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Cylinder 3 misfiring

8051 Views 372 Replies 11 Participants Last post by  new echo owner
I just bought 2007 Camry which has an original 98k. Some white smoke and cylinder 3 misfire. Code p0303. I checked and swapped the coil and spark plug but still running rough. I replaced the PCV. There is a clip below with the noise coming from under the valve cover

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Discussion Starter · #181 · (Edited)
Are those numbers from the most recent compression tests? You mentioned #3 was at 170 n 180 psi a few posts back, not 200!
You are right, the first time I checked it was 170 and the second time 180 but both times were within half an hour. I have not checked it again. I returned the tester to oreilly but I can get them again If I need to. I do not know whether would be easier if we find out the problem now or after dismantling the engine again....
 

· just a nobody
Echo
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No need to do the compression test again; just want to verify how the recent readings are! Orignally, you had higher reading for #3, but now it seems they are relately even, which in a way is a good sign.
The reason why I haven't suggest taking the engine apart because there are some tests that can only be done with the engine fully assembled. Prefer doing the diagnose and determine what the cause maybe, and then take the engine apart to confirm the diagnoses. Taking the engine apart and hope to find something that may or may not be the cause don't always work out!
Anyway, been going though some of the pictures you had taken! .
 

· Long-haired Southern-Squidbillie
2004 Camry 2AZ engine; 2018 Camry LE
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If you remove the fasteners to slide the intake manifold back, then with a flashlight and small mirror you can look in thru the intake port to see the back side of the intake valves.

If the stem seal or guides are worn and leaking oil, then there will likely be wet oil on the stems. If the #3 piston is in the position such that the intake valves are closed, then there might even be a puddle of oil in the valve seat area. If the valves and stems are dry with no evidence of oil, then the oil fouling of #3 may be from the piston ring issue that was the subject of the TSB.
 

· just a nobody
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· just a nobody
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Also looking into the oil leak around the dip stick tube area, it is close to the oil drain back hole of the head and block. Maybe the head gasket had been damage during installation!

Still considering the issue being related to the piston rings! Haven't come up with a cause to account for the amount of oil; enough oil in the cylinder to cause a misfire!
If a leak down test was done at higher pressure, maybe that would help to provide some indication with pressure drop, don't know!
 

· just a nobody
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Google search came up with information suggesting that the endoscope above, camera end aprroximately 6 - 7 mm diameter, have a chance to fit through the injector ports in the head, since the injector nozzle head is approximately 9 - 10 mm diameter. This way hopefully will provide the needed infomration with minimal teardown.

If anyone have any more accurate info or suggestions, please share here! :unsure:
 

· just a nobody
Echo
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@Alexqkama, you want to give that a try when you have the time? It would help in determing where the oil is coming from.
The amount of oil is not making sense!
You asked if you should be taking the engine apart to find out what the cause is; this is part of it! Unless we can get some indication of where the oil is coming from, we can't detremine how far you have to take the engine apart.
If it is valve seals, hopefully but too much oil to draw a conclusion, the seals can be replaced without taking the cylinder head off; just need to remove the cams! However, the oil leak around the dip stick will also need to be considered, which would require closer inspection of the area!
 

· Long-haired Southern-Squidbillie
2004 Camry 2AZ engine; 2018 Camry LE
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It a very tight fit at the dipstick and there is an oring that probably should be replaced if you ever pull out the tube; the old ring has taken a set and won't seal if you try to reuse it.
 

· just a nobody
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Discussion Starter · #192 ·
Actually looking into removing the fuel rail with the injectors, looking into the intake passage through the injector ports with an endoscope like this:

Wireless Endoscope, DEPSTECH 1080P HD Inspection Camera IP67 Waterproof Borescope with 6 LED Lights for Automotive, 2200mAh Battery Snake Camera for Android and iOS Phones,Tablet, IPad -Blue(10M/33FT): Amazon.com: Industrial & Scientific

Trying to determine if the camera will fit through the hole.
So I have to buy an endoscope to proceed.
Also looking into the oil leak around the dip stick tube area, it is close to the oil drain back hole of the head and block. Maybe the head gasket had been damage during installation!

Still considering the issue being related to the piston rings! Haven't come up with a cause to account for the amount of oil; enough oil in the cylinder to cause a misfire!
If a leak down test was done at higher pressure, maybe that would help to provide some indication with pressure drop, don't know!
The oil around the dipstick is fresh and was not there after I put back the cylinder head. There is no traces of oil dripping from the gasket. I sort of cleaned the engine with high pressure water. Also I would have noticed it when I put back the exhaust manifold. However I am not certain whether the oil was there before the compression and leak tests!!!?? I could clean it and do another leak test and see if has anything to do with it or it is not going to be helpful at this point???
I know for whomever is doing work as DIY needs to have tools but then I do not want to keep purchasing tools and then put them on the shelf. Before I purchase the endoscope, would it be a good idea to clean the oil around the dipstick and pressurize the cylinder or an endoscope would be more beneficial at this point?/
 

· just a nobody
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Can understand not wanting to keep buying tools, maybe check to see if it is available to rent at the auto parts store.

The endoscope can be a useful tool to have, not just for working on vehicles! The one listed in the link is actual a low end one but sufficient enough to do most common types of work. In your case, you can inpsect the intake passage mention above and also inside the cylinder walls without removing the head.
Using the endoscope looking into the intake passages, we hope to determine if the oil is entering into #3 cylinder through the valve guides. If the intake passages and back of the intake valves show oil that would mean the seals had been compromised in some way to allow oil to enter. If on the other hand it shows minimal oil there, then the source is elsewhere.

Did look back at the pictures you had taken, and no oil was visible in that area when you were working on the engine! The area to inspect is between the block and the cylinder, where they come together, just above where the leak is! The tear drop shaped hole area in this picture:

 

· Long-haired Southern-Squidbillie
2004 Camry 2AZ engine; 2018 Camry LE
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There are just 7 bolts to hold the intake manifold and then it can be slid back just enough to see into the intake ports using a mirror and flashlight. No need to buy any new tools.

my rationale,
i doubt any chemical method could repair this issue so you will be dismantling it eventually; i don't see how running the engine anymore provides any useful data; you can still do compression and leakdown tests with the intake manifold removed.
 

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Discussion Starter · #196 ·
Can understand not wanting to keep buying tools, maybe check to see if it is available to rent at the auto parts store.

The endoscope can be a useful tool to have, not just for working on vehicles! The one listed in the link is actual a low end one but sufficient enough to do most common types of work. In your case, you can inpsect the intake passage mention above and also inside the cylinder walls without removing the head.
Using the endoscope looking into the intake passages, we hope to determine if the oil is entering into #3 cylinder through the valve guides. If the intake passages and back of the intake valves show oil that would mean the seals had been compromised in some way to allow oil to enter. If on the other hand it shows minimal oil there, then the source is elsewhere.

Did look back at the pictures you had taken, and no oil was visible in that area when you were working on the engine! The area to inspect is between the block and the cylinder, where they come together, just above where the leak is! The tear drop shaped hole area in this picture:

 

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