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That's almost exactly what I did last time. Awesome, glad it should work again. Thanks for the diagram.

About the cruise control. What's critical will be the brake switch, and the ECU. So if you had cruise before the swap, and didnt swap ECU's, you should still be able to use it. However, if the ECU thinks the car is in park...cruise might not work so well.
 

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Discussion Starter #43 (Edited)
She's alive!
The reason it didn't start before was because I had connected the wrong pins on the NSS connector. There are two separate 12v loops in the NSS:
1st one powers the PRND2L indicator in the dash, cruise control, and ECU
2nd one is purely for the starter, and is only connected in P and N - these are pins 5 and 5, which are the two big wide pins in the middle of the connector.
(if you look at Perkins' NSS cleaning thread, you can actually see the two sets of connectors inside)

Previously, I closed the first loop, which gave me the speedo cluster indicator but no starter action.

That is a temporary solution anyway. The way it is supposed to work is that starter relay cable is supposed to go through the clutch release switch, like in the wiring diagram below:


So, I will connect a cable the way it is supposed to be, and you will only be able to start the car with clutch released - good safety feature anyway.

As for cruise control, here is what the FSM has to say about it:
Placing the shift lever except D position (Park/Neutral position SW except D position). ”Signal is not input to TERMINAL 3
of the cruise control ECU” (A/T)
Depressing the clutch pedal (Cruise control clutch SW off). ”Signal input to TERMINAL 3 of the cruise control ECU” (M/T)
In other words, the other connector on the clutch pedal, the one that is activated when the clutch is engaged, goes directly to the cruise control ECU. Connect it, and Cruise Control should definitely work. This is again confirmed by another wiring diagram (see how pin 3 is fed by either the said switch of the "D" auto tranny connector):


As for my swap, all is good. The only problem I had is that I get a bit of crunch when engaging 3rd gear with engine revs above 2k or so even with clutch fully released - I think I need to adjust my clutch pedal to solve that problem.

Hope this helps anybody doing this worthy swap in the future. I will update the thread once I'm done enjoying my finished swap and complete all the wiring. :)
 

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Lots of tech in this thread. I like it.

Someday, I want to do this. Were is the best place to find a 5spd for the 4th gen? Obviously IN a 4th gen, but what else has a compatible trans... that is maybe easier to find? Celica? Lexus? I'd ask if the 5spd in my MR2 would work, but those are prolly rarer than 5spd Camrys...
 

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Discussion Starter #45 (Edited)
Ok, so another update: Cruise Control works!

Here's how. Because starter mechanism is independent of the PRND2L mechanism, I connected the NSS to set the car to "D" all the time, and my cruise control works just fine. The car also starts just fine, and I can take out the key (key lock mechanism is linked to auto gear shifter lock mechanism, not NSS switch on the tranny).
In short, to make starter work, connect pins 5 and 6 of NSS; to set it in "D" to make Cruise Control work, connect pins 2 and 10.

Again, this is a temporary solution for me as I'm planning to convert it properly, but it might work for you if you choose so.

On a side note: I adjusted my clutch, and I still get some crunching into 3rd gear. Any info on 3rd gear syncro replacement? Thanks in advance.
 

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it lives..and spins wheel
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congrats btw sounds awesome... welcome to the 5speed swap club lolol



i'm def not new to driving manual but not TOO familiar on working on them....how and what could you do for "clutch adjustment"
 

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Cam A Roo
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Ok, so another update: Cruise Control works!

Here's how. Because starter mechanism is independent of the PRND2L mechanism, I connected the NSS to set the car to "D" all the time, and my cruise control works just fine. The car also starts just fine, and I can take out the key (key lock mechanism is linked to auto gear shifter lock mechanism, not NSS switch on the tranny).
In short, to make starter work, connect pins 5 and 6 of NSS; to set it in "D" to make Cruise Control work, connect pins 2 and 10.

Again, this is a temporary solution for me as I'm planning to convert it properly, but it might work for you if you choose so.

On a side note: I adjusted my clutch, and I still get some crunching into 3rd gear. Any info on 3rd gear syncro replacement? Thanks in advance.
Perfect I figured the cruise would work with the nss at drive.

As far as the 4th gen for 4cyl you could use any trans from 92+ as the bell housing bolts line up the same. For the v6 you have to use an e53 or e153

Sent from my SCH-I535 using AutoGuide.Com Free App
 

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Which way/how far did you adjust the clutch? Did you put a new clutch and machined flywheel in during your swap? Did you install the clutch correctly?

If yes to those questions, 3rd gear syncro is pretty deep in there. You might as well have a full rebuild done. I dont remember, but either 2nd or 3rd had a crazy syncro on it and was a pain to replace when I did a rebuild on my S51 years ago.
 
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Discussion Starter #49 (Edited)
Which way/how far did you adjust the clutch? Did you put a new clutch and machined flywheel in during your swap? Did you install the clutch correctly?

If yes to those questions, 3rd gear syncro is pretty deep in there. You might as well have a full rebuild done. I dont remember, but either 2nd or 3rd had a crazy syncro on it and was a pain to replace when I did a rebuild on my S51 years ago.
I do not think there are any problems with clutch - the gear grinds when selected with clutch fully disengaged, and only when the vehicle speed is above 20mph or so. Under 20, it goes into 3rd nice and easy.

I adjusted the clutch pedal, the rod that goes from the pedal to the master cylinder. It was loose when the pedal was released, so I tightened it so that there is no slack - as soon as you start pressing the pedal it starts acting on the master cylinder.

I put in used clutch and flywheel. The clutch I pulled from the donor car was a TYC/Valeo one, but it looked nearly new - the factory print on the clutch material was still visible, and it had at least 1.1mm of depth to the rivets (FSM says minimum is 0.3mm). I did not resurface the flywheel, but I don't see any problems with it.
 

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Sounds like you may not be getting full engagement. But you would think that would be across all gears, especially first.
I would first try adjusting the push rod out a little farther by extending it. If that works, awesome.
If that doesn't work, I'd look into a rebuild.
 

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Discussion Starter #51
Sounds like you may not be getting full engagement. But you would think that would be across all gears, especially first.
I would first try adjusting the push rod out a little farther by extending it. If that works, awesome.
If that doesn't work, I'd look into a rebuild.
Can you elaborate on that?

If you're talking about the clutch, then I don't see how they are related - the gear grinds when selected at speeds over 20mph with clutch fully disengaged.
 

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I simply meant that when you have the clutch pedal on the floor, the clutch may not be fully disengaged, meaning it's still slipping a little bit which can cause grinding.

But since it's only in one gear, it's probably the syncro rings on gear 3.
 

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Discussion Starter #53
I see. Well, I do get a bit of a grind into 4th sometimes, but rarely enough that I'm willing to attribute it to my lack of stick shift driving experience. With 3rd, however, it is quite apparent, and grinding gets worse and worse the higher the speed above 20mph.

1st, 2nd, 5th, and reverse all work just fine. So yea, looks like I've got my next big project handed to me. Might as well put in that LSD while I'm at it. :)

I'll start another thread on M/T rebuild another day - it's out of scope for this one - and would appreciate your opinions on the topic there. Thanks!
 

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I helped my old shop teacher rebuild my trans a few years ago.

I would NOT suggest attempting this alone if you've never done it before. This is one of those things that it's worth paying someone else to take care of. As I said earlier, I think 3rd gear has a crazy syncro, it's three pieces and it's hard to get apart.
 

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Drain the fluid and take a magnet to it to see if you find any metal particles. I'm not sure the metals used in the syncro's so they might not be magnetic actually...
 

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Discussion Starter #56
Alright, so I went to install my M/T ECU today, only to get P1130 code within minutes... Turns out my M/T ECU is Cali emissions. My car is Fed. Fail on my part.

The question is, will the vehicle pass NY State Vehicle Inspection with error codes for shift solenoids? I read over the rules, and it is not a "safety" or "emissions" feature, so it should not matter. I will purchase a proper M/T ECU shortly, but it won't get here in time for me to pass inspection by the end of this month.

Anybody knows what kind of resistor I need to wire to the shift solenoids for the darn CEL to go off?
 

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Discussion Starter #57
UPDATE: as I was poaching around the integration relay looking for some wires to cut into for clutch safety switch and cruise control switch, I noticed that my car is already pre-wired for those two - had connectors hanging out there unplugged.

So, if you have a 4th Gen 4Cyl LE Camry, you are likely to already have those two connectors there, making your switch much easier. All you have to do is wire reverse switch and that's all.

As for inspection, No, you cannot pass NY State inspection with any check engine light, no matter what it's for. You need either M/T ECU, or some beefy resistors.
 

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im not sure if its the same on the 4th gen, but on the 3rd gen the automatic and manual transmission ECU's are different... You have to swap the under-dash harness because one of the plugs is different. the engine harness side plugs right in, but the underdash plug is different size

Also, you can get past the check engine light with resistors. Other people on this forum have made resistor blocks and they have worked.
 

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Discussion Starter #59
im not sure if its the same on the 4th gen, but on the 3rd gen the automatic and manual transmission ECU's are different... You have to swap the under-dash harness because one of the plugs is different. the engine harness side plugs right in, but the underdash plug is different size

Also, you can get past the check engine light with resistors. Other people on this forum have made resistor blocks and they have worked.
Ahh, I didn't know that. I can confirm that for Gen4, the pinout is the same between A/T and M/T cars without immobilizer. Even Cali M/T ECU fit my Fed A/T car and it started and drove fine, aside from P1130 code for emissions and my lt fuel trims automatically being set to 25.

Like I said, it seems that the dash wire harness is the same for M/T and A/T 4cyl Gen4 Camry's, at least for CE and LE trims. I just plugged in the spare connectors into clutch pedal switches, and my car functions exactly like an M/T car should.

I even get "D" light on the dash when clutch pedal is up, and "R" when I go into reverse. Cruise Control works with clutch pedal up, and stops as soon as clutch is pressed.

Overall, driving a stick is turning out to be quite a lot of fun and a great learning experience. I kinda want to go for a drive every evening now...

As for inspection, all the shops are telling me that I cannot pass with CEL on, so I've ordered myself an M/T ECU for $49 shipped from eBay to remedy the problem.

Hope this info helps anyone undertaking this adventure in the future.
 

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A couple questions slavie. 1 does the brake pedal just take pulling the pivot pin to swap in manual brake pedal? 2. Does the manual trans take a different mount than the auto trans?

Besides swapping the brake pedal, clutch pedal, master and slave cylinder, hard line and flex line for them, shifter, shifter cables, trans, flywheel and clutch oh and Mt ecu. Is there anything I'm missing?

Also more details about the double switch on the clutch- you mention some wires were already in the car? I want my cruise to work. Does the clutch just switch to ground? I looked at a gen 3 switch and there were 2 wire and one switch. Is this the same setup as the gen 4s?
 
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