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It is an amazing car. I traded my 2010 Prius for my 19 Camry LE.
But my wife has the new generation Prius and she gets 63 mpg.
 

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You have to do the math for your own situation, but in virtually every scenario I have ran the numbers on a hybrid doesn't make economical sense. A plug-in hybrid, for someone who commutes a distance that does not exceed the electric only range or has charging capability at work for the return trip, can make sense. Of course there are tax advantages, so don't forget to calculate that in.
 
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A Camry Hybrid LE is rated for like 52mpg combined with a smaller 13.2 gallon tank (vs the non-hybrid's 15.8 gallon tank. That means that a hybrid LE could potentially go roughly 630ish miles with about a gallon left in the tank before refueling.

You'd get slightly longer between fill-ups despite smaller gas tank.

That said, you have to examine your driving style and needs to determine if a hybrid works for you. I purchased my 2007 Camry Hybrid originally because it made economic sense to me considering my commute. My daily commute to work at the time involved about fifteen miles of rush-hour traffic on the freeway- most of it on a slightly downhill slope in bumper-to-bumper traffic. I found that the car spent roughly 75% of the commute in EV mode and gave me extremely awesome gas mileage. The commute home was highway at 55mph and still gave me 40ish MPG. That was significantly better than what the gas engine Camry could have done at the time.

My Camry Hybrid was about $1500 more than a Camry XLE 4-banger at the time, which was the closest in terms of standard equipment at the time. At the time, there was a $1300 tax credit offered, making it only a few hundred dollars more. Given the fact that the car still gets in the mid to high 30s in terms of MPG despite it being thirteen years old and having 180,000 miles on the odometer means that the hybrid cost has more than paid for itself over the life of the vehicle. In addition, the hybrid system will save some expense in terms of maintenance. For example, the regenerative braking system in the hybrid model has resulted in me NEVER having to replace the front brakes on my car. Thirteen years old with 180,000 miles on a single set of front brake pads. The rear ones likely would have lasted too- but my wife made the mistake of using the parking brake a few years ago after not using it for years. As a result, one of the calipers stuck a bit and wore one of the pads out pretty quickly.

That said- the current hybrids are a bit more complex. Toyota charges a bit more of a premium on their hybrids now and the MPG of the traditional gas engine has significantly improved along with the hybrid's MPG improvement. The situation gets even more complex because the up-level hybrid models (anything other than the LE hybrid) gets much lower MPG than the LE hybrid.

The LE Hybrid is rated for 52MPG combined. The up-level hybrid trims are rated for 46MPG combined- which is only seven MPG better than the highway MPG on the 4-banger gas engine.
 
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You have to ask yourself, is the small amount of fuel savings worth the added cost and complexity? Especially with today's low fuel prices, along with the fact a standard 2.5L, 4-cylinder Camry gets up to 42 MPG highway. Not to mention the extremely high repair cost you'll be faced with when the vehicle goes out of warranty. I can't see how any of that would pay off in the long haul. Also, insurance is higher on the Hybrid models, over the standard gas models.

It also involves the kind of driving you do, along with climate. You have to involve A LOT of city, stop and go type driving to even consider a hybrid. (City taxi's for example might make use of them). For long distance highway driving, they are all but useless. Where I live, (hot, rural, desert environment), with long distances between cities, a hybrid would be the absolute worst choice. Because you wouldn't gain a thing with the battery electric drive. The battery would be depleted by the time you got 50 miles out of town, at 75 MPH on cruise control. Then you're just pushing the added weight of the dead batteries and electric drive system with the engine.

Always go by the sales of these things, because they tell a story.... A truthful one. When we bought our new 2.5L Camry SE, there were literally scores of them to choose from on the dealers lot. In most any color and trim package you could possibly want. There were 2 Hybrid Camry's on the lot. That's it.... 2. When I asked the salesman why, he told me if and when they can ever sell those 2, they might considering ordering another 2. In short, very few people want them. Because for most people they are nothing but a overly complex, expensive, false economy.
 

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You have to ask yourself, is the small amount of fuel savings worth the added cost and complexity? Especially with today's low fuel prices, along with the fact a standard 2.5L, 4-cylinder Camry gets up to 42 MPG highway. Not to mention the extremely high repair cost you'll be faced with when the vehicle goes out of warranty. I can't see how any of that would pay off in the long haul. Also, insurance is higher on the Hybrid models, over the standard gas models.

It also involves the kind of driving you do, along with climate. You have to involve A LOT of city, stop and go type driving to even consider a hybrid. (City taxi's for example might make use of them). For long distance highway driving, they are all but useless. Where I live, (hot, rural, desert environment), with long distances between cities, a hybrid would be the absolute worst choice. Because you wouldn't gain a thing with the battery electric drive. The battery would be depleted by the time you got 50 miles out of town, at 75 MPH on cruise control. Then you're just pushing the added weight of the dead batteries and electric drive system with the engine.

Always go by the sales of these things, because they tell a story.... A truthful one. When we bought our new 2.5L Camry SE, there were literally scores of them to choose from on the dealers lot. In most any color and trim package you could possibly want. There were 2 Hybrid Camry's on the lot. That's it.... 2. When I asked the salesman why, he told me if and when they can ever sell those 2, they might considering ordering another 2. In short, very few people want them. Because for most people they are nothing but a overly complex, expensive, false economy.
You have it wrong about this: "The battery would be depleted by the time you got 50 miles out of town, at 75 MPH on cruise control. Then you're just pushing the added weight of the dead batteries and electric drive system with the engine.". The engine charges the battery so it will always have a range of charge. Also the electric motor works with the gas motor to run the car so everything is working as needed when driving.
 

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The engine charges the battery so it will always have a range of charge. Also the electric motor works with the gas motor to run the car so everything is working as needed when driving.
Even if that's the case what are you saving?
 

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Even if that's the case what are you saving?
I hear you and totally understand as I traded a Prius for my LE. But then people buy what they want without any critical thinking like all the people that think they need a Pickup truck, Camaro or a Mustang. You could rent a truck quite often with the savings in gas from driving a Camry.

For me, a car is an appliance. So I don't buy the wheels and BS that pretty up a car. IMHO, that is foolish.

In Seattle and Vancouver, most all the cabs are Hybrids. They are also very reliable as this guy in Belgium got over 600k on the same battery.
 

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......In Seattle and Vancouver, most all the cabs are Hybrids.
If you look at the demographics, the hybrids, along with the plug in electrics sell in the liberal blue cities and states. They're the one's all bent out of shape over being "green". The conservative red states are all more practical. Hence gas models sell better there. In my town here in western Arizona, I've yet to see a Tesla..... Let alone a charging station for one. They're all but non existent.
 

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I don't think it has to do with the people but with infrastructure. Being a good steward of resources is being practical. You making this political is a bad move.
 

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If you look at the demographics, the hybrids, along with the plug in electrics sell in the liberal blue cities and states. They're the one's all bent out of shape over being "green". The conservative red states are all more practical. Hence gas models sell better there. In my town here in western Arizona, I've yet to see a Tesla..... Let alone a charging station for one. They're all but non existent.
Yes, but...those are the areas with the infrastructure, population density, and driving habits that not only support, but can make electric vehicles effective. In the rural areas none of that exists, plus road trips of 500+ miles are far more common. Can you imagine an electric vehicle in rural TX or Montana where they drive 100+ miles to get to the nearest Walmart?
 
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Yes, but...those are the areas with the infrastructure, population density, and driving habits that not only support, but can make electric vehicles effective. In the rural areas none of that exists, plus road trips of 500+ miles are far more common. Can you imagine an electric vehicle in rural TX or Montana where they drive 100+ miles to get to the nearest Walmart?
They're also worthless for pulling anything. Most everyone here has boats, RV's, Jet Ski's, or ATV's in their garages. Electric and hybrids offer nothing for these people. That's the biggest problem with them. They are only useful to a minimum amount of people. And of those, most all have to live in urban environments. This regardless of how much they improve them. They're just not cut out for most tasks.
 

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Along with everything mentioned, you also have to note that the car feels and drives different. Some people don't like the new 8 speed transmission on the non-hybrids. Some people don't like how "loud" the new non-hybrid Camry is. Some people don't like how braking feels on Hybrids. These are all things to take into consideration
 

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They're also worthless for pulling anything. Most everyone here has boats, RV's, Jet Ski's, or ATV's in their garages. Electric and hybrids offer nothing for these people. That's the biggest problem with them. They are only useful to a minimum amount of people. And of those, most all have to live in urban environments. This regardless of how much they improve them. They're just not cut out for most tasks.
Most everyone here? IMO it is quite the opposite. If my direct circle is any indication less than 20% of all car owners have those toys.
 

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They're also worthless for pulling anything. Most everyone here has boats, RV's, Jet Ski's, or ATV's in their garages. Electric and hybrids offer nothing for these people. That's the biggest problem with them. They are only useful to a minimum amount of people. And of those, most all have to live in urban environments. This regardless of how much they improve them. They're just not cut out for most tasks.
It is plain to see along with your other 3 posts that you are dissatisfied with hybrids, and if you are a closet lurker that won't admit that you have one, then why else would you be here telling everyone how bad they are? I see that you have a Camry....
When we bought our new 2.5L Camry SE,
but would I go to the other threads and rag on people for not having a hybrid? What good is your Camry for hauling a 24' boat? hauling firewood? bringing home a stack of drywall from Lowes? Either way, no vehicle is suited for every task, and with my last 3 examples, a vehicle suitable for those 3 things, would not be suitable for delivering pizzas.....yet I saw it with my own eyes, a guy delivering pizza with a white 4x4 3/4 ton Ford, complete with the Papa Johns pizza magnet sign on the roof of his truck.

Obviously there is a market for Hybrids, or else so many car companies wouldn't be jumping on the "bandwagon". So if a convertible is no good for Arizona....and you don't like them....then don't buy one!!!

Maybe this is a bad example, but there was a company called Mr Goodbuys, and the guy in the advertisement would come on and say that "If you can find it somewhere else cheaper, buy it"....well they are long ago out of business...maybe because people followed his advice. So follow your own advice, and don't buy a Hybrid.. and be happy about it.....alone.
 

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What good is your Camry for hauling a 24' boat? hauling firewood? bringing home a stack of drywall from Lowes?

Obviously there is a market for Hybrids, or else so many car companies wouldn't be jumping on the "bandwagon". So if a convertible is no good for Arizona....and you don't like them....then don't buy one!!!

Maybe this is a bad example, but there was a company called Mr Goodbuys, and the guy in the advertisement would come on and say that "If you can find it somewhere else cheaper, buy it"....well they are long ago out of business...maybe because people followed his advice. So follow your own advice, and don't buy a Hybrid.. and be happy about it.....alone.
Don't get your panties all twisted. Besides, a car isn't something you should invest your ego in. I have a full sized V-8 pickup, along with a HEMI Grand Cherokee. Either of which is more than capable of pulling anything I could possibly want to own. And I never said there wasn't a market for hybrids. It's just a very small one. Sales of them nationwide more than prove that. I'm not trying to piss on your parade with facts. That's just the way it is. Just like in ground pools aren't such a great selling point in Northern Minnesota.

If you live where you think you could get any favorable use out of one, and just can't live happily without one, great. Run out buy one. All I'm saying is they have a limited market, and deliver a very minimum of fuel savings for their added cost and complexity.... And that applies regardless of where you live. And convertibles are great in Arizona.
 

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Don't get your panties all twisted. Besides, a car isn't something you should invest your ego in. I have a full sized V-8 pickup, along with a HEMI Grand Cherokee. Either of which is more than capable of pulling anything I could possibly want to own. And I never said there wasn't a market for hybrids. It's just a very small one. Sales of them nationwide more than prove that. I'm not trying to piss on your parade with facts. That's just the way it is. Just like in ground pools aren't such a great selling point in Northern Minnesota.

If you live where you think you could get any favorable use out of one, and just can't live happily without one, great. Run out buy one. All I'm saying is they have a limited market, and deliver a very minimum of fuel savings for their added cost and complexity.... And that applies regardless of where you live. And convertibles are great in Arizona.
Pardon me for pointing out, that it was you in 4 posts, on this one thread, that you cannot help yourself from trying to piss on your parade with facts about why it is useless to own one. Obviously you don't know what you are talking about. Obviously you have confused electric (only) cars with hybrids, or "plug in" hybrids that mostly "shine" on short commutes to work.
For long distance highway driving, they are all but useless.
If you reread what you wrote:
The battery would be depleted by the time you got 50 miles out of town, at 75 MPH on cruise control. Then you're just pushing the added weight of the dead batteries and electric drive system with the engine.
Even Stevie Wonder could see that your "line of thinking" is parallel to Joe Biden, and cannot keep up with the teleprompter. I don't have any twisted panties, but I feel sorry for you when you comment on something that you do not have first hand knowledge of, or mechanical understanding of, in this thread's conversation. The discussion starter (of this thread) does not have a vehicle that is a plug in version. I believe that you have this Camry Hybrid confused with the many "flavors" of Prius cars. Speaking of Prius cars, I've linked the source for the fact that 10 million Toyota Hybrids have been sold Worldwide. Yes, Sleepy Joe would think that 10 million is very few.
In short, very few people want them.

The Prius family totaled global cumulative sales of 6.1 million units in January 2017, representing 61% of the 10 million hybrids sold worldwide by Toyota since 1997.[12]

Just so you know, I went back and looked at some of your old discussions, and I agree 100% on your ideas on 0W16 oil...and anything that starts out with an "0W...." I run 10W30 synthetic in my Avalon.

Please educate yourself on hybrids before commenting. I would not bother trying to "educate" you on hybrid's if it was only one short vomit of disinformation...but continued bad mouthing of hybrids, 4x in one thread, is too much. I promise that I will not come to your (straight gasoline) Camry thread and deride anyone on why they don't have a hybrid. If you can look down one inch....you would see that I don't need to run out and buy a Hybrid...I have one...an inch below in my "sig" line....
 

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Instead of whining so much, why don't you show us what you think you're saving over a standard gas model. Especially after you deduct the additional purchase price, added insurance cost, etc. I'm trying to figure out the allure of these things. And I can't from a monetary standpoint. Can you? We're listening if you have anything to bring to the table besides a steady diet of bitching and moaning.
 

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2019 camry le
stopped for gas today 13 gallons 597 miles this car is awesome!!!
That's almost 46 MPG! I'd love to get that with my non-hybrid XSE. Can you detail your driving techniques, inclines, speeds, traffic, etc.... Most of my miles are country road (50 to 60 MPH) and Interstate (70 to 80 MPH) and I have a lifetime average of 39.4 MPG and I have a "soft touch".
 
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