So it's not the battery or the cables. Ruled out with alternate battery and cable inspection.

Car still will not crank.

My OBDII scanner also won't connect, but I'm not sure if that's just a function of the age of the scanner. It only goes up to 2003 on the configuration.

What I don't know is if the ECM has control over the starter motor...

 

You can try bypassing the starter relay and apply 12v to the load side of the relay to test the starter. Or tap the housing of the starter and while cranking to see if it cranks.

How many volts are measured across the battery terminals? Any recent work done in the engine bay? Check your ground wires in the engine bay. Look for signs of corrosion and clean the leads for the ground cables.

 

Thanks. No work done pretty much ever except for regular maintainance. This car has been ultra reliable.

Some more diagnostic work...

No corrosion.

Alternate battery gives me 12.6V. Original battery that came out was 12.1V.

Pulled the starter relay from under the dash since I don't hear any clicking when turning the key. Bench tested it and it clicks normally. I'm simply not getting power to the relay.

No check engine light with key on, engine off.

Pulled fuses for the ECM and OBD under the dash, as well as every fuse and relay in the engine bay. Everything checks out.

What's baffling me is if the PCM is involved in the starter motor circuit. Something caused the engine to die AND result cutting off power to the starter relay.

 

on the starter relay under the dash, I took the relay off, and jumpered the power leads on the relay harness. Then turned the key. Still nothing.

BTW, the car has no anti-theft devices on it either.

 

Ok, the starter works. I jumped the solenoid to the battery terminal and it started to crank.

 

So you have no reaction when turning the key to try and start, but your starter relay checks out, battery has voltage, battery terminals are clean, there's nothing loose connected to the starter and you checked ground cables for corrosion... Does your fuel pump prime when the key is turned to on?

 

I don't hear anything out of the fuel pump. But I'm skeptical a bad fuel pump would disable the starter circuit.

I did however find an old recall notice...a recall notice that I never got

Vehicle Detail Search - 2006 PONTIAC VIBE 4 DR FWD/AWD | NHTSA

www.nhtsa.gov

The one at the bottom for engine stalling.


Engine could shut off and/or not start. It doesn't say whether it won't crank, but it's still an interesting coincidence.

I'm not sure what else to check at this point...

Start cranks if jumped
No power to starter relay
Battery ruled out with an alternate battery
All fuses and other relays are working
No check engine light with key-on, engine-off
Scanner can't connect to PCM

I'm thinking I may not have any other avenue but to try a new ECM.

 

Do you know which engine you have? Is it a 2ZR series?

I don't hear anything out of the fuel pump. But I'm skeptical a bad fuel pump would disable the starter circuit.

I did however find an old recall notice...a recall notice that I never got

Vehicle Detail Search - 2006 PONTIAC VIBE 4 DR FWD/AWD | NHTSA

www.nhtsa.gov

The one at the bottom for engine stalling.


Engine could shut off and/or not start. It doesn't say whether it won't crank, but it's still an interesting coincidence.

I'm not sure what else to check at this point...

Start cranks if jumped
No power to starter relay
Battery ruled out with an alternate battery
All fuses and other relays are working
No check engine light with key-on, engine-off
Scanner can't connect to PCM

I'm thinking I may not have any other avenue but to try a new ECM.

 

It may not start if the ECM/PCM thinks it has a security/theft event happening.

Are all the lights on the dash when you turn it to ignition position (not start).

It seems on here many have issues with the battery negative/ground cable. Voltage may read OK but it cannot handle the or a load due to corrosion. Done any load testing?

 

https://www.toyotanation.com/threads/2005-corolla-wont-start.1716611/?post_id=14609740#post-14609740

 

Thanks, I actually found that link too while searching. I can get the starter to activate if I jump it's terminals, so I don't think I have a short in the power cable.

 

I get the oil light and that's it. This car doesn't have any anti-theft as far as I know. The key doesn't have any resistor on it. It's the base-base model with no power door locks, no power windows, etc.

 

OK about the anti-theft. I agree no short but maybe a cable with only one strand left that won't allow the appropriate current to pass to activate what it is supposed to run. It basically sounds like a wiring issue of some sort that is causing all of this. Since it all started at the same time it is probably the same thing. I do not believe it is probably the ECM. It should crank without a functioning ECM.........it just wont start. All the lights should be on when the key is in the run position.

 

https://www.toyotanation.com/attachments/wiring-pdf.374940/

The link here seems to indicate the PCM is in the starter circuit... just not sure how it functions within that circuit. Page 80

 

In the starting circuit, there’s a light blue wire attached to the positive battery terminal. It powers the solenoid to the starter. In the fuse box under the hood, there’s a black with white wire that grounds the signal.

Check the light blue wire and verify you’re seeing 12v. You can also verify resistance in the wiring circuit.

I’ve had a similar issue when my positive terminal was destroyed by corrosion. For some time, the wiring harness got stretched out and had to do some surgery to fix the issues. Cut out the original harness for the starter and repaired the black with white stripe wire in the fuse box.

Without power, the starter will not energized.

 

understood, but that still wouldn't explain why the car died in the first place.

Every ground I can see on the chassis/engine looks good.

Backed probed the ECM per the wiring diagram and it appears to be getting 12V on the wire that's always supposed to be hot (which validates my inspection of the fuse too I guess). Back probing ground wires gets me about .6 ohms.

Probably just going to take a chance on a new ECM at this point. The car has >200k miles on it. If that doesn't fix it, I may just get rid of it and get a newer car.

 

Check the solenoid wiring and the positive cable at the starter. The starter is shorting between the battery and the housing. Need to inspect the wiring for damage within the loom. It’s a pain in the butt, but need to see the damages.

 

1zz

 

And you said you have no power to the relay have you tested power leaving the ignition switch/module? In my experience what killed the car and what keeps it from starting/running are usually the same thing but not to rule anything out when you've tried as many things as you have

 

if it has a stick shift and ignition works,, bump start it, if that works it narrows down issues

 

Thanks for everyone's help and suggestions.

After some deliberation, decided to get rid of the car. With my daughters driving around in it now too, I want something newer that I can have more confidence in. I'm grateful the breakdown occurred while I was driving alone in it.

Probably going to get a newer used Corrolla.