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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Introduction
Subscribe to this thread! I make revisions and updates and I will bump this topic to list them! This is the easiest way for you to know if I have made any modifications or additions to any information!!!
This write-up is property of RichieRichJP
I'm not a turbo guru but for the most part I know what needs to be done to do the swap. If I'm not 100% sure, I will otherwise say so.
There are too many pertaining to "how do I get power out of my Camry?" so this should provide an extra option.
While this topic applies mostly to doing the setup on a Camry, I tried to keep it in a format as general as possible so it applies to MR2, Celica, and Camry owners. I strongly suggest MR2 owners use MR2OC as a basis for their information and use this simply as a beginners guide.
Wiring related stuff will apply mostly to the 5SFE Celica or Camry platform using a Gen 2 3SGTE cylinder head since that is what most people go with. The Gen 3 cylinder head should be relatively the same with the exception of the MAT sensor/wiring and ECU pinouts. I do suggest you further research the differences.
This write-up is property of RichieRichJP
As far as turbo basics go, such as tapping the oil pan, oil lines, and other turbo information, see rdizzle’s "how to turbo your 5sfe Camry" or Hamsterman's How to Turbo the Camry - 5s-fTe tips and information for info. To get a more detailed view of how to put your setup together, the Rebuilding the 3SGTE site will help tremendously.
This write-up is property of RichieRichJP

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This write-up is property of RichieRichJP
There is a misconception as to whether or not the head and block will match due to the water jackets on the block in comparison to the head gasket and cylinder head. Let’s clear that up. All 3SGTE cylinder heads will bolt on to your 5SFE block and vice versa! Although it may not be a direct bolt-on without modification for the +1994 5SFE engine blocks, 1992-1993 blocks should be a direct bolt on with the proper head gasket. 5SFE engine blocks that do require machining only need the water jackets to be drilled out and matched up to whichever head gasket that you will be using. To avoid having to pay money on machining, you're best off getting the +98 5SFE block. The problem is that you have to pay more for the block, but the water jackets match up PLUS you get the benefits of this cylinder walls and the reinforced water pump area.
You MUST use the same year 3SGTE components (grouped by generations), whether it be the wiring harness, timing components, fuel rail, exhaust/intake manifold, igniter, etc.
The same model 3SGTE parts are grouped by years: ’91-92’ (Gen 2), ’93-95 (Gen 3), +’96 (Gen 4).
This write-up is property of RichieRichJP

Required/Minimum Parts Needed:
3SGTE Cylinder head, camshafts, and valves
5SFE Crankshaft machined to fit 3SGTE Connecting Rods
5SFE Block
3SGTE Intake Manifold
3SGTE TVIS
3SGTE Throttle Body, TPS, IACV
3SGTE Fuel rail w/ fuel injectors
3SGTE Timing Components: Timing Belt, Tensioner, Idler Pulley, Cam Gears, 3SGTE Timing Covers + components
5SFE 1999-2003 Toyota Solara or 3SGTE (High-Volume) Oil Pump
3SGTE serpentine/alternator belts
3SGTE Crank Pulley (Gen. specific) (Refer to "Parts Information: Oil Pump")
5SFE Rear Main Seal
5SFE Oil Cooler (Refer to "Parts Information: Coolant Bypass Pipes")
3SGTE Oil Pan (Refer to "Parts Information: Oil Pan")
3SGTE Oil Dipstick assembly
5SFE Water Pump, Thermostat, Thermostat Housing (MR2's and Celica's should use the 91-93 MR2 5SFE water pump and thermostat housing AND 3S Thermostat.)
5SFE Coolant Hard lines aka Bypass Pipes from a Camry (See "Parts Information: Coolant Bypass Pipes")
3SGTE Igniter/Coil
3SGTE Rotor, Cap, Spark Plug Wires
3SGTE Distributor (Distributorless? Refer to "Parts Information: Distributorless?")
3SGTE 2bar MAP Sensor
3SGTE Exhaust Manifold
CT26/CT20b Turbo
Cold Spark Plugs
Upgraded Fuel Pump
ATS Racing's 5SGTE Head Gasket or 3SGTE Head Gasket (Refer to "Parts Information: Head Gasket")
5SGTE specific Pistons (manufacturers don’t list as 5SGE/5SGTE, may be listed as "5SFE block with 3SGTE head" or "5SFE/3SGTE Head")
3SGTE Connecting Rods
IAT Sensor (GM) (Optional but important for tuning)
Fuel Pressure Regulator
Blow Off Valve
3SGTE Standalone Engine Management System
Custom Down Pipe
Custom Cat-Back Exhaust
Custom Intercooler and Piping
Wiring Engine Harness parts (Refer to "Parts Information: Engine Wiring Harness")
MAT Sensor (Gen 3 cylinder head ONLY)
A Boost Controller (External Wastegate or Electronic Boost Controller)
This write-up is property of RichieRichJP
Recommendations:
Remove EGR system; purchase ATS EGR block-off plates (Refer to "Parts Information: Engine Management")
Remove the balance shaft from the 5sfe crankshaft. These are prone to destroy themselves which can result in a damaged block.
+98 5SFE Block. (Refer to "Parts Information: +1998 5SFE Block")
3SGTE ARP Head Studs, Main Studs
Oil Catch Can
Dual Core-Radiator
Custom Torque Rod
Electronic Boost Controller
ATS Intake Manifold Phenolic Spacer (TVIS delete) (Refer to "Parts Information: TVIS Delete")
Polyurethane Motor Mounts (replace rubber)
Toyota OEM Oil Filter 90915-YZZF1 (For larger oil capacity)
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Highly Recommended for +300hp:
CRW Racing Inner CV Joint Cages (not necessary for RWD/AWD applications)
ATS Racing Outer CV Joint Cages
Anti-Torque Rod


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Parts Information:
This section will provide minimal information as to why each part is required.
This write-up is property of RichieRichJP

Transmission Swap
If you do this hybrid motor swap, you should already have done the automatic to manual transmission swap.
For starters, I recommend getting the e153 transmission over the s54. Some people on this Camry forum believe that due to the longer gears, that it becomes a disadvantage versus the shorter geared s54 transmission. WRONG. I've seen track times posted over on MR2OC and there is in fact almost no difference on the 1/4" mile track times (1/10 second).
Depending on how much power you want to make, consider these two options when choosing your clutch:
Recommended: 3SGTE clutch and a modified OEM or AFTERMARKET 3S flywheel (elongated holes to fit 5S crank). The only aftermarket 3S flywheel that I know that is a direct fitment without requiring machine work is the 3SGTE Clutchmasters Flywheel. The downside is that it is very expensive, but if you buy a cheaper alternative (e.g. Fidanza), the cost will even out after the machine work. A 3SGTE clutch is recommended as it is larger and has a better holding capacity than the smaller 5SFE clutch.
Option 2: 5SFE clutch w/ 3SGTE spline, 5SFE flywheel - If you're going to have an entry level set up, this will do. It would be enough to get you by without having to spend the little extra to modify the flywheel. Use OEM 5SFE flywheel bolts. There's no need to use the 4AGE ARP FW bolts.
Also, you'll have to use a modified e153 axle carrier bearing if you use the e153 transmission. The holes don't exactly line up (pretty close) so you'll either have to bore it out more or get the thing welded altogether. I had the work done by someone else and I was told it was about an inch off, but another member on TN said that it was thousands of an inch off; obviously two very different measurements. The axle carrier bearings are cast so they are hard to weld! The best thing to do is to try and see if the axle carrier bearing will bolt up to the block prior to installing the motor.
Here is some additional information on the e153 transmissions are far as LSD and Non-LSD goes.
http://www.mr2oc.com/showthread.php?t=168907&highlight=non-lsd+lsd
This write-up is property of RichieRichJP

Transmission Swap Reference Information:
http://www.toyotanation.com/forum/showthread.php?t=204270&highlight=supercharged+5spd
http://www.1jz.com/camry/guide-trans.htm
http://www.toyotanation.com/forum/showthread.php?t=223602&highlight=v6+transmission+swap
http://www.toyotanation.com/forum/showthread.php?t=138538&highlight=solara+cables&page=2
http://www.toyotanation.com/forum/showthread.php?t=296415
Auto to manual swap
Mr2 and camry tranny
This write-up is property of RichieRichJP

E153 (LSD or Non-LSD) Transmission
If you use an aftermarket LSD, you can use either Non-lsd or LSD turbo axles.
If you use a factory LSD, you can only use factory turbo LSD axles.
Here are some differences between the MR2 and Solara e153 transmissions:
1. The location of the mounting bracket the holds the shifter cables to the transmission. The MR2 has them located on the slave cylinder bracket whereas the Solara has them mounted on the transmission case housing.
2. The speedometer driven gear is completely different between the MR2 and Solara. They have different style connectors.
3. Gear selector orientation appear opposite of each other on housings. The Solara E153 gear selector is setup for FWD drive and the MR2 E153's is setup for RWD.

If you sourced a MR2 e153 transmission, you'll either have to resell it or source a Solara e153 transmission to swap out the bell housings.
If the transmission you sourced from an MR2 is from a Gen 2, you'll have a mechanical speed sensor on it; the speed sensor will have to be swapped out to a Gen 3 MR2 electronic speed sensor or a Solara electronic speed sensor.
This write-up is property of RichieRichJP
The transmissions are essentially the same with the following exceptions:
The 91-92 e153 transmissions on the MR2 did not come with an LSD; the +93 e153's from an MR2 and Solara do.
If worn out, the 91-92 e153 transmissions have replaceable synchros (and internals). The dual synchros on the +93 e153 requires the transmission to be completely rebuilt.
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Oil Pump
The timing components, requires that you use 3S parts, which is a given because of the cylinder head. The Solara oil pump on the other hand is optional to a certain degree, but at the same time essential. You can go with a OEM 3SG(T)E oil pump, but you wouldn’t want to starve your engine of oil. The Solara oil pump has a gerotor that provides a higher flow and pressure.
Links are below for additional information:
oil pump swap
Turbo oil pump swap
Apparently in the 5SGTE set up, you pretty much have to have an upgraded oil pump.
In order to use this, you will also have to change the Crankshaft Timing Gear to a 3SGTE or 3SGE gear (The gear should be the same through all years). Reason being, the 3S timing gear has two less teeth (23 in total) so using 5S ones are no good. The gear is part number 13521-88360.
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Oil Pan
The oil pan must be modified on the flywheel side of the motor. The oil pan must be modified where it bolts to the rear end seal retainer because the connecting rods and rod bolts won't clear the oil pan. You need to cut that area of the oil pan out out and raise it about 1cm. Don't go all the way to the edge of the pan, leave at least .5cm-1cm of lip so you can bolt down and seal the oil pan with FIPG.
This write-up is property of RichieRichJP

Exhaust Manifold
For you guys that are going 5SFTE, this is something that I noticed that not a single 5SFTE thread has covered: what year exhaust manifold you’re supposed to use (5SFTE guys, use a ‘91-92 manifold!!!). The problem I found was that my custom manifold, which has the regular bolt pattern as the 5SFE, will not bolt to a +1993 3SGTE head. Only the early revision ’91-92 will work for the 5S because of the stud count on the head. Gen 2 has 7 studs, Gen 3 has 9 studs. I just wanted to throw that out there.
So if you decide to go with a Gen 3 3SGTE head, use Gen 3 3SGTE parts. But be warned, the aftermarket support isn’t as heavy as for the Gen 2.
This write-up is property of RichieRichJP

Intake Manifold
The intake manifold would be one of the most critical parts to get if you want to achieve a lot of power. It may not be so necessary to upgrade at a 300hp goal, but once you break that, you should probably look into getting an aftermarket one. ATS Racing makes intake manifolds for the 3SGTE, but they may not fit our Camry’s. I say may not because I haven’t test fitted any, but the information I have gathered by calling some shops and taking measurements may prove otherwise. The OEM 3SGTE intake manifold is smaller than any aftermarket one and should fit.
The problems that an aftermarket intake manifold may pose are clearances between the head and firewall, and if it does clear, the manifold might knock the firewall because of the torque during a gear shift. Plus MR2’s are built with a lot more room behind the engine so there are no clearance problems with the intake manifold whatsoever. You will have to have a shop custom fabricate one that is built more toward the cylinder head rather than outward toward the firewall. ATS sells the cheapest intake manifolds so I suggest you discuss this with them.
This write-up is property of RichieRichJP

Cylinder Head
The main purpose of going through with the set up in the first place, along with a block with more displacement, is for more power (potentially). The reason why I ditched the 5SFE head is from the several discussions with MR2OC members, EngineLogics, and ATS Racing. Through their experiences and having in-depth knowledge of the 5SFE cylinder heads we use, they’ve apparently ported and have done angle jobs with minimal to almost no potential improvement for a turbo set up. Yes, there are some very slight gains, but due to the angle on the ports and valves, there’s only so much the head is capable of doing. With that said, we already know that most of the power we get is from the cylinder head anyway, especially on a turbo set up where increased air volume/flow and fuel is essential. Right off the bat, the 3SGTE cylinder head outperforms the 5SFE head by almost double as far as air flow characteristics go. So if you decide to upgrade to a larger turbo or ‘big turbo’, you’ve saved yourself a lot of hassle rather than trying to upgrade the 5SFE head with overly-expensive custom parts. Meanwhile, those parts will still have limited output/improvement due to a bottlenecked cylinder head. Another positive side in swapping to a 3SGTE cylinder head is that you no longer have to try finding parts that no one has and the doors open to the world of aftermarket support. Also you’ll save money by not having to get custom spec parts (and more trying to get the measurements which no one seems to have i.e. valve stems). Wouldn’t it feel good to have the same aftermarket support as a Honda Civic and not be one of them?
Make sure you look at your upgrade options per generation (gen 2 or Gen 3) beforehand!
This write-up is property of RichieRichJP

Head Gasket
ATS Racing sells a 5sgte specific head gasket.
If you purchase a 3SGTE one, it has to be modified to match up with the water jackets drilled out on the block. This route is unreasonable and will just cost more money.
This write-up is property of RichieRichJP

Coolant Bypass Pipes
The coolant bypass pipes have to be modified to get coolant to and from the turbo. No big deal. I welded a tube/pipe on one of the bypass pipes to accommodate the -8an lines running to the turbo. Just remember, there are 2 different 5sfe Coolant bypass pipes. You need the coolant bypass pipes that has two outlets that run to/from the oil cooler. If your block doesn't have an oil cooler, then you have the wrong pipes (this is likely the case for +97 5SFE's).
This write-up is property of RichieRichJP

Water Pump
Click to go to post #61.
This write-up is property of RichieRichJP

TVIS Delete
Just word of caution: The ATS Phenolic spacer is made out of porous material so it soaks in oil (and over time will leak through) caused by reversion.
The spacer reduces air flow restriction and keeps the intake manifold off the head, essentially lowering intake air temperature.
This write-up is property of RichieRichJP

+1998 5SFE Block
If you want to put out high numbers with some good reinforcement, the +1998 5SFE block is definitely the way to go.
It has 1mm larger bore and thicker cylinder walls which won't require that you sleeve the block for high hp output.
The earlier 5SFE blocks (before 1998) are known to have a weak area by the water pump / cylinder area.
See the difference in the next post (with pictures) under "Reinforcement Differences."
This write-up is property of RichieRichJP

Engine Wiring Harness
Since there are many platforms out there that you guys are coming from, it will be up to you to find out what your pin-out is for your ECU.
All you should need are the three 3SGTE ECU connectors (plug A, B, and D - read Engine Management for more info) to convert from the 5SFE ECU connectors.
I recommend getting at least 6" pigtails on the 3SGTE connectors from Phoenix Tuning.
Verify your sensors and connectors to make sure they are the same and have the same number of wires here: 3SGTE Engine Harness Connectors. Mouseover to get the name of the connector as included in the URL.
The only things you will need to wire are the fuel injectors.
Fuel injector wires are straightforward - striped wire to striped, solid to solid.
You will only use one o2 sensor.
This write-up is property of RichieRichJP

Engine Management
You will need a 3SGTE-based ECU for tuning. Do not get this confused with a OEM 3SGTE ECU!!
From information I have gathered, you must run a Full Standalone EMS, such as the AEM EMS.
This write-up is property of RichieRichJP

Since the AEM EMS is a plug-n-play ECU on the MR2, I recommend that you follow the four ECU connectors as according to the AEM EMS diagrams 30-1120 (gen 2) and 30-1121 (gen 3). Note that Plug C is reserved for extras so you will NOT actually be using that plug for anything. You will essentially be only using Plug A, B, and D.
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Distributorless?
Replace the distributor with a cam sensor and trigger wheel setup! Racer X Fab 1ZZ COP Conversion kit
Further information found here: Rebuilding the 3SGTE (Ref. pg.3 and pg. 7)
This write-up is property of RichieRichJP

Cylinder Head Studs
ARP Head Stud Install
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Additional Information
- If you're using an AEM EMS, you must run the IACV hose to a boosted source (intercooler piping after turbo).
- The coolant lines running to and from the IACV and throttle body can be closed/capped off.
- This does not require custom motor mounts.
- Don't need oil squirters; they aren't necessary and only come on a 3S block.
- Run the oil feed line to the turbo without an oil restrictor.
- The full standalone will ignore complications concerning the removal of the EGR system.
This write-up is property of RichieRichJP

Other Informational Links:
How to put a 3S-GTE head on a 5SFE Block
How to Build a 5SGTE
http://www.koracing.net/viewarticle.php?article=6
Project 5S-GE Gen 3 Head 94 5SFE Celica Block - Part 1
Project 5S-GE Gen 3 Head 94 5SFE Celica Block - Part 2
Project 5S-GE Gen 3 Head 94 5SFE Celica Block - Part 3
5S-GTE thread repost…
Start of 5SGTE build (Documenting the process)
This write-up is property of RichieRichJP


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Aftermarket Parts and Services:
ATS Racing
Hux Racing USA, 3413 Coosa County Rd. 511, Goodwater, AL 35072 (256-839-1027)
WolfKatz
RacerXFabrication
Phoenix Tuning
MR2OC Buy/Sell Forum Buyer Beware!
This write-up is property of RichieRichJP

Toyota Dealer OEM Parts
The following dealers offer deep discounts on their parts:
West Coast: Aaron @ Toyota of Lithia: http://www.lithiatoyotaparts.com/partlocator/index.cfm?siteid=215542
South-East: Gary @ Toyota of Newnan: PM ToyotaPartsMan or (770) 502-1333
This write-up is property of RichieRichJP


Thanks to Wraith, Swegyptian, Rdizzle (and others for their write-ups and questions) for providing some of this information!
Big thanks to those at MR2OC for providing the wealth of the knowledge and being helpful members for the Toyota community!
Allen Serban and EEngineer are ***gots.
This write-up is property of RichieRichJP
 
Joined
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3,030 Posts
Discussion Starter #2 (Edited)
Space reserved for future added information.

Block Differences
Here are the differences in the decks on the blocks. Notice the difference of the water jackets.


5SFE Block (provided by presure2 from 6gc.net)



3SGTE Block (Borrowed from turbomr2.com)



5SGTE Prepped Block from a 1995 MR2 (provided by me)



5SGTE Prepped Block from a 1998 Camry (provided by me)



Reinforcement Differences (provided by me)
Located directly behind where the water pump mounts onto the block.
Non-reinforced blocks are known to crack by that cylinder at around 500whp.



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Proof?
It's a myth for a 5SGTE or a 3SGTE to achieve 500hp in the Camry community.
MR2ownersclub.com has records with some dyno graphs.
http://www.mr2ownersclub.com/mr2records/dyno.htm

Here are a few videos:





 

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Registered
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855 Posts
sticky for sure.

This will be great for those that always ask "What can I do to mod my Gen3 Camry"
 

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TN Pussy Man
Camry
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13,302 Posts
haven't read through all of it yet, but stickied it anyway :p: :thumbup:
 

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Registered
1995 Vienta Touring
Joined
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465 Posts
Which part? Is it something that wasn't worded clearly or just something complicated?
I just checked through... can't see the part I was referring to... :(

Nothing major, there was a sentence and a bit of structure about what engine you were referring to, which wasn't clear. I re-read it and was fine from reading the sentence prior. It's all good otherwise :)
 

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The womaneater!!!!!!!!!!!
camry gen4th
Joined
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432 Posts
This is a good discussion. I ran into the same problem of the 3sgte manifold to 5sfe head. from all the previous threads I had searched they really don't say anything about the years that are compatible..........Good stuff.:D
 

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Nostalgia Member
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6,609 Posts
good write-up ... i had thought about keeping the engine out of my car, and doing a GE head as an NA project just for fun, not for big numbers or anything
 
Joined
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3,030 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
good write-up ... i had thought about keeping the engine out of my car, and doing a GE head as an NA project just for fun, not for big numbers or anything
Venom,
I actually read some posts over on MR2OC and some people have went N/A with this set up. Apparently those people were pulling out some VERY disappointing numbers. I think somewhere in the range of 165-180hp was what people were getting. If you can get all of the parts cheap and do the work yourself, it could be a worth while project.
 
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3,030 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
I also want to add that for everyone on a budget, definitely check out the MR2OC for sale forums. You can always find parted out projects and NEW motor builds for so much cheaper than having the shop do it for you. I've seen complete motor builds sell for easily +$2000 less than it would cost altogether. If anything, I would shop on there for a good while because eventually the part you want will probably put up on there for significantly less. There are lots of vendor group buys and discounts too that will save you money.
 

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"I BUILD SLEEPERS"
2014 4Runner TEP
Joined
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2,558 Posts
you can get a 3s-gte head gasket and trim it to 88mm or whatever bore your trying to run...

this has been done countless of time over at the honda forum...
 

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Nostalgia Member
Joined
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6,609 Posts
yea, i figured youd make in the 180-200whp ballpark with an NA build ... but really id just want an engine that screams and idles like a monster if i was going to do a 5S-GE setup
 

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Camryshowoff97
97 Camry
Joined
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92 Posts
So if I plan to do this build on a 97 Camry, I would need to use the gen3 head for the 3s? Id just have to get the water jackets machined and match the head gasket? If I go through with it Im looking at doing a full build while its apart. JE pistons, Carillo rods and then some head work. Any info about it would be appreciated. I was planning on doing a turbo setup on the 5s anyway so I have no problem with running a return fuel line to accomodate a FPR since the 97 5s had a returnless system anyway. Thanks again for any info about the head matching.
 
Joined
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3,030 Posts
Discussion Starter #20 (Edited)
Personally, I would use a 2nd Gen, but you can use a 3rd Gen. Make sure you read closely to everything I wrote as it can be very confusing. Also, check the links and give those garages a call.
Yes for the jackets and gaskets. Then you have to get stroker spec pistons, 3S rods and the crank machined, then the crank gear.
What's required for a basic build is listed!
 
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