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Considering late/high miles ATF change on a 2016

1.2K views 7 replies 6 participants last post by  woodthumb  
#1 ·
Howdy folks, new member here

My wife and I have a 2014 Honda Accord 6spd and 2016 Highlander Limited AWD, both of which we have liked a lot. At some point last year I realized that although we can afford newer vehicles, it just makes sense to take really good care of these and maybe even make them first cars for my kids who are in 5th and 6th grade!

I've got the Honda (216k miles) totally up to snuff with new tires, coolant, manual trans fluid, plugs, new valve cover gasket and valve adjustment. The thing has never run better and driven as smooth, Michelin Pilot Sports from Costco are fantastic.

The Highlander has never really had any problems since we purchased it in 2018 with 30k miles from Carmax. It currently has 140k. We changed oil and filters but not much else until recently. I just did spark plugs (the original Densos looked totally fine!) with new associated gaskets, and did a drain and fill of OEM coolant. Unfortunately I was lulled into not maintaining the transmission because, well, no dipstick sounded like it would be a pain in the a** to deal with, and all you hear about is how Toyotas just go forever with "regular" maintenance.

There is a lot of good information online on how to execute a proper drain and fill (no flush) of the ATF fluid on the Highlander. However, in this high mileage situation, there is tremendous variation of opinions on whether or not I should actually do it at 140k. It seems very mystical- some very credible (to me) you tubers have said don't do it. A chain transmission shop in town said not at this point, but that they don't see many Toyotas coming in for problems. Others say they did it at even higher miles than mine and "it's shifting much smoother!".

I have an idea on how to take out some of the mysticism. Drain some fluid from the trans and evaluate it at Blackstone labs. I would put the old fluid back and just enough new fluid to replace the sample volume. I'm sure some of you have used Blackstone before, it is pretty impressive how much information they can give. I think if the fluid sample tests old but functional, I think it would be unlikely to create a problem to proceed with a drain and fill (I estimate it would be around 3ish quarts) to rejuvenate the fluid. I would then pick back up and do it regularly after that. If it's totally "smoked" and terrible I would probably just let it go without any further intervention.
 
#2 · (Edited)
If the car is running okay, transmission is not slipping or missing shifts, etc then it's never too late to start changing fluids.

First, see if you can loosen the fill plugs on the transmission and also the rear differential, then go ahead and do a drain & refill.

Examine the old fluid or send out to a lab if you want.

Repeat the drain & fill at whatever interval you like 20k, 30k, 50k etc.

Mechanical parts such as gears and bearings all need lube to operate, and clean fluid is better than dirty fluid at doing its job.
 
#3 ·
RE "dirty" fluid. IMHO based on my Honda Odyssey, there may be some gear "dirt" in the pan, but dark fluid isn't "dirty", it is burned. I installed an aux transmission cooler when I purchased the Honda new. When I sold it at 135,000 miles, the buyer checked the dipstick and the oil looked like I had just changed it. I never did.
 
#4 ·
If you haven't changed your transmission fluid in 140k miles, you are most likely better off with not changing it at all. The risk that the transmission will start malfunctioning (slipping) after fluid change is pretty high. Your transmission shop is right.
Of course, your transmission won't last as long as one with regular fluid changes every 60k miles, but at this moment is too late to try to remedy the issue. The best thing you can do now is to start saving a little bit of money every month for a new transmission as the day will come sooner than later. Maybe another 50k miles with a bit of luck, maybe just 20k.
 
#7 ·
There are two schools of thought. One is that the suspended clutch material in the old fluid helps the clutches grip at the cost of accelerated clutch wear. Replacing contaminated fluid with fresh causes slippage because of increased lubricity on already eroded clutches. Regular fluid changes keeps this abrasive contamination to a minimum so higher mileage fluid changes are much safer.

The second theory is that the detergents in new fluid or or forced flushing disturbs sediment that breaks free and restricts flow through the valve body of the transmission. This results in low (or slow to build) fluid pressure holding clutch bands in place and excess slippage. Basically compromised shifting will cause the clutch packs to self destruct.
Doing a drop and fill is considered the safest way to service a high mileage transmission because you are not forcing either issue to play out but you are partially cleaning the fluid and giving the additive package a boost.