I went to turn on my headlights last night and total darkness. I guess both could go out at the exact same time but is there a fuse or other common point of failure? When I turn to the first click running lights and panel lights go on, normal, second click nothing, both main lights failed, when I push, or pull, the lever brights go on, normal. I am thinking there must be a headlights fuse to find or some other reason that would take both lights out at the same time.
both headlights out at the same time. Is there a fuse?
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There are separate fuses for each headlight (should be located either in the fuse panel behind the little door near your left knee, or in the fuse box under the hood): 15A Head (RH) and 15A Head (LH).
The three places where both headlight circuits are connected are:
1) the Headlight Relay (in the fuse box under the hood). If that has failed on your car both would go out.
2) the control switch (the lever on the steering column). It provides the ground path to close the circuit and illuminate the lights for high beam. If that switch has failed it'll make both go out.
3) the ground wire (white/black) from the low beams to ground. If that was broken both low beams would stop working but the high beams would still function as they go to ground through the column lever switch.
Since your high beams do work, that rules out 1, leaving possibly 2, a bad switch or 3 a broken ground wire for the low beam circuit.
Have you done any other electrical work on the car recently?
The three places where both headlight circuits are connected are:
1) the Headlight Relay (in the fuse box under the hood). If that has failed on your car both would go out.
2) the control switch (the lever on the steering column). It provides the ground path to close the circuit and illuminate the lights for high beam. If that switch has failed it'll make both go out.
3) the ground wire (white/black) from the low beams to ground. If that was broken both low beams would stop working but the high beams would still function as they go to ground through the column lever switch.
Since your high beams do work, that rules out 1, leaving possibly 2, a bad switch or 3 a broken ground wire for the low beam circuit.
Have you done any other electrical work on the car recently?
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You will not get better advice that this ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^.
1991 Corolla DLX 4AFE, 1994 Camry LE 5SFE, 1995 Avalon XLS 1MZFE, 2004 Sienna XLE/LTD, 2011 Camry LE
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It’s been quite awhile since I looked at the headlights schematics but I also seem to remember that the BCM (body control module) Integration relay was in the headlight circuit as well, for the automation of the headlights if your MY has that feature incorporated. The last Camry I repaired that had a headlight issue very similar to yours, it was the on/off switch on the steering wheel column. Norm356 is right on.
1991 Corolla DLX 4AFE, 1994 Camry LE 5SFE, 1995 Avalon XLS 1MZFE, 2004 Sienna XLE/LTD, 2011 Camry LE
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Try pulling headlight combination lever back to the high beam position and see if your headlights come on. Doing so provides an alternative path to ground. If it is a bad on/off switch the 92 MY repair would be much easier to replace the entire combination switch as the on/off switch is a PITA to replace by itself. This repair also involves the Airbag in the steering wheel and Clockspring removal and was a fairly intrusive repair so you might have to farm out this job if you’re not comfortable pulling all that apart. Hopefully it will be just the relay or something much easier to replace!
1991 Corolla DLX 4AFE, 1994 Camry LE 5SFE, 1995 Avalon XLS 1MZFE, 2004 Sienna XLE/LTD, 2011 Camry LE
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Ok just reread where you stated that pulling headlight switch lever to “flash” position turned your headlights on. Here’s some of my notes from this repair to help speed things along in your diagnostics if your headlight relays are missing their grounds.
NOTES:
{Troubleshooting indicates Combination switch not grounding headlight and taillight relays to enable lights. Integration relay appears good from t/s, but can't rule out yet. Body grounds appear ok, must tear apart steering wheel and access combination switch to diagnose fault(s). 'Flash' headlight position works ok (diff path for ground) and (Integration Relay) I13 pins 1 & 4 have continuity thru switch, but not to ground - BAD headlight on/off switch.}
The thing about this repair is that starting with the MY 1995/6 Toyota changed the whole combination switch assembly due to the fact that technicians had to tear apart the entire steering wheel column to make this repair. Later models simply required the removal of 2 screws holding in the entire combination switch and repair of the headlight switch was a 5-minute repair.
This is all FYI in case your troubleshooting leads you in the direction of the headlight switch being bad. Hopefully you have a good set of schematics for your MY, you’re going to need them to quickly diagnose this particular electrical issue. Good luck!
NOTES:
{Troubleshooting indicates Combination switch not grounding headlight and taillight relays to enable lights. Integration relay appears good from t/s, but can't rule out yet. Body grounds appear ok, must tear apart steering wheel and access combination switch to diagnose fault(s). 'Flash' headlight position works ok (diff path for ground) and (Integration Relay) I13 pins 1 & 4 have continuity thru switch, but not to ground - BAD headlight on/off switch.}
The thing about this repair is that starting with the MY 1995/6 Toyota changed the whole combination switch assembly due to the fact that technicians had to tear apart the entire steering wheel column to make this repair. Later models simply required the removal of 2 screws holding in the entire combination switch and repair of the headlight switch was a 5-minute repair.
This is all FYI in case your troubleshooting leads you in the direction of the headlight switch being bad. Hopefully you have a good set of schematics for your MY, you’re going to need them to quickly diagnose this particular electrical issue. Good luck!
So, are you saying that switching to high beams provides and alternate path to ground for the LOW beams? Then, if the lows STILL stay off when the high beams are selected it is NOT the low beam ground wire then then most likely the combo switch.? Is it also true to say that the headlight relay is one unit for BOTH the high and low beams? Then since I can get lights when selecting high it is NOT the relay.?
So, since I do get some lights with the high beams it is NOT a relay. If my lows are NOT coming on with my high beams it is not a ground wire. If both of these are true it must be the combo switch.?
Now I need to get out and check to see if all lights are on with high beams or just the highs. If it is just the highs the combo switch is the problem.
With the frame corrosion I just recently found to be bad I would do the ground or relay but probably not bother with the combo. I guess I can just put lows in the high slot for a while. As soon as used car prices return to normal this car is being scrapped so major work beyond oil and coolant changes is over.
So, since I do get some lights with the high beams it is NOT a relay. If my lows are NOT coming on with my high beams it is not a ground wire. If both of these are true it must be the combo switch.?
Now I need to get out and check to see if all lights are on with high beams or just the highs. If it is just the highs the combo switch is the problem.
With the frame corrosion I just recently found to be bad I would do the ground or relay but probably not bother with the combo. I guess I can just put lows in the high slot for a while. As soon as used car prices return to normal this car is being scrapped so major work beyond oil and coolant changes is over.
Check to see if the filament in bulbs are blown / damaged first....... it could be one bulb blew and you weren't aware till the other one blew.... lots of people don't realize this happens, then when the second goes, then you think both went out at the same time.
that would be the easiest check at the moment before tracking down an electrical / ground issue .
that would be the easiest check at the moment before tracking down an electrical / ground issue .
1991 Corolla DLX 4AFE, 1994 Camry LE 5SFE, 1995 Avalon XLS 1MZFE, 2004 Sienna XLE/LTD, 2011 Camry LE
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No, just the high beams. From your listed symptoms, I’m leaning in the direction of the headlight switch (combination switch) being bad. Those pin outs I listed above will tell you if you’re getting the relay grounds. If you’re getting both high beams only when you’re pulling back on the combination lever, then it’s most likely not two low beam bulb filaments that failed simultaneously. If you haven’t checked yet, your taillights will also be off with a bad headlight switch. Go around back and see if you have running/taillights when your headlight switch is ON.
Running lights and tail lights go on with the switch as normal so maybe they did go out at the exact same time. Every night I pull into a garage so I think I would have noticed one light out. I will swap some lights around tonight and find out. I just never thought they would go out at the same exact time and that I wouldn't see one out in the garage.
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1991 Corolla DLX 4AFE, 1994 Camry LE 5SFE, 1995 Avalon XLS 1MZFE, 2004 Sienna XLE/LTD, 2011 Camry LE
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If you would have tried the simple things first, would we have even seen this Toyota Nation thread? Most assume the simplest things have already been checked, before reaching out to the subject matter experts for a solution to their problem that doesn’t really exist… oh well.
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Since both bulbs went out at the same time, I would check the output of the alternator just to be safe. The regulator may be defective and it is now overcharging. Use a DVM to check output while the car is running. You shouldn't see more than 14.6 volts from the charging circuit.
Mike
Mike
Do you use anything other than standard bulbs?
Those Sylvania SilverStar's are a bit brighter / whiter... but they I believe burn hotter or something. I had one burn out, then the other burned-out literally a couple days later. They only lasted less than a year with lots of night driving.
Went back to standard bulbs... not a huge difference in visibility anyway. But cost and longevity are so much better on the standard el cheapo bulbs. Then went to LEDs. Very different story so far.
Those Sylvania SilverStar's are a bit brighter / whiter... but they I believe burn hotter or something. I had one burn out, then the other burned-out literally a couple days later. They only lasted less than a year with lots of night driving.
Went back to standard bulbs... not a huge difference in visibility anyway. But cost and longevity are so much better on the standard el cheapo bulbs. Then went to LEDs. Very different story so far.
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