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Newbie One Kanobi
2003 Toyota ECHO!!
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Total War! The Toyota WAY!!!

Too little too late...sure maybe just maybe if or when Toyota surpasses GM, GM might rebound to regain the title but who knows...they need to get serious about quality of their cars but most important being competitive with each segment, sub-compact, compact, mid-size etc...They need to stop sticking their noses in the air and think they're invincible and get back to reality. I'm generally not a GM fan, I do like some of their cars, I think they do have potential but they sure aren't using it or seeing it.

But in the mean time TOYOTA FTW!!!!:lol: :lol: :lol: :thumbup: :naughty:
 

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Good. I want GM to fight back. Competition means better products and prices for me in the end. When I was looking for a sedan, I really hated that for me it was only between Toyota and Honda. I didn't even consider GM or any other domestic for that matter.
 

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With their current management philosophy, I doubt that they will ever recover. When you hear the GM execs (or Ford for that matter) talking about improving the company, they always focus on profits, cost control, etc. Obviously these things are important, but they should not be the focus.

I like Toyota's philosophy, which is worry about pleasing the customer and making a better product. Focus on quality and building world class products. If you do that, profits and "increasing shareholder returns" will follow.
 

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2005 Toyota Sienna
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91 Posts
It's Funny to hear GM being defiant as the inevitable is about to happen(Toyota becoming number 1 in the world). As History will sadly note an American(the father of the 2nd industrial revolution) was responsible for the demise of the Big 3. The father of the second industrial revoultion's child(Toyota) is resposible for the demise of the children(GM, Ford, DC) of father of the first industrial revolution(Henry Ford). Actually the Big 3 automakers should blame Gen Douglas MacArthur for inviting this American to Japan to help in the rebuilding after WWII. But then again the Big 3 had sent this American packing after they rejected his teachings and to this day are paying for it dearly.

I remember in the 1980s as the Big 3 were bad mouthing American Labor as the sole source of their woes, Toyota and Honda started building MFG plants in the US employing this libeled American Labor. What do you know the quality of the American made Japaneese cars were almost the equivalent of the cars made in Japan.

In the 90s, the Big 3 again blamed their diminishing market share on American Labor and begin offshoring their labor to 3rd world countries. Meanwhile, JDPowers and CR were making a mockery of the Big 3s quality/reliability woes.

In the new milineum, the Big 3s trash talking continues as they blame again American Labor for their woes, but this time it's the company retiree pensioners and their Health benefits. The Bravado of Corporate America is best exemplified by Enron, in their total contempt for American Labor which is what the Big 3 are all about. GMs newest Silverado commercial announcing "This is our Country" is a Corporate America's Oxymoron. Here they preach Patriotism, when in reality Corporate Americas CEOs are ONLY patriotic to the almighty dollars they have lying in an offshore bank account. I always believed that incompetent Management were punished(Fired), but imagine rewarding the suddenly fired CEO of Home Depot, $210 Million for his incompetence is beyond me. GM can say whatever they want but a POS is what they will continue to build!!:rolleyes:
 

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GO PATRIOTS!
2007 Tundra
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8,676 Posts
reliability said:
It's Funny to hear GM being defiant as the inevitable is about to happen
It is inevitable, but honestly did anyone think they were just going to say "We're just going to roll over" :lol:
 

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1986 toyota camry
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119 Posts
reliability said:
It's Funny to hear GM being defiant as the inevitable is about to happen(Toyota becoming number 1 in the world). As History will sadly note an American(the father of the 2nd industrial revolution) was responsible for the demise of the Big 3. The father of the second industrial revoultion's child(Toyota) is resposible for the demise of the children(GM, Ford, DC) of father of the first industrial revolution(Henry Ford). Actually the Big 3 automakers should blame Gen Douglas MacArthur for inviting this American to Japan to help in the rebuilding after WWII. But then again the Big 3 had sent this American packing after they rejected his teachings and to this day are paying for it dearly.
Strangely, I thought Thomas Watt was the father of the First Industrial Revolution, and Gottleib Daimler the father of the Second.
 

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reliability said:
It's Funny to hear GM being defiant as the inevitable is about to happen(Toyota becoming number 1 in the world). As History will sadly note an American(the father of the 2nd industrial revolution) was responsible for the demise of the Big 3. The father of the second industrial revoultion's child(Toyota) is resposible for the demise of the children(GM, Ford, DC) of father of the first industrial revolution(Henry Ford). Actually the Big 3 automakers should blame Gen Douglas MacArthur for inviting this American to Japan to help in the rebuilding after WWII. But then again the Big 3 had sent this American packing after they rejected his teachings and to this day are paying for it dearly.

I remember in the 1980s as the Big 3 were bad mouthing American Labor as the sole source of their woes, Toyota and Honda started building MFG plants in the US employing this libeled American Labor. What do you know the quality of the American made Japaneese cars were almost the equivalent of the cars made in Japan.

In the 90s, the Big 3 again blamed their diminishing market share on American Labor and begin offshoring their labor to 3rd world countries. Meanwhile, JDPowers and CR were making a mockery of the Big 3s quality/reliability woes.

In the new milineum, the Big 3s trash talking continues as they blame again American Labor for their woes, but this time it's the company retiree pensioners and their Health benefits. The Bravado of Corporate America is best exemplified by Enron, in their total contempt for American Labor which is what the Big 3 are all about. GMs newest Silverado commercial announcing "This is our Country" is a Corporate America's Oxymoron. Here they preach Patriotism, when in reality Corporate Americas CEOs are ONLY patriotic to the almighty dollars they have lying in an offshore bank account. I always believed that incompetent Management were punished(Fired), but imagine rewarding the suddenly fired CEO of Home Depot, $210 Million for his incompetence is beyond me. GM can say whatever they want but a POS is what they will continue to build!!:rolleyes:
Good post, reliability. (Good handle for a Toyota site, too! :) )

C
 

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This is the exact opposite of what Bob Lutz said in a 60 minutes interview a couple months ago

:dunno:
 

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The Original Mofo
91 4Runner SR5
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575 Posts
was watching CNBC a few days ago during the NYSE market

and they said Toyota is slated to surpass GM, and showed the trends

not looking good for American Auto industry
 

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Im not sure exactly what GM could try and throw at toyota, a majority of their vehicles are already priced UNDER toyota, they offer more rebates, better warranties etc and toyota is STILL outselling them. cheap isnt what everyone wants. plus gm actually has a sports car line up. Its going to take more than them knocking a few bucks off.
 

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CRESSIDA!!!
1984 Toyota Cressida
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5,632 Posts
Too bad GM lost that fight when my dad bought a Camry in November.
 

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CRESSIDA!!!
1984 Toyota Cressida
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5,632 Posts
Too bad GM lost that fight when my dad bought a Camry in November.
 

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I can't decide if it is business as usual at GM or not. As of now, the one product that I really, really like that they have besides the Vette is the new T900 full size trucks.

They do have some very good things on their way though. The new Malibu, the Aura, and the new Cadillacs are sure to be popular. They still have to make the Colorado and Cobalt more appealing. Buick probably needs to go away.

The one hurdle that Toyota faces: It is expanding into full size truck territory. This isn't small cars. American truck owners, at least GM truck owners, seem much more satisfied with their product than other niches that Toyota has earned market share. It's a tough road to win those customers. On top of that, Hyundai, Nissan, Saturn, and even Kia are making much better lower end products than they used to, which is sure to light a fire under Toyota to keep their lower end products fresh.

It's possible, but I don't think it is as easy as a lot of folks think to be number 1 in America. The fact that GM is really pushing better product quality with better warranties and, honestly, really impressive offerings shows how worried they are. If GM survives the next 50 years, it will be because Toyota forced them to be more competitive. As Americans, we owe Toyota credit for that. Competition will mean more choices...and to be honest, I am not in love with the new Tundra yet as I am with the new Sierra. Maybe a price war will be in the future....?
 

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2005 Toyota Sienna
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aussie_gen1 said:
Strangely, I thought Thomas Watt was the father of the First Industrial Revolution, and Gottleib Daimler the father of the Second.
Thats strange? When I was Engineering School, it was quoted in the textbooks that Henry Ford was the father of the 1rst Industrial Revolution. I guess the authors referenced Mass Production as their primary criteria. Daimler from what I remember was the inventor of the automobile. :lol:
 

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2005 Toyota Sienna
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tacomasrock said:
I can't decide if it is business as usual at GM or not. As of now, the one product that I really, really like that they have besides the Vette is the new T900 full size trucks.

They do have some very good things on their way though. The new Malibu, the Aura, and the new Cadillacs are sure to be popular. They still have to make the Colorado and Cobalt more appealing. Buick probably needs to go away.

The one hurdle that Toyota faces: It is expanding into full size truck territory. This isn't small cars. American truck owners, at least GM truck owners, seem much more satisfied with their product than other niches that Toyota has earned market share. It's a tough road to win those customers. On top of that, Hyundai, Nissan, Saturn, and even Kia are making much better lower end products than they used to, which is sure to light a fire under Toyota to keep their lower end products fresh.

It's possible, but I don't think it is as easy as a lot of folks think to be number 1 in America. The fact that GM is really pushing better product quality with better warranties and, honestly, really impressive offerings shows how worried they are. If GM survives the next 50 years, it will be because Toyota forced them to be more competitive. As Americans, we owe Toyota credit for that. Competition will mean more choices...and to be honest, I am not in love with the new Tundra yet as I am with the new Sierra. Maybe a price war will be in the future....?
Why is it that most people believe that most truck buyers are extremely loyal and that they would not look at another competitor's vehicle? Just like any other vehicle most people judge a manufacturer by their Reliability Record. As many former owners of the Big 3's vehicles can attest to, loyalty ends when the ownership experience includes frequent trips to the Mechanics Shop. 100,000 mile Warranties are nothing new and just shows that the Manufacturer is trying to do a con job on the buying public. Quality first and foremost should be built into the car NOT Tacked on as 100,000 mile warranty. The smirk on one's face will be forever changed as one is frequenty inconvenienced as he or she constantly have to drop their car off at the shop even though the service is free. Funny thing is Time is money, so while the sucker has his POS in the shop, the Toyota/Lexus owner has the time to spend doing more important things like spending time with their family.

As for Toyota worrying about the Korean Makes, unless Koreans can exceed the Quality/Reliability Stats for a Toyota/Lexus they have no chance. Also the manufacturing secrets that Dr. Edward Deming gave to Toyota are to this day are company classified and have evolved even further. The stats that RAV4Ever referenced in that link he provided, shows that Toyota is destined to be number one for some time.
 
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