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Automatic downshifting on hills

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3.9K views 6 replies 3 participants last post by  John Kaufmann  
#1 ·
A year ago we bought a 2019 Rav4 off-lease, introducing us to an amazing 8-speed automatic transmission that offers Drive (auto) or Select shifting. With a torque converter that almost never unlocks, it's an efficient marvel.

With standard-transmission cars, my habit is to downshift into curves and down hills (for better control and reduced brake wear) -- but the Rav's handling is so good that curves are less of a consideration, and the transmission's gear choices need little help from me. That leaves driving down hills (especially when steep and winding), where I tend to use the Select side for appropriate downshifting. But several times recently we have noticed that, when left in Drive, the Rav sometimes downshifts automatically.

It did not do that a year ago, so I could almost believe that a car smarter than I am is learning my habits -- except that its automatic downshifting is sporadic, not consistent -- which makes me wonder if something is failing. [Or the inconsistency could reflect the fact that it has two drivers, with different habits.]

I've had automatic transmissions in the past (the kind where the torque converter unlocks for every shift), which never downshifted automatically with reduced engine load. (You could take Overdrive off, then downshift manually.) Have others with this 8-speed transmission seen automatic downshifting on hills? If so, is it in some kind of learning mode, or is it consistent?
 
#2 ·
Are you coasting? Going the same speed each time it happens? Did you tap the brakes? If so, how hard? What’s the grade of the decline? I’d imagine those are all the variables the car is thinking about when determining when to downshift.

My 2011 4Runner is also picky about when it’ll downshift while going down a hill. I mostly think it depends on how hard the brakes are tapped/decline grade. However, I haven’t been trying to monitor every single variable so I could be wrong.

In my experience, it decides to not downshift more often than not, so I usually manually control it in Select mode.

I drove my wife’s 23 RAV4 through the mountains in June, and I think I leaned more on Selector mode vs it automatically downshifting but I can’t remember exactly.

Regardless, I wouldn’t worry about anything being wrong. My 4Runner has 150k on it now and I got it at 50k; it’s always behaved the same for me.
 
#4 ·
Are you coasting? Going the same speed each time it happens? Did you tap the brakes? If so, how hard? What’s the grade of the decline? I’d imagine those are all the variables the car is thinking about when determining when to downshift.

My 2011 4Runner is also picky about when it’ll downshift while going down a hill. I mostly think it depends on how hard the brakes are tapped/decline grade. However, I haven’t been trying to monitor every single variable so I could be wrong.

In my experience, it decides to not downshift more often than not, so I usually manually control it in Select mode.

I drove my wife’s 23 RAV4 through the mountains in June, and I think I leaned more on Selector mode vs it automatically downshifting but I can’t remember exactly.

Regardless, I wouldn’t worry about anything being wrong. My 4Runner has 150k on it now and I got it at 50k; it’s always behaved the same for me.
It's always coasting when it downshifts automatically, but as you and I have both noticed, the automatic downshift is not consistent, so I usually control it manually. I was just surprised that it ever downshifts automatically (first car that I have seen do that).

But a 2011 4Runner does not have the same 8-speed transmission as in the Rav4, does it? May I ask what transmission you have?

Thanks for your thought that is just another interesting feature about this transmission, and not a problem developing.
 
#3 ·
If so, is it in some kind of learning mode, or is it consistent?
The 5th generation RAV4 8 speed trans has Adaptive Learning. Over time it adjusts itself to the driver's driving style. This is not a new thing. I had a 2003 Jeep Liberty with the Chrysler 45 RFE trans (used in Hemis) which had it. Your Rav may be inconsistent on downshifts on hills because, as you said--it has two drivers--so it's a little confused. I personally would not use the select shift function to downshift unless I was on a long, steep downgrade. Brake pads aren't expensive. However, I doubt you could over rev or damage the ICE in your RAV by using the selective shift.
 
#6 ·
The 5th generation RAV4 8 speed trans has Adaptive Learning. Over time it adjusts itself to the driver's driving style. ...
This comment sent me back to the Owner's Manual, thinking How did I miss that? It does not address "Adaptive Learning" per se, but now I think I understand what they mean by "AI-SHIFT" (pp.201, 203) -- it is, indeed, adaptive learning.

... This is not a new thing. I had a 2003 Jeep Liberty with the Chrysler 45 RFE trans (used in Hemis) which had it. Your Rav may be inconsistent on downshifts on hills because, as you said--it has two drivers--so it's a little confused. ...
Wow: first I learn from balong48 that this adaptive learning is not new with the 8-speed, now I learn it's not even new with Toyota. I am really out of touch [maybe a function of spending three decades with a Previa].

... I personally would not use the select shift function to downshift unless I was on a long, steep downgrade. ...
That is when I use it. [With my 90 Miata I'm constantly shifting into and out of curves and hills, but the Rav (which handles ridiculously well for a much taller car) seems to benefit less from such attention.]

... However, I doubt you could over rev or damage the ICE in your RAV by using the selective shift.
Yes, the manual makes clear that (with typical Toyota thoroughness) they have covered all the bases in that regard.

Thanks for the education!