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3. The LE uses steel wheels while the XLE uses larger cast aluminum. Could the cast aluminum be heavier? That would be my guess. However you would have to weigh them to know. Significant?
Personally, I would be quite surprised to learn that the aluminum wheels are heavier than their steel counterparts. "Alloy wheels" came into being because they are lighter, and therefore have less unsprung weight, which leads to better handling and a better ride. Their popularity for aesthetic reasons (now probably the main reason for their being offered) came later.
 

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Personally, I would be quite surprised to learn that the aluminum wheels are heavier than their steel counterparts. "Alloy wheels" came into being because they are lighter, and therefore have less unsprung weight, which leads to better handling and a better ride. Their popularity for aesthetic reasons (now probably the main reason for their being offered) came later.
Like I say you would have to weigh them to see. I don't find them particularly light when I rotate them. My guess is that the complete wheel tire assembly on the LE weighs less than the one the XLR. More wheel, wider wheel, and I would guess more weight.

To Whitesands, Wheel size is misleading. In almost every case as the wheel size gets bigger a lower profile tire is put on them keeping them exactly the same in outside diameter of the mounted tire. That is the case with the Camry. That lets Toyota use them interchangeably on the LE and XLE without any change to the overall drive ratio or speedometer accuracy etc.

Larger wheels is just a cosmetic issue. Generally they make the complete wheel heavier as you are substituting aluminum for rubber. Since they have less rubber they tend to be rougher. All things considered the 16" wheels and tires on the LE likely provide a better ride, and could give better mileage. Another case of functionality being sacrificed for cosmetics.
 

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2012 Camry Hybrid LE
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Some things to consider:

1. The EPA rates the LE at 41 mpg combined, and the XLE at 40 mpg combined. The EPA do not report down to the .1 of a mpg, and round off. The actual test results could have been 40.5 for the LE and 40.4 for the XLE. In other words the difference could be simple round off and is insignificant compared to the measurement error.

2. The only obvious difference in the models is the wheel and tire size. There is a small weight difference but that is probably insignificant. .
EPA city is 43 LE, 40 XLE

The XLE weighs 90 lbs more than LE, per Toyota brocure
 

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Like I say you would have to weigh them to see. I don't find them particularly light when I rotate them. My guess is that the complete wheel tire assembly on the LE weighs less than the one the XLR. More wheel, wider wheel, and I would guess more weight.

To Whitesands, Wheel size is misleading. In almost every case as the wheel size gets bigger a lower profile tire is put on them keeping them exactly the same in outside diameter of the mounted tire. That is the case with the Camry. That lets Toyota use them interchangeably on the LE and XLE without any change to the overall drive ratio or speedometer accuracy etc.

Larger wheels is just a cosmetic issue. Generally they make the complete wheel heavier as you are substituting aluminum for rubber. Since they have less rubber they tend to be rougher. All things considered the 16" wheels and tires on the LE likely provide a better ride, and could give better mileage. Another case of functionality being sacrificed for cosmetics.
The XLE wheels is 17" vs 16" for the LE. I think the 17" wheels is also wider than the 16". Thus the 17" wheels have larger volume than the 16". So the lighter aluminum might not be enough to compensate the increased volume weight. The 17" wheels are probably heavier because of this.
 

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Some things to consider:

1. The EPA rates the LE at 41 mpg combined, and the XLE at 40 mpg combined. The EPA do not report down to the .1 of a mpg, and round off. The actual test results could have been 40.5 for the LE and 40.4 for the XLE. In other words the difference could be simple round off and is insignificant compared to the measurement error.

4. The EPA tracks self reported mpg. Currently the average for the 2012 models is 40.2 for the LE, and 38.5 for the XLE. If you rounded them off like EPA does for the test data, that would be 40 for the LE and 39 for the XLE. It would seem that the very slight advantage of the LE is validated. Could it also be the those who buy the LE are more cost conscious and drive differently than those who buy the XLE? Or, is it the smaller wheels and higher profile tires on the LE?

The bottom line is that I think you would be chasing shadows trying to replicate the EPA test results, especially if you use cast aluminum tires instead of steel, and if you don't use exactly the same tires as they used for the EPA test. It is also very costly to change wheels and tires. You are unlikely to ever make your money back on improved fuel economy if you even get any. Best bet would be to keep the wheels and when the tires wear out do some research and buy the most fuel efficient version currently available. Tires are improving all the time.
There are many forum Camry Hybrid owners reporting their MPG here. I got the impression the LE is consistently beating the XLE in MPG. And the difference seems is not just 1 MPG.
 

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There are many forum Camry Hybrid owners reporting their MPG here. I got the impression the LE is consistently beating the XLE in MPG. And the difference seems is not just 1 MPG.
I have not noticed this difference in reports. I think Whitesands is the current mileage champ here and I recall he has an XLE... However, mileage reports are very highly dependent on the type of use the driver puts the vehicle to. My mileage is below EPA. however I drive in a cold climate for 6 months of the year, and our typical drive in winter is very short in distance. The vehicle barely gets a chance to warm up. In summer it does much better. You have to consider whether results are just cherry picked or are for a full year, and was that year a typical year?

To make any conclusion you would have to compare a number of drivers with the LE to another number of drivers with the XLE. The EPA site lets you do that. See link below. Currently there are 16 reporting for the LE compared to 27 for the XLE. Those were the numbers I used above in my post.

EPA LE to XLE Comparison 2012

Even with that number reporting I would be hesitant to form a conclusion. Notice the individual results and how widely they vary, and how much they overlap. Also notice that there is one report of 29 mpg for the XLE. That one seems a little off base. If you took that out they would likely move much closer together. Personally I would not invest a nickel trying to chase such a small difference.
 

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Guess I was wrong. I had no idea the aspect ratio made so much difference in height. I see the oem Energy Saver tires that come with the LE are 3 pounds lighter each than a XLE with the MXV4 Primacy tires.

It amazed me how close the sizes of the mxv4 on the XLE are compared the LE with the Energy Saver a/s tires.

check this out

XLE tires

215/55/17 mxv4 primacy

23 pounds, 7.2" wide, 26.3 high, 791 revs per mile

LE tires

215/60/16 mxv4 primacy

24 pounds, width 7.1, 26.1 high, 797 revs

215/60/16 energy saver a/s - OEM tires on the LE

21 lbs. width n/a, 26.1 high, 796 revs
 

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Like I say you would have to weigh them to see. I don't find them particularly light when I rotate them. My guess is that the complete wheel tire assembly on the LE weighs less than the one the XLR. More wheel, wider wheel, and I would guess more weight.
I see your point, Ron. Now you've got me curious. It would be interesting if someone with an XLE and an LE would weigh their wheels and post the results so we'd have a definitive answer.
 

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I have not noticed this difference in reports. I think Whitesands is the current mileage champ here and I recall he has an XLE... However, mileage reports are very highly dependent on the type of use the driver puts the vehicle to. My mileage is below EPA. however I drive in a cold climate for 6 months of the year, and our typical drive in winter is very short in distance. The vehicle barely gets a chance to warm up. In summer it does much better. You have to consider whether results are just cherry picked or are for a full year, and was that year a typical year?

To make any conclusion you would have to compare a number of drivers with the LE to another number of drivers with the XLE. The EPA site lets you do that. See link below. Currently there are 16 reporting for the LE compared to 27 for the XLE. Those were the numbers I used above in my post.

EPA LE to XLE Comparison 2012

Even with that number reporting I would be hesitant to form a conclusion. Notice the individual results and how widely they vary, and how much they overlap. Also notice that there is one report of 29 mpg for the XLE. That one seems a little off base. If you took that out they would likely move much closer together. Personally I would not invest a nickel trying to chase such a small difference.
I reviewed the EPA numbers. Now I think the MPG difference between XLE and LE is not that big as given by the EPA. The difference is mainly due to the rolling resistance because the 17" tire is wider. It make larger contact area with the road surface. At low speed the rolling friction/resistance is higher than high speed.
 

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I agree. Mostly an issue of rolling resistance due to the wider tire tread and softer compound on the 17". Also some extra rotational inertia and vehicle weight, both of which affect city mpg the most.
 

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Venzoid
V6 Venza AWD
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The XLE wheels is 17" vs 16" for the LE. I think the 17" wheels is also wider than the 16". Thus the 17" wheels have larger volume than the 16". So the lighter aluminum might not be enough to compensate the increased volume weight. The 17" wheels are probably heavier because of this.
The XLEs are wider. So they have a larger contact patch meaning more friction if the two types of rubber are comparable. I think Ron is right though, use the ones you have now and buy energy efficient ones in 3/4 years and they will probably be even more efficient.

I've got the LE. And FE was one of the reasons I chose the LE.
 

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LE tires

215/60/16 mxv4 primacy

24 pounds, width 7.1, 26.1 high, 797 revs

215/60/16 energy saver a/s - OEM tires on the LE

21 lbs. width n/a, 26.1 high, 796 revs
Makes you wonder what they leave out of the Energy Saver tire to save 3 lbs. 3 lbs of tread rubber that you do not get to wear out on the Energy Saver?
 

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Guess I was wrong. I had no idea the aspect ratio made so much difference in height. I see the oem Energy Saver tires that come with the LE are 3 pounds lighter each than a XLE with the MXV4 Primacy tires.

It amazed me how close the sizes of the mxv4 on the XLE are compared the LE with the Energy Saver a/s tires.

check this out

XLE tires

215/55/17 mxv4 primacy

23 pounds, 7.2" wide, 26.3 high, 791 revs per mile

LE tires

215/60/16 mxv4 primacy

24 pounds, width 7.1, 26.1 high, 797 revs

215/60/16 energy saver a/s - OEM tires on the LE

21 lbs. width n/a, 26.1 high, 796 revs
My tire size is P205/65R16 94S, not as shown above.
Per

http://www.michelinman.com/tire-selector/vehicle/2012/Toyota/Camry/Hybrid LE/-1/BE/BNW/energy-saver-a-s/42830/tire-details#techspecs

It is 22.8 lbs. 26.5 high and 786 revs per mile

Perhaps the lower revs per mile is contributing to the higher mileage of the LE, along with lighter car?
 

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When I look here...


http://www.michelinman.com/tire-selector/vehicle/2012/Toyota/Camry/Hybrid LE/-1/BE/BNW/energy-saver-a-s/42830/tire-details#techspecs


It says the Energy Saver is 22.8 lbs.
My tire is a 94S, and they do make it in this size with other numbers

Also, my tire is a 205X65R16, not a 215/60
I looked at the complete table for the Energy Saver tire, and all I could determine is that as the speed rating goes up, the weight seems to go down. Appears to be no relationship to tread depth, as I had incorrectly guessed. In the 16" size they list as follows:

94S (112 mph) - 22.8 lbs - 9.5/32" tread
94T (118 mph) - 21.4 lbs - 9.5/32" tread
91V (149 mph) - 21.0 lbs - 9.5/32" tread

This compares to the Primacy tire that came on my XLE:

93V (149 mph) - 22.6 lbs - 9.5/32" tread
 

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TCH13
Camry Hybrid XLE 13
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Is it a sound plan during the winter months to place 16 in Michelin Ice X-I3 tires with 16 in steel wheels on a 2013 Camry Hydrid XLE. The car currently has 17 in aluminium alloy wheels. I can not find any 17 in wheels to fit the car in steel, just 16 in.

I am hesitant to use the aluminium alloy wheels in the winter with 17 inch snow tires because of the fact that aluminium reacts with road salt. Also I believe the 16 inch tire is wider and should give me increased traction, although minimal - but every counts going up the mountain where I live.

Also anybody have any experience mounting spyderspikes which are instant on instant off chains on the 2012 or 2013 Camry Hybrid.
 

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Not trying to step on any toes here, but.................

Are people really so caught up in the numbers game that they'd seriously consider purchasing 4 wheels and 4 tires just to get an extra "rated" mile or two per gallon out of their vehicle? I would imagine that such an endeavor would be financially unrewarding until many years down the road. If someone cares to do the math, by all means do so. I'd be content just trying to improve driving technique or chalk up the expense difference to sheer driving enjoyment.

elliot
 

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TCH13
Camry Hybrid XLE 13
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Not trying to step on any toes here, but.................

Are people really so caught up in the numbers game that they'd seriously consider purchasing 4 wheels and 4 tires just to get an extra "rated" mile or two per gallon out of their vehicle? I would imagine that such an endeavor would be financially unrewarding until many years down the road. If someone cares to do the math, by all means do so. I'd be content just trying to improve driving technique or chalk up the expense difference to sheer driving enjoyment.

elliot
Elliot,

I hope you were not responding to my post "Is it a Sound Plan" I am simply trying to put snow tires on all four wheels. If I cared about MPG I also would not have asked about SpyderSpikes (instant on - instant off chains). I need serious traction in the winter on my 2013 Camry Hybrid XLE and 4 - Michelin ICE X-I3 should provide that.
 

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It's just interesting to KNOW. Cuz Knowlege is power! (#GI Joe)

TCH are really neat cars and most of us are having fun learning about them, that's why we ask questions on this forum.

Everyone has their own theory and it's fun to share and discuss. I wanted to know more.

For instance Hepstein01 wants to get 16" for spyderspikes and he's a XLE.

I might want to get aftermarket rims on my XLE in 16" superlight or possibly 16" steel with aero-moon covers! (TCH doesn't really use disc brakes-right!? j/k)

and 16" Steel wheels from toyota shouldn't be hard to find. I think they made quite a few of them...
I'll need tires every 2 years. haha
 

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Morning,

No Hepstein, I was not referring to you particularly and safety comes first regardless of mileage, no question. Maybe I missread the gist of the thread. I'm just trying to find the happy medium between numbers and driving pleasure. I'd hate to reach a point where the mileage clouds the enjoyment of driving.

Thanks and be well,
elliot
 
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