Toyota Nation Forum banner

1 - 20 of 63 Posts

·
Registered
1990 Toyota Camry LE
Joined
·
210 Posts
Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
A few questions I have about the swap are the ecu for the manual, is it the computer behind the climate control and radio? Ive read a few threads saying there's a second ecu for the tranny but I'm assuming it's only on the auto for the ect? So the only thing you'd need from a manual is the ECU.

Also regarding wiring, I'm a bit confused on the difference between an 89 m/t, and a 90 auto. Are there any things I should look for besides reverse lights?

I was able to grab the ECU and the shifter from an 89 manual (ran out of time to grab other stuff, but I figure I can find most of it online), and I plan to eventually convert my 90 auto. Just wondering if there's any updated information besides whats out on the forums already.

Also the options for transmission have varied, someone on the Facebook group recommended an s54(?) Out of a Celica for the different gearing, but wasn't sure what my best route was.

Aside from that what should I grab from the car while I can? Shifter cables? This is going to be a very slow project so not too concerned. But what's generally hard to find online?

Thanks for any help!
 

·
Toyota Collector
Joined
·
11,821 Posts
You need:

shifter and boot
shift cables
front and rear mounts
transmission and flywheel
ECU
brake and clutch pedals
clutch master and slave cylinder, hydraulic lines
engine harness

You can use the auto engine harness but I don't recommend this, yes the transmission ECU is a separate computer it is behind and upward of the glove box. Oh the transmission you can use any that were mated to an S engine FWD of course.
 

·
Registered
1990 Toyota Camry LE
Joined
·
210 Posts
Discussion Starter #3 (Edited)
You need:

shifter and boot
shift cables
front and rear mounts
transmission and flywheel
ECU
brake and clutch pedals
clutch master and slave cylinder, hydraulic lines
engine harness

You can use the auto engine harness but I don't recommend this, yes the transmission ECU is a separate computer it is behind and upward of the glove box. Oh the transmission you can use any that were mated to an S engine FWD of course.
Hmm I can get the shift cables and possibly the engine harness, but I'm budgeting out my buys out. Is the tranny ecu only on the auto? There was nothing in the glovebox for the manual.

What are difficulties of using the auto harness? If it's only a small few things to do I don't mind using it. I am not 100% sure how to pull off the dash and take the harness out (without breaking anything) and if the auto harness will work with minor changes id prefer to go that route currently. Not sure what I should look for, some of the info on the forums is a little vague.

Thanks for the help, any info makes budgeting easier haha.
 

·
Toyota Collector
Joined
·
11,821 Posts
Is the tranny ecu only on the auto?
Yes.
What are difficulties of using the auto harness?
The engine ECU communicates with the tranny ECU so engine drivability could be off. It's just much cleaner to use the proper harness.
If it's only a small few things to do I don't mind using it. I am not 100% sure how to pull off the dash and take the harness out (without breaking anything) and if the auto harness will work with minor changes id prefer to go that route currently. Not sure what I should look for, some of the info on the forums is a little vague.

Thanks for the help, any info makes budgeting easier haha.
Pulling the harness out of the car is about the easiest thing to do compared to the rest of the swap remember you'll be drilling and cutting holes in the firewall.
 

·
Registered
1990 Toyota Camry LE
Joined
·
210 Posts
Discussion Starter #5 (Edited)
Is the tranny ecu only on the auto?
Yes.
What are difficulties of using the auto harness?
The engine ECU communicates with the tranny ECU so engine drivability could be off. It's just much cleaner to use the proper harness.
If it's only a small few things to do I don't mind using it. I am not 100% sure how to pull off the dash and take the harness out (without breaking anything) and if the auto harness will work with minor changes id prefer to go that route currently. Not sure what I should look for, some of the info on the forums is a little vague.

Thanks for the help, any info makes budgeting easier haha.
Pulling the harness out of the car is about the easiest thing to do compared to the rest of the swap remember you'll be drilling and cutting holes in the firewall.
Hmm, ok I'll try and grab the harness too then. Is the dash held in by glue and a few screws? I was pressed for time last time (went near closing) so I couldn't get the dash off.
Not 100% sure where all the harness wires are routed as well.
I'm moving out of my comfort zone with this project haha.

Is it worth pulling the master cylinder as well? I know that it's available online as a reman, not sure what everyone's experience with those are though.

As for the holes I'm mostly worried about the shifter cables hole. But, I'm gonna measure stuff out at the yard for reference probably.

Thanks
 

·
Registered
1990 Toyota Camry LE
Joined
·
210 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
So just this harness right, nothing from the harness for the dash etc? This was a bit difficult to get out since the car was oily and everything was frozen lol! Was connected to ecu, fusebox, and various things on the motor.

Also got shift cables and clutch pedal. Do they sell the master cylinder and lines online or at any Toyota places?
 

Attachments

·
Toyota Collector
Joined
·
11,821 Posts
You also need the brake pedal. The cluster harness does not need to be changed the manual engine harness will plug into your car depending on the year of the donor car. On removing dash components the lower portions (and center console) have to come off anyway to make space for cutting/drilling. Removing interior bits is 50x easier than the rest of the job!

You need all the clutch hydraulic lines Toyota doesn't have this stuff anymore the master cylinder is available new
https://www.ebay.com/itm/272689637890
The slave cylinder is super easy to rebuild a 2 minute job.
 

·
Registered
1990 Toyota Camry LE
Joined
·
210 Posts
Discussion Starter #8 (Edited)
You also need the brake pedal. The cluster harness does not need to be changed the manual engine harness will plug into your car depending on the year of the donor car. On removing dash components the lower portions (and center console) have to come off anyway to make space for cutting/drilling. Removing interior bits is 50x easier than the rest of the job!

You need all the clutch hydraulic lines Toyota doesn't have this stuff anymore the master cylinder is available new
https://www.ebay.com/itm/272689637890
The slave cylinder is super easy to rebuild a 2 minute job.
Oh dang, I'll just wait for another car to drift in at some point haha, this drained my current budget for the time being.
I'll have to grab the brake pedal and hydraulic lines whenever one floats into the yard. Do you have a picture of what the lines look like and route to though? There was only one line going to the master cylinder and routing into the slave, is it that? There's also a part available on rockauto says for oem part # (9093101047, 9093101055, 9093101063, 9094702597)

And what's the difference in brake pedal?

Also grabbed the little rubber piece that holds the shift cables, will make lining up a cutting spot much easier haha.

Will have to definitely wait for another car tho since this one was missing bits here and there, and the clutch pedal seems to have been replaced at some point as well. Missing some rubber pieces on the pedal.

But yeah taking off the lower part of the dash made everything so much easier haha.

Now I just need to grab a transmission long with the pedal, master cylinder and hydraulic lines at some point.
What's the code for the 5 speed on these cars, s53? I'm assuming the Celica has the same transmission that can be used, any other cars though, besides the Camry?

Again, thanks for the help, it's made things much easier 😄
 

·
Toyota Collector
Joined
·
11,821 Posts
There are clips on the firewall for the clutch lines can't route them wrong, that part number is for the flexible line aftermarket has it probably 'cause it's pretty standard. S51 is the Camry box S53 Celica the S54 I think that's MR2. Manual brake pedal pad is half the width of the auto one so it doesn't hit the clutch pedal.

The later Camry boxes have no speedo cable instead a speed sensor I think you can swap in the mechanical adapter but not sure. Best transmission source is a Celica many were sold and of those a good amount came with the 5-speed.
 

·
Registered
1990 Toyota Camry LE
Joined
·
210 Posts
Discussion Starter #10
There are clips on the firewall for the clutch lines can't route them wrong, that part number is for the flexible line aftermarket has it probably 'cause it's pretty standard. S51 is the Camry box S53 Celica the S54 I think that's MR2. Manual brake pedal pad is half the width of the auto one so it doesn't hit the clutch pedal.

The later Camry boxes have no speedo cable instead a speed sensor I think you can swap in the mechanical adapter but not sure. Best transmission source is a Celica many were sold and of those a good amount came with the 5-speed.
Ah okay, that gives me a little piece of mind.
As for the hydraulic line, I'm assuming it's just the single metal line from the master to slave then. Would I be able to bend a piece of stainless tubing to use, if I can't get the oem line from a car?

And for the transmission, what year Celica was it? 86-89 or 90-93? I can't remember the chassis codes for the celicas.

Then the brake pedal I should be able to get at some point, fairly easy part.
Though for the spring connecting to the clutch pedal, is there a spot for it on the underside of the auto dash like the manual, or would it have to be welded in?
 

·
Toyota Collector
Joined
·
11,821 Posts
Ah okay, that gives me a little piece of mind.
As for the hydraulic line, I'm assuming it's just the single metal line from the master to slave then. Would I be able to bend a piece of stainless tubing to use, if I can't get the oem line from a car?
If you want to bend your own lines get NiCopp there is a rubber line between the firewall and transmission can't be a hard line there.
And for the transmission, what year Celica was it? 86-89 or 90-93? I can't remember the chassis codes for the celicas.
Any Celica with a 3S or 5S except the AWD ones the first FWD Celica was the ST162. Depending on the donor car you'll get different gear ratios the tallest 5th gear is in the 2nd gen Camry.
Then the brake pedal I should be able to get at some point, fairly easy part.
Though for the spring connecting to the clutch pedal, is there a spot for it on the underside of the auto dash like the manual, or would it have to be welded in?
There is a place for the clutch spring in your car.
 

·
Registered
1990 Toyota Camry LE
Joined
·
210 Posts
Discussion Starter #12
Ah okay, that gives me a little piece of mind.
As for the hydraulic line, I'm assuming it's just the single metal line from the master to slave then. Would I be able to bend a piece of stainless tubing to use, if I can't get the oem line from a car?
If you want to bend your own lines get NiCopp there is a rubber line between the firewall and transmission can't be a hard line there.
And for the transmission, what year Celica was it? 86-89 or 90-93? I can't remember the chassis codes for the celicas.
Any Celica with a 3S or 5S except the AWD ones the first FWD Celica was the ST162. Depending on the donor car you'll get different gear ratios the tallest 5th gear is in the 2nd gen Camry.
Then the brake pedal I should be able to get at some point, fairly easy part.
Though for the spring connecting to the clutch pedal, is there a spot for it on the underside of the auto dash like the manual, or would it have to be welded in?
There is a place for the clutch spring in your car.
Hmm, okay, thanks. The rubber line that goes through the firewall, is it the one part I saw online?

Thanks for the information though, waiting for a transmission to pop up will give me time to save up more lol!

And yeah I just went under my dash to check it out and found the small notch as well as a big cobweb haha.

The owner of the manual must've fiddled with the clutch pedal though, the rubber pad is gone most likely because they welded on a new pedal (just the part you step on). If I take the rubber pad off the brake pedal it fits fine surprisingly :lol:
 

·
Registered
1990 Toyota Camry LE
Joined
·
210 Posts
Discussion Starter #14 (Edited)
Hmm, okay, thanks. The rubber line that goes through the firewall, is it the one part I saw online?
It doesn't go through the firewall but the rubber hose is part # 90931-01055.
Ah yeah, I see, I went back and grabbed it lol, didn't know it was 2 separate lines connected by a hose haha. Only cost 2 bucks for all 3 pieces!

On an unrelated note, right when I use most of my budget up, an es250 pops into the yard, not sure if anyone hrre is gonna grab stuff off it. It was in decent shape too. I think it's in a yard near Charlie.

Anyhow, now all I need is the transmission lol!
 

·
Gen 2 Fanatic
'91 Camry DX
Joined
·
2,031 Posts
Go for an S53 from a ‘93 Celica with the 5SFE. It was the last year for the mechanical speedometer and the first year for dual synchros on some gears (can’t remember which two now). This is what I ran behind a 3sgte and now on my stock 3SFE. Just make sure that it has the speedo sensor, as long as it matches the trans you should be good on the speedometer readings.
 

·
Registered
1990 Toyota Camry LE
Joined
·
210 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
Go for an S53 from a ‘93 Celica with the 5SFE. It was the last year for the mechanical speedometer and the first year for dual synchros on some gears (can’t remember which two now). This is what I ran behind a 3sgte and now on my stock 3SFE. Just make sure that it has the speedo sensor, as long as it matches the trans you should be good on the speedometer readings.
Hmm I'll have to keep an eye out for it. How available are they usually? I usually only get 1 or 2 results on Google haha.

Thanks for the information though, helping narrow down my list haha.
 

·
Gen 2 Fanatic
'91 Camry DX
Joined
·
2,031 Posts
It is a one year only deal so a little difficult to stumble across. Car-part.com is your friend. Just make sure that it is a 93 from a 5S/GT.
 

·
3s-gte in a Camry?!?
'89 Camry Alltrac
Joined
·
8,265 Posts
Lots of questions here... been away from the computer for a week. I'll try to answer what I can... First, some pics:

Brake pedal and clutch pedal use the same pad on the manuals. The bolt holes and welded nuts are all there under the dash, but you will need to drill the firewall for the master cylinder. There is a obvious spot for it, but take pictures of your donor car to be sure...


You should (have) pull(ed) the complete clutch master, lines and slave as one unit. There is a hard line on the firewall, rubber line to the trans (aftermarket stainless line in this picture) and a metal line over the trans to the slave cylinder. Here, the slave is flopped over on the battery tray area.


The firewall is 3 layers thick where the manual shift cables go through the firewall. You will need to remove the steering rack to cut the holes. The inner firewall layer already has the correct hole, but you will need to cut the inner and outer panels. Here's a reference pic of the inside:


And the outside:


The cheapest way to do this project is to buy a donor car...

There are changes throughout the years in the wiring harness connections between the engine and dash harness. My personal suggestion is to keep your original harness and modify it. You will also need to grab the starter relay (driver's footwell, top right), clutch start switch and clutch cancel switch (if cruise control equipped). You basically wire the automatic neutral safety switch to fake 'park', then move one wire connection between the dash and engine harness to add the clutch interlock function. With a manual trans ECU (and the auto trans separate ECU removed), everything should work. You will need to make sure the ECU is compatible with your car (correct year(s) and emissions systems).

If you want good MPG, get the Camry trans (I basically never got below 30mpg in my original 90 DX and would always get above 35 on the highway). If you want performance, get a Celica trans. Any from '87-'98 will work. '94+ will need a mechanical speedo drive swapped in.

-Charlie
 

·
Toyota Collector
Joined
·
11,821 Posts
You will also need to grab the starter relay (driver's footwell, top right),
I've pulled parts from multiple 5-speed SV21's (and one VZV21) none had a starter relay so unless this is a U.S. only thing I don't think it exists.
 

·
Registered
1990 Toyota Camry LE
Joined
·
210 Posts
Discussion Starter #20 (Edited)
Hmm, well for the shifter line hole is it possible to Dremel from the inside? I didn't have to much difficulty squeezing under the dash and felt pretty roomy under there for me <img src="http://www.toyotanation.com/forum/images/smilies/lol.gif" border="0" alt="" title="Laugh out loud" class="inlineimg" />

Was also going to just grab a reman slave and master cylinder. It costs about the same for what I'd pay at the junkyard lol, that and the master was missing a few parts.

As for the harness, I already grabbed the manual one, but the car was an 89, mine is a 90. But i'm not super sure what the differences are. (Hoping I won't have too many problems, but idunno).
I'm not that great at custom wiring stuff either, so the option with less of that I have to do was better for me haha.

And the transmission will probably end up being whatever is more cost effective and available, since this is going to be a very slow project.

Couple minor questions about the transmission mounts I have also. I'm assuming I need the rear and side mounts? The whole metal bracket? But do I also need the front motor mount as well?
Didn't grab those because they were frozen and I didn't have a breaker/ cheater bar or power tools.

Many thanks for the pictures though, will be good additional references!
 
1 - 20 of 63 Posts
Top