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Discussion Starter #1
Not sure why I just recently noticed this (maybe because I just changed
the oil for the first time not long ago) but I think it sucks.

My truck (2005 V8 std cab Tundra) has the panel with the tach, oil
pressure, voltage etc. The manual is vague about a low oil pressure
light with this particular dash arrangement but suggested if there's a
gauge that a warning buzzer might be installed too. No light comes on
during the initial key to on when all the other lights test. The tech at
the dealer told me there is nothing except the gauge - no light and no
buzzer. I think it's borderline irresponsible for them to have done
this. I've had vehicles with gauges, but they always had a light as
well because a light will catch your attention a lot quicker than a
slowly fading gauge.

Just a rant.

Nate

--
*********************************************
Why is it all the sensors seeking intelligent
life are pointed away from earth?
*********************************************
 
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Discussion Starter #2
"N Williamson" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]
> Not sure why I just recently noticed this (maybe because I just changed
> the oil for the first time not long ago) but I think it sucks.
>
> My truck (2005 V8 std cab Tundra) has the panel with the tach, oil
> pressure, voltage etc. The manual is vague about a low oil pressure
> light with this particular dash arrangement but suggested if there's a
> gauge that a warning buzzer might be installed too. No light comes on
> during the initial key to on when all the other lights test. The tech at
> the dealer told me there is nothing except the gauge - no light and no
> buzzer. I think it's borderline irresponsible for them to have done
> this. I've had vehicles with gauges, but they always had a light as
> well because a light will catch your attention a lot quicker than a
> slowly fading gauge.
>
> Just a rant.
>
> Nate
>
> --
> *********************************************
> Why is it all the sensors seeking intelligent
> life are pointed away from earth?
> *********************************************


If your that concerned why not add a warning light yourself. Very easy job
to carry out, I would only add a light not a buzzer due to the fact that
every time you sit idle with the motor off and ignition on it will drive ya
batty. Use a superbright LED as that WILL get your attention if angled
correctly.
If your unsure about installation repost and Im sure that relevant info will
be posted for you.
 
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Discussion Starter #3
There is a Low Engine Oil Pressure Warning Light, check your owner's
manual - section 1-6, page 175

Looks like a little oil can

From the manual:
This light warns that the engine oil pressure is too low. If it flickers or
stays on while you are driving, pull off the road to a safe place and stop
the engine immediately. Call a Toyota dealer or qualified repair shop for
assistance.
The light may occasionally flicker when the engine is idling or it may come
on briefly after a hard stop. There is no cause for concern if it then goes
out when the engine is accelerated slightly.
The light may come on when the oil level is extremely low. It is not
designed to indicate low oil level, and the oil level must be checked using
the level dipstick.

"N Williamson" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]
> Not sure why I just recently noticed this (maybe because I just changed
> the oil for the first time not long ago) but I think it sucks.
>
> My truck (2005 V8 std cab Tundra) has the panel with the tach, oil
> pressure, voltage etc. The manual is vague about a low oil pressure
> light with this particular dash arrangement but suggested if there's a
> gauge that a warning buzzer might be installed too. No light comes on
> during the initial key to on when all the other lights test. The tech at
> the dealer told me there is nothing except the gauge - no light and no
> buzzer. I think it's borderline irresponsible for them to have done
> this. I've had vehicles with gauges, but they always had a light as
> well because a light will catch your attention a lot quicker than a
> slowly fading gauge.
>
> Just a rant.
>
> Nate
>
> --
> *********************************************
> Why is it all the sensors seeking intelligent
> life are pointed away from earth?
> *********************************************
 
N

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Discussion Starter #4
In article <[email protected]>,
"Glenn Arsenault" <[email protected]> wrote:

> There is a Low Engine Oil Pressure Warning Light, check your owner's
> manual - section 1-6, page 175
>
> Looks like a little oil can
>
>
> From the manual:
> This light warns that the engine oil pressure is too low. If it flickers or
> stays on while you are driving, pull off the road to a safe place and stop
> the engine immediately. Call a Toyota dealer or qualified repair shop for
> assistance.
> The light may occasionally flicker when the engine is idling or it may come
> on briefly after a hard stop. There is no cause for concern if it then goes
> out when the engine is accelerated slightly.
> The light may come on when the oil level is extremely low. It is not
> designed to indicate low oil level, and the oil level must be checked using
> the level dipstick.


I had read the section you mention before and therein lies the
confusion. There's a caveat about the light if the panel is like mine
with Oil Pressure gauge - and it's referenced later in the same chapter
(if memory serves).

When the ignition is first turned on you get the barrage of lights etc.
There is no Oil Light, nor is there a Low Fuel light, but I know in fact
it has an operable Low Fuel light. That's what prompted me to ask the
dealer maint tech. I was thinking. "Gee, maybe they dispensed with the
Oil Pressure light test when the ignition is turned on." and I was told
if there is a gauge, there is no light. If there were a light I would
expect it to test when the ignition is turned on like they do on all
other gauge equipped vehicles I've driven.

Could be the tech was wrong and I do not have immediate access to the
manual, but I'll re-look tomorrow.

Nate

--
*********************************************
Why is it all the sensors seeking intelligent
life are pointed away from earth?
*********************************************
 
N

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Discussion Starter #5
In article <[email protected]>,
"Scotty" <[email protected]> wrote:

> "N Williamson" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]
> > Not sure why I just recently noticed this (maybe because I just changed
> > the oil for the first time not long ago) but I think it sucks.
> >
> > My truck (2005 V8 std cab Tundra) has the panel with the tach, oil
> > pressure, voltage etc. The manual is vague about a low oil pressure
> > light with this particular dash arrangement but suggested if there's a
> > gauge that a warning buzzer might be installed too. No light comes on
> > during the initial key to on when all the other lights test. The tech at
> > the dealer told me there is nothing except the gauge - no light and no
> > buzzer. I think it's borderline irresponsible for them to have done
> > this. I've had vehicles with gauges, but they always had a light as
> > well because a light will catch your attention a lot quicker than a
> > slowly fading gauge.
> >
> > Just a rant.
> >
> > Nate

>
> If your that concerned why not add a warning light yourself. Very easy job
> to carry out, I would only add a light not a buzzer due to the fact that
> every time you sit idle with the motor off and ignition on it will drive ya
> batty. Use a superbright LED as that WILL get your attention if angled
> correctly.
> If your unsure about installation repost and Im sure that relevant info will
> be posted for you.


I actually am concerned about it to a degree. For the time it's under
warranty, no big deal other than the inconvenience a failure would
cause. Years ago my brother in law had a similar panel set up on an SUV
and the pressure slowly went down. He didn't pick up on it and it
toasted his engine...as you might expect.

I had asked the dealer about that and was told all the engine functions
feed through some kind of master circuit panel/analyzer and it would be
colossal pain in the ass to install one. As my electrical experience is
limited to installing car stereos etc, I'm squeamish about tackling it.
I may have some after market shop do it though.

I may pop in with a request down the road when I'm in a better position
to actually do it.

Thanks.

--
*********************************************
Why is it all the sensors seeking intelligent
life are pointed away from earth?
*********************************************
 
S

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Discussion Starter #6
On Fri, 03 Mar 2006 21:13:05 -0800, N Williamson <[email protected]>
wrote:

>In article <[email protected]>,
> "Scotty" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> "N Williamson" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]
>> > Not sure why I just recently noticed this (maybe because I just changed
>> > the oil for the first time not long ago) but I think it sucks.
>> >
>> > My truck (2005 V8 std cab Tundra) has the panel with the tach, oil
>> > pressure, voltage etc. The manual is vague about a low oil pressure
>> > light with this particular dash arrangement but suggested if there's a
>> > gauge that a warning buzzer might be installed too. No light comes on
>> > during the initial key to on when all the other lights test. The tech at
>> > the dealer told me there is nothing except the gauge - no light and no
>> > buzzer. I think it's borderline irresponsible for them to have done
>> > this. I've had vehicles with gauges, but they always had a light as
>> > well because a light will catch your attention a lot quicker than a
>> > slowly fading gauge.
>> >
>> > Just a rant.
>> >
>> > Nate

>>


My Tundra has the gauges but also an oil light that looks like the
Aladdin's lamp. I see it every time I start the car. You probably
have one, it just doesn't work. Go over your manual, find it and head
back to the dealer with chapter and verse.

Skip
 
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Discussion Starter #7
"N Williamson" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]
> In article <[email protected]>,
> "Scotty" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> "N Williamson" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]
>> > Not sure why I just recently noticed this (maybe because I just changed
>> > the oil for the first time not long ago) but I think it sucks.
>> >
>> > My truck (2005 V8 std cab Tundra) has the panel with the tach, oil
>> > pressure, voltage etc. The manual is vague about a low oil pressure
>> > light with this particular dash arrangement but suggested if there's a
>> > gauge that a warning buzzer might be installed too. No light comes on
>> > during the initial key to on when all the other lights test. The tech
>> > at
>> > the dealer told me there is nothing except the gauge - no light and no
>> > buzzer. I think it's borderline irresponsible for them to have done
>> > this. I've had vehicles with gauges, but they always had a light as
>> > well because a light will catch your attention a lot quicker than a
>> > slowly fading gauge.
>> >
>> > Just a rant.
>> >
>> > Nate

>>
>> If your that concerned why not add a warning light yourself. Very easy
>> job
>> to carry out, I would only add a light not a buzzer due to the fact that
>> every time you sit idle with the motor off and ignition on it will drive
>> ya
>> batty. Use a superbright LED as that WILL get your attention if angled
>> correctly.
>> If your unsure about installation repost and Im sure that relevant info
>> will
>> be posted for you.

>
> I actually am concerned about it to a degree. For the time it's under
> warranty, no big deal other than the inconvenience a failure would
> cause. Years ago my brother in law had a similar panel set up on an SUV
> and the pressure slowly went down. He didn't pick up on it and it
> toasted his engine...as you might expect.
>
> I had asked the dealer about that and was told all the engine functions
> feed through some kind of master circuit panel/analyzer and it would be
> colossal pain in the ass to install one. As my electrical experience is
> limited to installing car stereos etc, I'm squeamish about tackling it.
> I may have some after market shop do it though.
>
> I may pop in with a request down the road when I'm in a better position
> to actually do it.
>
> Thanks.
>
> --
> *********************************************
> Why is it all the sensors seeking intelligent
> life are pointed away from earth?
> *********************************************


Where your oil pressure gauge connects to the engine block buy a double
adapter for the hole and run a seperate oil pressure switch. Wire directly
to a nice bright LED somewhere in your vision and use completely independant
of any other system.

Scotty
 
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Discussion Starter #8
On Thu, 02 Mar 2006 21:56:55 -0800, N Williamson <[email protected]>
wrote:
> No light comes on
>during the initial key to on when all the other lights test. The tech at
>the dealer told me there is nothing except the gauge - no light and no
>buzzer. I think it's borderline irresponsible for them to have done
>this. I've had vehicles with gauges, but they always had a light as
>well because a light will catch your attention a lot quicker than a
>slowly fading gauge.


My wife blew up a 300ZX with a digital dash in this exact manner.

She didn't know what the numbers meant. <G>
 
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Discussion Starter #9
N Williamson wrote:
> In article <[email protected]>,
> "Glenn Arsenault" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>>There is a Low Engine Oil Pressure Warning Light, check your owner's
>>manual - section 1-6, page 175
>>
>>Looks like a little oil can
>>
>>
>>From the manual:
>>This light warns that the engine oil pressure is too low. If it flickers or
>>stays on while you are driving, pull off the road to a safe place and stop
>>the engine immediately. Call a Toyota dealer or qualified repair shop for
>>assistance.
>>The light may occasionally flicker when the engine is idling or it may come
>>on briefly after a hard stop. There is no cause for concern if it then goes
>>out when the engine is accelerated slightly.
>>The light may come on when the oil level is extremely low. It is not
>>designed to indicate low oil level, and the oil level must be checked using
>>the level dipstick.

>
>
> I had read the section you mention before and therein lies the
> confusion. There's a caveat about the light if the panel is like mine
> with Oil Pressure gauge - and it's referenced later in the same chapter
> (if memory serves).
>
> When the ignition is first turned on you get the barrage of lights etc.
> There is no Oil Light, nor is there a Low Fuel light, but I know in fact
> it has an operable Low Fuel light. That's what prompted me to ask the
> dealer maint tech. I was thinking. "Gee, maybe they dispensed with the
> Oil Pressure light test when the ignition is turned on." and I was told
> if there is a gauge, there is no light. If there were a light I would
> expect it to test when the ignition is turned on like they do on all
> other gauge equipped vehicles I've driven.
>
> Could be the tech was wrong and I do not have immediate access to the
> manual, but I'll re-look tomorrow.
>
> Nate


Nothing to do with the "missing" oil pressure light, but I remember the
first car my dad bought that had a light and no oil pressure gauge. He
installed a gauge! Being a pilot during WWII, he was very aware of what
was went on under the hood and would scan the gauges for any changes.
Kind of like the way we watch the temperature gauge when pulling a
trailer up a long hill.

Anyway, one day he took the oil light sensor to the airport and checked
it on a pressure tester; he found out the light came on when the oil
pressure got down to 2 psi. He said that it was about 10 psi too low "to
his way of thinking." He said the light only came on when it was too late.

Dad didn't coin the term "Idiot Light," but he always thought it was
appropriate.

BTW, Mom said he installed safety belts in their brand new '49 Buick,
she said she was so embarrassed, her friends asked her if she planed to
fly her car... :>))
--
Tom - Vista, CA
 
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Discussion Starter #10
Bonehenge wrote:
> On Thu, 02 Mar 2006 21:56:55 -0800, N Williamson <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
>> No light comes on
>>during the initial key to on when all the other lights test. The tech at
>>the dealer told me there is nothing except the gauge - no light and no
>>buzzer. I think it's borderline irresponsible for them to have done
>>this. I've had vehicles with gauges, but they always had a light as
>>well because a light will catch your attention a lot quicker than a
>>slowly fading gauge.

>
>
> My wife blew up a 300ZX with a digital dash in this exact manner.
>
> She didn't know what the numbers meant. <G>


Oops, someone forgot to explain the gauges to her. Probably a little
training session would have gone a long way... :>))
--
Tom - Vista, CA
 
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Discussion Starter #11
In article <[email protected]>,
Skip <[email protected]> wrote:

> On Fri, 03 Mar 2006 21:13:05 -0800, N Williamson <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
> >In article <[email protected]>,
> > "Scotty" <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> >> "N Williamson" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >> news:[email protected]
> >> > Not sure why I just recently noticed this (maybe because I just changed
> >> > the oil for the first time not long ago) but I think it sucks.
> >> >
> >> > My truck (2005 V8 std cab Tundra) has the panel with the tach, oil
> >> > pressure, voltage etc. The manual is vague about a low oil pressure
> >> > light with this particular dash arrangement but suggested if there's a
> >> > gauge that a warning buzzer might be installed too. No light comes on
> >> > during the initial key to on when all the other lights test. The tech at
> >> > the dealer told me there is nothing except the gauge - no light and no
> >> > buzzer. I think it's borderline irresponsible for them to have done
> >> > this. I've had vehicles with gauges, but they always had a light as
> >> > well because a light will catch your attention a lot quicker than a
> >> > slowly fading gauge.
> >> >
> >> > Just a rant.
> >> >
> >> > Nate
> >>

>
> My Tundra has the gauges but also an oil light that looks like the
> Aladdin's lamp. I see it every time I start the car. You probably
> have one, it just doesn't work. Go over your manual, find it and head
> back to the dealer with chapter and verse.
>
> Skip


Is your Tundra a 2005?

Where on the dash is your light? The manual simply groups all the
warning/service lights as '1'. I tried before to use a flashlight to
highlight the light by looking at an angle and saw the others but no
luck with the oil press light.

Thanks.

Nate

--
*********************************************
Why is it all the sensors seeking intelligent
life are pointed away from earth?
*********************************************
 
N

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Discussion Starter #12
In article <[email protected]>,
"Scotty" <[email protected]> wrote:

> "N Williamson" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]
> > In article <[email protected]>,
> > "Scotty" <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> >> "N Williamson" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >> news:[email protected]
> >> > Not sure why I just recently noticed this (maybe because I just changed
> >> > the oil for the first time not long ago) but I think it sucks.
> >> >
> >> > My truck (2005 V8 std cab Tundra) has the panel with the tach, oil
> >> > pressure, voltage etc. The manual is vague about a low oil pressure
> >> > light with this particular dash arrangement but suggested if there's a
> >> > gauge that a warning buzzer might be installed too. No light comes on
> >> > during the initial key to on when all the other lights test. The tech
> >> > at
> >> > the dealer told me there is nothing except the gauge - no light and no
> >> > buzzer. I think it's borderline irresponsible for them to have done
> >> > this. I've had vehicles with gauges, but they always had a light as
> >> > well because a light will catch your attention a lot quicker than a
> >> > slowly fading gauge.
> >> >
> >> > Just a rant.
> >> >
> >> > Nate
> >>
> >> If your that concerned why not add a warning light yourself. Very easy
> >> job
> >> to carry out, I would only add a light not a buzzer due to the fact that
> >> every time you sit idle with the motor off and ignition on it will drive
> >> ya
> >> batty. Use a superbright LED as that WILL get your attention if angled
> >> correctly.
> >> If your unsure about installation repost and Im sure that relevant info
> >> will
> >> be posted for you.

> >
> > I actually am concerned about it to a degree. For the time it's under
> > warranty, no big deal other than the inconvenience a failure would
> > cause. Years ago my brother in law had a similar panel set up on an SUV
> > and the pressure slowly went down. He didn't pick up on it and it
> > toasted his engine...as you might expect.
> >
> > I had asked the dealer about that and was told all the engine functions
> > feed through some kind of master circuit panel/analyzer and it would be
> > colossal pain in the ass to install one. As my electrical experience is
> > limited to installing car stereos etc, I'm squeamish about tackling it.
> > I may have some after market shop do it though.
> >
> > I may pop in with a request down the road when I'm in a better position
> > to actually do it.
> >
> > Thanks.
> >
> > --
> > *********************************************
> > Why is it all the sensors seeking intelligent
> > life are pointed away from earth?
> > *********************************************

>
> Where your oil pressure gauge connects to the engine block buy a double
> adapter for the hole and run a seperate oil pressure switch. Wire directly
> to a nice bright LED somewhere in your vision and use completely independant
> of any other system.
>
> Scotty


I'll look into that - thank you.
 
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Discussion Starter #13
In article <[email protected]>, TOM <[email protected]> wrote:

> N Williamson wrote:
> > In article <[email protected]>,
> > "Glenn Arsenault" <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> >
> >>There is a Low Engine Oil Pressure Warning Light, check your owner's
> >>manual - section 1-6, page 175
> >>
> >>Looks like a little oil can
> >>
> >>
> >>From the manual:
> >>This light warns that the engine oil pressure is too low. If it flickers or
> >>stays on while you are driving, pull off the road to a safe place and stop
> >>the engine immediately. Call a Toyota dealer or qualified repair shop for
> >>assistance.
> >>The light may occasionally flicker when the engine is idling or it may come
> >>on briefly after a hard stop. There is no cause for concern if it then goes
> >>out when the engine is accelerated slightly.
> >>The light may come on when the oil level is extremely low. It is not
> >>designed to indicate low oil level, and the oil level must be checked using
> >>the level dipstick.

> >
> >
> > I had read the section you mention before and therein lies the
> > confusion. There's a caveat about the light if the panel is like mine
> > with Oil Pressure gauge - and it's referenced later in the same chapter
> > (if memory serves).
> >
> > When the ignition is first turned on you get the barrage of lights etc.
> > There is no Oil Light, nor is there a Low Fuel light, but I know in fact
> > it has an operable Low Fuel light. That's what prompted me to ask the
> > dealer maint tech. I was thinking. "Gee, maybe they dispensed with the
> > Oil Pressure light test when the ignition is turned on." and I was told
> > if there is a gauge, there is no light. If there were a light I would
> > expect it to test when the ignition is turned on like they do on all
> > other gauge equipped vehicles I've driven.
> >
> > Could be the tech was wrong and I do not have immediate access to the
> > manual, but I'll re-look tomorrow.
> >
> > Nate

>
> Nothing to do with the "missing" oil pressure light, but I remember the
> first car my dad bought that had a light and no oil pressure gauge. He
> installed a gauge! Being a pilot during WWII, he was very aware of what
> was went on under the hood and would scan the gauges for any changes.
> Kind of like the way we watch the temperature gauge when pulling a
> trailer up a long hill.
>
> Anyway, one day he took the oil light sensor to the airport and checked
> it on a pressure tester; he found out the light came on when the oil
> pressure got down to 2 psi. He said that it was about 10 psi too low "to
> his way of thinking." He said the light only came on when it was too late.
>
> Dad didn't coin the term "Idiot Light," but he always thought it was
> appropriate.
>
> BTW, Mom said he installed safety belts in their brand new '49 Buick,
> she said she was so embarrassed, her friends asked her if she planed to
> fly her car... :>))


LOL!! Well, Mort Taylor did one, so it's not *too* crazy ;)

http://vintagecars.about.com/od/historygreatmoments/a/flycars.htm

Some similarities here. I fly helicopters for a living and have been
for 29 years now. All machines have a light and many also have a gauge.
I can't tell you how many times I've introduced an engine oil
malfunction (in the simulator) initiated by a slow decrease in pressure.
Excepting for 2 pilot crews, 99% of the time it goes unnoticed until the
light comes on. It's just how we are. Imagine yourself in rush hour
traffic (as I was in passing thru LA the other day - OMG!!). How often
do any of us even look at the gauges, speedo, fuel, etc? And that's how
it should be...we need to look outside in these and most cases.

Just my thoughts.

Nate

--
*********************************************
Why is it all the sensors seeking intelligent
life are pointed away from earth?
*********************************************
 
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Discussion Starter #14
In article <[email protected]>,
Bonehenge <[email protected]> wrote:

> On Thu, 02 Mar 2006 21:56:55 -0800, N Williamson <[email protected]m>
> wrote:
> > No light comes on
> >during the initial key to on when all the other lights test. The tech at
> >the dealer told me there is nothing except the gauge - no light and no
> >buzzer. I think it's borderline irresponsible for them to have done
> >this. I've had vehicles with gauges, but they always had a light as
> >well because a light will catch your attention a lot quicker than a
> >slowly fading gauge.

>
> My wife blew up a 300ZX with a digital dash in this exact manner.
>
> She didn't know what the numbers meant. <G>


Ouch!
 
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Discussion Starter #15
In article <[email protected]>, TOM <[email protected]> wrote:

> Bonehenge wrote:
> > On Thu, 02 Mar 2006 21:56:55 -0800, N Williamson <[email protected]>
> > wrote:
> >
> >> No light comes on
> >>during the initial key to on when all the other lights test. The tech at
> >>the dealer told me there is nothing except the gauge - no light and no
> >>buzzer. I think it's borderline irresponsible for them to have done
> >>this. I've had vehicles with gauges, but they always had a light as
> >>well because a light will catch your attention a lot quicker than a
> >>slowly fading gauge.

> >
> >
> > My wife blew up a 300ZX with a digital dash in this exact manner.
> >
> > She didn't know what the numbers meant. <G>

>
> Oops, someone forgot to explain the gauges to her. Probably a little
> training session would have gone a long way... :>))


Perhaps so, but this further emphasizes the ease of understanding lights
more so than a gauge. We're all probably automotive/vehicle enthusiasts
if we're in here or another like group so it's easy for us to
understand. Oil pressure? What is oil? Huh? I don't understand...why
can't it be 5? But you just said if it goes low I should pull over and
now you're saying it can be low but if I give it gas and it goes up it's
OK? How much gas?
Gawd...I can't imagine it.

My solution?

RED = pull over now and shut it off.

AMBER = when time permits and its convenient, pull over and check things
out, look at the manual, have a smoke, yadda, yadda, yadda...

Training session over. Short and sweet.
 
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Discussion Starter #16
>
>Is your Tundra a 2005?
>
>Where on the dash is your light? The manual simply groups all the
>warning/service lights as '1'. I tried before to use a flashlight to
>highlight the light by looking at an angle and saw the others but no
>luck with the oil press light.
>
>Thanks.
>
>Nate


Oops. Disregard. I typed Tundra but was thinking of my other truck.
Sorry for the error.

Skip
 
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Discussion Starter #17
On Sat, 04 Mar 2006 16:16:54 -0800, TOM <[email protected]> wrote:

>Oops, someone forgot to explain the gauges to her. Probably a little
>training session would have gone a long way... :>))


She wasn't my wife yet. I had just started dating her and got to be
the person who found her a used engine and someone trustworthy to
install it. It wasn't exactly a thankless job... ;^)
 
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Discussion Starter #18
On Sat, 04 Mar 2006 20:30:50 -0800, N Williamson <[email protected]>
wrote:

>
>Perhaps so, but this further emphasizes the ease of understanding lights
>more so than a gauge.


Exactly. My wife's 300 had one of the earliest digital dashes. These
were covered with LED displayed numbers. So many numbers, that the
information gets lost. Did we really care if we had 9.5 gallons of
gas or 9.1? <G> Newer digital dashes either display bar graphs,
change the number color, or totally hide it unless it's not inside the
normal range.

Modern planes, locomotives, and even some road vehicles have gone to
the "silent / dark" concept, where the computer hides normally reading
instruments unless asked for a readout. If the instrument goes out of
range, a master alarm is sounded and the instrument is displayed. This
is an excellent example of the number AND light concept, developed to
perfection.

I'm also all for round gauges with colored ranges AND a light that
comes on when things are critical. I fly aircraft (fixed wing, not
"bugs" like the other poster to this thread. <G>), and needles in the
wrong place stick out in my scan, while digital numbers often don't.
Our better digital gauges have multi-color bar graphs in addition to
the numbers. The numbers are for fine tuning, but you can quickly
scan the color. Critical readings, like critically low oil pressure,
alternator failures, high CHT, etc... also bring a nice, bright light.

For needle gauges, I don't care if it's 15 or 25, just that the needle
is pointing approximately where it should be. That's why race cars
often have the gauges rotated so that the normal range is straight up.
If a needle isn't straight up, you inspect it more closely.

To the helicopter instructor:
Do your simulators have colored ranges on the gauges, or simply
digital numbers or a black steam gauge face, and a bottom limit light?

The aircraft I typically fly have a colored background and sometimes
even a dot at normal, making them extremely easy to notice a change
during a scan. It's surprising to me that a helo would have an oil
pressure gauge that's so easy to miss trends. It seems that if that
99% of the students miss the failure, it's time for a redesigned
gauge. <G>
 
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Discussion Starter #19
N Williamson wrote:
> In article <[email protected]>, TOM <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>>N Williamson wrote:
>>
>>>In article <[email protected]>,
>>> "Glenn Arsenault" <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>There is a Low Engine Oil Pressure Warning Light, check your owner's
>>>>manual - section 1-6, page 175
>>>>
>>>>Looks like a little oil can
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>>From the manual:
>>>
>>>>This light warns that the engine oil pressure is too low. If it flickers or
>>>>stays on while you are driving, pull off the road to a safe place and stop
>>>>the engine immediately. Call a Toyota dealer or qualified repair shop for
>>>>assistance.
>>>>The light may occasionally flicker when the engine is idling or it may come
>>>>on briefly after a hard stop. There is no cause for concern if it then goes
>>>>out when the engine is accelerated slightly.
>>>>The light may come on when the oil level is extremely low. It is not
>>>>designed to indicate low oil level, and the oil level must be checked using
>>>>the level dipstick.
>>>
>>>
>>>I had read the section you mention before and therein lies the
>>>confusion. There's a caveat about the light if the panel is like mine
>>>with Oil Pressure gauge - and it's referenced later in the same chapter
>>>(if memory serves).
>>>
>>>When the ignition is first turned on you get the barrage of lights etc.
>>>There is no Oil Light, nor is there a Low Fuel light, but I know in fact
>>>it has an operable Low Fuel light. That's what prompted me to ask the
>>>dealer maint tech. I was thinking. "Gee, maybe they dispensed with the
>>>Oil Pressure light test when the ignition is turned on." and I was told
>>>if there is a gauge, there is no light. If there were a light I would
>>>expect it to test when the ignition is turned on like they do on all
>>>other gauge equipped vehicles I've driven.
>>>
>>>Could be the tech was wrong and I do not have immediate access to the
>>>manual, but I'll re-look tomorrow.
>>>
>>>Nate

>>
>>Nothing to do with the "missing" oil pressure light, but I remember the
>>first car my dad bought that had a light and no oil pressure gauge. He
>>installed a gauge! Being a pilot during WWII, he was very aware of what
>>was went on under the hood and would scan the gauges for any changes.
>>Kind of like the way we watch the temperature gauge when pulling a
>>trailer up a long hill.
>>
>>Anyway, one day he took the oil light sensor to the airport and checked
>>it on a pressure tester; he found out the light came on when the oil
>>pressure got down to 2 psi. He said that it was about 10 psi too low "to
>>his way of thinking." He said the light only came on when it was too late.
>>
>>Dad didn't coin the term "Idiot Light," but he always thought it was
>>appropriate.
>>
>>BTW, Mom said he installed safety belts in their brand new '49 Buick,
>>she said she was so embarrassed, her friends asked her if she planed to
>>fly her car... :>))

>
>
> LOL!! Well, Mort Taylor did one, so it's not *too* crazy ;)
>
> http://vintagecars.about.com/od/historygreatmoments/a/flycars.htm
>
> Some similarities here. I fly helicopters for a living and have been
> for 29 years now. All machines have a light and many also have a gauge.
> I can't tell you how many times I've introduced an engine oil
> malfunction (in the simulator) initiated by a slow decrease in pressure.
> Excepting for 2 pilot crews, 99% of the time it goes unnoticed until the
> light comes on. It's just how we are. Imagine yourself in rush hour
> traffic (as I was in passing thru LA the other day - OMG!!). How often
> do any of us even look at the gauges, speedo, fuel, etc? And that's how
> it should be...we need to look outside in these and most cases.
>
> Just my thoughts.
>
> Nate


Great link, thank you!
--
Tom - Vista, CA
 
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Discussion Starter #20
N Williamson wrote:
> In article <[email protected]>, TOM <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>>Bonehenge wrote:
>>
>>>On Thu, 02 Mar 2006 21:56:55 -0800, N Williamson <[email protected]>
>>>wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>No light comes on
>>>>during the initial key to on when all the other lights test. The tech at
>>>>the dealer told me there is nothing except the gauge - no light and no
>>>>buzzer. I think it's borderline irresponsible for them to have done
>>>>this. I've had vehicles with gauges, but they always had a light as
>>>>well because a light will catch your attention a lot quicker than a
>>>>slowly fading gauge.
>>>
>>>
>>>My wife blew up a 300ZX with a digital dash in this exact manner.
>>>
>>>She didn't know what the numbers meant. <G>

>>
>>Oops, someone forgot to explain the gauges to her. Probably a little
>>training session would have gone a long way... :>))

>
>
> Perhaps so, but this further emphasizes the ease of understanding lights
> more so than a gauge. We're all probably automotive/vehicle enthusiasts
> if we're in here or another like group so it's easy for us to
> understand. Oil pressure? What is oil? Huh? I don't understand...why
> can't it be 5? But you just said if it goes low I should pull over and
> now you're saying it can be low but if I give it gas and it goes up it's
> OK? How much gas?
> Gawd...I can't imagine it.
>
> My solution?
>
> RED = pull over now and shut it off.
>
> AMBER = when time permits and its convenient, pull over and check things
> out, look at the manual, have a smoke, yadda, yadda, yadda...
>
> Training session over. Short and sweet.


My dad's '52 Chevy pickup had a gauge that read 30 at the right end (if
I remember right). It would hang around the center when cruising along
at about 40 MPH is third, but at idle, it was barely above 0 (zero). If
you want to go back farther, some old cars only used splash lubrication
and didn't need an oil pressure gauge or light... :>))
--
Tom - Vista, CA
 
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