[Lundy]

Bob, this is a really fantastic write up. I’ve been looking for a 2017 limited platinum Highlander to go camping in and the inverter idea is great.

Do you mind sharing some of your pictures of this setup, and perhaps some instructions on what you bought and how you set this up? Is your inverter bolted to the car or is it unsecured while moving? I’d like to see where the cable comes out from the 12v to the inverter in the 2017-2019 highlander for instance, what wiring you used, any fuses, amp limits, etc .

Also, I though the 2017-2019 max amp rating was 150A. Does it say on the 12V battery what it is?

Another thought - since you have the hybrid why not just sleep in it versus the trailer since the highlander seats fold flat - and just use the Highlander built in AC!


When you say “You would have to assure that the hybrid system was in the On condition before turning it on and remember to turn it off before shutting down the hybrid system.“

What would happen if you forget to turn it off? Does it just drain the 12V battery? Can you run an on/off switch from the rear cargo 12v battery inverter to the driver seat with that inverter you recommended or do you go have to go back to the trunk every time? Also , on the ‘14-‘19 Highlander - the inverter you recommended was 2000w - what’s the max watts for the ‘14-‘19?

Also, what are quick disconnect plugs for and do?

BTW, I am 100% sure that the 2020 Highlander limited and platinum 1500W are running off the 12V. It’s not coming from the high voltage traction battery. It’s the same setup as the Prius. There’s no other way to meaningfully do it. Toyota justdid thesame thing Bob suggested but in a more streamlined and clean way rather than the inverter sticking out but that costs an extra $1500. No thanks; I’ll buy a 3 year old Highlander hybrid platinum certified used for $20k off versus a brand new ‘20 Highlander that’s $50k and doesn’t have tow Package o rear folding window.

Bob, if you can link us all the parts you bought, perhaps a write up, or even a YouTube video showing how you wired this it would be really appreciated. I’d like to see where your inverter is relative to the 12V battery. You’re the first person on the internet who has described using an inverter on a hybrid Highlander on the 2014-2019 generation and it would help a lot of future campers.

To BOB and OTHERS:

1.The following YouTuber is reporting on his experimenting with using the 1500 watt outlet to run his AC on the 2021 Sienna (same hybrid setup as the Highlander) while car camping and describes his observations on this strange kind of constant engine re-starting interval and run time of the engine; and then switch to hybrid battery to power the AC for a constant time interval, that is regardless of the temperature inside or outside. I may have misunderstood him on the above. I think he is also not indicating or providing info on at what interval the compressor is on and off as if the programming is disregarding how often the compressor is cycling. He gives his assumptive explanations on why and reason's programming. What do you think of the facts being provided, all the explanations & observation. While you really need to watch the whole video but my summary(including the link) is as follows:

MY SUMMARY:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=bngRFxiYagY He tested at 72 or 78 degrees F AC settings while the outside temperature is 85 , blower fan is at 2 bars, and he found the car simply start every 12 minutes, engine ON for 3 minutes ' and 9 minutes off with the hybrid battery powering the A/C, but actually that is independent of the outside or inside temperature. That is programed to top off the hybrid battery to keep the battery in peak readiness for driving rather than the AC because the AC battery can run much longer than that. Also, cannot lock the car while the engine is on A/C.

2.On the 'car cannot be locked', that is a little different from the owner's manual solution that car will not active the auto shutoff after 1 hr. if one locks the door with the door lock switch or with the mechanical key from the outside (ie. open the window, lock, and shut the window).

 

[StatCoder]

When I was using the generator to power my household appliances for several days, I turned off the HVAC to keep the engine from starting every 10 minutes. Using the generator with the HVAC off, the engine would not come on for over an hour, sometimes. My guess is that there is a benefit to keeping the engine warm vs a colder start every 30 minutes or something.

I was able to keep the vehicle on indefinitely by locking from the outside using the physical key. I have also spent the night in the vehicle with the HVAC on by locking the vehicle from the inside.

Sleeping in the vehicle at a rest stop or parking lot is definitely more feasible in the hybrid as idling a conventional engine for multiple hours is a questionable practice while the hybrid engine is designed to rapidly cycle on and off.


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[viperman97]

So was reading this thread and think I understand, but wanted to review with some of the experts on the forum. I am looking at using my 2022 hybrid to power my sump pump 750W in the event of a power outage. If I pull the car outside, run an extension cord from the hatch area to my sump pump, turn the car on and lock the door from the outside, I will have a few days worth of backup sump power until the car runs out of gas? This would be a short term stop gap and since the sump is plugged directly into the extension cord, no worry of back feeding if the electric was to return.
thanks, JR

 

[HybridSpooner]

So was reading this thread and think I understand, but wanted to review with some of the experts on the forum. I am looking at using my 2022 hybrid to power my sump pump 750W in the event of a power outage. If I pull the car outside, run an extension cord from the hatch area to my sump pump, turn the car on and lock the door from the outside, I will have a few days worth of backup sump power until the car runs out of gas? This would be a short term stop gap and since the sump is plugged directly into the extension cord, no worry of back feeding if the electric was to return.
thanks, JR

I believe this will work but I would check the wattage & associated horse power of your sump pump. I would be concerned that it exceeded the amp draw momentarily at startup and that “trips” the Highlander inverter into protection mode. I was trying to run a 20amp AC unit when camping 18 months ago and it would trigger a circuit breaker in the Highlander at startup when the ac compressor kicked on. . I gave up and ran a fan at night instead and then a toaster and microwave in the morning for breakfast.

You could also just try it out and report back. My experience was the car protected itself from issue. YMMV.

PS… I installed a Venturi pump as a backup to my electric sump pump for like 200 bucks off Amazon. Need a little bit of DIY expertise and some tools but it wasn’t terrible. This kinda pump always works as long as there is water pressure… and when my sump died it was obvious because I had zero water pressure elsewhere in the house when the backup Venturi turned on.


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[StatCoder]

So was reading this thread and think I understand, but wanted to review with some of the experts on the forum. I am looking at using my 2022 hybrid to power my sump pump 750W in the event of a power outage. If I pull the car outside, run an extension cord from the hatch area to my sump pump, turn the car on and lock the door from the outside, I will have a few days worth of backup sump power until the car runs out of gas? This would be a short term stop gap and since the sump is plugged directly into the extension cord, no worry of back feeding if the electric was to return.
thanks, JR

From my experience this would work. A couple of times during the Texas freeze, the inverter did kick off for reasons which I couldn’t identify. I knew right away because the space heater turned off. I’m not sure if I would completely trust this setup unmonitored for a critical task but I guess you could always install some kind of water alarm.


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[CC_HH]

Maybe I'm skipping over details in the thread, but is there any way to retrofit this into lower model trims, like the XLE?

 

[StatCoder]

Maybe I'm skipping over details in the thread, but is there any way to retrofit this into lower model trims, like the XLE?

Not seamlessly. First, the stock 1500W inverter draws power directly from the hybrid battery while any retrofit would have to draw from the 12V system. There are a myriad of reasons why you don’t want to mess with the high-voltage hybrid battery including safety and warranty issues.

Various aftermarket inverters can be connected to the 12V system via jumper cable-like connections to the 12V battery. They are too bulky to really install anywhere and would have to be turned on and off manually to keep from quickly draining the 12V battery when the vehicle is off. However, you still get the benefit of only intermittently having the ICE to come on as the hybrid battery will keep the 12V system powered via the DC to DC. converter. The same setup with a regular gas engine Highlander would need the engine to be idling constantly.


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[stormblessed]

Great discussion. New 2022 XLE owner, my only regret being I wasn’t really aware of the 1500w inverter on higher trim levels, plus the XLE was what was available and in the color we liked.

To summarize, for an XLE that does not have the built in inverter, I should be able to use a 1500w pure sine inverter connected to the 12v battery in the rear. To do this safely, with the vehicle off, I would connect the inverter to the 12v battery. Then I would power on. Then I could use the inverter within its capacity, being powered by the hybrid battery through the 12v to inverter. The hybrid gas will cycle on to keep the 12v battery charged. Have to lock the car to exceed an hour. When done, turn off the connected devices or appliances, then power off the vehicle and disconnect inverter.

Does this sound safe and proper for the vehicle and the humans? I don’t expect to use this very often, but it could sure be handy when camping or in an outage.

 

[StatCoder]

Sounds right.

For the vehicle to stay on for an hour, the driver door must be either locked manually from the inside or using physical key from the outside (sticking it in the lock).

You will be connecting to the terminals of the 12V battery in the rear so I don’t think it matters whether the vehicle is on or not.

One thing I would consider is that if the vehicle shuts off then the inverter may quickly drain the 12V battery so having a portable battery jumper or at least jumper cables would be advisable.

I would recommend some testing of various setups at home before going camping with it.


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[Tigerman52]

Hey - new question. Would the system like this thread is about, with the inverter attached to the battery, basically work the same if I avoided an inverter and drew power only from the 12vdc power outlet on the dash to power a 7 watt cpap. I don’t need an inverter to run my cpap just 12vdc which is already available thru the 12vdc power outlet. My real question is: Would the traction battery keep the 12v battery charged up throughout the night when the 12vdc power outlet is drawing power. Any potential damage to electrical system? Note power usage for this cpap is very small without humidifier. 7 watts. Thanks folks.

 

[StatCoder]

Hey - new question. Would the system like this thread is about, with the inverter attached to the battery, basically work the same if I avoided an inverter and drew power only from the 12vdc power outlet on the dash to power a 7 watt cpap. I don’t need an inverter to run my cpap just 12vdc which is already available thru the 12vdc power outlet. My real question is: Would the traction battery keep the 12v battery charged up throughout the night when the 12vdc power outlet is drawing power. Any potential damage to electrical system? Note power usage for this cpap is very small without humidifier. 7 watts. Thanks folks.

If the vehicle is in Ready mode (on) and in Park then the 12V battery will stay charged. How often the ICE will start up probably depends on what the climate control is doing and the minimum number of startups per hour required to keep the ICE warm.

If the vehicle is in Accessory mode then I would be concerned that the 12V battery would run down overnight due to various other power draws in that mode.


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[JPElectron]

Here is how I wired an inverter to my 12v battery for use in case of an emergency.

I decided to only power one phase of the house, so I bought a slightly less expensive inverter, and I moved some breakers around to ensure only the ones I wanted were powered. I made a little box to monitor the voltage and Hz output, before it goes to the twist-lock connector in the house.

 

[bingo0]

interesting how powerful is DC-DC inverter (high voltage to 12v) ? theoretically it should be not less than 1000W constant and maybe 2000W peak. I assume all heating gizmos and lights are 12V, thus should be decent nominal power. perhaps secondary HVAC is also 12V

Ideal setup would be portable inverter pluggable to prepared high current socket for AdHoc cases, Seems yours is exactly that , but hard to tell what wiring schema and components from picture.

 

[dknightd]

I did this the other day. I have a limited with 1500W ac outlet. So I used that. I have a flat extension cord that let me close the rear hatch. It worked fine for refrigerator and a few smaller loads.
I made the car stay on for longer than an hour by reaching in through back door and locking from the inside driver door switch. I did it this way partially to see if it would work. If you do this, make sure you have your key with you. I could not unlock the car using the fob. I had to use physical key to unlock car again. So, next time I'll just lock it from the outside using the key.
Unfortunately I did not turn off the HVAC in car. So it probably used more gas than was needed. But the benefit was I found I had a nice cool car, so, could probably sleep in the car and stay cool if needed.
I'm not sure how much gas I used. I ran it this way for about 3 hours. Gas gauge barely moved.
It is a nice capability to have.

 

[Sbjenni]

I would imagine that the 1500 Watt inverter in the left rear corner of the 2020 HyHi is simply a 12 volt to 120 volt pure sine inverter that runs off the nearby (like inches) 12 volt battery.

I have a 2019 and I run a 2000 Watt NaturePower pure sine inverter when camping if I need 120 volt power. The inverter/converter under the hood is capable of keeping the small (50 aH) 12 volt battery charged and of running all the 12 volt lights, motors and infotainment system as well as the various computers. The fuse between the inverter/converter and the battery looks like it's 150 amps which would mean it can provide upwards of 2000 Watts at 14.6 volts (slightly less when it drops back to 13.6 when fully charged).

I would wager that this is exactly what Toyota did with the built-in 1500 Watt inverter. If you need 1500 Watts continuously I'd suggest turning off the center console screen and the heating/air conditioning system to conserve the 12 volts for use by the inverter, then leave the vehicle in the READY condition (On).

Last September we had a warm spell (high 80's/low 90's) and while camping at the Hershey PA RV show it got too darned hot for sleeping without air conditioning. I went to Camping World bought the 2000 Watt inverter and temporarily wired it to the battery with 4 gauge battery cables (that's all I could find) and it ran my little [email protected] teardrop trailer's 5000 BTU window air conditioner all night while only starting the Highlander's engine for 5 minutes every 15-20 minutes all night. So it appears to have plenty of amps available from the inverter/converter and MG1.

I picked up this thread because, like just a few other folks it seems, I'm pulling a small travel trailer behind a Highlander Hybrid (2016) and I'm interested in better using the hybrid system for powering my rig. I recently sub'd out the wet cell in the trailer (2021 Flagstaff T12RB) for a 200ah LiFePO4 battery and now thinking about better ways to charge it while towing. It seems that a 40a DC to DC Charger might be the way to go, but need guidance about wiring this up to a hybrid tow vehicle that has no alternator. The discussion about inverters has me wondering why I couldn't simply connect it directly to the tow-side AGM battery(?) Any informed thoughts/suggestions would be much appreciated.

 

[recharging]

interesting how powerful is DC-DC inverter (high voltage to 12v) ? theoretically it should be not less than 1000W constant and maybe 2000W peak. I assume all heating gizmos and lights are 12V, thus should be decent nominal power. perhaps secondary HVAC is also 12V

Ideal setup would be portable inverter pluggable to prepared high current socket for AdHoc cases, Seems yours is exactly that , but hard to tell what wiring schema and components from picture.

Indeed. The highest amp draws to the HiHy 12V are from the starter? So the DC-DC inverter can't be expected to be consistently supplying 120A. Doesn't the 288VDC-12VDC wire get real hot since it is not designed to be cooled?

 

[dknightd]

Indeed. The highest amp draws to the HiHy 12V are from the starter? So the DC-DC inverter can't be expected to be consistently supplying 120A. Doesn't the 288VDC-12VDC wire get real hot since it is not designed to be cooled?

My understanding is the 12v battery is not used to start the engine in a hybrid. The 12v battery is used only to power the computer, stereo, lights, and other 12v accessories. In fact, I do not think the hybrid has a starter (or alternator) in the traditional sense. My understanding, and it could be wrong, is that the "traction" battery starts the engine by using one of the electric motors. And one of the electric motors recharges the traction battery. The 12v battery is charged from the traction battery through a DC-DC voltage convertor.
I have no idea what that DC-DC convertor is rated for..
I think the AC outlet in a hybrid is powered by an inverter from the traction battery.
Again, I'm NOT positive about any of the above . . .

 

[chubbysumo]

My understanding is the 12v battery is not used to start the engine in a hybrid. The 12v battery is used only to power the computer, stereo, lights, and other 12v accessories. In fact, I do not think the hybrid has a starter (or alternator) in the traditional sense. My understanding, and it could be wrong, is that the "traction" battery starts the engine by using one of the electric motors. And one of the electric motors recharges the traction battery. The 12v battery is charged from the traction battery through a DC-DC voltage convertor.
I have no idea what that DC-DC convertor is rated for..
I think the AC outlet in a hybrid is powered by an inverter from the traction battery.
Again, I'm NOT positive about any of the above . . .

I come from another toyota forum where this is discussed extensively, and seeing as I own both a 2020 Highlander hybrid platinum, as well as a 2021 toyota sienna, I have researched this to death because I wanted to add the inverter that is in my hihy to my sienna(which didn't have it).

Lets start with the basics. You can't. the 120v 1500w outlet runs right from the motor inverter controller. it literally is using part of the same inverter circuitry that powers MG1/2 and 3 if you have AWD to lop off a square wave 120v signal. This comes right from the HV traction battery, not the 12v system.

The cars with the 120v outlet have a different inverter physically than those without. the circuitry isn't in the ones that don't have it, and you cannot add it. you also can't swap them because the 120v function is controlled by the computer(does a bunch of checks before it turns on the outlet), and you cannot "add" that button and feature into the featureset of the car you have because they are programmed by VIN, and toyota programming does not allow "outside of vin" features to be added.

so then, now that we have that covered, I do not recommend you run an inverter from the 12v system. the 12v system in these is rather anemic, you can tell by the battery size being almost just as big as a lawn tractor battery. the DC to DC converter in the motor controller/inverter is only rated at something like 140 amps peak, but more 60 to 80 amps constant. the 12v system only runs the computers and lights and HVAC blower motor, and of course, the main battery contactors in the HV battery. It does not start the engine, therefore, the circuitry is not designed to be run at full amps all the time, and if you run a 1500w aftermarket inverter, you are likely going to damage your DC to DC converter in your motor controller(or severely shorten its lifespan), and that motor controller comes in at like 5500 bucks for the non-120v one, and 6300 for the 120v ready one.

This isn't even getting into the discussion of what else comes with the 120v inverter kit, like the 15 amp self resetting breaker, the household wiring, the socket in the back, ect.

 

[agent_smith]

I am trying to determine some facts about the 120VAC outlets in the 2021 HiHy Limited that I have. I have read through this thread as well as others but have not seen pointers to direct Toyota statements about specific characteristics of this system.
My vehicle has a 120 VAC receptacle in the back of the center console visible when seated in the second row of seats. There is another 120VAC receptacle in the rear hatch area.
1) are these receptacles individually fused? In either case, what is the fuse rating?
2) Is each receptacle fed from its own inverter, or does one inverter feed both receptacles?
3) is the inverter a pure sine wave inverter? reference to a Toyota doc that specifies it? It is impossible to determine this from a cut away picture shown in this forum.

A related question - I assume there are Toyota factory service manuals around - a wiring diagram would provide the definitive information regarding my questions. Any pointers to how they can be obtained or found on line?
Thanks
J

 

[chubbysumo]

I am trying to determine some facts about the 120VAC outlets in the 2021 HiHy Limited that I have. I have read through this thread as well as others but have not seen pointers to direct Toyota statements about specific characteristics of this system.
My vehicle has a 120 VAC receptacle in the back of the center console visible when seated in the second row of seats. There is another 120VAC receptacle in the rear hatch area.
1) are these receptacles individually fused? In either case, what is the fuse rating?
2) Is each receptacle fed from its own inverter, or does one inverter feed both receptacles?
3) is the inverter a pure sine wave inverter? reference to a Toyota doc that specifies it? It is impossible to determine this from a cut away picture shown in this forum.

A related question - I assume there are Toyota factory service manuals around - a wiring diagram would provide the definitive information regarding my questions. Any pointers to how they can be obtained or found on line?
Thanks
J

Both Outlets are on the same breaker, and it is a breaker. It is a self resetting breaker. The inverter is 1500 W total between the front and rear outlets. This would be easily found in your owner's manual. At least one of them, I got like eight with my highlander. To reset the breaker after it has been tripped you must shut the inverter off from the button on the dash, and then you must turn it back on. I believe you also have to unplug anything plugged in, else it won't reset the breaker. Someone else took a look at waveform that the inverter puts out, and it is a pretty clean pure sine wave inverter. As far as the wiring diagram and Toyota documentation on inverter itself, I would recommend hitting up a dealer service counter, they have actually been pretty good at my local dealer on printing off both wiring diagrams and service data paperwork for me to be able to repair it fix things. Maybe you will have luck at a dealer near you.