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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Just something that's been bugging me for quite some time now. I've been on
edmunds and other such boards. And all I hear is car buyers whining about
this and whining about that. Now i'm not going to sit here and say that alot
of car salesmen aren't honest. What i'm trying to bring across is that
consumers can sometimes bring this on themselves.

Imagine being a salesman and spending 3-4 hours with someone only to find
out that they had no interest in buying a vehicle, or worst yet are just
beating you up for a price and then go to the dealer down the road and buy
from him. Thats 3-4 hours out of your day that you didn't make ONE DIME!

This can lead salesmen to viewing customers in the same light as the
customers view salesmen.

Another thing, it is very frustrating when customers come in with so called
"invoice" from edmunds or other sources and they are not the true invoice
(assuming financial reserve and dealer holdback are factored in). Good luck
convincing them otherwise.

Just remember when you do buy a vehicle, your salesman is also a normal
person trying to make a living. How would you react working a 12 hour day
and making no money? If the salesman is upfront, friendly, and seems truly
interested in you being in his dealership 9 times out of 10 he truly cares
about your business.
 
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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]
> Just something that's been bugging me for quite some time now. I've been
> on
> edmunds and other such boards. And all I hear is car buyers whining about
> this and whining about that. Now i'm not going to sit here and say that
> alot
> of car salesmen aren't honest. What i'm trying to bring across is that
> consumers can sometimes bring this on themselves.
>
> Imagine being a salesman and spending 3-4 hours with someone only to find
> out that they had no interest in buying a vehicle, or worst yet are just
> beating you up for a price and then go to the dealer down the road and buy
> from him. Thats 3-4 hours out of your day that you didn't make ONE DIME!
>
> This can lead salesmen to viewing customers in the same light as the
> customers view salesmen.
>
> Another thing, it is very frustrating when customers come in with so
> called
> "invoice" from edmunds or other sources and they are not the true invoice
> (assuming financial reserve and dealer holdback are factored in). Good
> luck
> convincing them otherwise.
>
> Just remember when you do buy a vehicle, your salesman is also a normal
> person trying to make a living. How would you react working a 12 hour day
> and making no money? If the salesman is upfront, friendly, and seems truly
> interested in you being in his dealership 9 times out of 10 he truly cares
> about your business.
>

Good (and correct) advice!
--
Ray O
correct the return address punctuation to reply
 
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Ray O wrote:
> <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]
>
>>Just something that's been bugging me for quite some time now. I've been
>>on
>>edmunds and other such boards. And all I hear is car buyers whining about
>>this and whining about that. Now i'm not going to sit here and say that
>>alot
>>of car salesmen aren't honest. What i'm trying to bring across is that
>>consumers can sometimes bring this on themselves.
>>
>>Imagine being a salesman and spending 3-4 hours with someone only to find
>>out that they had no interest in buying a vehicle, or worst yet are just
>>beating you up for a price and then go to the dealer down the road and buy
>>from him. Thats 3-4 hours out of your day that you didn't make ONE DIME!
>>
>>This can lead salesmen to viewing customers in the same light as the
>>customers view salesmen.
>>
>>Another thing, it is very frustrating when customers come in with so
>>called
>>"invoice" from edmunds or other sources and they are not the true invoice
>>(assuming financial reserve and dealer holdback are factored in). Good
>>luck
>>convincing them otherwise.
>>
>>Just remember when you do buy a vehicle, your salesman is also a normal
>>person trying to make a living. How would you react working a 12 hour day
>>and making no money? If the salesman is upfront, friendly, and seems truly
>>interested in you being in his dealership 9 times out of 10 he truly cares
>>about your business.
>>

>
> Good (and correct) advice!

When I shop for a car, I know what I want, what is reasonable for
what I want, and what I am willing to pay. If we reach an agreement, I
buy it, if not I leave my name and phone number and tell them if they
decide they want to sell it at the price I offered, give me a call.
Last time it was a couple or three weeks and the salesman called, and I
bought it. I don't waste their time, and they don't waste mine we don't
play games. They know what they have to have if they are going to stay
in business. Sometimes they call, sometimes they don't. Sometimes I've
already bought something in the meantime. One thing I tell them up
front is that is the absolute price I will pay, no docking fees, or
paper work fees etc. The price I offer is the obsolute price, PEROID!
No extra fees at closing time or I walk out the door, and I make sure
they understand that. On the other hand I make it clear I won't try to
Jew them down if they call.
I've bought several used cars from dealers this way, the best deals
I've gotten were when I paid more for low mileage vehicles that were in
excellent shape and well taken care of by the previous owner. All in all
they turned out to be a better deals then the bargain cars with high
mileage I've also bought.
 
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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Moe <[email protected]> wrote:

>Ray O wrote:
>> <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]
>>
>>>Just something that's been bugging me for quite some time now. I've been
>>>on
>>>edmunds and other such boards. And all I hear is car buyers whining about
>>>this and whining about that. Now i'm not going to sit here and say that
>>>alot
>>>of car salesmen aren't honest. What i'm trying to bring across is that
>>>consumers can sometimes bring this on themselves.
>>>
>>>Imagine being a salesman and spending 3-4 hours with someone only to find
>>>out that they had no interest in buying a vehicle, or worst yet are just
>>>beating you up for a price and then go to the dealer down the road and buy
>>>from him. Thats 3-4 hours out of your day that you didn't make ONE DIME!
>>>
>>>This can lead salesmen to viewing customers in the same light as the
>>>customers view salesmen.
>>>
>>>Another thing, it is very frustrating when customers come in with so
>>>called
>>>"invoice" from edmunds or other sources and they are not the true invoice
>>>(assuming financial reserve and dealer holdback are factored in). Good
>>>luck
>>>convincing them otherwise.
>>>
>>>Just remember when you do buy a vehicle, your salesman is also a normal
>>>person trying to make a living. How would you react working a 12 hour day
>>>and making no money? If the salesman is upfront, friendly, and seems truly
>>>interested in you being in his dealership 9 times out of 10 he truly cares
>>>about your business.
>>>

>>
>> Good (and correct) advice!

> When I shop for a car, I know what I want, what is reasonable for
>what I want, and what I am willing to pay. If we reach an agreement, I
>buy it, if not I leave my name and phone number and tell them if they
>decide they want to sell it at the price I offered, give me a call.
>Last time it was a couple or three weeks and the salesman called, and I
>bought it. I don't waste their time, and they don't waste mine we don't
>play games. They know what they have to have if they are going to stay
>in business. Sometimes they call, sometimes they don't. Sometimes I've
>already bought something in the meantime. One thing I tell them up
>front is that is the absolute price I will pay, no docking fees, or
>paper work fees etc. The price I offer is the obsolute price, PEROID!
>No extra fees at closing time or I walk out the door, and I make sure
>they understand that. On the other hand I make it clear I won't try to
>Jew them down if they call.


snip

A friendly word of advice here Moe...I'd be more careful of
people's feelings in your public writing sir...while I don't
think that it's legally actionable most people nowadays never use
that phrase...
--

-Gord.
(use gordon in email)
 
G

·
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]
> Just something that's been bugging me for quite some time now. I've been
> on
> edmunds and other such boards. And all I hear is car buyers whining about
> this and whining about that. Now i'm not going to sit here and say that
> alot
> of car salesmen aren't honest. What i'm trying to bring across is that
> consumers can sometimes bring this on themselves.
>
> Imagine being a salesman and spending 3-4 hours with someone only to find
> out that they had no interest in buying a vehicle, or worst yet are just
> beating you up for a price and then go to the dealer down the road and buy
> from him. Thats 3-4 hours out of your day that you didn't make ONE DIME!
>
> This can lead salesmen to viewing customers in the same light as the
> customers view salesmen.
>
> Another thing, it is very frustrating when customers come in with so
> called
> "invoice" from edmunds or other sources and they are not the true invoice
> (assuming financial reserve and dealer holdback are factored in). Good
> luck
> convincing them otherwise.
>
> Just remember when you do buy a vehicle, your salesman is also a normal
> person trying to make a living. How would you react working a 12 hour day
> and making no money? If the salesman is upfront, friendly, and seems truly
> interested in you being in his dealership 9 times out of 10 he truly cares
> about your business.
>
>


I am out the door with a new car in less than 1 hour - and the sales guys
could still be jerks. If they sense you are nice, they will try to fuck you
over. If you let up how much you like the car, they will fuck you more. Do
you think they lose sleep over this? Nope.

Hey it's like working in porn. Sooner or later, you are gonna have to take
it up the ass. Same for the sales guys. Don't like it? Get a different gig.

Thing is, lots of good sales guys make good money.
 
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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Jim Fixx wrote a great book on buying / selling a car.
(He's the guy who wrote about jogging, then died from a heart attack
while doing so.)

There's a new factor if your looking for the Toyota / Pontiac duo. Very
interesting.

Karl
 
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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
[email protected] wrote:
> Just something that's been bugging me for quite some time now. I've been on
> edmunds and other such boards. And all I hear is car buyers whining about
> this and whining about that. Now i'm not going to sit here and say that alot
> of car salesmen aren't honest. What i'm trying to bring across is that
> consumers can sometimes bring this on themselves.


> Imagine being a salesman and spending 3-4 hours with someone only to find
> out that they had no interest in buying a vehicle, or worst yet are just
> beating you up for a price and then go to the dealer down the road and buy
> from him. Thats 3-4 hours out of your day that you didn't make ONE DIME!


> This can lead salesmen to viewing customers in the same light as the
> customers view salesmen.


If that is the case, wouldn't everyone benefit from getting rid of
the game and offering upfront product pricing like almost every other
consumer product?

If I want to buy a hammer, I can comparison shop between my local hardware
store, drug store, Home Depot, Lowes, Walmart, and fleamarket, to buy the
hammer that fits my needs and budget. I don't want to waste an hour
negotiating the price of the hammer and then get hit with surprise fees
in the end.
 
G

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Re: Car Salesmen- F 'em

I could care less what the salesman thinks, feels or earns. I am not
holding a gun to his head to keep that job.

In fact the sooner we can make car selling as unpleasant as they've made
car buying the happier I'll be. I don't need a sales man (she is just
another layer of fat that needs to be cut). If toyota wants to be
(remain) REVOLUTIONARY they will be the first to do so.

Fuck the sales man. And this is from a guy who's worked in sales the
last 20 years and straight commision the last 11. I make a good livng
and don't cry when a customer wastes my time. I've gotten' hella good
at spotting the talkers and lonley hearts (etc.) though.

CP
 
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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Gord Beaman wrote:
> Moe <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>>Ray O wrote:
>>
>>><[email protected]> wrote in message
>>>news:[email protected]
>>>
>>>
>>>>Just something that's been bugging me for quite some time now. I've been
>>>>on
>>>>edmunds and other such boards. And all I hear is car buyers whining about
>>>>this and whining about that. Now i'm not going to sit here and say that
>>>>alot
>>>>of car salesmen aren't honest. What i'm trying to bring across is that
>>>>consumers can sometimes bring this on themselves.
>>>>
>>>>Imagine being a salesman and spending 3-4 hours with someone only to find
>>>>out that they had no interest in buying a vehicle, or worst yet are just
>>>>beating you up for a price and then go to the dealer down the road and buy
>>>
>>>>from him. Thats 3-4 hours out of your day that you didn't make ONE DIME!
>>>
>>>>This can lead salesmen to viewing customers in the same light as the
>>>>customers view salesmen.
>>>>
>>>>Another thing, it is very frustrating when customers come in with so
>>>>called
>>>>"invoice" from edmunds or other sources and they are not the true invoice
>>>>(assuming financial reserve and dealer holdback are factored in). Good
>>>>luck
>>>>convincing them otherwise.
>>>>
>>>>Just remember when you do buy a vehicle, your salesman is also a normal
>>>>person trying to make a living. How would you react working a 12 hour day
>>>>and making no money? If the salesman is upfront, friendly, and seems truly
>>>>interested in you being in his dealership 9 times out of 10 he truly cares
>>>>about your business.
>>>>
>>>
>>>Good (and correct) advice!

>>
>> When I shop for a car, I know what I want, what is reasonable for
>>what I want, and what I am willing to pay. If we reach an agreement, I
>>buy it, if not I leave my name and phone number and tell them if they
>>decide they want to sell it at the price I offered, give me a call.
>>Last time it was a couple or three weeks and the salesman called, and I
>>bought it. I don't waste their time, and they don't waste mine we don't
>>play games. They know what they have to have if they are going to stay
>>in business. Sometimes they call, sometimes they don't. Sometimes I've
>>already bought something in the meantime. One thing I tell them up
>>front is that is the absolute price I will pay, no docking fees, or
>>paper work fees etc. The price I offer is the obsolute price, PEROID!
>>No extra fees at closing time or I walk out the door, and I make sure
>>they understand that. On the other hand I make it clear I won't try to
>>Jew them down if they call.

>
>
> snip
>
> A friendly word of advice here Moe...I'd be more careful of
> people's feelings in your public writing sir...while I don't
> think that it's legally actionable most people nowadays never use
> that phrase...

Know where I can buy a cheap suit? It's for my brother-in-law.
 
G

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
On Tue, 13 Dec 2005 06:30:35 GMT, <[email protected]> wrote:

>
>Imagine being a salesman and spending 3-4 hours with someone only to find
>out that they had no interest in buying a vehicle, or worst yet are just
>beating you up for a price and then go to the dealer down the road and buy
>from him. Thats 3-4 hours out of your day that you didn't make ONE DIME!


Read this to your kids, then tell them "STAY IN SCHOOL!" Seriously,
it must be a tough way to make a living, and even the successful ones
don't enjoy high social status. Kind of like being an IRS auditor or
a life insurance agent.

I was told by the owner of a small dealership that he doesn't make any
real money selling new cars, but that the service department keeps him
in business. Kind of like the "big box" retailers that get most of
their profits from extended warranty sales, or fast food joints that
sell burgers at cost to make a profit on fries and soft drinks.

Jim
Norfolk, VA
 
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