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1991 Corolla DX wi A240L 4-spd automatic
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Discussion Starter #41
So it seems like I read that ATF and an automatic transmission can handle having just water mixed in it by accident. But NOT if glycol is in the water? Or is it catastrophically bad to have just regular water in there too? Just wondering.
 

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1991 Corolla DX wi A240L 4-spd automatic
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Discussion Starter #42
A guy at my work who has a lot of experience with American cars but not with Toyotas, said that the TC should hold the ATF up in there all the time. So I imagine that is a different Torque Converter type than what is used on the Aisin automatic transmissions. You guys wouldn't happen to know what type that is called? If not I'll just ask him on Monday, and also finally show him the car because he has been making fun of me for nigh on two years for not getting this car finally finished sooner. XD

Anyway thanks again for all the assistance. It really has been a lifesaver... er, I mean a car saver.:)??
 

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Discussion Starter #43
So this morning I drove over to Walmart, the outside temperature was in the 20s F. This is all with the tranny cooler lines still looped. At first it would not shift out of the lowest gear once I was on the road. I drove it a bit in the church parking lot, went back to my parents and checked the level a couple times--up above hot. So I thought oh well I guess I'll try it again. That time it shifted okay.

After getting back home, I checked the ATF with the vehicle running. It was exactly on the higher mark of the 'Hot' section, so no overage. This was after a 2.4 mile trip.

Yesterday when it was in the 50s F, after getting up to where the radiator fan starts kicking on and off, just going over to a nearby church parking lot briefly and then back (so not even 0.25 miles) put the level up to 1/4'' above the higher 'Hot' mark. So the outside temperature seems to really affect this. If you fill a tranny in the winter do you count on it having overpressure in the summer? Or I guess this is why you check the level on a regular basis?

The other thing I thought is that maybe the tranny on Rollas actually IS supposed to hold onto quite a bit of the fluid when cooled down. And mine being not in pristine shape, isn't able to. That would explain why I can't hit the Cold dipstick markings right after startup. Is that correct?
 

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Discussion Starter #44
Posting at a mile a minute here, I guess, but just checked my ATF samples in small yogurt cups where I was testing if you can tell ATF that has antifreeze mixed into it, by comparison to non-contaminated ATF. I thought, 'I can't see a difference, and who knows if Pa was out here and maybe switched them unintentionally' (since the labels weren't taped on.) So I dumped them both in the trash which was full of paper towels. Guess I should have dumped them in my waste oil jug though. : ( But anyway, at the bottom of one yogurt cup was the coolant I had mixed in. So it WAS separating back out, but then just staying on the bottom.

I am learning things you guys all have at instant recall already so hope you don't think I'm trying to tell everyone what is up. I am just posting this first to correct my earlier posted conclusion about it, and also more for the benefit of any duncehead newbies out there similar to myself. XD
 

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1992 Geo Prizm
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Posting at a mile a minute here, I guess, but just checked my ATF samples in small yogurt cups where I was testing if you can tell ATF that has antifreeze mixed into it, by comparison to non-contaminated ATF. I thought, 'I can't see a difference, and who knows if Pa was out here and maybe switched them unintentionally' (since the labels weren't taped on.) So I dumped them both in the trash which was full of paper towels. Guess I should have dumped them in my waste oil jug though. : ( But anyway, at the bottom of one yogurt cup was the coolant I had mixed in. So it WAS separating back out, but then just staying on the bottom.

I am learning things you guys all have at instant recall already so hope you don't think I'm trying to tell everyone what is up. I am just posting this first to correct my earlier posted conclusion about it, and also more for the benefit of any duncehead newbies out there similar to myself. XD
I don't know if you covered this before or not. But did you drive the car before you pulled the motor and trans to redo the flex plate? Or did you buy it that way? What I'm getting at, is/was this a good working transmission before all of the work? Basically, I'm trying to figure out if it's something you did, or if it was already on it's way out before you pulled it.

Yes, the AT will tolerate some water (but not a lot), as it'll eventually boil off once the trans starts getting some real heat into it (it'll puke the water out the vent tube).
 

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1991 Corolla DX wi A240L 4-spd automatic
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Discussion Starter #46
Yeah it was a working transmission, I had never noticed any problems with it. Including, the trans shifted okay in very cold weather right after starting.

I replaced the torque converter with a new one from AutoZone. I at least was able to verify that the gear inside of the new one would rotate only in one direction, as it is supposed to.
 

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Yeah it was a working transmission, I had never noticed any problems with it. Including, the trans shifted okay in very cold weather right after starting.

I replaced the torque converter with a new one from AutoZone. I at least was able to verify that the gear inside of the new one would rotate only in one direction, as it is supposed to.
Ok, did you add a quart or 2 of fluid to it right before you installed it? Just asking, as with most "new" converters, the rebuilder wants you to add some fluid to them before installing it into the car. I say that, because most converters will hold between 4 and 6 quarts of ATF by themselves.
 

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Discussion Starter #48
Yes I did. I can't remember now exactly how much, though. But I think it was around 1 or 2.

My theory is that in 20s degrees F, it is harder for the fluid to get to where it needs to be...?

Plus my pan level when cold is way too high, again suggesting the fluid isn't staying where it is supposed, due to poor seals, etc., maybe?
 

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Discussion Starter #49
Before the flexplate broke, I remember my car shaking for like 15 seconds once while driving. Also found shavings (about 3/8'' long by 1/32" wide) at the bottom of the bellhousing, when I took it apart. So I guess my original TC was dying. Hope it didn't release a bunch of metal into my tranny before the flexplate finally went. = /
 

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Before the flexplate broke, I remember my car shaking for like 15 seconds once while driving. Also found shavings (about 3/8'' long by 1/32" wide) at the bottom of the bellhousing, when I took it apart. So I guess my original TC was dying. Hope it didn't release a bunch of metal into my tranny before the flexplate finally went. = /
Unfortunately, it kind of sounds like it did. Even though the flex plate is on the outside, the torque converter drives the pump in the trans, That might be where any damage (internally) started.
 

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try revving the engine to 2000 rpms for 30 seconds before driving to fill the converter and see if that helps.

it could also be with seals at the valve body and/or internal check valves.
 

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Discussion Starter #52
Okay guys thanks for the info.

I'll look into those possibilities, JohnGD.

In the meantime it does shift okay 99 percent of the time so far. Just that one morning when it was 20 degrees F, that it wouldn't shift at first. Hopefully it won't keep happening.

Just for fun I may pull another A240L that is at the local PnP. Get started learning how to overhaul one.
(y):)
 

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Discussion Starter #53
This morning I unlooped the ATF cooler hoses so they actually go to the ATF cooler in the radiator. On purpose I let quite a bit run out of them since I expect my ATF level was still a bit high.

Just got back this evening from my 15-mile commute home from work, and the ATF is now right on the higher 'Hot' mark. So I guess you were right, Clone, that I had just overfilled it.

BTW thanks for the tip on the hydraulic clutch, never knew there was such a thing. I'll have to definitely look into that as well.

So shavings in the bellhousing and then the brief shaking that one time while driving, IIRC from reading around on the web they are both indicators of your Torque Converter going out, or having gone out.

But can your TC really go out w/o ever exhibiting problems in the shifting? Up until the failure to shift last week right after starting out on a pretty cold morning, it has always shifted flawlessly, both before the flexplate broke, and after I finally got it running again. Never a loss of torque or power trying to go up a hill, never any popping out of gear on its own, nothing.
 

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Discussion Starter #55
This morning it was 15 degrees F, so when I first started out, I let off the gas a bit right where I thought it would do its first shift, a trick I have learn from delivering cars at my car auction job. Maybe that helped, because it seemed to shift okay this time, even though it was pretty cold. I guess I'll just have to see how it goes.
 

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try revving the engine to 2000 rpms for 30 seconds before driving to fill the converter and see if that helps.

it could also be with seals at the valve body and/or internal check valves.
Yup, but I wasn't sure if he was willing to either pull the trans again, to go thru it, or work under it with it still in the car.
This morning I unlooped the ATF cooler hoses so they actually go to the ATF cooler in the radiator. On purpose I let quite a bit run out of them since I expect my ATF level was still a bit high.

Just got back this evening from my 15-mile commute home from work, and the ATF is now right on the higher 'Hot' mark. So I guess you were right, Clone, that I had just overfilled it.

BTW thanks for the tip on the hydraulic clutch, never knew there was such a thing. I'll have to definitely look into that as well.

So shavings in the bellhousing and then the brief shaking that one time while driving, IIRC from reading around on the web they are both indicators of your Torque Converter going out, or having gone out.

But can your TC really go out w/o ever exhibiting problems in the shifting? Up until the failure to shift last week right after starting out on a pretty cold morning, it has always shifted flawlessly, both before the flexplate broke, and after I finally got it running again. Never a loss of torque or power trying to go up a hill, never any popping out of gear on its own, nothing.
No, not really. And you didn't see a lot of metal in the pan while you had it off (I saw the pics you posted). The shavings you saw in the bellhousing were probably from when the flex plate broke, and allowed the torque converter to move around too much, or were pieces of broken flex plate.
 

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Okay guys thanks for the info.

I'll look into those possibilities, JohnGD.

In the meantime it does shift okay 99 percent of the time so far. Just that one morning when it was 20 degrees F, that it wouldn't shift at first. Hopefully it won't keep happening.

Just for fun I may pull another A240L that is at the local PnP. Get started learning how to overhaul one.
(y):)
I'd pick it up as a spare, just because you might need or could use a spare. It's one of those cases of "if I have it I won't need it" and "if I don't get it, I'll need it and can't find it". At least that's how my luck runs. ;)
 

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This morning it was 15 degrees F, so when I first started out, I let off the gas a bit right where I thought it would do its first shift, a trick I have learn from delivering cars at my car auction job. Maybe that helped, because it seemed to shift okay this time, even though it was pretty cold. I guess I'll just have to see how it goes.
It might be a case of needing to be exercized again. After all you had drained it, knocked it over off the blocks, and spent almost 6 months getting it all together so you could re-install it. Then you over filled it, and now it's being put to use again.

Can you do me a favor? See what they get for a fuel pump sending unit (without the pump) for a 92 Toyota Corolla at your local junk yard. I'm looking for 1, but around here there's nothing but rust. I really don't want to spend 279 bucks for a new one (with pump) from Rock Auto. If I have to, I'll do some cutting and welding on the old one before I do that.
 

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Discussion Starter #59 (Edited)
I couldn't find 'sending unit' on their price list, but here is their fuel pump price.

293212

Holy cow, yeah that RockAuto price is way harsh. How hard of a pull is it? Last time I checked they had three 6th Gens there.
 

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Discussion Starter #60
Anyway let me know if you want me to go try and pull one for you. I'm always up for learning more, and pulling parts is one way to do it. ??
 
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