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0 Posts
Easiest way to do this project would be to use under-side pictures of bother cars and literally see for yourself what is different between them.

I'm planning this project for my 90 GTS and to get around all of the different body/frame details I will just be custom fab'ing a couple different braces.. some that will run side to side in the rear and front and one that will do an X cross pattern between the front and the rear. They will all be made out of some very strong steel.. probably boxed steel or already rectangle steel. That will add all of the support needed.. but first I will need to research all the specific parts and get the best of everything.. I'd prefer to atleast have an LSD rear diff.. which came as an option on the celica's.. along with front LSD as well I believe.. so once I research all the parts and get them all in I can lay them out... and from all of my studying of the 2 different frames and spacing of things I can build all of my frame/body supports and be pretty damn confident they will fit in the first time.

Project isn't hard.. but just like any project it can become a very long drawn out process if you just decide to start ripping your car apart one day and not have all of the information and plans needed to continue the job smoothly.

Scoobie Killer
113 Posts
nammer said:
hey dude i dont knoe wat the ***k your talking about but they do sell lhd celica in the UK market....well you needa stop pulling stuff out of your ass and get the fact straight before u say anything...Tell me then: wat county does the most ralli racing?....
They do not sell LHD Celicas on the UK market, as I live in the UK I might know a little about it, the only LHD cars that come into this country are foreign imports which are privately imported by the purchaser and usually only cars that were never made as the RHD option, as the Celica was made in RHD why the hell would they make a LHD Celica for the UK, noone would buy it and they have no resale value, most UK rallies use RHD cars, the only reason LHD cars are used on the WRC is because the majority of the races are held in countries that drive on the right, they are specially supplied direct to the teams.
I`m glad to see you have such an elegant grasp of the English language:clap:

446 Posts
Yeah, I don't see why they would sell lhd cars in a country where its all rhd cars. Importing in a lhd and then selling it is the only way.

If anyone wants lhd gtfour's. I'm sure they'll have them in the Netherlands though.

Alltrack Wannabe
639 Posts
I know this thread is really old, but I wanted to add some information it is lacking.

allblackalltrac said:
For the noobs 1st gen AllTrac is 88-89' ST165, 2nd gen AllTrac is 90-93' ST185, 3rd gen AllTrac 94-97' ST205. All three came in either right or left hand drive.

Already mentioned is the fact that the AllTrac structurally was built like a tank, a shell within a shell.
Structurally it shares nothing with its NA FWD brother.
The front bulkhead has a larger transmission tunnel and set further back for a larger rack and pinion.
The center tunnel is wider to accept the transfer case and center drive shaft, mounting points for the sway bar are in different locations, same is for the rack and pinion.
The front floor plan is narrower cause of the wider tunnel, mounting locations for the seats are different; the seat belt lock is incorporated into the seat instead of bolted to the tunnel.
The rear floor plan is completely different in regards to the fuel tank, under the spare tire well back from under the rear seats. The spare tire well sits higher. The rear seats have the ABS controlling unit under them as well as the sub frame for the rear end assembly.
The rear bumper re-bar has mounting locations further apart.
There is significant added metal structurally bracing in the rear sections of the car i.e. all around the rear strut towers.
The brake, fuel lines and exhaust system is completely different.
^This is true for the 4th g Alltracs. Not the 5th or 6th [only GT4, NO Alltrac] gen.

The 5th gen Alltrac is structurally closer to it's fwd brother.
It had a different firewall [for the transfer case ouput shaft]
Different floorpan with a wider tunnel for the driveshaft. Seat mounts are the same.
Higher trunk floor, to fit the rearend/gas tank
Gas tank is in the rear instead of under the rear seats.
There are only 2 extra braces in the rear. They connect the sides of the strut towers to the brace between them.
Rear [only] brake lines, fuel lines, exhaust is different.
front sway bar.
COMPLETE rear suspension.
And alot of small, misc badges and stuff.
Steering rack is the same.
The abs actuator is in the engine bay, same place as the fwd [same exact part too]

It is NOT a "shell within a shell"
The entire chassis, minus the floorpan, is the same, except for the fenders [on the widebody only].

The above is from owning both, and tearing both down to the bare chassis.

I don't believe it's as hard as everyone says to do a fwd to awd conversion.
All that needs to be done chassis wise is the floorpan, bottom of firewall, and the lower section of the trunk walls.

Not to say it's simple, easy, or should be done.
I agree that it's idiotic to "create" something that's already been created.
But, it's not my time or money.

As far as the 6th gens, supposedly the floorpan is the same. I don't know, as I've never worked on either. If that's the case, it would be relatively easy to swap one of those.

91 Posts

Will this 2 bar map work with my 5sfte. I will be using a btm with an apexi safc II. Think it will work???????????
They all share a common pinout, although the connector keying may be different:
Pin A -- Ground
Pin B -- Sensor output
Pin C -- +5 volts

Manifold Pressure
(relative sea level / absolute)

2 Bar
MAP Output
14.31psi / 29.01psi
14.00psi / 28.70psi
13.00psi / 27.70psi
12.00psi / 26.70psi
11.00psi / 25.70psi
10.00psi / 24.70psi
9.00psi / 23.70psi
8.00psi / 22.70psi
6.00psi / 20.70psi
4.00psi / 18.70psi
2.00psi / 16.70psi
0.00psi / 14.70psi
5.00inHg / 12.24psi
10.00inHg / 9.78psi
15.00inHg / 7.33psi
20.00inHg / 4.87psi
25.00inHg / 2.41psi
29.10inHg / 0.40psi

4 Posts
"Maybe if you wanted to convert an Echo or MR2 to AWD status then yes that would be original"

that I would love to see! AWD MR2.

I've got an 87 GT-S that I'm thinking of swapping a 3SGTE into, never even considered putting in AWD too lol

421 Posts
Well, I've heard that before, so you'll have to forgive me for being skeptical. I'll believe it when I see it.
You can find a decent 165s in the $2000 neighborhood nowadays. IMO, a much better starting point than DIY AWD. Good luck on the project. Take a few pics of your progress.

8 Posts
Need to find a donor alltrac first. Dont like 165s. I enjoy my notchback. There are many people who talk about doing an alltrac conversion so I understand that. I will post pics once i start the project. For now I'll roll around spinning tires. :)

toyota enthusiast
93 mr2 turbo
36 Posts
an AWD mr2 would be almost impossible. the tranny is facing the wrong way. you'd have to somehow reverse the gears in the transfer case, then rotate the motor to face the other direction, then you'd have to make room for the driveline. i guess you could put a fuel cell in the frunk and drop the tank for room. the fabrication would be insane. you could just buy an audi TT and actually make it fast (lol) for cheaper. rwd owns in road racing anyway. awd is too heavy. rallying might work, but you could just build any other awd car.

i want a gt4 myself, but i will have to settle for a subaru :(. i don't like mitsu, even though my mr2 has a td06 20g.

4 Posts
Funny and inciteful

You guys are prolly gonna kill me if you even look at this post anymore but lemme get to it..

i got st184 90 celica gt-s 5sfe automatic

got a jdm engine with tranny and harness and ecu

extended harness myself and put a 91 GT 5spd tranny - i may rebuild soon - first want to drive it

the problem is i am not getting power to injectors.. i think its something to do with the clip going into the ECU that is still in my stock 5sfe from the ignition i spose..

The injectors from the gts get fed thru only 2 slost of the clip instead of 4? thats what im getting out of the books for this shit but i just wanna know if i am sposed to rewire the clip that goes into the ecu or move the pins in the ecu.. PLEASE help I WANNA DRIVE MY CELICA

i know i really shoulda bought a mofuckin all-trac and then plopped the JDM into and then modded but i was in a rush and just bought stuff lmao Either way its almost done! the engine is all in -- plzz any advice

64 Posts
so if you like sticky this reply.........

i got a mate of mine atm.....

who is in the middle of a V6 twin turbo, AWD conversion in his 184/GTS

very very interesting stuff......and not really that complicated..... but this guy knows what he's doing..........


1> remove fuel diff goes there....
2> make mounting point to chassis.
3> remove rear chassis and floor pan section....
4> bolt up diff cradle complete with diff and struts, axles etc etc......
5> re-inforce chassis....
6> weld in gt4/alltrac AWD rear floorpan.

no need for cutting or any mods to front half of the celica.... all celicas came off the same production line..... only difference between the gts and Alltrac.. is the rear floorpan....and fuel tank position.....

3sgte and gearbox bolts in..... there is already a tunnel there for the tailshaft... you will just need to move the exhaust system as it run down the tunnel.............

it is possible...... and given that the person interested has the skills to do it... or the money to throw at it.... its more then possible and has been done.... i have seen with my own eyes the process invloved......

i may decide to do this myself in coming years as i get used to the power and hunger for more traction from my V6 conversion.....but untill then it is hjust a thought........

WORTHIT?.....Jury is still out........

421 Posts is possible...... and given that the person interested has the skills to do it... or the money to throw at it.... its more then possible and has been done.........
WORTHIT?.....Jury is still out........
You said it yourself, but there comes a point where it's just a waste of time and money to re-create what came from the factory. It's different if you're attempting something unique or a one-off, like your friend is doing.

That's why you don't see many successful conversions. Even the big talkers who swear they can do it - they never post up again and just disappear.

Throw up some pics of your friend's conversion, I'm sure everyone would like to see :D
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