[Sulu]

The American Council for an Energy-Efficient Economy, a Washington-based nonprofit group financed by foundations, electric utilities, and some federal agencies has released its list of the 12 greenest vehicles sold in the US in 2008 as well as the 12 "meanest" (meaning least environmentally friendly) vehicles.

The organization's methodology (available here) claims to consider fuel economy, pollution emissions, CO2 (which is really a proxy for fuel consumption, since consuming fuel releases CO2, no matter how sophisticated emission controls are), vehicle weight, and even its cradle-to-grave environmental impact. On that last point, I found it the #2 green choice on the list below to be surprising, since the widely-criticized CNW Marketing Research report accused the Prius of having a larger overall environmental footprint than some Hummer models.

The list of the top 12 greenest vehicles sold in the US are:

1. Honda Civic GX [powered by natural gas]
2. Toyota Prius
3. Honda Civic Hybrid
4. Smart ForTwo Convertible/Coupe
5. Toyota Yaris
6. Nissan Altima Hybrid
7. Toyota Corolla
8. Mini Cooper/Clubman
9. Ford Focus
10. Toyota Camry Hybrid
11. Honda Civic
12. Honda Fit

The 12 "meanest" vehicles for 2008 are:

1. Volkswagen Touareg V10 TDI
2. Bugatti Veyron V16
3. Mercedes-Benz GL320 CDI
4. Jeep Grand Cherokee Diesel
5. Mercedes-Benz R320 CDI
6. Lamborghini Murcielago/Murcielago Roadster V12
7. Mercedes-Benz ML320 CDI
8. Mercedes-Benz G55 AMG
9. Hummer H2
10. GMC Yukon 2500 6.0L
11. Bentley Azure V8
12. Bentley Arnage V8

The full article is available at: http://www.autosavant.net/2008/02/aceee-lists-greenest-and-meanest.html.

 

[EchoHoLiK]

Correction for the "meanest" list #2: the Bugatti Veyron has a W16


Is this a list of cars one can readily buy from anywhere? I mean, how accessible is it to purchase the Civic GX (natural gas powered), which is situated above the Prius? And shouldn't the Tesla electric car be on the list as well?

 

[eurohazard]

Is the Tesla being sold right now? I saw an article in Car and Driver, and there was literally blue duct tape affixed to the motor(?). I haven't had a chance to read the article yet, but the picture caught my eye. But no doubt it would fare well in the standings.

 

[EchoHoLiK]

Is the Tesla being sold right now? I saw an article in Car and Driver, and there was literally blue duct tape affixed to the motor(?). I haven't had a chance to read the article yet, but the picture caught my eye. But no doubt it would fare well in the standings.

I guess not yet, but will be very soon according to their website http://www.teslamotors.com/media/press_room.php?id=803

Series production of the Tesla Roadster is scheduled to begin March 17th, 2008.

But that brings back to my point about the natural gas powered Civic. Can a regular Joe actually buy one?

 

[eurohazard]

But that brings back to my point about the natural gas powered Civic. Can a regular Joe actually buy one?

I'm not really sure bro. I have checked them out on Honda's website before. But tonight I found something interesting. In the FAQ portion they mention a range of 170 miles, but in another section they mention a range of 225-250 miles. That's a big difference IMHO. They appear to cater to Californians mostly, but I didn't read anywhere about "Cal only". I have seen a few on the roads before, but I am pretty sure they were fleet, and I honestly don't remember where I saw them....I travel all the time. You can fill your tank with a device called "Phill" installed in your own house......seriously! lol

http://automobiles.honda.com/civic-gx/faq.aspx

 

[EchoHoLiK]

I'm not really sure bro. I have checked them out on Honda's website before. But tonight I found something interesting. In the FAQ portion they mention a range of 170 miles, but in another section they mention a range of 225-250 miles. That's a big difference IMHO. They appear to cater to Californians mostly, but I didn't read anywhere about "Cal only". I have seen a few on the roads before, but I am pretty sure they were fleet, and I honestly don't remember where I saw them....I travel all the time. You can fill your tank with a device called "Phill" installed in your own house......seriously! lol

http://automobiles.honda.com/civic-gx/faq.aspx

Thanks for the link, very interesting :thumbup:

And I'd initially presume that it's mainly a fleet-vehicle too. At least they didn't call the refilling device "Dr. Phill" :lol:

It'd be great if we see more natural gas vehicles (NGVs) in cities everywhere, where one can rent for cheap (per hour, per mile, per day, etc). And I'm not talking about just NGV buses, but cars (like a Smart) that one can rent, but using natural gas. The governments of North America fail to realize that some people would like to do their part to keep the pollution down, but not all of those people like bicycling or riding public transit, and most would like to drive.

 

[dakmor]

The Veyron has 2 V8s, one directly on top of the other.

 

[Sulu]

The Veyron has 2 V8s, one directly on top of the other.

I am not sure what you mean by "one directly on top of the other". Reading it literally would suggest that the car has 2 separate engines, stacked 2 storeys high. That would not be possible for a car as low as the Veyron.

It is correct that the Veyron's W16 engine is made up of 2 V8 engines joined together side-by-side (not one on top of the other) and sharing a common crankshaft, thus making it one engine. The 2 V8 engines are joined with a 72degree "V" between the 2 V8 engines. The 2 V8 engines are actually Volkswagen's own VR8 engines, narrow angle V8 engines consisting of 2 inline 4-cylinder engines joined together, with a very narrow 15degree "V" between the 2 banks of 4 cylinders. Two "V"s make a "W", so 2 V8s make a W16. The Volkswagen W16 engine is very compact, not much longer than an inline 4-cylinder engine, and only a bit wider than a normal V8 engine (which is usually 2 inline 4-cylinder engines joined together with a 90degree "V" between the 2 banks of cylinders).

 

[Lasse D]

It would be much more interesting to see the "greenest and the meanest" divided into car types.

So the Prius is cleaner than the Touareg?... ORLY!?

 

[eurohazard]

It would be much more interesting to see the "greenest and the meanest" divided into car types.

So the Prius is cleaner than the Touareg?... ORLY!?

lol, good point!

I wonder where the Big 3 diesel HD trucks rank?

 

[Sulu]

I wonder where the Big 3 diesel HD trucks rank?

They would rate among the meanest, according to the criteria mentioned in the article:

However, the worst are actually mostly European diesels and expensive, high performance vehicles. Although diesel-powered vehicles have 20-30% lower fuel consumption than comparable gasoline-powered vehicles, they also emit much more NOX and other pollutants than their gasoline-powered counterparts. Clean diesel technology such as BlueTec and Honda's solution are coming in the next year or two, so perhaps many of these diesels will fall off the list, but right now, ACEEE does not consider diesel engines to be clean enough for consideration among the greenest vehicles.

 

[eurohazard]

They would rate among the meanest, according to the criteria mentioned in the article:

I am assuming that too.....but how could a 6.6l Duramax, or a 6.7l Dodge diesel be cleaner than the heavily vaunted MB 320 CDI? I think they were omitted if I had to guess, but why?

 

[EchoHoLiK]

The Veyron has 2 V8s, one directly on top of the other.

I am not sure what you mean by "one directly on top of the other". Reading it literally would suggest that the car has 2 separate engines, stacked 2 storeys high. That would not be possible for a car as low as the Veyron.

It is correct that the Veyron's W16 engine is made up of 2 V8 engines joined together side-by-side (not one on top of the other) and sharing a common crankshaft, thus making it one engine. The 2 V8 engines are joined with a 72degree "V" between the 2 V8 engines. The 2 V8 engines are actually Volkswagen's own VR8 engines, narrow angle V8 engines consisting of 2 inline 4-cylinder engines joined together, with a very narrow 15degree "V" between the 2 banks of 4 cylinders. Two "V"s make a "W", so 2 V8s make a W16. The Volkswagen W16 engine is very compact, not much longer than an inline 4-cylinder engine, and only a bit wider than a normal V8 engine (which is usually 2 inline 4-cylinder engines joined together with a 90degree "V" between the 2 banks of cylinders).

:rofl2:


dakmor, please stick around, your intelligent comments have never failed to make me laugh (at you, not with you). :lol::thumbup::thumbup:

 

[dakmor]

perception is the same as opinion. the way i perceive it, it has 2 v8s, one on top of a another.

glass is neither half full or half empty.

 

[EchoHoLiK]

perception is the same as opinion. the way i perceive it, it has 2 v8s, one on top of a another.

Wow, seriously, you need to get your brain checked.

In your case, both your perception and opinion are wrong. Basically speaking, a W16 engine has two VR8 cylinder blocks side by side, NOT one on top of another. :disappoin

Honestly, if you really wanna argue that your perception (of what a W16 engine is) was correct, people will laugh at you.

glass is neither half full or half empty.

Is this your attempt to sound "deep"? :lol:

Would you happen to be wolverine10's long lost twin brother? :rofl2:

 

[tacosteelersman]

New York State has a very large fleet of the Civic natural gas cars a lot of the heavy highway inspectors drive them they are Clean but not cheap as they do not go very far on a tank full one of the inspectors told me they go approx 250 miles on a fill up

 

[100$ GUY]

Hummer H2 ninth place..... u are not that mean anymore!