone else getting tired of all the Chinese toy recalls? Why are we still buying shit from there!!! Oh yea, that's right, because we no longer have american made alternatives, silly me :slap:

Next time you're in Wal-Mart, go to the back where they have the lay-a-way section and there should be a bulletin board filled with postings of recalled Chinese made toys :disappoin
 

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Dang, yet another setback to GM's Volt project. . . . .now the prototypes are catching fire. . . .

Stupid GM. . . .

sincerely,
-fanfanfan

:D;)

Well, I think it may at least mean the death of the planned Cinderella Edition Volt or CEV as it was codenamed. It also turned into a pumpkin at midnight.

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^^^^^^^

I whole heartedly agree!!!

Problem is, we Americans want to spend as little money as possible on goods and services, yet want a high wage when we get a job.

Until people connect the dots that high American wages equal higher priced American made goods/services, we are in for more of this type of stuff, and worse.

I seek out American made goods, and gladly pay the 2-10% difference just to know that I am supporting an American worker, given it’s an equally as good American made product. These are harder and harder to find as our manufacturing base leaves the US for lower rate workers in China, Korea, Taiwan, Mexico and others.

Americans need to realize, your desire for low cost goods requires these goods to be made somewhere other than here. US workers are too expensive, especially when it comes to manual labor (be it at a construction site or manufacturing plant).

Until we show, with our pocket books, American manufactures we are willing to absorb some of the cost of the expensive American workforce, things are not going to change any time soon.
 

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^^^^^^^

I whole heartedly agree!!!

Problem is, we Americans want to spend as little money as possible on goods and services, yet want a high wage when we get a job.

Until people connect the dots that high American wages equal higher priced American made goods/services, we are in for more of this type of stuff, and worse.

I seek out American made goods, and gladly pay the 2-10% difference just to know that I am supporting an American worker, given it’s an equally as good American made product. These are harder and harder to find as our manufacturing base leaves the US for lower rate workers in China, Korea, Taiwan, Mexico and others.

Americans need to realize, your desire for low cost goods requires these goods to be made somewhere other than here. US workers are too expensive, especially when it comes to manual labor (be it at a construction site or manufacturing plant).

Until we show, with our pocket books, American manufactures we are willing to absorb some of the cost of the expensive American workforce, things are not going to change any time soon.
It's the Invisible Hand at work. It's not going to change and the U.S. is still better off for it.

The net sum of positive societal impact from drastically reduced prices, far outweighs the net sum of problems caused by defects and loss of American jobs in manufacturing.

When Americans shop at Walmart, their actions confirm the above.

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When I restored my '67, almost every aftermarket part was made overseas.
 

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It's the Invisible Hand at work. It's not going to change and the U.S. is still better off for it.
The net sum of positive societal impact from drastically reduced prices, far outweighs the net sum of problems caused by defects and loss of American jobs in manufacturing.

When Americans shop at Walmart, their actions confirm the above.

Fan


Lower prices are a great thing, within reason and not to the detriment of our manufacturing base.

The real problem is when people go and stock up on this cheaply made foreign junk, and put it on their credit card. . . . .effectively screwing America twice. First when they bought the un-needed foreign junk (trade deficit), and second when they put it on their credit card (China owns a portion of, or all of, a substantial number of our financial institutions).

If Americans were even a little concerned with where things were made, and even a little responsible with their personal finances. . . .this would not be an issue. However, as it is, the average American CC debt is over $15,000 and most of that money was spent on junk they didn't even need (wide screen TVs, DVDs, 26" wheels, 5 TV's in their car, etc. . . . .). Most of this junk was made in China.

American spending is out of hand, and China et al are reaping the benefits of our "It's not what I can afford. . . .It’s what can I afford per month. . . ." mentality. All the while, Americans are getting laid off so that American companies can move shop overseas and feed our habit. . . . .

There has to be a balance, and we have not found it yet.

This does not even touch on the unfair trade policies, patent infringements, and currency manipulations China participates in.
 

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The net sum of positive societal impact from drastically reduced prices, far outweighs the net sum of problems caused by defects and loss of American jobs in manufacturing.


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You OBVIOUSLY do not work in mfg. This is total BS!!! What would become of this country without a mfg industry? Think about it Einstein.
 

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You OBVIOUSLY do not work in mfg. This is total BS!!! What would become of this country without a mfg industry? Think about it Einstein.
See, except for the "think about it Einstein" and "this is total BS", your post actually has an issue worth discussing. So I'll ignore the name calling and reply.

You can't force the market. You need to let it flow like a river as much as you can. To use an automotive analogy:

The Domestic 3 were forced to pay far more for the labour used to build it's cars because the Unions forced the labour market. If the Domestics were able to use the open labour market, their profitability would be much different over the life of their companies.

Trying to force the manufacturing market to stay in the U.S. would produce subsidized business (in policies or tariffs) plans that will eventually fail, because subsidies never last in perpetuity.

The work has to go where the labour is cheaper. I agree quality/nationalism/workforce are also factors (why Toyota builds in Texas for example). However for plastic garbage bins, China is the best choice for Americans.

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See, except for the "think about it Einstein" and "this is total BS", your post actually has an issue worth discussing. So I'll ignore the name calling and reply.
You can't force the market. You need to let it flow like a river as much as you can. To use an automotive analogy:

The Domestic 3 were forced to pay far more for the labour used to build it's cars because the Unions forced the labour market. If the Domestics were able to use the open labour market, their profitability would be much different over the life of their companies.

Trying to force the manufacturing market to stay in the U.S. would produce subsidized business (in policies or tariffs) plans that will eventually fail, because subsidies never last in perpetuity.

The work has to go where the labour is cheaper. I agree quality/nationalism/workforce are also factors (why Toyota builds in Texas for example). However for plastic garbage bins, China is the best choice for Americans.

Fan


This "flow like a river" analogy only works when both sides of the river are built on equal ground (trade policies). As soon as one bank (the US) is allowed to erode due to unfavorable government trade policies, patent infringement and currency manipulation, you have a recipe for disaster and an "overflow" of manufactures leaving NA and going to China (and others).

And don't fool yourself. We're not talking about plastic trash bins. We're talking about Boeing buying parts from China that used to be made in the US. We're talking about cheap knockoff car parts that undercut US (and Japan) made parts (while disregarding patents). We're talking about consumer and industrial electronics that were designed in the US, but are being built in China due to less stringent environmental regulations, and cheap labor. We're talking about steel, lumber, and other building materials that used to be made in the US, but now is being shipped to China to be refined/manufactured then sent back to us, cheaper than what it would cost to manufacture here (even with the round trip ticket across the worlds larges ocean). We are talking about the forced inclusion of Chinese car companies (government owned may I add) when GM, Ford, Toyota and others try to build cars in China. . . . . .

See, you're thinking trash cans and tinker toys. . . . we're talking about airplanes and electronics. This is the difference, and the reason your "flow like a river" analogy does not hold water, and frankly the reason we in manufacturing are so mad. The trade practices between the US and China are a one way street, and it all goes to China.

I blame greedy consumers that want cheap junk that they can't afford anyways. Quit buying shit you can't afford, and quit bitching about our $256.3 BILLION trade deficit (with China alone) when your house if full of the cheap, Chinese made junk.
 

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This "flow like a river" analogy only works when both sides of the river are built on equal ground

In nature and in Economics, there is never equal ground. That is why the river flows.

If you tried to level the ground you need the same equipment and the US doesn't have the same economic equipment to level the ground. Trying to level it is a fools errand. You are better off to find a new river to boat on.

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In nature and in Economics, there is never equal ground. That is why the river flows.
If you tried to level the ground you need the same equipment and the US doesn't have the same economic equipment to level the ground. Trying to level it is a fools errand. You are better off to find a new river to boat on.

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I don't get your logic.

Basically, your saying who cares that China manipulates its currency, who cares if China rips off intellectual and proprietary property, who cares if China violates human rights practices and environmental safeguards. . . . .Who cares about those issues so long as we in NA get cheap, Chinese made goods. . . . And oh, by the way, US. . . . .go find another river to boat on because this is how economics works. . . .never mind that "free trade" agreements are fundamental to the economic success of both countries who sign the agreement.

Point is, China is not practicing "free trade", and has not, ever. Until they get a hold of the patent stealing, corrupt, currency manipulating, lopsided policy making government, there will never be free trade between China and the rest of the world. They are all to happy to screw the rest of the world, and most Americans are helping. . . . .one junky product at a time.

You honestly can’t believe that the US (or Canada) should “find another river to sale on”. . . . .are you that detached, or are you just complacent?
 

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Basically, your saying who cares that China manipulates its currency, who cares if China rips off intellectual and proprietary property, who cares if China violates human rights practices and environmental safeguards. . . . .Who cares about those issues so long as we in NA get cheap, Chinese made goods. . . .
I'm telling you what, if the "greenies" over here really want to make an environmental difference, they are barking up the wrong side of the globe. Me thinks that if you dropped them over there next to a Chinese factory of your choice for just 5 minutes, they would be absolutely horrified by what is going on there.

In the end, it's just more proof that money ALWAYS wins out in the end. There was never any talk of conserving fuel for the environment's sake 15 years ago when gas was dirt cheap. Never much talk about the electric car being so necessary. It all comes down to money. "Saving the environment" is a thin veil for what our real, not-so-pretty priorities are.
 

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I don't get your logic.

Basically, your saying who cares that China manipulates its currency, who cares if China rips off intellectual and proprietary property, who cares if China violates human rights practices and environmental safeguards. . . . .Who cares about those issues so long as we in NA get cheap, Chinese made goods. . . . And oh, by the way, US. . . . .go find another river to boat on because this is how economics works. . . .never mind that "free trade" agreements are fundamental to the economic success of both countries who sign the agreement.
The market agrees with me and disagrees with you. That should tell you something.


You honestly can’t believe that the US (or Canada) should “find another river to sale on”. . . . .are you that detached, or are you just complacent?
No i just understand economics.

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I'm telling you what, if the "greenies" over here really want to make an environmental difference, they are barking up the wrong side of the globe. Me thinks that if you dropped them over there next to a Chinese factory of your choice for just 5 minutes, they would be absolutely horrified by what is going on there.

In the end, it's just more proof that money ALWAYS wins out in the end. There was never any talk of conserving fuel for the environment's sake 15 years ago when gas was dirt cheap. Never much talk about the electric car being so necessary. It all comes down to money. "Saving the environment" is a thin veil for what our real, not-so-pretty priorities are.
Yup.

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The market agrees with me and disagrees with you. That should tell you something.
yep, that your part of the problem.

Environment? Who cares!! Human Rights? Who cares!! Patent Infringement? Oh well!! Currency Manipulation? Not me!!! Now where is my Credit card so I can buy this wide screen, my 24's, and this furniture. . . . .

The market agrees with you because there are artificial factors that makes producing things in China attractive to manufactures. Does that mean the US (or Canada) should allow these things to happen, just because China is willing to manipulate trade policies? NO!!

Manufactures are going to make things as cheaply as they can, but we consumers need to punish those companies (financially) who exploit the environment, workers, intellectual property, and our own country. . . .and we do this with our purchasing power and taking these companies (and their products) off our shopping list.

You can continue to think this is "the market at work", but in reality, it is the exploitation of the Chinese people, the environment, intellectual property, and our economy.

No i just understand economics.
No, you understand your desire to purchase cheap goods, be-damned of the consequences it may have to your countries economy.
 

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No, you understand your desire to purchase cheap goods, be-damned of the consequences it may have to your countries economy.
Even if it was as cut and dried as you try to make my position sound, you proved my point exactly. The market agrees with me. That's economics at work.

If my country can't compete making airplanes, then it shouldn't be making airplanes. If the country making airplanes builds faulty ones, eventually, economics dictates they will fail and production will move elsewhere.

As i said before the economic benefits of Chinese production far out weigh the negatives. If they didn't, production would move elsewhere.

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