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After watching the car care nut video I'm not all that sure about that with the new oil pump design
AMD said that lubrication system is calibrated for 0W-16 oil. Now my question is it possible that North American cars are calibrated more strictly than Australian cars?
 

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'21 Corolla LE - Celestite (1K3) / Black (FB20)
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AMD said that lubrication system is calibrated for 0W-16 oil. Now my question is it possible that North American cars are calibrated more strictly than Australian cars?
Absolutely no way.

Think about the cost. You are talking about different internals and a different program on the ECU for two different markets. No manufacturer would do that.
 

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Discussion Starter · #83 ·
Absolutely no way.

Think about the cost. You are talking about different internals and a different program on the ECU for two different markets. No manufacturer would do that.
I'm willing to bet all the people saying you can and should use higher viscosity then 0w16 or 0w20 don't actually have one of these new Toyota motors. At this point I'm listening to AMD
 

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'21 Corolla Apex SE - 6mt 👽
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different program on the ECU for two different markets. No manufacturer would do that.
Yes they would use diff tuning / program for ecu in different markets... different countries use different fuels and require different tuning on same engine.

If you look into the variants of fuel used on the m20a in different markets you will see how the hp changes as well. (Diff fuels will also cause different temperatures)
 

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Yes they would use diff tuning / program for ecu in different markets... different countries use different fuels and require different tuning on same engine.

If you look into the variants of fuel used on the m20a in different markets you will see how the hp changes as well. (Diff fuels will also cause different temperatures)
The code can take into account how good of a fuel is going into the engine and adjust A/F ratios accordingly. We are talking about a new program and parts that regulate oil pressure.

Do you know what the most efficient ratio is? Do you know how that changes in relation to EtOH in the fuel? Do you know this is most likely the source of the variation?
 

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The code can take into account how good of a fuel is going into the engine and adjust A/F ratios accordingly. We are talking about a new program and parts that regulate oil pressure.

Do you know what the most efficient ratio is? Do you know how that changes in relation to EtOH in the fuel? Do you know this is most likely the source of the variation?
Yes mild timing advances and retard for fuel quality, this is not that.

Same ecu in different regions do in fact use different tunes, which is why tuning modules are region specific for ecus...
 

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This isn't about tuning, this is about how the ECU controlled oil pump controls oil pressure and the solenoids that activate or are shut off to redirect flow. You know, a vital component of engine health.
 

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johdirt784 said:
You are talking about a different program on the ECU for two different markets. No manufacturer would do that.
 

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johdirt784 said:
You are talking about a different program on the ECU for two different markets. No manufacturer would do that.
Exactly!!!!!!!!!! They aren't going to do that, it would cost entirely too much money.

The oil that will work in Australia will work just as well in the US as long as you are within the specified temperature ranges.
 

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Stop worrying about viscosity. Keep replacing it regularly, and be sure to keep it topped off. There is a difference of 1.6 US quart (1.5 liter) between Full and Low on the dipstick... As stated in your owner's manual;

-Engine oil may need to be refilled between service intervals.

-To prevent serious engine damage, check oil level on a regular basis.
 

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Stop worrying about viscosity. Keep replacing it regularly, and be sure to keep it topped off. There is a difference of 1.6 US quart (1.5 liter) between Full and Low on the dipstick... As stated in your owner's manual;

-Engine oil may need to be refilled between service intervals.

-To prevent serious engine damage, check oil level on a regular basis.
The language in the US manual - "You need to use 0W-16 and if you can't find 0W-16, 0W-20 is fine, but switch back immediately" is required by the EPA. That's why they only give you one option.
 

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Discussion Starter · #93 ·
Another great concern to be aware about is 0W-16 oil's tendency to absorb much moisture in sub-freezing temperatures, which can then frost up and clog the oil filter...No such problems with 0W-20 which also provides better protection under extreme heat or extreme frigid conditions.

Cold Start Oil Pressure Issue's | Toyota Nation Forum
Strange since they act the same in cold temps being 0w
 

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Strange since they act the same in cold temps being 0w
There are very large differences in Kinematic Viscosity @ 40ºC, pour point temp, CCS Viscosity ratings, etc, between, 0W-16, 0W-20, 0W-30, 0W-40... You need to focus on its larger number, which is viscosity at operating temp (100ºC). You can then look into each oil's specific data, which also varies between different brands and versions.

The expressed concern over 0W-16 is about its undesired hygroscopic ability in sub-freezing temps.
 

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Yes, he is a master tech, but why the hell would Toyota put any other oil in their manual besides 0W-16 in other countries if it would cause catastrophic failure or the lubrication system to not function properly? They would 100% put a disclaimer on their owner's manual - "This engine requires 0W-16 or there is a risk of severe damage and/or engine failure."

It's the same engine!
Why? Cause not all engines be built the same, they have different production methods and tolerances for the different areas. Toyota quite heavily has modified production depending on the location the vehicle is being sold in. A russian spec car is not the same as a Canada/US spec one.

Plus again, oil lubrication works primarily on hydrodynamic lubrication in an engine.

As for viscosity, it's operating temperature effective viscosity will always be less than cold viscosity, so a 0w40, the 40 will be more fluid than when at 0. A 16 just has a bit more flow than the 40, but not by much since the differences is not a lot. But if still running higher than you can actually get improper lubrication all the same since the resistance to flow can reduce lubrication effectiveness. It is why you don't just bag on a cold engine because while cold, the engine isn't getting proper lubrication.

Plus the oil doesn't take heat as well and breaks down quicker when higher viscosity. So sure, you can run thicker, just change it a lot more.

But mainly, thicker oil is more resistant to flow, and modern engines to be able to run thinner oils run much tighter tolerances. And so running thicker means wear because you don't get proper film formation due to the tight tolerances. Running a 20 instead of 16 probably is insignificant, but running more will most likely cause pre-mature wear. Who needs them bearings, just wear em out a bit and then it won't be a problem!

Edit: As for moisture... That is a misnomer. The moisture issue isn't the oil, it is the wider interval oil changes people run more than anything, plus usage of ethanol gas and fuel/oil startup contamination putting the ethanol to begin buildup in the oil. The 0W is the unmodified oil weight. A 0W 16 and a 0W40 are pretty much the same thing. It is the additives that cause the high temp viscosity changes. It isn't additives to thin it up when cold.
 

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Why? Cause not all engines be built the same, they have different production methods and tolerances for the different areas. Toyota quite heavily has modified production depending on the location the vehicle is being sold in. A russian spec car is not the same as a Canada/US spec one.

Plus again, oil lubrication works primarily on hydrodynamic lubrication in an engine.

As for viscosity, it's operating temperature effective viscosity will always be less than cold viscosity, so a 0w40, the 40 will be more fluid than when at 0. A 16 just has a bit more flow than the 40, but not by much since the differences is not a lot. But if still running higher than you can actually get improper lubrication all the same since the resistance to flow can reduce lubrication effectiveness. It is why you don't just bag on a cold engine because while cold, the engine isn't getting proper lubrication.

Plus the oil doesn't take heat as well and breaks down quicker when higher viscosity. So sure, you can run thicker, just change it a lot more.

But mainly, thicker oil is more resistant to flow, and modern engines to be able to run thinner oils run much tighter tolerances. And so running thicker means wear because you don't get proper film formation due to the tight tolerances. Running a 20 instead of 16 probably is insignificant, but running more will most likely cause pre-mature wear. Who needs them bearings, just wear em out a bit and then it won't be a problem!

Edit: As for moisture... That is a misnomer. The moisture issue isn't the oil, it is the wider interval oil changes people run more than anything, plus usage of ethanol gas and fuel/oil startup contamination putting the ethanol to begin buildup in the oil. The 0W is the unmodified oil weight. A 0W 16 and a 0W40 are pretty much the same thing. It is the additives that cause the high temp viscosity changes. It isn't additives to thin it up when cold.
:rolleyes: Vaporisor has lost his bearings and is just blowing hot air again... What else is new?

I was able to get some of this cool new Mobil™ Full Synthetic 0W-20 instead today. 5 US quarts for $23 at Walmart.
337627

337628
 

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It's fluid dynamics and hydraulic principles. Shear is a factor, but so is flow and pressure. Higher viscosity means lower flow of a given pressure. Higher viscosity means more heat and the oil degrades faster. The pump and clearances are designed for the optimal oil. Yes, others can "work" but they won't work as well. the alternatives for heavier duty are under the assumption that you are running hotter, therefore the 20 will have a lower overall operating viscosity.

Edit: Also mobil 1 has been pretty crappy oil for a while. Gotta love that "lasts longer" (up to 7500 miles vs the 5000 mi of conventional mobil oil) so grats. Use that, and have to change your oil more frequently than if you used the 0w16. Best read the fine print on the jug.
 

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I work at a small business. I will bet a million dollars that Toyota would not change the production tolerances of the same engine (we are talking about the M20A-FKS in the US vs say Australia) in different parts of the world. They invest R&D dollars in X, figure out the tolerances, locate suppliers, and make sure that an engine built in Japan, Russia, the US, and in Taiwan have tolerances within specifications as defined.

It would become an absolute logistical nightmare and would also increase costs (different suppliers, supply chains, etc.) hurting their profit margins if they had to define different criteria in different countries.

You are correct, the Russian Corolla has the 1ZR engine in it, but that's old tech. They aren't running a modified M20A-FKS there.
 

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Edit: Also mobil 1 has been pretty crappy oil for a while. Gotta love that "lasts longer" (up to 7500 miles vs the 5000 mi of conventional mobil oil) so grats. Use that, and have to change your oil more frequently than if you used the 0w16. Best read the fine print on the jug.
Kind of funny that you say that. TGMO is made by Mobil 1 and a lot dealerships offer Mobil 1 as a replacement for TGMO.
 

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Well I gave up doing the odd old change years ago. My back can't do that kind of stuff anymore. So there's no option at Toyota where I can ask for 0w20 or 0w30 or 0w40??
Why not use an independent repair shop? For example, I use a shop that will put in my oil and preferred filter at a reasonable price.
 
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