HAs the transmission fluid ever been changed?
Is the check engine light on?
So you can put it in 2 or L but it doesn't move or ?

 

Oil replaced a while ago, drained it today and it was brown and burnt looking. Magnets had some iron shavings on them but not metal pieces. Check engine light not on. It goes in all gears except reverse, but it doesn't appear to shift into 2 or L but rather stays in D. I removed the pan, filter & 1/2 solenoids and will check them later. But given all this, could it be the solenoids, or likely inside the trans?

 

The reverse issue sounds like an ATF issue but the 2 0r L sound like solenoids. Sorry not much help.

 

So when the car is in D, it shifts through all forward gears? If so maybe something related to the Reverse. If you google "A140e shift matrix", maybe the B3 - First and Reverse Brake clutch pack is worn? Especially if the wheels turn weak and you can stop it easily. It may be slipping there. Just a guess.

If the car is stationary, and you move from D to 2 or L, I don't think you'll feel it shift. The transmission would be in 1st gear when you shift to D. And does the car move in L or 2 on the ground?

Consider changing out the strainer besides the fluid.

 

So when the car is in D, it shifts through all forward gears? If so maybe something related to the Reverse. If you google "A140e shift matrix", maybe the B3 - First and Reverse Brake clutch pack is worn? Especially if the wheels turn weak and you can stop it easily. It may be slipping there. Just a guess.

If the car is stationary, and you move from D to 2 or L, I don't think you'll feel it shift. The transmission would be in 1st gear when you shift to D. And does the car move in L or 2 on the ground?

Consider changing out the strainer besides the fluid.

By strainer do you mean filter? And, how do I get as much old oil out without taking apart the whole trans? I'd rather not mix good with bad as it's pretty bad. Would a flush be a bad idea without taking apart the trans?

As for shifting, I did some more reading and I think I misunderstood how shifting to 2 & L work, that when the front is up and there's no load the trans will stay in 1st gear whether in D, 2 or L, so it was proper that I didn't feel any shifting. With the front up and the oil and solenoids out obviously I can't drive it, so first I'll test the solenoids and replace them if necessary, replace the filter if necessary (how can you tell btw?), and of course the oil, and see if that gets reverse back and how shifting goes in all the positions.

If it is the actual trans, how hard is it to take it down and apart and fix it? I've rebuilt a manual but those are much simpler. Am I going to need a lot of special tools and parts and is it even worth it?

 

Also, could a clogged valve body be the cause of no reverse? I'm going to take it out today both to see if it's clogged and to release more of the bad oil before replacing it. Might as well replace the filter and of course the pan gasket and oil while I'm at it. Anything else to replace as preventive maintenance?

 

Sounds a little like my car's symptoms. It works fine in all forward gears but it takes a few seconds to fully engage when you put it in R. I always assumed it was a leaky shift solenoid. Isn't there a shift solenoid for reverse??

FYI, my car shifts into reverse normally when the transmission has warmed up so I try to always back into parking spots (especially the garage) so I can always begin any drive in a forward gear. Hope that helps!

 

When the car's warmed up the car inches back in reverse ever so slowly, if the surface is flat or even slopes down, and the front left wheel moves slowly when the front is raised, so there is minimal reverse, just not enough to be useful. As per my comment above I just tested both solenoids and thy appear to be fine, so it's something else, perhaps debris in the valve body or bad oil. Hopefully not in the gears, bands, clutches and such as that would require a rebuild.

 

Tested 1 & 2 solenoids. Both check out fine, with a 13.5Ω reading and clicking when a 12V current was passed through them. I used AA batteries wired in series as these are low power devices. I assume this was ok. So the problem lies elsewhere. I'll remove the valve body and maybe there something obstructing the reverse valve(s). When I removed the pan & filter yesterday a couple of thin plastic-like pieces came out, one around an inch long, so something's up there.

 

Ok, I just checked and your car has a different transmission. Again, this is for a different transmission, but some of the concepts or linked documents might help (I think the last two pages of the long thread):

https://www.toyotanation.com/threads/loosing-oil-probably-valve-stem-seal.1713149/page-5#replies

My car does exactly what you describe when it's cold but eventually bumps into R.....or goes right in when it's hot. When it's cold, it feels like the clutch is slipping. Perhaps your clutch is slipping but it also may be a clogged valve body port or sluggish reverse control valve, also in the valve body.

 

This document shows the reverse control valve in my transmission for a general concept of what yours might be like (or not!) If that reverse control valve is sticking or one of the ports it opens/closes are clogged, you can see how you might just need a valve body rebuild (or perhaps your transmission fluid change might resolve it...hopefully!)

https://www.mr2.com/files/mr2/techinfo/Random%20FSM%20Data/94a541e.pdf

 

Oh, just re-reading your post above how you checked the solenoids. Someone else correct me if I'm wrong but I think you could get good resistivity and hear clicking in a bad solenoid. I had to do an air pressure check to verify one of mine was bad. I think the electronics of the solenoid were good and working but the mechanical valve in the solenoid was leaking. Double check to make sure your transmission indeed has a reverse shift solenoid before you go to the trouble! Perhaps reverse is a mechanical shift and it might be something like that reverse control valve I mentioned above.

 

BTW, I like taking shortcuts. When I initially tested the pressure valve in my shift solenoid, I just put it to my mouth and blew through it. That highly technical ******* test didn't cut it. The solenoid failed an actual measured air pressure tester but passed the ******* breathalyzer pressure test.
Oh that's priceless! It's censuring my SE Texas terminology. The words I used could also describe how one's neck would look if it were sunburned!

 

BTW, I like taking shortcuts. When I initially tested the pressure valve in my shift solenoid, I just put it to my mouth and blew through it. That highly technical test didn't cut it. The solenoid failed an actual measured air pressure tester but passed the breathalyzer pressure test.
Oh that's priceless! It's censuring my SE Texas terminology. The words I used could also describe how one's neck would look if it were sunburned!

I think I know what word that was. Yeah, a different kind of filter was used here. ;-)

Anyway, I'll do a proper non-banned word pressure test, but I also think that I should at least also remove the valve body to see what's in there, and drain as much of the rest of the oil as I can from the radiator outlet.

I wonder if there's a safe way to activate the oil pump to get as much out of the torque converter and trans body as possible. I think the only safe way to do it is while pouring new oil into the fill tube, so I'll have to buy some, which I was going to anyway. Given that the whole system uses 6 or so gallons maybe it would be best to get 2 gallons as there will be some wasted in pushing the old oil out, comparable to bleeding brakes.

 

I think the two shift solenoids are for forward gears only. The solenoid will need to be checked with compressed air, becaue like EVAP VSV's, the solenoids might click but hardly pass any air (or fluid) in volume.

As far as getting the old fluid out, you can do a cooler line flush. See the DIY section, linked below.

If OP has experience rebuilding a manual transmission, then A140e shouldn't be a problem. If you have a Transtar warehouse nearby just pick up the necessary parts and a rebuilt torque converter from them. Part 4 starting on the transmission, it'll link to later parts of his 10-part videos.

A140e service and cooler line flush. Yes, the "filter" used on these A-series is a metal screen "strainer", unlike the felt filters used in most later U-series.

DIY: 5S-FE Transmission Fluid & Strainer Replacement...

DIY: 1996 Camry Transmission Fluid & Strainer Replacement Procedure 5S-FE (GEN 3) I completed this procedure at 207,000 km on my 1996 Camry 2.2L automatic (5S-FE engine). The transmission fluid was turning a brownish-red colour. The transmission fluid was previously flushed at 145,000 km. No...

www.toyotanation.com

Transtar Locations:

Contact - Transtar Aftermarket Solutions

Contact Us Transtar Aftermarket Solutions(855) TRANSTARinfo@nexamotiongroup.com

www.transtar1.com

 

I think the two shift solenoids are for forward gears only. The solenoid will need to be checked with compressed air, becaue like EVAP VSV's, the solenoids might click but hardly pass any air (or fluid) in volume.

As far as getting the old fluid out, you can do a cooler line flush. See the DIY section, linked below.

If OP has experience rebuilding a manual transmission, then A140e shouldn't be a problem. If you have a Transtar warehouse nearby just pick up the necessary parts and a rebuilt torque converter from them.

A140e service and cooler line flush. Yes, the "filter" used on these A-series is a metal screen "strainer", unlike the felt filters used in most later U-series.

DIY: 5S-FE Transmission Fluid & Strainer Replacement...

DIY: 1996 Camry Transmission Fluid & Strainer Replacement Procedure 5S-FE (GEN 3) I completed this procedure at 207,000 km on my 1996 Camry 2.2L automatic (5S-FE engine). The transmission fluid was turning a brownish-red colour. The transmission fluid was previously flushed at 145,000 km. No...

www.toyotanation.com

Transtar Locations:

Contact - Transtar Aftermarket Solutions

Contact Us Transtar Aftermarket Solutions(855) TRANSTARinfo@nexamotiongroup.com

www.transtar1.com

I don't have a compressor but isn't there a compression test kit that comes with a pump that many auto parts stores loan out for free? I recall using one last year to test various emissions and turbo valves on my own car last year, that you manually pump. Is that what you mean?

What about the solenoid(s) that are removed from outside the trans body, near the throttle cable? Could those be bad, or irrelevant?

I'm about to remove the valve body. I studied the FSM and watched a video on it. Doesn't seem too hard so long as you know where and how everything goes back on. Took and will take lots of photos. Things are remarkably clean above the pan, despite the dirty oil.

And, can I do the cooler line flush myself w/o special tools? I'll watch the video of course. Thanks.

 

Air compressor will flow a lot of air, but the hand pump tester (such as cooling system pressure tester) I don't think flows enough air. Anyway, I kinda doubt the two solenoids are the problem, as you said the forward gears seem to be working fine. But if the solenoids are out, might as well check them.

The solenoid outside the case, by the neutral safety switch (NSS), is the torque coverter lockup solenoid. I don't think that's the problem with the Reverse gear.

Sure, you can remove the valve body as in Toyota_JP's thread and make sure all the valves move freely and not stuck by debris. It's not hard, just detail oriented and time consuming.

Cooler line flush doesn't require special tools. I mean, pliers for removing the hose clamp, a catch bucket, etc. It should take 8-10 qts to get clear fluid flowing. So you might need 3 jugs on hand.

 

So foolishly or not, I removed one of the valve body "subcovers", that reveals some of the valves. To get the oil out I turned it over, and a u-shaped piece of metal around 5mm thick fell out, and now I'm not sure where it goes. I'll try to include a photo as there's one of these on either side of the valve body. It look like a thick brake line bracket. Better yet, is there a guide on how to take these apart to clean them as the FSM doesn't go into this much detail?

In any case, I'll see what I can do to test the solenoids, clean everything up, get as much oil out, put it all back together, remove radiator oil outflow line, fill with new oil to flush out the rest of the old as I run the engine, and when only clean oil comes out I'll shut the engine off, reconnect the line and hopefully this solves the reverse issue. If not, it's inside the trans body itself and a whole other matter.

...Ok never mind. I found a YouTube video series that shows where this part goes. It's in the smaller of the two "subcoverrs", on the side with the shield or sleeve.

 

Regarding the cooler line flush method, the pump will pump out faster than the dipstick tube can be refilled. So you'll need to stop say 1.5-2 qts to refill. Avoid letting the pump run dry.

Yes the video is one of the Pageboy25 videos. The one I linked was Part 4, and at the end it'll take you to Part 5 (you linked above) and so on.

Did you remove the entire valve body to work on it, or by pieces? I'd drop the whole thing like Pageboy25, now that you're there.

See if you can google up an ATSG A140e repair manual online. Or the local Transtar warehouse might have one for sale still for such an old transmission. The pressure regulator (I think) positioning needs to be placed back exactly. And all the check balls need to be at the correct locations. Make sure the bolts are torqued to spec in a criss-cross pattern or valves can bind.

 

Where are the check valve balls? So far I've seen none come out. It it in the main valve "maze"? Haven't take that one out. I assume that it's best to replace all the plasticky valve gaskets while I'm at it? There appear to be 3, a small, medium and large one. Anything else to replace other than the oil, pan gasket and filter/strainer?

Incidentally, one of the nuts securing the cooling pipes to the trans was loose, the one closest to the fill tube. No sign of leaks near there or under the car, but could that have caused any problems, like loss of pressure? I'll secure it in any case, per torque spec. I have crow's feet sockets for that.

 

Looking on search result pdf, looks like 2 check balls in the upper valve body and 4 in the lower. You can do a search on that too. There are also slower tear down videos on the A140e. The car might sit there for a while tho.

The pipes I believe comes out of the torque converter and into the atf oil pan. So if it's not leaking, I don't think it's related to the reverse problem. Looks like someone might have dug into that transmission before. That doesn't give much confidence. LOL

 

Looking on search result pdf, looks like 2 check balls in the upper valve body and 4 in the lower. You can do a search on that too. There are also slower tear down videos on the A140e. The car might sit there for a while tho.

The pipes I believe comes out of the torque converter and into the atf oil pan. So if it's not leaking, I don't think it's related to the reverse problem. Looks like someone might have dug into that transmission before. That doesn't give much confidence. LOL

Thanks, I'll review the AT manual, which I found online, and proceed accordingly. Btw do you know where I can get a complete set of VB gaskets for less than a king's ransom? I think there are three. The current ones are ok but what appears to be the malamine coating is chipping away a bit and I want to avoid parts falling into the valves or even tiny leaks. I might as well do this right.

As for removing the oil oil, a bunch more came out when I removed the VB. Much less when I disconnected the cooling lines where they connected to the hoses into the radiator and pulled the ends below the bottom of the radiator. At this point I think I've removed over 4qts of old oil, or around 2/3 of it (it was at the proper level before I started). So less than 2 qts left in the TC & trans body.

So wouldn't a gallon or possibly even less new ATF be enough to flush the rest of the old oil out using the oil pump once I put it all back together? And will the new mix much with the old or should it mostly push out the old without much wasting of the new, akin to flushing out old brake fluid? I'll buy 3 gallons just in case, and at worst will return one of them if unused.

Btw which ATF? Is any brand ok, and should I get regular or high mileage? Synth or regular (looks like synth is for T & WS trans though, not this one)? Which if any additive?

And is the same oil used in the diff?

Sorry, last question, I believe this is a reman trans, so how do I tell which model it is in case it's not the A140E? Where would I find the stamped model # on the trans?

 

For parts, check to see if you have a Transtar nearby as linked earlier. Also check WIT transmission. Both will ship to you.

The differential chamber holds about 1.7 qts. Make sure the fill plug can be removed first, before you remove the drain.

As far as flush amount, I'd only flushed a little when installing a cooler, but the DIY linked earlier filled 3 liters and used another 6 liters. So that's 9 liters. If you used less, then just return the unopened jug.

Either of these from Walmart will work:

Differential fluid DIY:

DIY : Differental Fluid Change

Hey I love being on vacation, I got plenty of time to give some love to my baby, and post some DIYs!!! My car is a '98 Camry 4cyl with 290 000 kilometers (around 180 000 miles), not all models of Camry have their Differential fluid in a separate casing, but if yours does, here's how you can...

www.toyotanation.com

I don't think toyota put an identifier plate on the transmission. At least I don't know. They should tho. You can look up the pan gasket shape and number of bolts, I guess that would be a way to tell but not the different versions of A140e (gear ratios).

 

For parts, check to see if you have a Transtar nearby as linked earlier. Also check WIT transmission. Both will ship to you.

The differential chamber holds about 1.7 qts. Make sure the fill plug can be removed first, before you remove the drain.

As far as flush amount, I've done it myself except when installing a cooler, but the DIY linked earlier filled 3 liters and used another 6 liters. So that's 9 liters. If you used less, then just return the unopened jug.

Either of these from Walmart will work:

Differential fluid DIY:

DIY : Differental Fluid Change

Hey I love being on vacation, I got plenty of time to give some love to my baby, and post some DIYs!!! My car is a '98 Camry 4cyl with 290 000 kilometers (around 180 000 miles), not all models of Camry have their Differential fluid in a separate casing, but if yours does, here's how you can...

www.toyotanation.com

I don't think toyota put an identifier plate on the transmission. At least I don't know. They should tho. You can look up the pan gasket shape and number of bolts, I guess that would be a way to tell but not the different versions of A140e (gear ratios).

Isn't the red bottle ATF for the later moder T or WS trans? And, given the age and condition of this trans, would it be better to go with the slightly thicker cheaper blue bottle mineral ATF? What about additives?

Also, what about this instead of the above 2 ATFs:

Amazon.com

I.e. Valvoline Import Multi-Vehicle (ATF) Full Synthetic Automatic Transmission Fluid. Just $20.24/gal.

Also, if I'm going to drain & fill the diif then it's probably unavoidable to get 3 gals, and might be good to have some extra on hand in case I have to rebuild the trans and lose some oil in the process.

And I'm pretty sure it's an A140E because the diagrams for the A140L don't match what I'm seeing on the VB.

 

The High Mileage version of the SuperTech DII/III ATF contains additional seal conditioners & friction modifiers, according to the label. Formulated to help "stop leaks", and provide "smoother shifting" .. in an older transmission.

I don't see any reason why you can't use it, if you want. But I would just use the regular ATF, if it was here.


To the best of my knowledge, both the (regular) SuperTech Dex II/III ATF and the Valvoline Dex/Merc ATF products

are formulated at 7.2 cSt @ 100c, or above.

Either would be a solid ATF choice for your transmission. I've used both products here in other vehicles previously.

I see that JohnGD also recommended the Valvoline Dex/Merc fluid in his post above.

I would use what is available to you locally, that is cost effective, and makes good sense to you there.

--

http://goto.walmart.com/c/404739/56...walmart.com/ip/Super-Tech-Automatic-Transmission-Fluid-1-Gallon-Bottle/20573820

http://goto.walmart.com/c/404739/56...almart.com/ip/Valvoline-Dex-Merc-Automatic-Transmission-Fluid-ATF-1-GA/15125788

 

The High Mileage version of the SuperTech DII/III ATF contains additional seal conditioners & friction modifiers, according to the label. Formulated to help "stop leaks", and provide "smoother shifting" .. in an older transmission.

I don't see any reason why you can't use it, if you want. But I would just use the regular ATF, if it was here.


To the best of my knowledge, both the (regular) SuperTech Dex II/III ATF and the Valvoline Dex/Merc ATF products

are formulated at 7.2 cSt @ 100c, or above.

Either would be a solid ATF choice for your transmission. I've used both products here in other vehicles previously.

I see that JohnGD also recommended the Valvoline Dex/Merc fluid in his post above.

I would use what is available to you locally, that is cost effective, and makes good sense to you there.

--

http://goto.walmart.com/c/404739/56...walmart.com/ip/Super-Tech-Automatic-Transmission-Fluid-1-Gallon-Bottle/20573820

http://goto.walmart.com/c/404739/56...almart.com/ip/Valvoline-Dex-Merc-Automatic-Transmission-Fluid-ATF-1-GA/15125788

Thanks. More data points...better...also more confusing...

Sounds like any of these would work. And sorry, forgot, is the Valvoline MV Import thicker than their regular DII/III & MaxLife ATF? I checked with Valvoline and they said it's ok for this use as it's DII/III compatible.

Something tells me that thicker might be better for a slipping reverse gear, along with an additive.

As for additives, any recs there?

 

I think there are changes to the Valvoline ATF lineup. It looks like while Walmart still has the Dex/Merc, the Valvoline website NO LONGER lists that ATF. Instead there's only the Import Multi-Vehicle ATF. It's possible they changed the formulation, but I personally prefer to see it in writing on the back label.

That said, by enter the car info into Valvoline's website. It says the Import Multi-Vehicle ATF is NOT compatible with the 92 Camry. LOL!

Well, if the Valvoline tech support has updated info and they tell you that fluid is ok, then I guess either one will work. LOL

Valvoline Import Multi-Vehicle Full Synthetic Automatic Transmission F

Valvoline Import Multi-Vehicle ATF is the full-synthetic automatic transmission fluid that has been specially engineered to meet and exceed the requirements of most imports and domestics with automatic transmissions. Formulated with advanced additives to prevent the major causes of transmission...

shop.valvolineglobal.com

Valvoline site says "Product Does Not Fit Your 1992 TOYOTA CAMRY":

 

Yeah I know it's confusing. I got this in response to a question I asked on Amazon:

Q: Would this work well on a '92 Camry with an A140E auto trans that hasn't been maintained very well, after full drain & clean (NOT flush)?
A: Thank you for your interest in our products and question! We recommend the use of our Valvoline Import Multi-Vehicle ATF in Toyota Camry applications requiring the Dexron II/III fluid specification. This product will safely mix with the OEM automatic transmission fluid. -Valvoline Product Support Manufacturer · June 14, 2024

Worst case, if they're wrong and referring to an old formulation no longer being sold, what might happen?

Also, I'm sure a stupid question, but I just took apart & cleaned up the valve body as best I could. There was some sludge, not too bad. I made sure that all the little parts that can fall out were in place, balls, retainers, etc. But before I put it back, is it possible to run the car in Park so that what remaining old oil doesn't run through and contaminate the VB that I just cleaned? Or would that destroy the trans?

And in either case, while I ordered a new pan gasket & strainer, can I use the old ones during the drain & fill operation, until all the old oil is displaced, drop the pan again and save the good new oil, and install the new strainer & gasket? This would be to capture as much crap from the old oil as possible in the old strainer so as to not mess up the new one, and also not subject the new gasket to an unnecessary install/remove/install cycle.

 

That said, by enter the car info into Valvoline's website. It says the Import Multi-Vehicle ATF is NOT compatible with the 92 Camry. LOL!

Yeah, I saw that too.

Not surprised, Walmart's vehicle selector does the same thing. "There were No results that fit your vehicle."

Given that we are talking about "Dex/Merc", a domestic-licensed manufacturer fluid ( GM / Ford ) that was "sunset" over 15 years ago, in favor of more modern ATF formulations: on a bottle marketed as an "Import Multi-Vehicle" fluid .. again, not surprised it's no longer on the bottle. aka: "Marketing". The Valvoline tech line rep. I spoke to back in 2014 basically said as much at that time: without outright saying it.

Yeah I know it's confusing. I got this in response to a question I asked on Amazon:

There should be a manufacturer fluid specification sheet, and safety data sheet - for any fluid: you are interested in using. You will find the full manufacturer specifications on that sheet.

SuperTech (Walmart) ATF spec sheet may be hard to find. It is produced / bottled regionally by multiple producers, including Warren, Exxon Mobil, etc. last time I checked.

Edit: SuperTech is made by Highline Warren, Suggest contacting them for a specific Product Data Sheet, if interested. Link for Highline Warren is here:

https://highlinewarren.com/

If you want to use the Valvoline Multi Vehicle Import ATF - sure, I'd use it. Don't pay $35 a jug, get it from Amazon.

Dex II/III and Mercon compatibility is listed, same as back in 2014 (first paragraph).

Current specification sheet attached, effective date of 5/9/2023.

 

Yeah, I saw that too.

Not surprised, Walmart's vehicle selector does the same thing. "There were No results that fit your vehicle."

Given that we are talking about "Dex/Merc", a domestic-licensed manufacturer fluid ( GM / Ford ) that was "sunset" over 15 years ago, in favor of more modern ATF formulations: on a bottle marketed as an "Import Multi-Vehicle" fluid .. again, not surprised it's no longer on the bottle. aka: "Marketing". The Valvoline tech line rep. I spoke to back in 2014 basically said as much at that time: without outright saying it.


There should be a manufacturer fluid specification sheet, and safety data sheet - for any fluid: you are interested in using. You will find the full manufacturer specifications on that sheet.

SuperTech (Walmart) ATF spec sheet may be hard to find. It is produced / bottled regionally by multiple producers, including Warren, Exxon Mobil, etc. last time I checked.

If you want to use the Valvoline Multi Vehicle Import ATF - sure, I'd use it. Don't pay $35 a jug, get it from Amazon.

Dex II/III and Mercon compatibility is listed, same as back in 2014 (first paragraph).
Current specification sheet attached, effective date of 5/9/2023.

Looks like it's compatible after all, per the doc date.

Btw would either or my drain & fill approaches above work?

 

No, you want to completely reassemble the transmission, using a new filter and gasket, fill the transmission to proper level, remove the oil cooler return line and place in appropriate pan, start the vehicle, and pump out 1-2 quarts of transmission fluid, turn off, refill w/ same amount pumped out, restart, and repeat: until 8-10 quarts of fluid have been exchanged. With the front end properly lifted: or w/ the vehicle properly chocked, with e-brake on, with foot on brake pedal, shift thru all gears for a few seconds, a few times while doing the exchange, to work new fluid thru the valve body.

* Don't run the transmission without fluid ("dry"), and wouldn't run the transmission with a suspect filter -

use the "fluid exchange thru the oil cooler return line method", so any debris will get pumped out of the valve body, the transmission, the torque converter, and the oil cooler -> into the catch pan, while you replace w/ new fluid.

Given the work you've done at the valve body, I suspect it will take less than the 8-10 quarts to do a full fluid exchange / before fluid runs out "looking like new".

Fill to full mark, start and let run for 5-10 seconds max: shut off, and check the fluid level / top off to full - on the first start.

This is how I'd do it here.

 

No, you want to completely reassemble the transmission, using a new filter and gasket, fill the transmission to proper level, remove the oil cooler return line and place in appropriate pan, start the vehicle, and pump out 1-2 quarts of transmission fluid, turn off, refill w/ same amount pumped out, restart, and repeat: until 8-10 quarts of fluid have been exchanged. With the front end properly lifted: or w/ the vehicle properly chocked, with e-brake on, with foot on brake pedal, shift thru all gears for a few seconds, a few times while doing the exchange, to work new fluid thru the valve body.

* Don't run the transmission without fluid ("dry"), and wouldn't run the transmission with a suspect filter -

use the "fluid exchange thru the oil cooler return line method", so any debris will get pumped out of the valve body, the transmission, the torque converter, and the oil cooler -> into the catch pan, while you replace w/ new fluid.

Given the work you've done at the valve body, I suspect it will take less than the 8-10 quarts to do a full fluid exchange / before fluid runs out "looking like new".

Fill to full mark, start and let run for 5-10 max: shut off, and check the fluid level / top off to full - on the first start.

This is how I'd do it here.

Awesome, great advice, thanks so much for the tips! I like shortcuts but not if they're going to cause problems.

Oh, and just ordered 3 gallons of the Import MV. Everything arrives tomorrow so hopefully I get it done soon. I suspect that this won't solve the underlying problem but the trans and oil were way overdue for cleaning and replacement so I'd have had to do it anyway and this just saves me a task if I do have the rebuild the trans.

Btw, if I do end up having to take down the trans to rebuild it, is it ok to support the engine from below with a jack or block, or do I have to support it from above with an engine hoist or support beam, so it doesn't sag? I've done the former on a different car when taking off its trans, but perhaps with the Camry this isn't advisable.

 

Sorry, missed your above posts. Been busy.

I posted a separate thread on this and the consensus is that they only proper and safe way to drop the trans is by supporting the engine from above, so that's what I'll do.

Cool. Safety first. Especially when DIY'ing this type of repair.

Is it entirely mechanical or does it have some sort of electrical connector? Could a bad pump cause one of the gears to not work, by not cycling and cooling hot ATF?

Yes, the internal oil pump is mechanically driven. The Torque converter drives / turns the internal oil pump.

Now I'm thinking that maybe the tubes or lines are clogged, perhaps in the radiator. I'll disconnect the oil outlet hose and direct its output to a drip pan and see if oil comes out. I'll also try to use compressed air to blow out the radiator cooling passages. Hopefully it's just that and not a bad pump.

That's what I would suspect, and do (make sure the lines are not blocked), if here.

 

Sorry, missed your above posts. Been busy.

Cool. Safety first. Especially when DIY'ing this type of repair.

Yes, the internal oil pump is mechanically driven. The Torque converter drives / turns the internal oil pump.

That's what I would suspect, and do (make sure the lines are not blocked), if here.

So for the pump to not be working basically a big chunk of the trans would be inoperable, and it wouldn't go in any direction? Could I have messed up putting things back together in such a way that despite there being ample oil in the pan it's not being sucked into the main body of the trans? New strainer w/new cork strainer gasket, everything appeared to align properly, torqued down properly per FSM specs, etc.

I will try to see if it's the radiators lines. Could those being blocked by debris and thus oil not circulating and being cooled properly have caused reverse gear to go out over time, even though forward gears are still working?

What about old/bad/low diff oil? Could that be a cause? Our neighbor used to own a junkyard and told me that Camrys tended to have diff issues. I cleaned it up nicely yesterday so I could examine the fluid and replace it if it's bad or low. Good to do in any case, of course. Can I use the same ATF?

 

Fluid is picked up from the sump (transmission pan), then goes thru the transmission filter -> the oil pump -> and into the valve body. (At least that's my understanding of it here.)

Did you do any electrical work or testing while R&Ring the valve body?

Are all electrical connectors for the valve body solenoids in place? (Internally to the transmission, at the motor wiring harness)

Is there any change / improvement - if the (original) transmission filter is reinstalled?

These are all questions I'd be asking myself, if here.

 

Fluid is picked up from the sump (transmission pan), then goes thru the transmission filter -> the oil pump -> and into the valve body. (At least that's my understanding of it here.)

Did you do any electrical work or testing while R&Ring the valve body?

Are all electrical connectors for the valve body solenoids in place? (Internally to the transmission, at the motor wiring harness)

Is there any change / improvement - if the (original) transmission filter is reinstalled?

These are all questions I'd be asking myself, if here.

I tested the 2 solenoids, they checked out (resistance & clicking), so I just reinstalled and reconnected them. I forgot to check continuity on their wires though, from the connector outside the trans. But I can do that from the connector though, grounding the negative to the trans body, so that's ok. I'll also test continuity going to the harness and ECM.

But no, no improvement with reverse, just very slow low torque movement with wheels up, that I can easily stop with my hand. And now this pump/cooler issue. I'll look into all that today.

As for the diff, yes, I realize that it's separate, just wondering if low/bad oil or other issues could cause a problem with reverse but not forward. I don't see how, having taken apart diffs, it's all mechanical and works the same in either direction, but who knows, I'm no expert.

But, I can put the Import MV ATF in the diff? And, same torque specs for drain & fill plugs as trans pan plug, 36ft-lb?

Btw, a caution, but the 3 gallons of ATF I bought from Amazon were packed loosely in a large box and just dangled around during shipment, no packing material whatsoever. One of them leaked a bit, which I didn't realize until the next day after I put the unopened box on another car's front seat, and now it has a big oil stain on it. I'll contact Amazon to see what they're willing to do about it, and hopefully I can clean the stain with upholstery cleaner, but really lame on their part and a caution to anyone else buying fluids from them that they sometimes do this.

 

Btw, given that everything I've done so far hasn't fixed the reverse issue and that it's almost certainly in the trans shaft section, what are the most likely causes that I should be looking it if I take it apart, and how would I know that a given part is bad? I suppose that by reading up on how auto trans work I should be able to figure it out for myself, but any advice would be appreciated, as well as pitfalls in rebuilding an auto trans since there are so many parts. Any special tools needed and will I need a hydraulic press?

 

to be honest if you do not have experience in automatic transmissions, ie some course or previous preparation I do not recommend you unmount the transmission, not for the fact of experimenting that you can do if not because you will not know exactly what could be the component that generates the failure, automatic transmissions are more complex than manual transmissions of this generation, If you have discarded all past options including electrical problems, I would recommend you to get some other transmission in a junkyard and make the change, you will save headaches and above all time, because the problem you have can be a myriad of things. It is very likely that you do not enter that gear because the clutch of that set due to the problem you had cooling were burned, it is a guess.

 

Looking at the shift matrix, the activation of C2 (direct clutch) and B3 (first and reverse brake) will activate the reverse gear. With manual first gear, the direct clutch isn't activated. As to how the power flow goes I don't know.

How's manual first gear work compared to the same gear in D?

If all the spool valves and bores don't have wear and pressure leaks, and the spool valves move freely in the bores, then it may be as simple as changing the B3 clutch packs (among all other clutch packs once you open it up).

A plugged cooler line can damage a transmission quickly, as I posted in another recent thread.

 

Looking at the shift matrix, the activation of C2 (direct clutch) and B3 (first and reverse brake) will activate the reverse gear. With manual first gear, the direct clutch isn't activated. As to how the power flow goes I don't know.

How's manual first gear work compared to the same gear in D?

If all the spool valves and bores don't have wear and pressure leaks, and the spool valves move freely in the bores, then it may be as simple as changing the B3 clutch packs (among all other clutch packs once you open it up).

A plugged cooler line can damage a transmission quickly, as I posted in another recent thread.

The car moves in all manually selected forward gears, D, 2 & L. I can't fully vouch for them being automatically shifted to and then when it's supposed to when the car is moving and in D, as I haven't tested that, nor for engine braking and all the other tests.

So, the direct clutch "engages" the reverse gear, I mean literally the gear inside the trans that reverses first gear, as in a manual trans, and if it's failing then reverse isn't happening?

Sorry for asking but the Toyota diagrams are really poor quality and it's hard to tell. My car's FSM has very clear diagrams where nothing's left to guesswork.

 

BOTH the direct clutch and 1st/reverse brakes activate the reverse gear. Again, it's not clear to me how the power flow goes.

I think your description is correct that both of these essentially act the same as a manual transmission's shift fork engaging a reverse-cut gear.

The reason I'm guessing it's B3 is because forward gears using C2 seem to be working.

 

No, I understood that. But since you say that the direct clutch is engaged only when in reverse, not in 1st, and since it moves in 1st, B3 should be ok, or at least not the reason for no reverse, and looks like the problem is the DC, based on what you wrote just above, if I understood you correctly.

 

Transtar is an aftermarket distributor, as far as I know, it's an authorized distributor for German ZF transmission parts. I only heard of but don't know about Amayama. They claim genuine tho. It's kinda like Japan's eBay-Auto of sorts, I think.

Did you bypass the plugged cooler? Plugged cooler might be a source of problems too.

You'll probably be looking at $200 in a "master" rebuild kit with friction and steels, plus $150 in rebuilt converter. You're probably looking at $500 (ATF is like $75) if no other problems beside worn clutches. So if you can get a junkyard transmission in usable condition for $300-400, then that might be the time saver. It's a dice roll still, as some sellers misrepresent the condition of their transmissions.

A "banner" kit, with friction but not steels, is about $167 + shipping on Rockauto. I would get new steels (such as Raybestos STMTOYTA12) if you're going to rebuild, but not sure if they're even available (not that I could see).

1996 TOYOTA CAMRY 2.2L L4 Rebuild Kit | Shop Now at RockAuto

Transmission-Automatic Parts and More for Your 1996 TOYOTA CAMRY at Reliably Low Prices. Fast Online Catalog. DIY-Easy. Your Choice of Quality. Full Manufacturer Warranty.

www.rockauto.com

 

I've ordered from Amayama a bunch of times and everything I've gotten from them appears to be OEM and good quality, so I've been happy with them. Typically better than US-based OEM prices, and they often have parts that aren't available in the US, with the main downsides being that it takes longer to arrive and it's a pain to return, but I've never needed to return anything so not an issue for me. I saved quite a bit with them. It was all for my 1G DSM, for which parts are becoming hard to get. Rebuilt my trans with parts from them, including shims that are nearly impossible to get in the US. Highly recommended.

Anyway, yes, I unplugged the cooler, literally a 5 cent piece of rubber on the coolant inlet pipe that probably came that way from the factory to keep debris out that the idiot who installed it failed to remove. This is one of many reasons that I now fix our cars. But any damage has already been done from years of running uncooled ATF, so I'm guessing that reverse is just the tip of the iceberg with other parts likely to fail eventually. Perhaps this was for the best as drive could have failed when my mom was miles from home, and she doesn't handle situations like that well. Now she's not driving it till we properly fix this with either a rebuild or a used trans,

That's why I'm leaning towards a rebuild, as you don't know what you're getting with a used one. I've already cleaned up the valve body & pan, replaced the gasket & strainer, and drained most of the old ATF and put in new ATF (which ended up costing me nothing due to Amazon messing up with the shipment, throwing 3 gallon containers into a large box with no padding or sealed bags for each container, and one developed a leak during shipment that stained the front seat of another car when I put the unopened box that hadn't yes shown signs of leaks on it for overnight storage, so they're refunding the entire cost of 3 gallons). So I've invested time and money on it and based on what you're telling me it'll cost somewhere between another $200-$350 to finish the job, plus of course a fair amount of time.

I assume that "master" kits don't come with actual replacement gears, shafts, etc, but that they're probably not necessary for this sort of situation, but they should have everything I'm likely to need to fix this, e.g. clutches, brakes, bands, gaskets, o-rings, seals, etc.? And is a rebuilt TC really necessary, or just wise preventive maintenance if I'm going to all the trouble of removing and taking apart the trans?