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Discussion Starter #1
Not sure if I can say which dealer, but here in Illinois we had a great XLE picked out (first one had the rusty gas cap rivet and some interior scratches). Costco pricing...asked sales guy about Costco, and has he used it “yes...yes.”
Suddenly after being dragged out for 2 hours, the finance manager John E. comes over and Has the cargo liner which for two days the sales guy knew we didn’t want. The sales liner was being forced on us as was the cargo cover...I mentioned we didn’t want to pay for it...and even though they only had the 2 white xle’s, John said “would you like me to find you a car without the cargo cover?” Dude, we spent 30 minutes examining the only 2 white ones you have and you wasted 2 hours with computer glitches and paperwork. I mentioned that if they want to throw the sale away for $400 of options we didn’t want (let alone the trade value of our Honda van was 3-5k less than kbb, Edmunds and true car) I said there was another Toyota dealer 20 minutes away. “ok go to them then, bye.” Now we must scramble to get the .9’financing Monday.
 

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They didn't kiss your A after you threatened to go to another dealer? How dare them! You seem like the kind of buyer that any sales team would love to deal with.
 

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Sounds like a lousy experience.

If you're serious about buying a new car tomorrow to get in on the April finance offer, then you'll have to press the reset button, forget what happened there, and start over. Make good on your threat to go to another dealer. Don't even tell the next dealer about this experience... no sense in sounding negative or difficult.

Fortunately it seems white XLE's are all over the place in the Chicago area right now, if that's where you're at in Illinois. (Assuming that since the next closest dealer is "20 minutes away".) Naperville alone claims to have 24 on the lot!

Start with the price of the new car. I don't know how the Costco program works, but I'd ask how much money its supposedly saving you. Looking at new listings on cars.com, you can easily get over $2,000 off MSRP just for walking in the door, and multiple dealers are showing XLE's for $3,000 off MSRP. Invoice isn't much lower than that, so I'd say $3,000 off MSRP is your goal on the new car. If you can talk in actual numbers instead of "the Costco price", you'll be a lot better off. Never say the word "invoice" either, as that's a variable number that dealers will play games with. Have a number in mind and go with it. If Costco is a better deal, wouldn't they have you go through their Web site and send you to a certain dealer? I wouldn't walk into a random dealer and ask for "the Costco price", although I would try using that number (the actual number, not "the Costco price") as a starting point for negotiation if I didn't work through Costco.

Then look at your trade-in. If the dealer was that far below what you believe your trade was worth, then something's wrong. It's one of these three things: (1) they felt they were not making enough money on "the Costco price" on the new car and wanted to get some back on the trade, (2) they were just plain trying to screw you on it (yes, I've had that happen), or (3) your expectations about the value aren't realistic. To make sure it's not number 3, there are a couple of things you can do. First, make sure you're looking at the "wholesale" or "trade-in" value on those Web sites you mentioned, not "private party" or "dealer list" prices. And be honest about the condition of your car - very few are at the top rating of "excellent". The more waxing, buffing, cleaning, or even repairing the car needs to look good on the lot, the lower the rating. It's only "excellent" if the worst things it needs are a wash and a vacuum to be totally clean and blemish-free. Next, find listings on the Internet at places like cars.com, Carmax, or other dealers for cars that are as close to your exact trade-in as possible, and ideally near your location as well since prices vary around the country. Get similar color, mileage, trim level, condition, and so on. Find those prices, and then subtract about $2,000 from those prices to get to the trade-in value on your car. Dealers always list cars at higher prices so they have room to negotiate and make money. If they're listing a used car for $20K, then they certainly didn't pay $20K for it - they paid around $18K so that they can meet someone in the middle at $19K. Even though Carmax doesn't negotiate, they still have to make money too, so there is markup there.

Now that you have a number in your head for the new car and a number for your trade-in, you now have a number for the difference between the two - "your car and $X,000". That's the deal you want. They may raise the price of the new car but then raise the value of your trade-in, or they could lower the price on both. It doesn't really matter - the difference between the two is the amount you're paying tax on and financing.

Dealers want to sell cars, period. As long as you walk in there with realistic expectations, things usually work out fine and you get a new car. Yes, I've been to dealers that want to play games instead, and that's unfortunate. You still need to be prepared to walk out if they can't get close enough to the deal you want. But if you go in with a positive attitude, that will work in your favor.
 

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Sounds like a dealer that doesn’t need your business. Go elsewhere and don’t worry about the financing deal. Around my area the incentives haven’t changed since November when I first started looking at highlanders. If they did it was a small $250 change in rebate. Nothing for financing around me for months. Seems certain areas get the finance deals and others get the rebate deals. And some get both. But it may change for the better so don’t rush... and I wouldn’t worry about the rivet rust. The one you buy will have it eventually unless you prevent it ...
 

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They didn't kiss your A after you threatened to go to another dealer? How dare them! You seem like the kind of buyer that any sales team would love to deal with.
Didn’t kiss his A? Seriously? The salesman threw away a deal over floormats? And offered to do a dealer locate over mats?? It’s not a paint color or interior color here. It’s mats.... Give me a break..take the mats and add them to another one on the lot(or sell them) and make the sale happen. Simple as that..or the OP buys elsewhere which I think this dealer deserves anyway..
 

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Discussion Starter #6 (Edited)
They didn't kiss your A after you threatened to go to another dealer? How dare them! You seem like the kind of buyer that any sales team would love to deal with.
Smh....did I imply I wanted them to? no... great reading comprehension bud! The point is, there was no discussion no explanation of why the trade was much lower than researched, plus there was no explanation why mats couldn’t be pulled from the car. So the client is supposed to kiss the dealer’s a—?
It was an hour after closing time and the manager was probably ticked he had to stay late (there were 4 other families in there). Their computer system glitches for almost 2 hours and delayed us.

Just love keyboard warriors, thanks for your helpful comment. 🙂
 

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The point is, there was no discussion no explanation of why the trade was much lower than researched, plus there was no explanation why mats couldn’t be pulled from the car.
Was the trade-in value $3-5k less than retail or wholesale at kbb, etc? When you do a trade-in, they give you the wholesale price, because often times they end up selling the trade-in at auction and they only get the wholesale price. Even if they keep the vehicle for their own used car lot, they have to make a profit. Stores buy stuff at wholesale price and sell at retail.

If the mats were installed by the regional Toyota distributor and are on the sticker, it is hard for them to take it off your vehicle and put it on a another new one for two reasons. First, it is likely that all their other inventory already has the mats. Even if there was another model without the mats that they can add them to, they can't change the sticker after they add them. So they would probably just have to put them for sale in the parts department, but they would not have the original packaging so probably could not sell them as new. But the dealer probably should have given the mats to you at half price if they really wanted your business.
 

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Discussion Starter #8 (Edited)
So reviewing the paperwork further (took pictures of it) it would have been nice if our salesperson was better.

Time elapsed between when we got the paperwork, and when the manager came over and simply highlighted our price (didn’t explain anything), then the questions about the cargo cover and the all weather floor liner/cargo liner extras amounted to 3 minutes.

Dealer holdback $932.00.
Holdback amount includes “PPO holdback” $116.00

Wholesale Financial Reserve $408.00.
Gas $10.51 (lol did we get any credit for our trade-in gas?)

Total “dealer price” (not invoice?). $39,552.38 versus a sticker of $42,546

The process in general was quite confusing when buying car every 5 years. The salespersons these days seem to have very little knowledge (Audi person was great).
 

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"We've never done this before, but I can knock $100 off that TrueCoat, since it's special circumstances and all." :grin:
It sounds like that dealer simply didn't want to close the deal at that point for whatever reason. I agree - locating another car over accessories is just nuts.

The dealership can do anything they really want to in order to make a sale. They can remove post-production options (mats, cargo covers, etc.) True, they either then have to put them on another car on the lot or sell them as parts. The window sticker isn't cast in stone, so taking accessories off is no big deal. When the dealer puts them on another new car, you simply add another mini window sticker that lists "added dealer options" above and beyond the main sticker.

I play a swap deal on accessories almost every time I buy a car. For example, I don't like Toyota's all-weather mats, which it seems lately everything in this region is coming with. I swap for carpet, which I prefer when it's not snowy outside. I've even had tube steps removed from a truck before I bought it.
 

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When the dealer puts them on another new car, you simply add another mini window sticker that lists "added dealer options" above and beyond the main sticker.
True, but if every HL they get has them already installed, not so easy to put them on another vehicle. But they should have at least given them to him at or near dealer cost if they don't want to remove them.

But this is typical of any buying service. Some dealers feel like they are not going to give an inch on the buying service price because it is below their average selling price.
 

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One hundred? You lied to me, Mr Lundegaard. You're a bald-faced liar. A ****ing liar.
That scene from Fargo is classic. I can't help but think about that every time I feel like I'm getting screwed by a salesman on price, whether it's a car or something else.
 

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ugh can't win.....purchased a highlander....next day finance rates dropped to 0%
Told you to not rush as they might get better and probably not get worse..oh well shake it off and enjoy the new ride!
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Told you to not rush as they might get better and probably not get worse..oh well shake it off and enjoy the new ride!
My crystal ball stinks....with bank rates/Fed going up I didn't think rates would go down.


I appreciate the encouraging words...I know I wasn't the only person to buy new yesterday! :crying:. Misery loves company kinda thing.


Unfortunately there was a little "domestic" (wife) time pressure to get the process done. I know why I still have my 2001 Escape (paid for)...I hate dealerships.


Anyway, nice picture...my escape is red, and my young daughter said now we need a blue car for red, white, and blue!
 
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